But riddle me this, why is it you dont pay for your phone software that auto updates? If you had to pay to update its software then you might complain right? The phones software is required for the phone to work, just as your ship is required for you character to work in STO.
You also need a celular service plan for the phone to be of much use too.
As I've mentioned on this topic and its associates many times over..... what we are paying for in STO is NOT a physical product and is NOT a piece of software.... we are paying for services. The system is funded on microtransactions which are for all intents and purposes providing ongoing and/or one-time services. When one purchased a particular "ship" from the c-store, they are paying a one-time fee for the use of said ship on all their appropriately factioned toons. Upgrade of said ship service to a slightly better plan (much like upgrading a cellular plan to a slightly better one) typically results in additional service fees past initial payment. Upgrading a ship from T5 to T5-U is closer to the concept of upgrading ones phone plan to include additional data.
Ok, so the ire over T6 ships boils down to one single little point... People who are quite literally demanding a free upgrade to their existing ships seem to understand they would not receive the same upgrade free if we were all buyers of the IPhone...
What's the difference between a digital and physical product? I mean really, what is the difference?
When you purchase the product, you purchase it in a given state with the understanding it will fulfill a certain purpose or task...
This makes no difference if that product is a physical item, or a digital item, the purchaser made the entirely voluntary choice to purchase that digital product in a given state...
You might as well turn around to a game publisher and demand all DLC for free because you bought their game in a digital format off Steam, and the latest DLC update changes the content of the existing game... Hell, you should demand they give you free stuff because they release a sequel and you bought all the DLC for the first game which has suddenly been rendered obsolete...
I don't hear people screaming at Maxis/EA demanding free content packs every time there's a new Sims game released... Why do people expect Cryptic to give them free stuff because of a new free expansion - something even alot of F2P MMO's charge for...
This is exactly the same premise here... Cryptic released ships in a given state... We all purchased those ships in that given state, completely of our own volition... At no point was there the condition (stipulated, insinuated, presumed or otherwise) that Cryptic were obligated to upgrade or provide additional functionality to those ships (outside of bug fixes) once purchased... We all received - and are STILL RECEIVING exactly what we agreed to pay for...
Just because a product is a digital product does not mean the developer is required to give you a free upgrade because new content results in that digital product no longer being the best thing around - to expect anything else, really is a perfect example of an 'entitlement mentality'....
Yeah, and even all that aside the reality is pretty simple. The game is releasing ongoing content, which requires employees, who must be paid, which costs money. It is operating on physical servers, which must be maintained, which requires money. Therefore, going forward, the game needs to keep finding ways to get money. Even beyond that, as a commercial company Cryptic has to turn a constant profit. It is not enough that people paid at some point in the past.
difference between physical and digital? digital can be copied infinitely. beyond initial creation, there is zero continued cost for manufacture. digital is pure profit as there aren't continued costs as there is with physical products.
so, lets go into sto's digital products.
2500 zen for a ship, new ones are estimated at 3k.
to convert one of the 2500 ships unit T6 requires 500 to 1000 more zen to still get an inferior ship. a console might have one active ability, mostly passive, whereas the new boff...yeah. much more possibilities there since they AREN'T going to make the new boff and powers weaksauce because they want you to buy their copy pasta infinite new T6 ships.
this is on a product that costs them nothing beyond creation of the product. and don't play the 'oh coding is soooo hard' etc. they have pipelines for that. as many years as cryptics been creating ships it's a streamlined process. considering also low poly and low rez textures...yeah, not that much.
problem is many people think digital goods require as much effort and work as physical products...they don't. another tendency is to think they have any sort of actual real world value...once again, they don't. if you can create infinite perfect copies where's that value?
sure, cryptic wants to make money...but the current upgrade method is pure BS. spend the same zen for an inferior ship.
games are supposed to be entertaining yes? spending a little on entertainment is expected. being required to spend on a f2p mmo to access content means it's not f2p, it's a hybrid f2p+P2W/pay to play.
unless you have your head buried in sand it's obvious. the money players previously spent, the time they may have spent farming if they didn't buy zen outright = meaningless with the arrival of delta, same as all those crafting levels just reset to zero.
all to get players to spend more. instead of doing things that would get more players (more players = potential profit) and they would be willing to spend, cryptic prefers to force the issue with what player base they currently have.
season 7, the fleets and high dil costs (remember dil= zen) rep system, the doff changes (more dil) new crafting system AND resetting all levels to zero forcing another climb, at the end of which...you guessed it more dil. now delta...more dil farming or buying zen, one you will have to do.
and nothing in all that time to gather different types of players, instead actively alienating several types of players.
cryptic has the worst word of mouth online of many of the developers, along with PWE. you'd THINK they would try and improve their image, try and make themselves out to be not quite so greedy. actually make new content not trapped behind grind or pay walls.
rofl, fat chance.
so don't try to defend them, don't try to play it off as they are the good guys. they're a business that's proven they don't give a flying tribble about player concerns time and time again. one of the myriad of reason why they're so low on the list of devs/publishers that anyone would actually want to play a game from.
Dr. Patricia Tanis ~ "Bacon is for sycophants and products of incest."
Donate Brains, zombies in Washington DC are starving.
Lockbox and Fleet/10 console ships will get the same upgraded stats.
I will post this every time people spread this inferiority myth.
And you're blindly gonna believe that PWE will let them slip a good portion of their profit for that?
Along the way it will become clear that T5 and T5-U will be completely inferior to Full T6 even if it is "just" the lack of the Specialist BOff and Trait or they won't make any money...
Unless something is on the server I am not going to believe a single word about "being competitive" and "just lacking Specialist and Trait"... remember... it's all subject to change.
Ok, so the ire over T6 ships boils down to one single little point... People who are quite literally demanding a free upgrade to their existing ships seem to understand they would not receive the same upgrade free if we were all buyers of the IPhone...
What's the difference between a digital and physical product? I mean really, what is the difference?QUOTE]
the difference is that the I phone is something we have in real life.. the ships are something we buy to use in a game.
also, for all its not about a free upgrade.. I mean, it would be nice if cryptic stopped nickel and diming me, but, its about value.. t5-u is not worth the price, especially were so many people have so many alts..
also, you have to take into consideration that this game is based off of a very popular franchise.. a lot of people come to this game to fly the ship they want.. it would be like having a company make a my little pony game, and instead of having ponies, you had vampires instead.
I play sto because I love star trek.. I love the iconic vessels, and some of the other canon vessels.. I literally have no desire to have any of the fugly cryptic designs (my taste, I know others like it, whatevs). I want to continue playing as the iconic vessels, but, at the same time, after being patient with cryptic for nearly 5 years, I want to be able to explore and play all the "new" stuff that is gated to t6 ships..
I have literally been dying to see new boff types in the game to help mix up the same old same old.. and inversely I have zero desire in the federation cryptic t6 designs thus far.. so where does that leave me, a player who has supported cryptic even when I felt I wasn't getting my "values" worth, and as a reward, im not gated from experiencing awesome new content.
I wouldn't mind the upgrade cost if it came with the new boff seating.. I have said earlier, id sacrifice a console slot or hull for that.. I want to shake up what has been the boring same old same old forever. tf-u just doesn't give me the value I want in an upgrade for the iconic vessels that make this game possible..
Duh. How is a digital object real in the real world. Can you touch it, can you take it out and parade it in front of you friends? NO matter the tech that exists, that thing is just zeros and ones. Nothing more. Even on a quantum level a digital object has no value.
Lets talk mass. Does digital stuff have mass?
Lets talk dimensions. Where does digital stuff have physical dimensions? Not even oculus rift on my face is going to convince me that my starship exists here.
Lets talk about energy. No digital stuff runs on the stuff that our real world stuff runs on.
The argument is moot. As for everything else, there is no rules that govern how these guys run their business. So they get to make up the rules as they go along. Don't compare it to other mmo's , cause frankly there is not other mmo out there that has Star trek lore and history behind it.
We can argue digital rights. It will just prove that we have no say over what they do. But for those of us that are speaking out, the other few percent will just follow along happily being sheep..
Cryptic is a service provider and we are its customers. In all of business its always been a bad idea to shove it to your customer base for that extra buck. You might show profits in the short term, but in the long term, word will spread on what you run your business..
Who knows. Maybe all of this boils down to one guy in their business that doesnt give a hoot about the game, but about the bottom line only. Somehow i believe this is the same person that will end up going to jail/ end pennyless due to stabbing other ins the back.
Whether you think you are right or wrong, either way you are RIGHT.
Comments
You also need a celular service plan for the phone to be of much use too.
As I've mentioned on this topic and its associates many times over..... what we are paying for in STO is NOT a physical product and is NOT a piece of software.... we are paying for services. The system is funded on microtransactions which are for all intents and purposes providing ongoing and/or one-time services. When one purchased a particular "ship" from the c-store, they are paying a one-time fee for the use of said ship on all their appropriately factioned toons. Upgrade of said ship service to a slightly better plan (much like upgrading a cellular plan to a slightly better one) typically results in additional service fees past initial payment. Upgrading a ship from T5 to T5-U is closer to the concept of upgrading ones phone plan to include additional data.
Yeah, and even all that aside the reality is pretty simple. The game is releasing ongoing content, which requires employees, who must be paid, which costs money. It is operating on physical servers, which must be maintained, which requires money. Therefore, going forward, the game needs to keep finding ways to get money. Even beyond that, as a commercial company Cryptic has to turn a constant profit. It is not enough that people paid at some point in the past.
so, lets go into sto's digital products.
2500 zen for a ship, new ones are estimated at 3k.
to convert one of the 2500 ships unit T6 requires 500 to 1000 more zen to still get an inferior ship. a console might have one active ability, mostly passive, whereas the new boff...yeah. much more possibilities there since they AREN'T going to make the new boff and powers weaksauce because they want you to buy their copy pasta infinite new T6 ships.
this is on a product that costs them nothing beyond creation of the product. and don't play the 'oh coding is soooo hard' etc. they have pipelines for that. as many years as cryptics been creating ships it's a streamlined process. considering also low poly and low rez textures...yeah, not that much.
problem is many people think digital goods require as much effort and work as physical products...they don't. another tendency is to think they have any sort of actual real world value...once again, they don't. if you can create infinite perfect copies where's that value?
sure, cryptic wants to make money...but the current upgrade method is pure BS. spend the same zen for an inferior ship.
games are supposed to be entertaining yes? spending a little on entertainment is expected. being required to spend on a f2p mmo to access content means it's not f2p, it's a hybrid f2p+P2W/pay to play.
unless you have your head buried in sand it's obvious. the money players previously spent, the time they may have spent farming if they didn't buy zen outright = meaningless with the arrival of delta, same as all those crafting levels just reset to zero.
all to get players to spend more. instead of doing things that would get more players (more players = potential profit) and they would be willing to spend, cryptic prefers to force the issue with what player base they currently have.
season 7, the fleets and high dil costs (remember dil= zen) rep system, the doff changes (more dil) new crafting system AND resetting all levels to zero forcing another climb, at the end of which...you guessed it more dil. now delta...more dil farming or buying zen, one you will have to do.
and nothing in all that time to gather different types of players, instead actively alienating several types of players.
cryptic has the worst word of mouth online of many of the developers, along with PWE. you'd THINK they would try and improve their image, try and make themselves out to be not quite so greedy. actually make new content not trapped behind grind or pay walls.
rofl, fat chance.
so don't try to defend them, don't try to play it off as they are the good guys. they're a business that's proven they don't give a flying tribble about player concerns time and time again. one of the myriad of reason why they're so low on the list of devs/publishers that anyone would actually want to play a game from.
Donate Brains, zombies in Washington DC are starving.
And you're blindly gonna believe that PWE will let them slip a good portion of their profit for that?
Along the way it will become clear that T5 and T5-U will be completely inferior to Full T6 even if it is "just" the lack of the Specialist BOff and Trait or they won't make any money...
Unless something is on the server I am not going to believe a single word about "being competitive" and "just lacking Specialist and Trait"... remember... it's all subject to change.
digital objects : Not real
Duh. How is a digital object real in the real world. Can you touch it, can you take it out and parade it in front of you friends? NO matter the tech that exists, that thing is just zeros and ones. Nothing more. Even on a quantum level a digital object has no value.
Lets talk mass. Does digital stuff have mass?
Lets talk dimensions. Where does digital stuff have physical dimensions? Not even oculus rift on my face is going to convince me that my starship exists here.
Lets talk about energy. No digital stuff runs on the stuff that our real world stuff runs on.
The argument is moot. As for everything else, there is no rules that govern how these guys run their business. So they get to make up the rules as they go along. Don't compare it to other mmo's , cause frankly there is not other mmo out there that has Star trek lore and history behind it.
We can argue digital rights. It will just prove that we have no say over what they do. But for those of us that are speaking out, the other few percent will just follow along happily being sheep..
Cryptic is a service provider and we are its customers. In all of business its always been a bad idea to shove it to your customer base for that extra buck. You might show profits in the short term, but in the long term, word will spread on what you run your business..
Who knows. Maybe all of this boils down to one guy in their business that doesnt give a hoot about the game, but about the bottom line only. Somehow i believe this is the same person that will end up going to jail/ end pennyless due to stabbing other ins the back.