We are the sum of our possessions I guess, and as for the fed forums it,s the same mentality just a different doom.
Now to be clear, I do not wish any one to leave, but if someone does not enjoy anything about this game then a short break might be called for.
Yeah doesn't matter what side you more heavily play the whole way this is being handled and such just is bad and that is just an understatement of the situation. I am still trying to figuring out what has possibly changed though why we would trust anything cryptic or pwe says lol. Especially when it comes to the KDF and fed side learned from last year and this year they are pretty much the 18% now lol
For whose who are clueless about the 18% referrence Daniel Stahl before f2p tried to make a statement that only 18% of the player base even had a Klingon character or even played KDF and that being that it was under 1/5th of the player base that it didn't justify making anything for Klingon content even though he had stated numerous times more Klingon content was coming lol. Now though being that everyone has fallen into this bracket its more of a dilusion that they make stuff and think everyone is on board with it and then they wonder why people are putting them down so much when no one really likes what they've done in the last year pretty much it was just merely something to collect.
I had a feeling even from day one they might eventually start tossing Romulan stuff over to the Fed side. Heck, they even broke the other 'rule' so to speak by tossing over a tier 5 console.
I'm sure the Valdore console will have the Grappler and...I dunno, what else do the KDF have left? I guess the Repair Platform console could work. I certainly don't care about that thing.
Funny thing is, KDF has gotten so little love over the years, we have almost no tier 5 consoles to give up in the first place.
One disturbing thought I have is that in the future they might release new tier 5 (yes 5, not 6) KDF and Rom ships purely for the sake of packing up consoles to toss to the Feds.
Hmm...anymore, I dunno. It's more like the Federation in STO is...a virus. They are a disease, and we...are the cure.
I commented about it in one of your threads around here. There's literally nothing left to pillage from the KDF. Except...
The Bird of Prey.
And we know what the Feds have been saying about that. They want the Raider gameplay but not the price that KDF BOPs play.
They've gotten Carrier access.
They've gotten DHC capable Battlecruiser access.
They've gotten our best consoles. Watch us get the Transwarp Computer next
They've gotten limited access to Cloaks (Standard versions via Console).
KDF & Feds are going to start getting Rom Consoles.
Honestly, the only things left that the Feds have been demanding but not received are:
Battle Cloaks & All Universal BOFF Stations.
Those are the last unique things left with the KDF. We haven't gotten **** in return.
They've gotten our best consoles. Watch us get the Transwarp Computer next
They've gotten limited access to Cloaks (Standard versions via Console).
KDF & Feds are going to start getting Rom Consoles.
Honestly, the only things left that the Feds have been demanding but not received are:
Battle Cloaks & All Universal BOFF Stations.
Those are the last unique things left with the KDF. We haven't gotten **** in return.
Well, if the rumor-mill is to be believed (or at least the forum's rumor-mill, as I've yet to see anything to actually prove it is happening) The Aquarius will be redone to be a 'Fed Raider'. If it happens, I hope there is at least SOME small sense left in their heads and they actually still make that ship pay for the extras it has.
People already got their 'chance' at a raider after all with the Plesh Brek, which has no cloak, and well...look at how many of THOSE are flying around in the first place. You are right in that regard, people want the supposed 'OPness' of a BoP, but don't want to pay any costs for it.
And also true, there has yet to be a full universal ship given to the Feds, which again, they wouldn't want to pay the cost for it, of that I am sure.
But yeah...ain't got **** in return for it. We were given our generic Dyson ships with a 'slight' Klingon feel to them, and before that was the Mogh given AFTER the Avenger, and before that was the long empty space going back to the Bortasqu'.
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
But yeah...ain't got **** in return for it. We were given our generic Dyson ships with a 'slight' Klingon feel to them, and before that was the Mogh given AFTER the Avenger
But isn't that something, at least? The Mogh may have a carbon copy of the Avenger's boff layout and stats, but personally I think it looks a million times better. I would never fly an Avenger, for reasons including it looks ugly and antithetical to Starfleet. But the Mogh looks all-klingon.
But isn't that something, at least? The Mogh may have a carbon copy of the Avenger's boff layout and stats, but personally I think it looks a million times better. I would never fly an Avenger, for reasons including it looks ugly and antithetical to Starfleet. But the Mogh looks all-klingon.
Yeah they are a carbon copy but after you've played a mogh now you won't take your avenger out lol. Heck one thing I can give cryptic props on there is that it lets you better use cannons since you can have more than 1 Lt tactical. Then the way the special console works imo is way better than the avengers setup. Odds are though that was intentional try to please us in the short term and yet in the long term give the feds a reason to open lockboxes to get the console. One day they might give us KDF bug fixes in a lockbox.
Only possible way I can think of that the factions would be closer to balance is if each faction had a hand in each type of design in the game. Although I doubt defiant will ever get a battle cloak, bops won't ever be as strong as something with 5 tact consoles even with flanking its not going to happen, and romulans will fall behind eventually as all their consoles will be given out and then they will be like the KDF and not get much of anything released.
One thing though that X2 better bring to the table is a way without boffs to be able to do the same thing romulan and remans can as far as reducing battle cloak cd and extention of the cloak ambush duration. People were saying they didn't need flanking they already have battle cloak although these ppl never flew a bop only romulan ships where they had like a 30 second cloak ambush duration and like 14-15 second cd lol. Then even though I am big on the KDF and such the defiant does need a battle cloak to me IMO the ships immersion and uniqueness in DS9 series is that it had one. Although it wasn't in a romulan ship so it didn't work as well it should still have one and in the game its a destroyer but in canon it was never a destroyer it was basically the federations first raider(or one of the top 10 lol).
1. Forgive old sins and move forward?
2. Remain bitter and maintain a petty existance.
I can only speak for myself and I've probably mentioned this a few times before - what I'd want for the KDF faction from Cryptic is continuous development. Not equal with the Federation, I'm mature and smart enough to understand that with this company it's nothing but a pipe-dream. Just continuous things even at a smaller scale, to have sth. moving the faction forward even at a slower pace.
Do I agree with it? Hell no, I think it's the most incompetent and lazy aproach to factions and diversity I have ever seen, but that's besides the point now and here.
Having been here since 2011, I do consider that 2013 was the best year for the KDF and a significant improvement in the dev. attention department comapred to previous years.
So talking about my expectations in regards to the 'continuous development' I'm talking about here, I'm at a place where I'm satisfied now.
Starting LoR, we became a full faction and received a number of unique and very good missions, 2 new low-tier ships, the unique Klingon tricoder + a bunch of small and yet important stuff I'm forgetting, we got Michael Dorn VO work for the new LoR missions and as a narrator, we got the Mogh - finally something that can be very competitive in the current environment and on par with the other factions' counterparts, then shortly after (in KDF terms) we got the DSD 3-pack that even though I don't consider to be a Klingon ships based on looks - it's still a 3-pack of KDF science ships that were much needed, then the raiders were touched up and got the flanking mechanic, even got a few more uniform options lately.....so as far as 'continous development' goes, I'm satisfied currently.
See, I'm not greedy or need to have it all, even though I'm a firm believer of full equality between factions for a quality game. I just need that guarantee that the faction I'll enjoy will be getting continuous development, so I can continue enjoying my time spent in the KDF.
Plus, the last 1.5 years sure beats the glaring gap of nothingness that was before LoR.
One disturbing thought I have is that in the future they might release new tier 5 (yes 5, not 6) KDF and Rom ships purely for the sake of packing up consoles to toss to the Feds.
Nah, I'm pretty sure that apart for some weird ocassions we'll be getting T6 C-Store ships almost exclusively after Ex.2 launches. No point for them to waste time and effort on designing many new T5 ships after the demand for them plumments because there's another, superior tier of ships.
But isn't that something, at least? The Mogh may have a carbon copy of the Avenger's boff layout and stats, but personally I think it looks a million times better. I would never fly an Avenger, for reasons including it looks ugly and antithetical to Starfleet. But the Mogh looks all-klingon.
I agree with you on this one. I have both ships and still trying to figure out WTF was I thinking when I bought the Avenger, while at the same time my main char and a few alts command the Mogh.
They could always undo the cross faction console B.S. and make KDF special again, but that will never happen. There's a better chance of Earth colliding with Mars before KDF gets their stuff exclusive again.
It's just so hopeless. I wish I was in charge around here... :cool:
KDF has always been special to me, but for other reasons. I reckon to the resilient KDF guard, or the ones we refer jokingly as to "the 18%", the KDF is still and always will be special for the same reasons.
Besides, I find it hillarious to be the Feds' boogyman outnumbered 5 to 1 and with ships 2+ years old.
Yeah doesn't matter what side you more heavily play the whole way this is being handled and such just is bad and that is just an understatement of the situation. I am still trying to figuring out what has possibly changed though why we would trust anything cryptic or pwe says lol. Especially when it comes to the KDF and fed side learned from last year and this year they are pretty much the 18% now lol
For whose who are clueless about the 18% referrence Daniel Stahl before f2p tried to make a statement that only 18% of the player base even had a Klingon character or even played KDF and that being that it was under 1/5th of the player base that it didn't justify making anything for Klingon content even though he had stated numerous times more Klingon content was coming lol. Now though being that everyone has fallen into this bracket its more of a dilusion that they make stuff and think everyone is on board with it and then they wonder why people are putting them down so much when no one really likes what they've done in the last year pretty much it was just merely something to collect.
I agree trusting Cryptic for full balance would be folly. The only way to bring true balance between the factions would be to mirror the ship stats and making no one special beyond the different looks. Mirroring the stats seem to be par for the course in ship release since the Mogh, Nothing wrong with that to me. I can take less hull for a cloak, less shield for better turn and speed. These new T6 ships will probably be just that.
I do trust cryptic though to continue to include KDF and RRW factions in future content. How much though remains to be seen.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
I agree trusting Cryptic for full balance would be folly. The only way to bring true balance between the factions would be to mirror the ship stats and making no one special beyond the different looks. Mirroring the stats seem to be par for the course in ship release since the Mogh, Nothing wrong with that to me. I can take less hull for a cloak, less shield for better turn and speed. These new T6 ships will probably be just that.
See, this is where our opinions differ. There's everything wrong with this approach to me. This is very incompetent, lazy and cheap way to develop a game, especially one based on a franchise as Star Trek. Furthermore that is not balance, that's molding the factions into one so you can get away with the proverbial "murder" a.k.a. resign yourself from working more and making faction specific content and updates. And that's exactly what Cryptic is doing here. And I don't like it. They don't have the capacity to create a fulfilling experience for all the factions, so they start messing up the IP instead.
Balance is when different and unique things are balanced against eachother in a way that it won't give the owner of each inherited advantage. Balance is when things that preform differently, behave differently and appear differently produce the same outcome or produce the same amount of reaction to the action of the other one.
Balance is not me and you both having the exact same BMW model, only mine is silver and yours is black.
Nah, I'm pretty sure that apart for some weird ocassions we'll be getting T6 C-Store ships almost exclusively after Ex.2 launches. No point for them to waste time and effort on designing many new T5 ships after the demand for them plumments because there's another, superior tier of ships.
Besides, I find it hillarious to be the Feds' boogyman outnumbered 5 to 1 and with ships 2+ years old.
Oh yes, being the boogeyman is still so enjoyable.
While I do think you are right, just a nagging thought in my head makes me wonder if they would. I mean, eventually Roms and KDF are gonna run out of consoles to toss to the Fed side. So that either means they will need more ships to give consoles with, or Cryptic will have to go back to making up new consoles for it.
Also, I agree about not wanting everyone to get the same ships with every release. The Avenger/Mogh fiasco started it, and they were lazy in releasing the Dyson ships in a similar manner. I hope it stops.
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
While I do think you are right, just a nagging thought in my head makes me wonder if they would. I mean, eventually Roms and KDF are gonna run out of consoles to toss to the Fed side. So that either means they will need more ships to give consoles with, or Cryptic will have to go back to making up new consoles for it.
You need to think like Cryptic. Let's say, hypothetically, the KDF and RR really run out of consoles to give away.
If you're Cryptic, what would you do? Start making a single universal console per lockbox for everyone, or design and create multiple sub-par starships and then invent multiple unique consoles?
You need to think like Cryptic. Let's say, hypothetically, the KDF and RR really run out of consoles to give away.
If you're Cryptic, what would you do? Start making a single universal console per lockbox for everyone, or design and create multiple sub-par starships and then invent multiple unique consoles?
The single console would be less labor intesive and in turn less expensive.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
See, this is where our opinions differ. There's everything wrong with this approach to me. This is very incompetent, lazy and cheap way to develop a game, especially one based on a franchise as Star Trek. Furthermore that is not balance, that's molding the factions into one so you can get away with the proverbial "murder" a.k.a. resign yourself from working more and making faction specific content and updates. And that's exactly what Cryptic is doing here. And I don't like it. They don't have the capacity to create a fulfilling experience for all the factions, so they start messing up the IP instead.
Balance is when different and unique things are balanced against eachother in a way that it won't give the owner of each inherited advantage. Balance is when things that preform differently, behave differently and appear differently produce the same outcome or produce the same amount of reaction to the action of the other one.
Balance is not me and you both having the exact same BMW model, only mine is silver and yours is black.
This is true balance, because it is the same. All that is left over would be design prefrence and skill use. Sure their are other ways to provide balance, and yes it more cost effective. With Cryptic's reasonfor less kdf content being cost a more stock method would improve our own access to new gear. Until we increase kdf numbers their is very little else but the current status quo.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
This is true balance, because it is the same. All that is left over would be design prefrence and skill use. Sure their are other ways to provide balance, and yes it more cost effective. With Cryptic's reasonfor less kdf content being cost a more stock method would improve our own access to new gear. Until we increase kdf numbers their is very little else but the current status quo.
I get that it can be perceived as such, but that's not balance in my book. If there are 2 exaclty same things, then there's nothing to balance - they're exactly the same.
And then there's that damn 'catch 22' all over again. KDF numbers can't increase without equal attention. KDF numbers can't increase if Geko publicly states that they'll always do more for the Federation. And they certainly won't increase by releasing the same stuff with a different skin to everyone. They need to entice players to join the KDF and RR with diversity and different playstyles and experiences if they want to boost faction populations, so people will come to the KDF or RR to experience diffferent gameplay styles. Why would a Fed player try out KDF or RR if his ship is exactly the same as this raptor over here or that warbird over there?
Actually, I firmly believe that this approach, if they really take it - it's going to be counterproductive. Starting from myself - the only thing this approach would make me do is pull back to playing KDF exclusively and not bothering with other factions. Because now I'll buy a Fed crusier, but then I'll buy a new BoP for my KDF to change the pace and then maybe a warbird to switch playstyles.
If tommorow they start releasing, let's say, 3 escorts that are exactly the same for each faction - just with different skin, what in the world would make me buy the same ship to experience the same gameplay 3 times over? Absolutely nothing, such approach could affect their sales as well.
Also, I agree about not wanting everyone to get the same ships with every release. The Avenger/Mogh fiasco started it, and they were lazy in releasing the Dyson ships in a similar manner. I hope it stops.
I guess it depends on how successful the Dyson destroyers were, financially. Because mang, if anything screams laziness paired with a blatant cashgrab, it's that 9-pack.
This is true balance, because it is the same. All that is left over would be design prefrence and skill use. Sure their are other ways to provide balance, and yes it more cost effective. With Cryptic's reasonfor less kdf content being cost a more stock method would improve our own access to new gear. Until we increase kdf numbers their is very little else but the current status quo.
i watched an alien vs space marine fps hl mod thrive for a decade.
aliens (cloak and melee attacks) were perfectly balanced against space marines (ranged attacks). and it was accomplished by a student in their dorm room... if that kid can manage that feat there is no excuse in the world that cryptic cannot balance sto factions, other than the fact it isnt important to them.
i watched an alien vs space marine fps hl mod thrive for a decade.
aliens (cloak and melee attacks) were perfectly balanced against space marines (ranged attacks). and it was accomplished by a student in their dorm room... if that kid can manage that feat there is no excuse in the world that cryptic cannot balance sto factions, other than the fact it isnt important to them.
This is more difficult for cryptic because they refuse to pay for exclusive content or equipment. It does not matter if they can or not, the pattern over the past year is that any new kdf ships were either mirrored in stats like the DSD's or nearly so like the Mogh and Avenger.
My way is more regular content for the kdf and rrw like we have seen this past ten months, or more exclusive content and we get nothing for like two years like before. By the way they would still take our stuff. Wishes and hurt feelings will not get us what we want.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
You need to think like Cryptic. Let's say, hypothetically, the KDF and RR really run out of consoles to give away.
If you're Cryptic, what would you do? Start making a single universal console per lockbox for everyone, or design and create multiple sub-par starships and then invent multiple unique consoles?
Well that is actually quite easy still. After all, the ship itself that they could make wouldn't have to do diddly squat. As long as people were willing to buy the ship for the console, nobody would care that much what it did. What matters is that the console would need to be super-good so it would be bought by KDF and/or Rom players in large enough numbers to at least break even and possibly make a profit, so that it could then eventually be stuffed into a lockbox and make more money.
Besides, what scenario is kind of what us KDF players HAVE been doing for years anyways. Seriously, does anyone really use the ships that a lot of low tier consoles come on? Sure you might for leveling a toon, but I really doubt most are gonna use em at end-game or anything.
I guess it depends on how successful the Dyson destroyers were, financially. Because mang, if anything screams laziness paired with a blatant cashgrab, it's that 9-pack.
I know at the very least I didn't buy those damn Dyson ships. The Avenger/Mogh issue was one thing, as at the time I wasn't sure when the KDF would get a ship, as our 'in progress' ship at the time (I'm guessing the Mogh itself) was suddenly 'delayed' only for them days later to suddenly release the Avenger out of the blue then release the Mogh a couple months later.
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
The kdf has been waiting for t5 science ships for a long time. The DSD's were badly needed, as for how many were purhased is unclear. The consoles seemed negligable to me though. The only real telling would be the amount of kdf and rrw ships will be released through out expansion 2.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
I guess it depends on how successful the Dyson destroyers were, financially. Because mang, if anything screams laziness paired with a blatant cashgrab, it's that 9-pack.
I barely see them to be honest. And most times I do, it's the giveaway version. Mostly I see the Romulan version.
Seriously, does anyone really use the ships that a lot of low tier consoles come on? Sure you might for leveling a toon, but I really doubt most are gonna use em at end-game or anything.
I used the Vandal at end-game before I got a Guramba! :cool:
But isn't that something, at least? The Mogh may have a carbon copy of the Avenger's boff layout and stats, but personally I think it looks a million times better. I would never fly an Avenger, for reasons including it looks ugly and antithetical to Starfleet. But the Mogh looks all-klingon.
And what was the next ship after the Mogh?
Tempest.
They give the Feds ANOTHER 5 TAC ship. As it stands currently:
Kumari (5 TAC + 5 Fwd Weaps)
Fleet Defiant
Fleet Prometheus
Tempest / Fleet Patrol Escort (Recent addition, because Feds don't have enough strong Escorts, I guess)
KDF: Bortasqu TAC Cruiser with 5 TAC Consoles.
And that's it.
After roughly a 2 year drought of KDF ships since the Bortasqu', they give the Mogh. Then go right back to the Feds. Not even the Roms got a new one. But I guess Cryptic is done doing the Robber Baron thing with the Roms, so it's back to the Feds.
Now and always. Just like it's always been.
This game has favored the Feds for so much for so long that currently, one has to wonder WHY to play the KDF. Only reason is you like the look of classic KDF warships. But there's no solid reason to do so outside of that. Our uniform options suck. Our ship selection sucks. Additions to the KDF are almost non-existent (STO's history has proven this); Only thing that gets less development than the KDF is PVP, which says a whole lot because PVP gets nothing.
Mark my words. Expansion 2 will favor the Feds like never before. If you think their current lineup is great, watch it. It will completely remove any reason to play the KDF. Remember this prediction.
They give the Feds ANOTHER 5 TAC ship. As it stands currently:
Kumari (5 TAC + 5 Fwd Weaps)
Fleet Defiant
Fleet Prometheus
Tempest / Fleet Patrol Escort (Recent addition, because Feds don't have enough strong Escorts, I guess)
KDF: Bortasqu TAC Cruiser with 5 TAC Consoles.
And that's it.
After roughly a 2 year drought of KDF ships since the Bortasqu', they give the Mogh. Then go right back to the Feds. Not even the Roms got a new one. But I guess Cryptic is done doing the Robber Baron thing with the Roms, so it's back to the Feds.
Now and always. Just like it's always been.
This game has favored the Feds for so much for so long that currently, one has to wonder WHY to play the KDF. Only reason is you like the look of classic KDF warships. But there's no solid reason to do so outside of that. Our uniform options suck. Our ship selection sucks. Additions to the KDF are almost non-existent (STO's history has proven this); Only thing that gets less development than the KDF is PVP, which says a whole lot because PVP gets nothing.
Mark my words. Expansion 2 will favor the Feds like never before. If you think their current lineup is great, watch it. It will completely remove any reason to play the KDF. Remember this prediction.
And thats the kicker. I'm only hoping beyond hope we get at least one of each ship class for X2's release. At least a cruiser, raptor, sci, and maybe a BoP and carrier. Not holding my breath on carrier, they'll probably give one to feds and not kdf for t6. lulz.
I wouldn't expect KDF to get anything at all past the beginning of X2 and the first surge of T6 ships.
I play the kdf because, well the ships. I'm not into playing Dinner-plates-with-toilet-rolls-glued-on Online. :P That being said i kinda like the new cryptic designs in the concept art for feds.
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
Yeah for those who liked pretty much everything in star trek this game really is a kick to the gut when you look at faction stuff other than federation. For those of us who out of just about 9 out of 10 games in the last 3 or 4 decades the trek games are usually all about playing the enterprise or a federation generic ship lol. Although there are some out there that did allow other kinds of ships this one had the most potential but yet wasted potential.
X2 in the beginning might be okay for the kdf and romulans but after that it'll just be all federation and if we do get anything we are just beta testing it for feds before we lose it and they get it heh as in form of the power creep.
And at some point, you just give in, and roll the Fed toon with the lobotomy scar...am I right?
I'm right.
Meh.
Sorry no, I only play kdf full time. My fed toons are only if my fleet's fed side needs an extra and my klink won't work becouse of faction differences.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
They give the Feds ANOTHER 5 TAC ship. As it stands currently:
Kumari (5 TAC + 5 Fwd Weaps)
Fleet Defiant
Fleet Prometheus
Tempest / Fleet Patrol Escort (Recent addition, because Feds don't have enough strong Escorts, I guess)
KDF: Bortasqu TAC Cruiser with 5 TAC Consoles.
And that's it.
After roughly a 2 year drought of KDF ships since the Bortasqu', they give the Mogh. Then go right back to the Feds. Not even the Roms got a new one. But I guess Cryptic is done doing the Robber Baron thing with the Roms, so it's back to the Feds.
Now and always. Just like it's always been.
This game has favored the Feds for so much for so long that currently, one has to wonder WHY to play the KDF. Only reason is you like the look of classic KDF warships. But there's no solid reason to do so outside of that. Our uniform options suck. Our ship selection sucks. Additions to the KDF are almost non-existent (STO's history has proven this); Only thing that gets less development than the KDF is PVP, which says a whole lot because PVP gets nothing.
Mark my words. Expansion 2 will favor the Feds like never before. If you think their current lineup is great, watch it. It will completely remove any reason to play the KDF. Remember this prediction.
Yes they got the tempest and galaxy bundle.
One ship and some remakes over what we received this past year, as opposed to the two prior years when we received nothing but our old ships back.
The tempest and galaxy bundle is helping to pay for the set of ships.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
Uh the next ship after the Mogh was the Anniversary ship and the Dyson Destroyer pack.
But otherwise I agree with you. I wasn't doing anything but a devil's advocate defence of Cryptic, and that alone was more of a Mogh vs Avenger argument. I definitely don't appreciate the plethora of 5 tac console ships on the Federation and Romulan lineup, with the Bortasqu' being the only representative for the KDF.
Comments
We are the sum of our possessions I guess, and as for the fed forums it,s the same mentality just a different doom.
Now to be clear, I do not wish any one to leave, but if someone does not enjoy anything about this game then a short break might be called for.
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
Yeah doesn't matter what side you more heavily play the whole way this is being handled and such just is bad and that is just an understatement of the situation. I am still trying to figuring out what has possibly changed though why we would trust anything cryptic or pwe says lol. Especially when it comes to the KDF and fed side learned from last year and this year they are pretty much the 18% now lol
For whose who are clueless about the 18% referrence Daniel Stahl before f2p tried to make a statement that only 18% of the player base even had a Klingon character or even played KDF and that being that it was under 1/5th of the player base that it didn't justify making anything for Klingon content even though he had stated numerous times more Klingon content was coming lol. Now though being that everyone has fallen into this bracket its more of a dilusion that they make stuff and think everyone is on board with it and then they wonder why people are putting them down so much when no one really likes what they've done in the last year pretty much it was just merely something to collect.
I commented about it in one of your threads around here. There's literally nothing left to pillage from the KDF. Except...
The Bird of Prey.
And we know what the Feds have been saying about that. They want the Raider gameplay but not the price that KDF BOPs play.
They've gotten Carrier access.
They've gotten DHC capable Battlecruiser access.
They've gotten our best consoles. Watch us get the Transwarp Computer next
They've gotten limited access to Cloaks (Standard versions via Console).
KDF & Feds are going to start getting Rom Consoles.
Honestly, the only things left that the Feds have been demanding but not received are:
Battle Cloaks & All Universal BOFF Stations.
Those are the last unique things left with the KDF. We haven't gotten **** in return.
a voice is wispering me "it will be the kdf's gravestone"
Playing STO spamming FAW is like playing chess using always the computer's suggested moves
Well, if the rumor-mill is to be believed (or at least the forum's rumor-mill, as I've yet to see anything to actually prove it is happening) The Aquarius will be redone to be a 'Fed Raider'. If it happens, I hope there is at least SOME small sense left in their heads and they actually still make that ship pay for the extras it has.
People already got their 'chance' at a raider after all with the Plesh Brek, which has no cloak, and well...look at how many of THOSE are flying around in the first place. You are right in that regard, people want the supposed 'OPness' of a BoP, but don't want to pay any costs for it.
And also true, there has yet to be a full universal ship given to the Feds, which again, they wouldn't want to pay the cost for it, of that I am sure.
But yeah...ain't got **** in return for it. We were given our generic Dyson ships with a 'slight' Klingon feel to them, and before that was the Mogh given AFTER the Avenger, and before that was the long empty space going back to the Bortasqu'.
Yeah they are a carbon copy but after you've played a mogh now you won't take your avenger out lol. Heck one thing I can give cryptic props on there is that it lets you better use cannons since you can have more than 1 Lt tactical. Then the way the special console works imo is way better than the avengers setup. Odds are though that was intentional try to please us in the short term and yet in the long term give the feds a reason to open lockboxes to get the console. One day they might give us KDF bug fixes in a lockbox.
Only possible way I can think of that the factions would be closer to balance is if each faction had a hand in each type of design in the game. Although I doubt defiant will ever get a battle cloak, bops won't ever be as strong as something with 5 tact consoles even with flanking its not going to happen, and romulans will fall behind eventually as all their consoles will be given out and then they will be like the KDF and not get much of anything released.
One thing though that X2 better bring to the table is a way without boffs to be able to do the same thing romulan and remans can as far as reducing battle cloak cd and extention of the cloak ambush duration. People were saying they didn't need flanking they already have battle cloak although these ppl never flew a bop only romulan ships where they had like a 30 second cloak ambush duration and like 14-15 second cd lol. Then even though I am big on the KDF and such the defiant does need a battle cloak to me IMO the ships immersion and uniqueness in DS9 series is that it had one. Although it wasn't in a romulan ship so it didn't work as well it should still have one and in the game its a destroyer but in canon it was never a destroyer it was basically the federations first raider(or one of the top 10 lol).
I can only speak for myself and I've probably mentioned this a few times before - what I'd want for the KDF faction from Cryptic is continuous development. Not equal with the Federation, I'm mature and smart enough to understand that with this company it's nothing but a pipe-dream. Just continuous things even at a smaller scale, to have sth. moving the faction forward even at a slower pace.
Do I agree with it? Hell no, I think it's the most incompetent and lazy aproach to factions and diversity I have ever seen, but that's besides the point now and here.
Having been here since 2011, I do consider that 2013 was the best year for the KDF and a significant improvement in the dev. attention department comapred to previous years.
So talking about my expectations in regards to the 'continuous development' I'm talking about here, I'm at a place where I'm satisfied now.
Starting LoR, we became a full faction and received a number of unique and very good missions, 2 new low-tier ships, the unique Klingon tricoder + a bunch of small and yet important stuff I'm forgetting, we got Michael Dorn VO work for the new LoR missions and as a narrator, we got the Mogh - finally something that can be very competitive in the current environment and on par with the other factions' counterparts, then shortly after (in KDF terms) we got the DSD 3-pack that even though I don't consider to be a Klingon ships based on looks - it's still a 3-pack of KDF science ships that were much needed, then the raiders were touched up and got the flanking mechanic, even got a few more uniform options lately.....so as far as 'continous development' goes, I'm satisfied currently.
See, I'm not greedy or need to have it all, even though I'm a firm believer of full equality between factions for a quality game. I just need that guarantee that the faction I'll enjoy will be getting continuous development, so I can continue enjoying my time spent in the KDF.
Plus, the last 1.5 years sure beats the glaring gap of nothingness that was before LoR.
Nah, I'm pretty sure that apart for some weird ocassions we'll be getting T6 C-Store ships almost exclusively after Ex.2 launches. No point for them to waste time and effort on designing many new T5 ships after the demand for them plumments because there's another, superior tier of ships.
I agree with you on this one. I have both ships and still trying to figure out WTF was I thinking when I bought the Avenger, while at the same time my main char and a few alts command the Mogh.
KDF has always been special to me, but for other reasons. I reckon to the resilient KDF guard, or the ones we refer jokingly as to "the 18%", the KDF is still and always will be special for the same reasons.
Besides, I find it hillarious to be the Feds' boogyman outnumbered 5 to 1 and with ships 2+ years old.
those werent actually new ships.
those were two ships that had existed prior to cryptic moving the kdf starting point to 25.
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I agree trusting Cryptic for full balance would be folly. The only way to bring true balance between the factions would be to mirror the ship stats and making no one special beyond the different looks. Mirroring the stats seem to be par for the course in ship release since the Mogh, Nothing wrong with that to me. I can take less hull for a cloak, less shield for better turn and speed. These new T6 ships will probably be just that.
I do trust cryptic though to continue to include KDF and RRW factions in future content. How much though remains to be seen.
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
See, this is where our opinions differ. There's everything wrong with this approach to me. This is very incompetent, lazy and cheap way to develop a game, especially one based on a franchise as Star Trek. Furthermore that is not balance, that's molding the factions into one so you can get away with the proverbial "murder" a.k.a. resign yourself from working more and making faction specific content and updates. And that's exactly what Cryptic is doing here. And I don't like it. They don't have the capacity to create a fulfilling experience for all the factions, so they start messing up the IP instead.
Balance is when different and unique things are balanced against eachother in a way that it won't give the owner of each inherited advantage. Balance is when things that preform differently, behave differently and appear differently produce the same outcome or produce the same amount of reaction to the action of the other one.
Balance is not me and you both having the exact same BMW model, only mine is silver and yours is black.
Oh yes, being the boogeyman is still so enjoyable.
While I do think you are right, just a nagging thought in my head makes me wonder if they would. I mean, eventually Roms and KDF are gonna run out of consoles to toss to the Fed side. So that either means they will need more ships to give consoles with, or Cryptic will have to go back to making up new consoles for it.
Also, I agree about not wanting everyone to get the same ships with every release. The Avenger/Mogh fiasco started it, and they were lazy in releasing the Dyson ships in a similar manner. I hope it stops.
You need to think like Cryptic. Let's say, hypothetically, the KDF and RR really run out of consoles to give away.
If you're Cryptic, what would you do? Start making a single universal console per lockbox for everyone, or design and create multiple sub-par starships and then invent multiple unique consoles?
The single console would be less labor intesive and in turn less expensive.
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
This is true balance, because it is the same. All that is left over would be design prefrence and skill use. Sure their are other ways to provide balance, and yes it more cost effective. With Cryptic's reasonfor less kdf content being cost a more stock method would improve our own access to new gear. Until we increase kdf numbers their is very little else but the current status quo.
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
I get that it can be perceived as such, but that's not balance in my book. If there are 2 exaclty same things, then there's nothing to balance - they're exactly the same.
And then there's that damn 'catch 22' all over again. KDF numbers can't increase without equal attention. KDF numbers can't increase if Geko publicly states that they'll always do more for the Federation. And they certainly won't increase by releasing the same stuff with a different skin to everyone. They need to entice players to join the KDF and RR with diversity and different playstyles and experiences if they want to boost faction populations, so people will come to the KDF or RR to experience diffferent gameplay styles. Why would a Fed player try out KDF or RR if his ship is exactly the same as this raptor over here or that warbird over there?
Actually, I firmly believe that this approach, if they really take it - it's going to be counterproductive. Starting from myself - the only thing this approach would make me do is pull back to playing KDF exclusively and not bothering with other factions. Because now I'll buy a Fed crusier, but then I'll buy a new BoP for my KDF to change the pace and then maybe a warbird to switch playstyles.
If tommorow they start releasing, let's say, 3 escorts that are exactly the same for each faction - just with different skin, what in the world would make me buy the same ship to experience the same gameplay 3 times over? Absolutely nothing, such approach could affect their sales as well.
aliens (cloak and melee attacks) were perfectly balanced against space marines (ranged attacks). and it was accomplished by a student in their dorm room... if that kid can manage that feat there is no excuse in the world that cryptic cannot balance sto factions, other than the fact it isnt important to them.
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This is more difficult for cryptic because they refuse to pay for exclusive content or equipment. It does not matter if they can or not, the pattern over the past year is that any new kdf ships were either mirrored in stats like the DSD's or nearly so like the Mogh and Avenger.
My way is more regular content for the kdf and rrw like we have seen this past ten months, or more exclusive content and we get nothing for like two years like before. By the way they would still take our stuff. Wishes and hurt feelings will not get us what we want.
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
Well that is actually quite easy still. After all, the ship itself that they could make wouldn't have to do diddly squat. As long as people were willing to buy the ship for the console, nobody would care that much what it did. What matters is that the console would need to be super-good so it would be bought by KDF and/or Rom players in large enough numbers to at least break even and possibly make a profit, so that it could then eventually be stuffed into a lockbox and make more money.
Besides, what scenario is kind of what us KDF players HAVE been doing for years anyways. Seriously, does anyone really use the ships that a lot of low tier consoles come on? Sure you might for leveling a toon, but I really doubt most are gonna use em at end-game or anything.
I know at the very least I didn't buy those damn Dyson ships. The Avenger/Mogh issue was one thing, as at the time I wasn't sure when the KDF would get a ship, as our 'in progress' ship at the time (I'm guessing the Mogh itself) was suddenly 'delayed' only for them days later to suddenly release the Avenger out of the blue then release the Mogh a couple months later.
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
I barely see them to be honest. And most times I do, it's the giveaway version. Mostly I see the Romulan version.
I used the Vandal at end-game before I got a Guramba! :cool:
And what was the next ship after the Mogh?
Tempest.
They give the Feds ANOTHER 5 TAC ship. As it stands currently:
Kumari (5 TAC + 5 Fwd Weaps)
Fleet Defiant
Fleet Prometheus
Tempest / Fleet Patrol Escort (Recent addition, because Feds don't have enough strong Escorts, I guess)
KDF: Bortasqu TAC Cruiser with 5 TAC Consoles.
And that's it.
After roughly a 2 year drought of KDF ships since the Bortasqu', they give the Mogh. Then go right back to the Feds. Not even the Roms got a new one. But I guess Cryptic is done doing the Robber Baron thing with the Roms, so it's back to the Feds.
Now and always. Just like it's always been.
This game has favored the Feds for so much for so long that currently, one has to wonder WHY to play the KDF. Only reason is you like the look of classic KDF warships. But there's no solid reason to do so outside of that. Our uniform options suck. Our ship selection sucks. Additions to the KDF are almost non-existent (STO's history has proven this); Only thing that gets less development than the KDF is PVP, which says a whole lot because PVP gets nothing.
Mark my words. Expansion 2 will favor the Feds like never before. If you think their current lineup is great, watch it. It will completely remove any reason to play the KDF. Remember this prediction.
And thats the kicker. I'm only hoping beyond hope we get at least one of each ship class for X2's release. At least a cruiser, raptor, sci, and maybe a BoP and carrier. Not holding my breath on carrier, they'll probably give one to feds and not kdf for t6. lulz.
I wouldn't expect KDF to get anything at all past the beginning of X2 and the first surge of T6 ships.
I play the kdf because, well the ships. I'm not into playing Dinner-plates-with-toilet-rolls-glued-on Online. :P That being said i kinda like the new cryptic designs in the concept art for feds.
Ok, fair enough, but even so, you only used it until you got your Gurumba, which doesn't have a fleet version.
And at some point, you just give in, and roll the Fed toon with the lobotomy scar...am I right?
I'm right.
Meh.
X2 in the beginning might be okay for the kdf and romulans but after that it'll just be all federation and if we do get anything we are just beta testing it for feds before we lose it and they get it heh as in form of the power creep.
Sorry no, I only play kdf full time. My fed toons are only if my fleet's fed side needs an extra and my klink won't work becouse of faction differences.
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
Yes they got the tempest and galaxy bundle.
One ship and some remakes over what we received this past year, as opposed to the two prior years when we received nothing but our old ships back.
The tempest and galaxy bundle is helping to pay for the set of ships.
I was Klingon before Klingon was cool.
But otherwise I agree with you. I wasn't doing anything but a devil's advocate defence of Cryptic, and that alone was more of a Mogh vs Avenger argument. I definitely don't appreciate the plethora of 5 tac console ships on the Federation and Romulan lineup, with the Bortasqu' being the only representative for the KDF.