I'm not saying that FTL drive can never happen. I'm saying that the timeframes of the people using it could never be synced because time is relative to spatial position. That there is no such thing as an absolutely synced common timeframe.
People would routinely arrive places before or centuries after they left depending on how this stuff pans out and that would simply become a part of the setting. It's a contrivance that you'd have a linear time progressing at the same rate for everyone once you have FTL travel.
I'm not saying that FTL drive can never happen. I'm saying that the timeframes of the people using it could never be synced because time is relative to spatial position. That there is no such thing as an absolutely synced common timeframe.
People would routinely arrive places before or centuries after they left depending on how this stuff pans out and that would simply become a part of the setting. It's a contrivance that you'd have a linear time progressing at the same rate for everyone once you have FTL travel.
Warping space with a warp bubble or micro black hole (my favorite method) should not create additional relativistic problems.
However, they are still traveling at impulse often - somewhere between 1/3 and 2/3 s.o.l. This, as well as simply being on different planets will cause problems with timeframe of reference. Of course, there is not absolute time at all.
The answer to why it's not addressed much is that it is tedious and not incredibly important. If they were traveling for large amounts of time at 0.9 + s.o.l it would be a huge problem. Ooops the admiral back at the academy died 20 years ago, I was supposed to report to him!
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
No, because it is a game not a Simulator. Let me say it one more time: Because it is a GAME not a Simulator. People want to go back and finish off their Kill Accolades or replay favorite Missions - or play them for new Loot drops.
People simply need to accept that STO is a game full of gaming tropes. One such trope is replaying things for any number of reasons. STO is not SIM City Star Trek. It never has been, it never claimed to be, nor will it ever be.
This is something I have said for some time but I would say that it's a form of simulator.
It's an episode simulator, not a world simulator.
Hence rapid travel, lack of things like dance lessons and staging plays and eating in the mess hall unless those things forwar4d a plot.
It's not purely a game like Tetris or pinball or blackjack. (Actually even those games have narratives although they are entirely mechanical narratives.)
It's also not a world or life simulator like The Sims.
At its core and at its best, STO is a Star Trek episode simulator. That stuff that happens offscreen between episodes is largely handwaved or simulated through DOffing and roleplay.
When you replay a fleet action, STF, or episode, it's in large measure a rerun. Although I can see some room for budging on that a bit and Stephen D'Angelo has suggested as much as well, when he talked about lecturing his team on the difference between repeatable content and replayable content. That some content rather than simulating a specific episode can simulate a specific KIND of episode. Colony Invasion is a light example of this. The random changes to A Step Between Stars or the branching pathlines in Of Bajor is another. You could, within the episode simulator framework, have game encounters which vary wildly but which represent a standard stock plot that can vary on replay.
You could in theory have a replayable mission on DS9 where the bartender causes trouble with a scheme but the details of the scheme vary, the enemies vary, the solution varies. Enough variables and no two play throughs are identical.
In a thread about why people are still fighting in 2410 but all the previous missions are in 2409, you nitpick that really?
Okay just to nitpick the troll at the bud, they are beginning peaceful talks but still the mission that is the current FE is the only one taking place at that time. All the rest are before that time. Happy so we can get back to what is really about in here?
___________________
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
In a thread about why people are still fighting in 2410 but all the previous missions are in 2409, you nitpick that really?
Okay just to nitpick the troll at the bud, they are beginning peaceful talks but still the mission that is the current FE is the only one taking place at that time. All the rest are before that time. Happy so we can get back to what is really about in here?
It's not nitpicking ... the point is : It's not beyond possible there are still Skirmishes / Territorial Disputes etc in 2410 ... so you don't even have to play the "But it's all back in 2409" - Card ... the whole peace thing is extremely vague ... and I'm pretty sure that's intentional otherwise Cryptic would have to redesign DoFF-Missions i.E. ...
check DS9 - 5x01 [Gowron's Cease-Fire] & 5x04 [Klingon Attack on Arcanis] for that matter ...
Patch Notes : Resolved an Issue, where people would accidently experience Fun.
It's not nitpicking ... the point is : It's not beyond possible there are still Skirmishes / Territorial Disputes etc in 2410 ... so you don't even have to play the "But it's all back in 2409" - Card ... the whole peace thing is extremely vague ... and I'm pretty sure that's intentional otherwise Cryptic would have to redesign DoFF-Missions i.E. ...
check DS9 - 5x01 [Gowron's Cease-Fire] & 5x04 [Klingon Attack on Arcanis] for that matter ...
And where does it say ALL the missions that were in 2409 is now in 2410? Link it since you are saying check stuff out.
The troll is strong with you.
___________________
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
And where does it say ALL the missions that were in 2409 is now in 2410? Link it since you are saying check stuff out.
The troll is strong with you.
Seriously what's your problem ... who said such a thing ... it really doesn't matter what year they are ... that's the point as I told you before ... fighting Klingons is STILL POSSIBLE because of the vague Ending in "Surface Tension"
It's safe to assume, though ... we're not traveling back in Time every time we do a Doff-Mission i.E.
Who's trolling, you're just Butt-hurt ...
Patch Notes : Resolved an Issue, where people would accidently experience Fun.
Seriously what's your problem ... who said such a thing ... it really doesn't matter what year they are ... that's the point as I told you before ...
It's safe to assume, though ... we're not traveling back in Time every time we do a Doff-Mission i.E.
Not feeding your troll attempts any more. It was you who first had an issue with my mentioning the year. If you had no issue then you shouldn't have had one with what started this.
But even Cryptic isn't so p-poor of writers to now say what was once 2409 that is now everything happens in 2410 and not just the new mission that they point out is 2410.
And prior stuff is reruns. Like somewhere TOS is still being aired. But because the TNG era happen, does that mean Kirk and co are in Picard's time?
___________________
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
Not feeding your troll attempts any more. It was you who first had an issue with my mentioning the year. If you had no issue then you shouldn't have had one with what started this.
But even Cryptic isn't so p-poor of writers to now say what was once 2409 that is now everything happens in 2410 and not just the new mission that they point out is 2410.
And prior stuff is reruns. Like somewhere TOS is still being aired. But because the TNG era happen, does that mean Kirk and co are in Picard's time?
Seriously ... the OP Question was "Why am I killing Klingons & Romulans", I was just providing an alternative Answer [one, where nobody really has to care about what year it is] ... if you have a problem with it ... go back to sleep, you obviously got off the wrong foot today ...
Is Doffing prior Stuff, too ... there are still Klingon Marauding Missions i.E. , granted it's just a game ... but again these "Raid Vulcan Science Station" - Missions COULD still happen in 2410 ... because there is no official peace-treaty or anything ... "Surface Tension" basically ended with a "Now anything can happen" ...
Patch Notes : Resolved an Issue, where people would accidently experience Fun.
As far as I'm concerned all content before 'Surface Tension' is 2409, while from 'Surface Tension' it's 2410. Things like STF's and things like 'Breaking the Planet' are tied to a specific story arc within the STO mission timeline. For example all the Romulan content new Romulas etc should be tied in with the Romulan arc and therefore should be considred 'finished' when the next arc happens. Klingon stuff=Klingon arc and so on. The borg STF's were supposed to take place as part of the Borg arc but now they have completely retconned the Undine/Borg arc so now it doesn't really fit anymore
They are. It's actually even said in some missions. Some people seem to want to ignore that.
Oh boy ... who's trolling now ... you're just not getting the point ... I never ever said the opposite ... yes some Missions are obviously in 2410, while others are obviously in 2409, yet others like Doff-Missions are unclear (happy now ?) ... which doesn't really matter at all, because all the things I told you above, you just choose to ignore ... so have a nice day ... stay being butt-hurt, for what reason whatsoever, and post ridiculous answers, to statements nobody even made ...
Patch Notes : Resolved an Issue, where people would accidently experience Fun.
As far as I'm concerned all content before 'Surface Tension' is 2409, while from 'Surface Tension' it's 2410. Things like STF's and things like 'Breaking the Planet' are tied to a specific story arc within the STO mission timeline. For example all the Romulan content new Romulas etc should be tied in with the Romulan arc and therefore should be considred 'finished' when the next arc happens. Klingon stuff=Klingon arc and so on. The borg STF's were supposed to take place as part of the Borg arc but now they have completely retconned the Undine/Borg arc so now it doesn't really fit anymore
Too true.
And to make the character limit for posting, a letter to Cryptiic to help those who think everything is 2410.
Dear, Cryptic.
I know you guys just redid that Fed tutorial. I do like it. Don't get me wrong. On new characters, I replay it because I like it. But we have a problem. Since it's outside the realm of possibility that events are in 2409 now and all the stuff is fights happening with rebels or the Tal Shiar in 2410, I must say you have to redo that Fed tutorial yet again. I don't want you to but to solve the issue that some people have with events happening prior to 2410.
Don't change the tutorial as far as mission or story goes though. Just change these things to help the nitpickers.
1. Banners all over the place say "Class of 2409" need to be changed to "Class of 2410".
2. When raising the toast, you have to change it from 2409 to 2410.
And that's just the tutorial. You need to go through every mission that even has the year mentioned and change it. Oh and that book that mentions 2409 on the cover, you got to reprint it with the new title changed to 2410.
I know this is unnecessary work but just to save their sanity. And it will waste time that could be used on what happens after the latest mission. But oh well.
lol
___________________
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
As far as I'm concerned all content before 'Surface Tension' is 2409, while from 'Surface Tension' it's 2410. Things like STF's and things like 'Breaking the Planet' are tied to a specific story arc within the STO mission timeline. For example all the Romulan content new Romulas etc should be tied in with the Romulan arc and therefore should be considred 'finished' when the next arc happens. Klingon stuff=Klingon arc and so on. The borg STF's were supposed to take place as part of the Borg arc but now they have completely retconned the Undine/Borg arc so now it doesn't really fit anymore
I tend to ignore that completely TRIBBLE 2410 introduction. As far as I am concerned its somewhen about 2421^^
Supported by the fact that we indeed HAD time progression in the mission logs once and that did already put us into 2418.
The dyson destroyer alone should proof other wise. Even for fictional science its impossible to refit even an already existing starship on that degree with dyson tech within a few weeks, and this is what the idea suggests that the entire story takes place in one year.
Building that ship from the scratch would even take longer (I'd suggest at least a decade).
No way that all happened in one year.
If they want to introduce I time progression in the story arc... which I really like as an idea, it should make at least remotely sense. I could live with 2414 to mirror real time progression, although this would already be stupid, but forgivable.. But never ever ever ever ever 2410.
I do and I will continue to ignore that stupidity.
But for the rest I agree.
Playing a mission tied to an arc that is in the past is a rerun or a flashback or how ever you want to call it. It takes place then.
If I replay stranded in space that is indeed still 2409 for example. Same for stfs or fleet actions or the ce.
I tend to ignore that completely TRIBBLE 2410 introduction. As far as I am concerned its somewhen about 2421^^
Supported by the fact that we indeed HAD time progression in the mission logs once and that did already put us into 2418.
The dyson destroyer alone should proof other wise. Even for fictional science its impossible to refit even an already existing starship on that degree with dyson tech within a few weeks, and this is what the idea suggests that the entire story takes place in one year.
Building that ship from the scratch would even take longer (I'd suggest at least a decade).
No way that all happened in one year.
If they want to introduce I time progression in the story arc... which I really like as an idea, it should make at least remotely sense. I could live with 2414 to mirror real time progression, although this would already be stupid, but forgivable.. But never ever ever ever ever 2410.
I do and I will continue to ignore that stupidity.
But for the rest I agree.
Playing a mission tied to an arc that is in the past is a rerun or a flashback or how ever you want to call it. It takes place then.
If I replay stranded in space that is indeed still 2409 for example. Same for stfs or fleet actions or the ce.
But the time all being this close means my characters are beating the promotion rate record of Johnny Rico. Still second to JJ-verse Kirk though. I think that record will always be safe to Captain. But one year to Vice Admiral is even beating JJ-verse Kirk.
___________________
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
Logically the game should mirror the same passage of time as the real world (I mean come on we've been stuck in 2409 for 4 years now!). It doen't make sense when we've already had what like 3 winter events in the same in-game year? I mean how many times can winter occur in 1 year...
Why are we still killing Klinks? Because they're stupid, ugly, they have fleas, they don't wash, they have mange, they have lice (different to fleas), and most importantly, because they deserve it.
Romulans? Well, they're a little more tolerable. I think we should only smack them with a wet newspaper to remind them of how stupid they were before their plant went boom-boom.
Logically the game should mirror the same passage of time as the real world (I mean come on we've been stuck in 2409 for 4 years now!). It doen't make sense when we've already had what like 3 winter events in the same in-game year? I mean how many times can winter occur in 1 year...
Winter is coming...
___________________
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
Why are we still killing Klinks? Because they're stupid, ugly, they have fleas, they don't wash, they have mange, they have lice (different to fleas), and most importantly, because they deserve it.
Romulans? Well, they're a little more tolerable. I think we should only smack them with a wet newspaper to remind them of how stupid they were before their plant went boom-boom.
And the Undine has tricked the Feddy Bears so many times, it's become a cliche. And he calls the other factions stupid? lol
___________________
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
Well the Undine can't seem to work out that the fleet that entered their realm was fake...
Well, it has only been fake a week. Give them some time.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
Logically the game should mirror the same passage of time as the real world (I mean come on we've been stuck in 2409 for 4 years now!). It doen't make sense when we've already had what like 3 winter events in the same in-game year? I mean how many times can winter occur in 1 year...
...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
Comments
The only thing I can say is....
Wow!!! People are actually playing Breaking the Planet?????
I have been queuing that mission several times a day for about a month and that is as far as I have gotten.
I think this would be a great choice. But...
Still have them available to play under a new 'Historical Battles" tab for those who have finished "Surface Tension" (ending the war).
arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1203368/pve-content-a-list-of-gamewide-polishing-pass-suggestions
The Empire of lies.
I'm not saying that FTL drive can never happen. I'm saying that the timeframes of the people using it could never be synced because time is relative to spatial position. That there is no such thing as an absolutely synced common timeframe.
People would routinely arrive places before or centuries after they left depending on how this stuff pans out and that would simply become a part of the setting. It's a contrivance that you'd have a linear time progressing at the same rate for everyone once you have FTL travel.
Warping space with a warp bubble or micro black hole (my favorite method) should not create additional relativistic problems.
However, they are still traveling at impulse often - somewhere between 1/3 and 2/3 s.o.l. This, as well as simply being on different planets will cause problems with timeframe of reference. Of course, there is not absolute time at all.
The answer to why it's not addressed much is that it is tedious and not incredibly important. If they were traveling for large amounts of time at 0.9 + s.o.l it would be a huge problem. Ooops the admiral back at the academy died 20 years ago, I was supposed to report to him!
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
This is something I have said for some time but I would say that it's a form of simulator.
It's an episode simulator, not a world simulator.
Hence rapid travel, lack of things like dance lessons and staging plays and eating in the mess hall unless those things forwar4d a plot.
It's not purely a game like Tetris or pinball or blackjack. (Actually even those games have narratives although they are entirely mechanical narratives.)
It's also not a world or life simulator like The Sims.
At its core and at its best, STO is a Star Trek episode simulator. That stuff that happens offscreen between episodes is largely handwaved or simulated through DOffing and roleplay.
When you replay a fleet action, STF, or episode, it's in large measure a rerun. Although I can see some room for budging on that a bit and Stephen D'Angelo has suggested as much as well, when he talked about lecturing his team on the difference between repeatable content and replayable content. That some content rather than simulating a specific episode can simulate a specific KIND of episode. Colony Invasion is a light example of this. The random changes to A Step Between Stars or the branching pathlines in Of Bajor is another. You could, within the episode simulator framework, have game encounters which vary wildly but which represent a standard stock plot that can vary on replay.
You could in theory have a replayable mission on DS9 where the bartender causes trouble with a scheme but the details of the scheme vary, the enemies vary, the solution varies. Enough variables and no two play throughs are identical.
In a thread about why people are still fighting in 2410 but all the previous missions are in 2409, you nitpick that really?
Okay just to nitpick the troll at the bud, they are beginning peaceful talks but still the mission that is the current FE is the only one taking place at that time. All the rest are before that time. Happy so we can get back to what is really about in here?
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
It's not nitpicking ... the point is : It's not beyond possible there are still Skirmishes / Territorial Disputes etc in 2410 ... so you don't even have to play the "But it's all back in 2409" - Card ... the whole peace thing is extremely vague ... and I'm pretty sure that's intentional otherwise Cryptic would have to redesign DoFF-Missions i.E. ...
check DS9 - 5x01 [Gowron's Cease-Fire] & 5x04 [Klingon Attack on Arcanis] for that matter ...
And where does it say ALL the missions that were in 2409 is now in 2410? Link it since you are saying check stuff out.
The troll is strong with you.
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
Seriously what's your problem ... who said such a thing ... it really doesn't matter what year they are ... that's the point as I told you before ... fighting Klingons is STILL POSSIBLE because of the vague Ending in "Surface Tension"
It's safe to assume, though ... we're not traveling back in Time every time we do a Doff-Mission i.E.
Who's trolling, you're just Butt-hurt ...
Not feeding your troll attempts any more. It was you who first had an issue with my mentioning the year. If you had no issue then you shouldn't have had one with what started this.
But even Cryptic isn't so p-poor of writers to now say what was once 2409 that is now everything happens in 2410 and not just the new mission that they point out is 2410.
And prior stuff is reruns. Like somewhere TOS is still being aired. But because the TNG era happen, does that mean Kirk and co are in Picard's time?
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
Some queue events and missions are happening before year 2410.
Seriously ... the OP Question was "Why am I killing Klingons & Romulans", I was just providing an alternative Answer [one, where nobody really has to care about what year it is] ... if you have a problem with it ... go back to sleep, you obviously got off the wrong foot today ...
Is Doffing prior Stuff, too ... there are still Klingon Marauding Missions i.E. , granted it's just a game ... but again these "Raid Vulcan Science Station" - Missions COULD still happen in 2410 ... because there is no official peace-treaty or anything ... "Surface Tension" basically ended with a "Now anything can happen" ...
Exposing fakes since 2374
They are. It's actually even said in some missions. Some people seem to want to ignore that.
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
Oh boy ... who's trolling now ... you're just not getting the point ... I never ever said the opposite ... yes some Missions are obviously in 2410, while others are obviously in 2409, yet others like Doff-Missions are unclear (happy now ?) ... which doesn't really matter at all, because all the things I told you above, you just choose to ignore ... so have a nice day ... stay being butt-hurt, for what reason whatsoever, and post ridiculous answers, to statements nobody even made ...
Too true.
And to make the character limit for posting, a letter to Cryptiic to help those who think everything is 2410.
Dear, Cryptic.
I know you guys just redid that Fed tutorial. I do like it. Don't get me wrong. On new characters, I replay it because I like it. But we have a problem. Since it's outside the realm of possibility that events are in 2409 now and all the stuff is fights happening with rebels or the Tal Shiar in 2410, I must say you have to redo that Fed tutorial yet again. I don't want you to but to solve the issue that some people have with events happening prior to 2410.
Don't change the tutorial as far as mission or story goes though. Just change these things to help the nitpickers.
1. Banners all over the place say "Class of 2409" need to be changed to "Class of 2410".
2. When raising the toast, you have to change it from 2409 to 2410.
And that's just the tutorial. You need to go through every mission that even has the year mentioned and change it. Oh and that book that mentions 2409 on the cover, you got to reprint it with the new title changed to 2410.
I know this is unnecessary work but just to save their sanity. And it will waste time that could be used on what happens after the latest mission. But oh well.
lol
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
I tend to ignore that completely TRIBBLE 2410 introduction. As far as I am concerned its somewhen about 2421^^
Supported by the fact that we indeed HAD time progression in the mission logs once and that did already put us into 2418.
The dyson destroyer alone should proof other wise. Even for fictional science its impossible to refit even an already existing starship on that degree with dyson tech within a few weeks, and this is what the idea suggests that the entire story takes place in one year.
Building that ship from the scratch would even take longer (I'd suggest at least a decade).
No way that all happened in one year.
If they want to introduce I time progression in the story arc... which I really like as an idea, it should make at least remotely sense. I could live with 2414 to mirror real time progression, although this would already be stupid, but forgivable.. But never ever ever ever ever 2410.
I do and I will continue to ignore that stupidity.
But for the rest I agree.
Playing a mission tied to an arc that is in the past is a rerun or a flashback or how ever you want to call it. It takes place then.
If I replay stranded in space that is indeed still 2409 for example. Same for stfs or fleet actions or the ce.
But the time all being this close means my characters are beating the promotion rate record of Johnny Rico. Still second to JJ-verse Kirk though. I think that record will always be safe to Captain. But one year to Vice Admiral is even beating JJ-verse Kirk.
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
Exposing fakes since 2374
Romulans? Well, they're a little more tolerable. I think we should only smack them with a wet newspaper to remind them of how stupid they were before their plant went boom-boom.
Exposing fakes since 2374
Winter is coming...
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
And the Undine has tricked the Feddy Bears so many times, it's become a cliche. And he calls the other factions stupid? lol
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
Exposing fakes since 2374
Exposing fakes since 2374
Reading this then looking at your sig. I lol'ed.
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution
1 for each planet in the universe. doesnt mean they all have them at the same exact time. some planets, like andoria, are cold all year long
As many times as Q wants.