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Your solution to the Kobayashi Maru.

cbrjwrrcbrjwrr Member Posts: 2,782 Arc User
edited April 2014 in Ten Forward
What would you do?

I think it is safe to presume I don't need to explain it on here.
Post edited by cbrjwrr on
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  • ashkrik23ashkrik23 Member Posts: 10,809 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    cbrjwrr wrote: »
    What would you do?

    I think it is safe to presume I don't need to explain it on here.

    Eat an apple while blowing up Klingon ships with my hand.



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  • anazondaanazonda Member Posts: 8,399 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    I beat the KM... In Starfleet Academy, Bridge Commander and STO.

    First by cheating, then by kiting and finally by fighting...

    Each works equally well for me.
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  • starswordcstarswordc Member Posts: 10,966 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    cbrjwrr wrote: »
    What would you do?

    I think it is safe to presume I don't need to explain it on here.

    I've always been partial to Mackenzie Calhoun's solution: Blow up the Maru myself. Either the crew is already dead in which case the whole thing's a trap, or the crew is not dead and after I waste the lives of my crew trying to rescue them they'll end up in Klingon custody, and frankly death by exploding starship is a kinder fate.
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  • kojirohellfirekojirohellfire Member Posts: 1,606 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    I'd have several teams take all available shuttlecraft filled with the supplies necessary to repair the Kobayashi launch immediately before closing in with the Klingons, firing all weapons, while maintaining large distance from the freighter (I'd kite them away from it if necessary). Then once I was in range with the Klingon Birds of Prey, I'd activate the ship's self-destruct, taking the Klingons with me.

    It's a modification of Chekov's plan who stupidly used escape pods and killed his crew with radiation. At least in shuttlecraft, the teams have a chance to complete the task while I sacrifice the ship.
  • starswordcstarswordc Member Posts: 10,966 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Alternative solution (era-dependent, mind): Don't enter the Neutral Zone at all. Contact the Federation embassy on Qo'noS and have them handle it.
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  • simeion1simeion1 Member Posts: 898 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Four letter WWKD? (What would Kirk Do)
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  • redsnake721redsnake721 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    If I was in the TOS era I would use my contacts in Starfleet security and on the high council to have the blue prints for the cloaking device that Kirk stole from the Romulans. I would have my Chief Engeneer build one but hide it and keep it a secret until a situation arose where it would be needed. Then just cloak and wait until the right moment then drop in and beam the crew to safety.
  • ryan218ryan218 Member Posts: 36,106 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    I wouldn't engage the Klingons at all. I'd get in range of the Maru at high warp, drop out of warp just long enough to beam the crew aboard and a photon torpedo into the Maru's engine room, and jump back into warp, firing a torpedo spread to blind the Klingon sensors while also detonating the torpedo on the Maru.

    Kobayashi Maru's crew is safe, the Klingons think the ship was destroyed, and I'm not dead.
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  • anazondaanazonda Member Posts: 8,399 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    ryan218 wrote: »
    I wouldn't engage the Klingons at all. I'd get in range of the Maru at high warp, drop out of warp just long enough to beam the crew aboard and a photon torpedo into the Maru's engine room, and jump back into warp, firing a torpedo spread to blind the Klingon sensors while also detonating the torpedo on the Maru.

    Kobayashi Maru's crew is safe, the Klingons think the ship was destroyed, and I'm not dead.

    In SFA you can try it... But theres a jamming field in place... Try to tractor it, and the klingons blow it up, try to kite the ships away a squadron decloaks once you get too far away and blows it up.

    Survive the first wave, another appears, and another, and another... The closest I got to the non-cheating solution was 4 ships short of the 2'nd squadron...
    Don't look silly... Don't call it the "Z-Store/Zen Store"...
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  • marcusdkanemarcusdkane Member Posts: 7,439 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    I'd use the Kobayashi Maru as a shield from the Klingons (or as much as possible) while beaming any survivors over... I expect I'd wind up getting rear-ended by a cloaked squadron as soon as I drop shields for transport, but given the scenario is supposed to be unbeatable, I wouldn't focus on trying to beat it, and do what I could instead... :cool:
  • grandnaguszek1grandnaguszek1 Member Posts: 2,188 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Assume this is TOS era against Klingons.

    I would use that maneuver that Picard used on that Ferengi ship while commanding the Stargazer: go into warp for a millisecond and come out behind the klingon ship, presumably all their shield power will be to forward still and their sensors will still think your in front of them. When your out of warp behind them, fire a full spread of photon torpedoes. Then do that on as many klingon ships as possible until you are successfully able to rescue the crew of the maru.
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  • hawku001xhawku001x Member Posts: 10,769 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    offer the klingons my surrender then join them, and through years of gaining their trust, become one of them..... then, gain even more trust by entering into their politics..... then after years of that, make subtle changes to their society, and reap the benefits of their discomfort (would be a long test)
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  • ryan218ryan218 Member Posts: 36,106 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    hawku001x wrote: »
    offer the klingons my surrender then join them, and through years of gaining their trust, become one of them..... then, gain even more trust by entering into their politics..... then after years of that, make subtle changes to their society, and reap the benefits of their discomfort (would be a long test)

    It wouldn't be long at all. Klingons don't accept surrender. Saavik tried that in WoK, and they blew the ship up.
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  • kuntelkuntel Member Posts: 16,484 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    I would aim my ship at the nearst Klingon and set a collision course. Then transport the crew to a Klingon ship and systematically take it over, then set it for a collision course. Rinse, wash, and repeat. It entirely depends on if the transporter would work. If not, substitute for shuttles.
  • hawku001xhawku001x Member Posts: 10,769 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    ryan218 wrote: »
    It wouldn't be long at all. Klingons don't accept surrender. Saavik tried that in WoK, and they blew the ship up.

    all i have to do is perform klingon opera then..... bam-- *swoon*
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  • aeonthehermitaeonthehermit Member Posts: 218 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Assuming that the obvious cheating thing isn't allowed in this scenario, I wonder how well declaring the Kobayashi Maru to be the targets of my ship's pursuit to the Klingons would go over. Especially after declaring our intent to scuttle the ship with armed torpedoes, then actually beaming over the torpedoes (Possibly swapping them for survivors). If not, then plan B, which involves whatever shuttles I can muster (not many, since I fly a Defiant) coasting in on minimal power via inertia, then covertly beaming over crew while I kick up a tussle to distract the Klinks. They'd likely have to try Transport Buffer tricks, but I could likely save at least a few before having to turn tail and run.
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  • sumghaisumghai Member Posts: 1,072 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    starswordc wrote: »
    I've always been partial to Mackenzie Calhoun's solution: Blow up the Maru myself. Either the crew is already dead in which case the whole thing's a trap, or the crew is not dead and after I waste the lives of my crew trying to rescue them they'll end up in Klingon custody, and frankly death by exploding starship is a kinder fate.

    As am I.

    I've made this part of my toon's backstory, such that after he does this during the exam, he has a falling out with a close friend because the latter's family were merchants in real life.
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  • disposeableh3r0disposeableh3r0 Member Posts: 1,927 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Theres a book based in the enterprise era that uses the kobayashi maru as an actual situation that captain archer faced during the early days of the romulan war.

    The Klingon ships were actualy under the control of romulans. The romulans had developed a telecapturing system allowing them to remotely hijack enemy vessels and were trying to stat a war between the coalition and the empire.

    The hacking weapon is also the reason the NX has more advanced looking control interfaces than the Connie. As a counter measure to the hacking weapon Starfleet hardens their command and control systems by reverting to a more analog setup, its also the birth of the prefix code.
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  • disposeableh3r0disposeableh3r0 Member Posts: 1,927 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Upon actually thinking about it I have come up with this...

    If we are ignoring the most obvious solution to the scenario, leave the maru to its fate and save my (much larger) crew instead, then the only other real option is to fight.

    3 on 1 is long odds but I think I may have some ways to even it up.

    Upon encountering the Klingon vessels I would first order all escape pods launched and programmed to "land" on the three Klingon ships. I would then fire a full spread of torpedoes ahead of the pods.

    Using he few seconds of cover I created I would close on the first vessel to maneuver away from my incoming torpedoes, the assumption being that this ship has exposed the least armed facing to me.

    With the assumption that Klingon ships tend to be heavily armed in their forward arcs, I would attempt to stay abreast and among the three ships, since federation ships tend to have a distributed armament this should give me the advantage in this kind of combat since I can put out the same damage in all directions at once.

    With any luck some of my pods made contact with their targets, and since escape pods are designed for re-entry I can only hope hey could do some considerable damage upon impact.

    I would target the nacelles of my Klingon foes first hoping that the shields in this area are weakened slightly by the engines.

    During the melee if at all possible I would eject a few antimatter storage pods, maybe some unfortunate Klingon will run into one.


    Maybe I'll live maybe ill doe but I know I'll take at least one with me.
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  • fmgtorres1979fmgtorres1979 Member Posts: 1,327 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    I don't think people usually get what this test is even though they do explain it (or maybe they get it but they just don't accept it). Firstly it's not a win or loose test, it's a test designed to perceive how the person would act. If you don't risk your crew it's fine, if you all die trying to save lives is fine too.

    The test has no "solution". Kirk's "victory" is also in line with the test's idea, as it shows very well how he works; if you can't win, cheat. It's fine, too.



    I would have crossed the border and assist the Maru.
  • disposeableh3r0disposeableh3r0 Member Posts: 1,927 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    fmgtorres1979 wrote: »
    I don't think people usually get what this test is even though they do explain it (or maybe they get it but they just don't accept it). Firstly it's not a win or loose test, it's a test designed to perceive how the person would act. If you don't risk your crew it's fine, if you all die trying to save lives is fine too.

    The test has no "solution". Kirk's "victory" is also in line with the test's idea, as it shows very well how he works; if you can't win, cheat. It's fine, too.



    I would have crossed the border and assist the Maru.

    IDK. personally I see it as a failure if you choose to sacrifice you crew and your ship in pursuit of an un attainable goal.

    I mean It must not even be an option for the test since a Vulcan didn't do it. Vulcans being the ultimate pragmatists.

    Which is why I assume you don't have a choice in the matter and must pursue the engagement.

    I wonder how much a student knows about the test before taking it.
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  • fmgtorres1979fmgtorres1979 Member Posts: 1,327 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    disposeableh3r0 wrote: »
    IDK. personally I see it as a failure if you choose to sacrifice you crew and your ship in pursuit of an un attainable goal.

    I mean It must not even be an option for the test since a Vulcan didn't do it. Vulcans being the ultimate pragmatists.

    Which is why I assume you don't have a choice in the matter and must pursue the engagement.

    I wonder how much a student knows about the test before taking it.

    You are not choosing to sacrifice anyone. It's what happens because that's how they rig the test. Just like in your real life you may have a choice a day that ends up being catastrophic.
  • disposeableh3r0disposeableh3r0 Member Posts: 1,927 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    fmgtorres1979 wrote: »
    You are not choosing to sacrifice anyone. It's what happens because that's how they rig the test. Just like in your real life you may have a choice a day that ends up being catastrophic.

    well lets see and assume we know nothing about how the test plays out.

    Test starts

    Maru cries: HALP! I'm stuck in a bear trap in the neutral zone.

    I ponder: Dad says not to go in there but the maru needs help so we go.

    I go

    3 Evil Klingons show up

    I say: Hallow evil Klingons! Sorry I'm in your yard but that idiot in the maru is stuck in a bear trap and I must help.

    Klingons say: "torpedo fool!"

    At this point I can choose to leave the maru to its fate and sacrifice its crew or fight the Klingons


    Option A) the maru is dumb anyway:

    I leave, its destroyed and we deal with the loss of the crew. But I accept that against the 3 evil Klingons I would have died too, and we deal with the people who would insist that there was a way. Maybe if I had bounced a graviton particle bean off the main deflector dish......

    Option B) Klingons are smelly and must be destroyed.

    I poke the Klingons in the eye and they kill me and the maru. Some one may eventually find out what happened to my ship. The familys can be comforted by the notion that their loved ones gave their lives in the service of a greater cause while attempting to provide aide to an idiot in a bear trap. But in the end it was a futile effort and not so many need have died.


    Which is why I assume the option to leave is not available to the cadets or the simulation is programmed to ambush then if they attempted to do so. Because if you could it is the most logical option.
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  • artan42artan42 Member Posts: 10,450 Bug Hunter
    edited April 2014
    I would decloak my OP scimitar and launch an Alpha Strike wiping out the Klingons in one hit they fly around stupidly as I don't have Transfer Shield Strength for the freighter.
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  • fmgtorres1979fmgtorres1979 Member Posts: 1,327 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    disposeableh3r0 wrote: »

    (...)

    Which is why I assume the option to leave is not available to the cadets or the simulation is programmed to ambush then if they attempted to do so. Because if you could it is the most logical option.


    I don't know how it's rigged (I don't think anyone knows as it's fiction), but I believe that once you cross the neutral zone your fate is sealed.

    I don't think it was ever mentioned the option of not helping.
  • talonxvtalonxv Member Posts: 4,257 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    My solution, Picard maneuver, over and over again. Just quick warp jumps between each klingon ship, fire a burst then disappear again and just continue till all klingon ships are dust, then rescue the crew at my leasure.

    Picard maneuver FTW.
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  • disposeableh3r0disposeableh3r0 Member Posts: 1,927 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    fmgtorres1979 wrote: »
    I don't know how it's rigged (I don't think anyone knows as it's fiction), but I believe that once you cross the neutral zone your fate is sealed.

    I don't think it was ever mentioned the option of not helping.

    I still think leaving is the best option anyway.

    Consider.

    Why are there mines in the neutral zone?

    Isn't it odd that there are already 3 Klingon cruisers in he neutral zone when you arrive?

    Why are they already jamming communications? And ready for battle?

    Doesn't this hint at a slightly larger plot that just an unlucky series of events?

    Is that information potentially worth more than the lives of the freighter crew?
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  • ryan218ryan218 Member Posts: 36,106 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    disposeableh3r0 wrote: »
    I still think leaving is the best option anyway.

    Consider.

    Why are there mines in the neutral zone?

    Isn't it odd that there are already 3 Klingon cruisers in he neutral zone when you arrive?

    Why are they already jamming communications? And ready for battle?

    Doesn't this hint at a slightly larger plot that just an unlucky series of events?

    Is that information potentially worth more than the lives of the freighter crew?

    It's possible that it's based heavily on the original events in the Earth-Romulan War; the Romulans mined the area between the Coalition, the Klingons and the Star Empire. They take control of 3 Klingon Cruisers and jam Enterprise, etc, etc.

    Tweak it a little to suit the era and you have the no-win scenario.
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  • fmgtorres1979fmgtorres1979 Member Posts: 1,327 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    disposeableh3r0 wrote: »
    I still think leaving is the best option anyway.

    Consider.

    Why are there mines in the neutral zone?

    Isn't it odd that there are already 3 Klingon cruisers in he neutral zone when you arrive?

    Why are they already jamming communications? And ready for battle?

    Doesn't this hint at a slightly larger plot that just an unlucky series of events?

    Is that information potentially worth more than the lives of the freighter crew?


    I'm pretty sure the test would allow for the Captain not to go into the Neutral zone, therefore respecting the treaties. But I don't think anyone has ever mentioned that. And that doesn't mean the test wouldn't throw something at you just the same.
  • disposeableh3r0disposeableh3r0 Member Posts: 1,927 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    fmgtorres1979 wrote: »
    I'm pretty sure the test would allow for the Captain not to go into the Neutral zone, therefore respecting the treaties. But I don't think anyone has ever mentioned that. And that doesn't mean the test wouldn't throw something at you just the same.


    hmmmm

    Captain I'm receiving a distress call!

    Tell it I'm busy.

    CAPTAIN WE HAVE A WARPCORE BREACH IN..........
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