Those days SHOULD be gone. No one should be able to get their entire cap in 5-10 minute - 2 missions. There is no incentive to play past 10 minutes if you reach your caps in that period of time.
These huge rewards for minimal effort is what has turned STO into a grindfest - because people can simply run through 5 characters in around 30 minutes and make 20,000 Refined Dilithium just doing one mission over and over.
People are burning themselves out trying to earn the most Dilithium, and thus Zen, they can with the least amount of effort.
You think running elite fleet actions is minimal effort? I have five Marauder mules that would like a word with you. :rolleyes: But never mind that, I'll play your game. If you think accumulation of resources in this game needs a massive nerf, then fine. Ask Cryptic to just come out and say they're nerfing resource accumulation across the board instead of shuffling things around patch after patch and upselling it as a buff. There's no need to call a duck a goose. Just be straight with us for god sakes. We're not all morons.
Just an FYI update - they have since removed the update from blog #5 and moved it farther back to Blog #3 where it is a "better" place to locate it:rolleyes:
It's easy, just open the launcher and click the tribble button above the patch status bar.
I'm sorry, I don't see it. Do you mean on Arc or the regular launcher. I just use the regular.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
It's a bonus of 55, that number was chosen because it is enough to do both the large and small project, with a few left over. All other rewards are the same.
Ah okay, It isn't on tribble yet, so wasn't sure.
I still do not consider 55 marks as "Large". They need to change that to "moderate" or "enough".
There are silly ppl like me, who actually use the BNP's to, you know, buy equipment. Not an issue on my Fed (I recently converted over 900 of them during Dilithium weekend); but on my newly rolled Rom, who's still in for the long grind haul, I say this nerf reeks.
Also, it is becoming more and more clear Cryptic is nerfing the existing reps and STFs to promote new ones. Very lame.
From what I have seen on tribble, the equipment in Omega rep still costs the same, 5 bnp's and 1000 Marks for a space piece.
This needs to be 2-3 bnp's and 600 Marks to account for the lower rewards.
b)they have removed the chance to get 6 or 11 Bio-neural Processors
c)they have removed the 3 to 4x per day 3 hour bonus event which netted an extra 25% and replaced it with 1 single mark weekend that happened back in Feb with none slated as far as can been seen.
Which ever way you look at it, it is still another nerf.
I'm sorry, I don't see it. Do you mean on Arc or the regular launcher. I just use the regular.
There is usually a box along the bottom after you first click the login button - but BEFORE you click engage
Holodeck - (box) Tribble -(box) Redshirt (box) These boxes default to Holodeck and are located above the update window in the bottom left corner of the Launcher.
There is usually a box along the bottom after you first click the login button - but BEFORE you click engage
Holodeck - (box) Tribble -(box) Redshirt (box) These boxes default to Holodeck and are located above the update window in the bottom left corner of the Launcher.
Yes, thanks, I was looking into that earlier for the rep system changes but didn't want to get involved with Arc to copy the character. Thanks for trying to help, though. Eventually I will try and get on tribble.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
I suppose I need to grind the Borg Infected Elite missions to max out my chances of getting BNPs prior to S9.
At least the Space Infected missions are the ones I enjoy the most playing. I'll probably limit myself to no more than 6 times per day during the weekends...
Right - give up something players like a lot - space STFs and force them into Ground stuff they don't like as much? Sounds good!
It's the same with the Voth Rep system. You can play the Spire mission and get your one commendation, a bunch of Dyson marks and dil, and maybe one or two VCI. Or, you could go to Voth BZ and, for about the same amount of time, get triple that.
Besides, the Omega system already forces you to play ground if you want to get the maximum number of Omega marks in a single run. I really don't see what your issue is.
stardestroyer001, Admiral, Explorers Fury PvE/PvP Fleet | Retired PvP Player
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9 My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
People need to stop shouting DOOOOOOOOOOM before something even arrives. But of course we know that's impossible here.
But this isn't the DOOM thread. That one is elsewhere in the forum. It goes DOOM DUH DOOM DOOM. DOOM DUH DOOM DOOM DOOOOOOOM. Or: DOOMDOOM. DOOMDOOM. DOOMDOOMDOOMDOOMDOOM (the second one is supposed to be the "Jaws" theme). Or we can just sing along with the Isley Brothers song "Shout".
I still do not consider 55 marks as "Large". They need to change that to "moderate" or "enough".
From what I have seen on tribble, the equipment in Omega rep still costs the same, 5 bnp's and 1000 Marks for a space piece.
This needs to be 2-3 bnp's and 600 Marks to account for the lower rewards.
Which ever way you look at it, it is still another nerf.
There is NO reduction in the mark cost/dilithium cost/or BNP cost to obtain items that I can see, however, the BNP trade in has been reduced from 5/1000D to 3/1000D
The rep levels also all cost 30 marks for each 20h project - unlike before:
I have to go from memory:
17 for T0-T1
20 for T1-T2
28 For T2-T3
29 for T3 - T4
32 for T4 - T5
Have not done the math to see what the total mark cost of old vs new system is.
There is NO reduction in the mark cost/dilithium cost/or BNP cost to obtain items that I can see, however, the BNP trade in has been reduced from 5/1000D to 3/1000D
The rep levels also all cost 30 marks for each 20h project - unlike before:
I have to go from memory:
17 for T0-T1
20 for T1-T2
28 For T2-T3
29 for T3 - T4
32 for T4 - T5
Have not done the math to see what the total mark cost of old vs new system is.
So basically, if what you said is correct, it's easier to get dil and a little more difficult to complete rep projects. So again, how is this a nerf to dil generation?
stardestroyer001, Admiral, Explorers Fury PvE/PvP Fleet | Retired PvP Player
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9 My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
It's the same with the Voth Rep system. You can play the Spire mission and get your one commendation, a bunch of Dyson marks and dil, and maybe one or two VCI. Or, you could go to Voth BZ and, for about the same amount of time, get triple that.
Besides, the Omega system already forces you to play ground if you want to get the maximum number of Omega marks in a single run. I really don't see what your issue is.
Most people in the game like the Borg STFs - they are simple and time efficient
Just look any day at the Q's - you will see 50-100 people in Infected elite and perhaps 30-60 in KSE
The only other Q'd mission that comes anywhere close is CC(mirror is a temp event so I don't count that)
Even the Voth battlezone has dropped of dramtically - but the Borg STFs still going strong - we shall see what happens in S9
the equipment that you will only buy ONCE!! Has had it's cost reduced in processors!! Yay!!
To be fair there is quite a bit of equipment. 3 Borg, 3 MACO space, 3 MACO ground, 3 Omega space, 3 Omega ground, 3 KDF space, 3 KDF ground and 3 adapted set.
So basically, if what you said is correct, it's easier to get dil and a little more difficult to complete rep projects. So again, how is this a nerf to dil generation?
It IS a major nerf because everyone got a MIN of 1 BNP but a chance to get 6 or 11 BNPs - many times I would go 5 runs and get only one - then I could have 3 back to back runs of getting 11 BNPs each time.
From S9 onward that is being ELIMINATED - and the max anyone can get is 1 (from the space missions at least - I don't know about the ground ones)
It IS a major nerf because everyone got a MIN of 1 BNP but a chance to get 6 or 11 BNPs - many times I would go 5 runs and get only one - then I could have 3 back to back runs of getting 11 BNPs each time.
From S9 onward that is being ELIMINATED - and the max anyone can get is 1 (from the space missions at least - I don't know about the ground ones)
Like I said, its a direct nerf to resource accumulation. Keep in mind you can no longer get multiple BNPs, and your " HUGE DAILY MARK BONUS" is a mere 55 marks. Yowch.
Don't expect the Voth ground to be lucrative much longer, either. It's currently way too fast and easy DIL.
Well if they are dropping at a rate similar to Voth implants unless they changed that very recently it cant be limited to one I have had 2 before from the Voth space maps.
To be fair there is quite a bit of equipment. 3 Borg, 3 MACO space, 3 MACO ground, 3 Omega space, 3 Omega ground, 3 KDF space, 3 KDF ground and 3 adapted set.
Not exactly the right thread for feedback but the new system is very annoying because you can't benefit from set bonuses until you are all the way through the rep system - with the move to all Mk12 items.
It IS a major nerf because everyone got a MIN of 1 BNP but a chance to get 6 or 11 BNPs - many times I would go 5 runs and get only one - then I could have 3 back to back runs of getting 11 BNPs each time.
From S9 onward that is being ELIMINATED - and the max anyone can get is 1 (from the space missions at least - I don't know about the ground ones)
So what? It just means you are certain to run 3 STFs to fill the upcoming dil project, as opposed to 1-5 STFs to fill the current dil project. They're trying to standardize the drops (similar to how EDCs evolved into the Omega rep system). It's not a bad thing, it's just different.
stardestroyer001, Admiral, Explorers Fury PvE/PvP Fleet | Retired PvP Player
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9 My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
So what? It just means you are certain to run 3 STFs to fill the upcoming dil project, as opposed to 1-5 STFs to fill the current dil project. They're trying to standardize the drops (similar to how EDCs evolved into the Omega rep system). It's not a bad thing, it's just different.
Any way you run the math it's another NERF - but at this point why bother arguing - I am over it now as it won't change Cryptic's mind one bit.
What they are going for is High turnover - short-term players to come in and spend and then leave - maybe come back - maybe not. It just does not seem to be a good business model, but I must be wrong because they say they are still making money - so MEH
Any way you run the math it's another NERF - but at this point why bother arguing - I am over it now as it won't change Cryptic's mind one bit.
What they are going for is High turnover - short-term players to come in and spend and then leave - maybe come back - maybe not. It just does not seem to be a good business model, but I must be wrong because they say they are still making money - so MEH
Yes, but an incredibly minor one. It won't change the fact that I run several STFs for marks - if I needed dil that badly, that's what Voth BZ is for.
As for high turnover, I agree with you. Cryptic's last release on the number of people that play the game, compared to the number of people I see in the instance-changing box, don't add up. Yes, the business model is a bad one (take their money and leave them to their own devices) - Cryptic has made, and continues to make, blunder after blunder that will eventually cost them a LOT of money.
stardestroyer001, Admiral, Explorers Fury PvE/PvP Fleet | Retired PvP Player
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9 My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
People need to stop shouting DOOOOOOOOOOM before something even arrives. But of course we know that's impossible here.
Your solution seems to work perfectly .
Keep the playerbase divided , make fun of the "Doom" sayers while offer soothing words to those in doubt and ... end up with a Dilithium Bonus Weekend once every ... 3 months or so .
So please come out and share : you don't give a f#$% about the STF playerbase , you have your way of earning Dil (so you're good) , and as for the rest (if they're not as "good" as you) then they can go $%&^* themselfs .
How close am I to the truth ?
- As for the rest of you -- yes , this is one more nerf .
Cryptic is "reinvisioning" STO's entire economy , one piece at a time ( so ppl don't throw themselves out the window) , for the single reason of making you reach for your wallet more ... because (if I had to guess) , ships & lockboxes are not selling like they used to .
Your solution seems to work perfectly .
Keep the playerbase divided , make fun of the "Doom" sayers while offer soothing words to those in doubt and ... end up with a Dilithium Bonus Weekend once every ... 3 months or so .
So please come out and share : you don't give a f#$% about the STF playerbase , you have your way of earning Dil (so you're good) , and as for the rest (if they're not as "good" as you) then they can go $%&^* themselfs .
How close am I to the truth ?
- As for the rest of you -- yes , this is one more nerf .
Cryptic is "reinvisioning" STO's entire economy , one piece at a time ( so ppl don't throw themselves out the window) , for the single reason of making you reach for your wallet more ... because (if I had to guess) , ships & lockboxes are not selling like they used to .
I am not calling "Doom" per se - BUT - in the last several months I have lost over 20 friends that have left the game because the changes/grinds etc became too much. For me that matters WAY more then the actual dilithium/implants/ec - whatever rewards - as I have lots of that - but the loss of friends in the game is a major problem from my perspective.
- As for the rest of you -- yes , this is one more nerf .
Cryptic is "reinvisioning" STO's entire economy , one piece at a time ( so ppl don't throw themselves out the window) , for the single reason of making you reach for your wallet more ... because (if I had to guess) , ships & lockboxes are not selling like they used to .
Right - so they remove the daily bonus 3 hour time + they remove the bonus marks that you had the chance to get EVERY time you ran the mission + they are removing the 6 or 11 Borg neural processors - and replacing it with some magical 1 time a day Bonus to marks - sounds like a major nerf to me.
Oh wait - players could do other content that they might not want to do - just to make up the lost rewards - even better:rolleyes:
Wasn't this the reasoning behind the removal of the Dill awards from the STF's in S.7 ?
Just sneaking it in from the back door I guess .
Problem is , most of the players who could do 1+1 have left this game already ... , so I'm not really expecting a lot of outrage .
Wasn't this the reasoning behind the removal of the Dill awards from the STF's in S.7 ?
Just sneaking it in from the back door I guess .
Problem is , most of the players who could do 1+1 have left this game already ... , so I'm not really expecting a lot of outrage .
Wonder if Mav over at Jupiter Force will pick on any of the big changes in this coming weekends podcast - he seems to have been moving away from STO for awhile now.
Those days SHOULD be gone. No one should be able to get their entire cap in 5-10 minute - 2 missions. There is no incentive to play past 10 minutes if you reach your caps in that period of time.
These huge rewards for minimal effort is what has turned STO into a grindfest - because people can simply run through 5 characters in around 30 minutes and make 20,000 Refined Dilithium just doing one mission over and over.
People are burning themselves out trying to earn the most Dilithium, and thus Zen, they can with the least amount of effort.
Oh Wise One ... please tell us ... what do you think ppl are going to do now ?
See their choices just got reduced to :
1) Grind A LOT for very little .
2) Shoot dino's in the face all day long . (soon to be nerfed , err 'improved')
Yes, but an incredibly minor one. It won't change the fact that I run several STFs for marks - if I needed dil that badly, that's what Voth BZ is for.
I wouldn't expect that one to last much longer either, partner.
As for high turnover, I agree with you. Cryptic's last release on the number of people that play the game, compared to the number of people I see in the instance-changing box, don't add up. Yes, the business model is a bad one (take their money and leave them to their own devices) - Cryptic has made, and continues to make, blunder after blunder that will eventually cost them a LOT of money.
I've seen this in other games. It changes hands from person A to person B, many things are altered in a manner to make Person B look good to executives who don't see (or care) the "WHY" or "HOW" just that numbers are up. Person B leaves, leaving a mess behind them.
Not saying it will happen here, but it SURE LOOKS FAMILIAR.
Comments
You think running elite fleet actions is minimal effort? I have five Marauder mules that would like a word with you. :rolleyes: But never mind that, I'll play your game. If you think accumulation of resources in this game needs a massive nerf, then fine. Ask Cryptic to just come out and say they're nerfing resource accumulation across the board instead of shuffling things around patch after patch and upselling it as a buff. There's no need to call a duck a goose. Just be straight with us for god sakes. We're not all morons.
I'm sorry, I don't see it. Do you mean on Arc or the regular launcher. I just use the regular.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Ah okay, It isn't on tribble yet, so wasn't sure.
I still do not consider 55 marks as "Large". They need to change that to "moderate" or "enough".
From what I have seen on tribble, the equipment in Omega rep still costs the same, 5 bnp's and 1000 Marks for a space piece.
This needs to be 2-3 bnp's and 600 Marks to account for the lower rewards.
Which ever way you look at it, it is still another nerf.
There is usually a box along the bottom after you first click the login button - but BEFORE you click engage
Holodeck - (box) Tribble -(box) Redshirt (box) These boxes default to Holodeck and are located above the update window in the bottom left corner of the Launcher.
But you must copy a character over first:
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1043641
Yes, thanks, I was looking into that earlier for the rep system changes but didn't want to get involved with Arc to copy the character. Thanks for trying to help, though. Eventually I will try and get on tribble.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
At least the Space Infected missions are the ones I enjoy the most playing. I'll probably limit myself to no more than 6 times per day during the weekends...
It's the same with the Voth Rep system. You can play the Spire mission and get your one commendation, a bunch of Dyson marks and dil, and maybe one or two VCI. Or, you could go to Voth BZ and, for about the same amount of time, get triple that.
Besides, the Omega system already forces you to play ground if you want to get the maximum number of Omega marks in a single run. I really don't see what your issue is.
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9
My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
But this isn't the DOOM thread. That one is elsewhere in the forum. It goes DOOM DUH DOOM DOOM. DOOM DUH DOOM DOOM DOOOOOOOM. Or: DOOMDOOM. DOOMDOOM. DOOMDOOMDOOMDOOMDOOM (the second one is supposed to be the "Jaws" theme). Or we can just sing along with the Isley Brothers song "Shout".
There is NO reduction in the mark cost/dilithium cost/or BNP cost to obtain items that I can see, however, the BNP trade in has been reduced from 5/1000D to 3/1000D
The rep levels also all cost 30 marks for each 20h project - unlike before:
I have to go from memory:
17 for T0-T1
20 for T1-T2
28 For T2-T3
29 for T3 - T4
32 for T4 - T5
Have not done the math to see what the total mark cost of old vs new system is.
So basically, if what you said is correct, it's easier to get dil and a little more difficult to complete rep projects. So again, how is this a nerf to dil generation?
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9
My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
Most people in the game like the Borg STFs - they are simple and time efficient
Just look any day at the Q's - you will see 50-100 people in Infected elite and perhaps 30-60 in KSE
The only other Q'd mission that comes anywhere close is CC(mirror is a temp event so I don't count that)
Even the Voth battlezone has dropped of dramtically - but the Borg STFs still going strong - we shall see what happens in S9
Another across the board nerf with people actually pretending it's a good thing.
To be fair there is quite a bit of equipment. 3 Borg, 3 MACO space, 3 MACO ground, 3 Omega space, 3 Omega ground, 3 KDF space, 3 KDF ground and 3 adapted set.
Daizen - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
Selia - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
It IS a major nerf because everyone got a MIN of 1 BNP but a chance to get 6 or 11 BNPs - many times I would go 5 runs and get only one - then I could have 3 back to back runs of getting 11 BNPs each time.
From S9 onward that is being ELIMINATED - and the max anyone can get is 1 (from the space missions at least - I don't know about the ground ones)
Like I said, its a direct nerf to resource accumulation. Keep in mind you can no longer get multiple BNPs, and your " HUGE DAILY MARK BONUS" is a mere 55 marks. Yowch.
Don't expect the Voth ground to be lucrative much longer, either. It's currently way too fast and easy DIL.
Not exactly the right thread for feedback but the new system is very annoying because you can't benefit from set bonuses until you are all the way through the rep system - with the move to all Mk12 items.
For example
T2 unlocks Assimilated Deflector Mk12
T3 unlocks Assimilated Impulse Mk12
T5 Unlocks Assimilated Shield Mk12
So ALL sets if you want the 3 - piece bonus - you have to wait until T5
and to get any 2 piece bonus you need to wait until T3!!
Rayzee
excellentawesome#4589
torgaddon101
raeat
So what? It just means you are certain to run 3 STFs to fill the upcoming dil project, as opposed to 1-5 STFs to fill the current dil project. They're trying to standardize the drops (similar to how EDCs evolved into the Omega rep system). It's not a bad thing, it's just different.
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9
My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
Any way you run the math it's another NERF - but at this point why bother arguing - I am over it now as it won't change Cryptic's mind one bit.
What they are going for is High turnover - short-term players to come in and spend and then leave - maybe come back - maybe not. It just does not seem to be a good business model, but I must be wrong because they say they are still making money - so MEH
Yes, but an incredibly minor one. It won't change the fact that I run several STFs for marks - if I needed dil that badly, that's what Voth BZ is for.
As for high turnover, I agree with you. Cryptic's last release on the number of people that play the game, compared to the number of people I see in the instance-changing box, don't add up. Yes, the business model is a bad one (take their money and leave them to their own devices) - Cryptic has made, and continues to make, blunder after blunder that will eventually cost them a LOT of money.
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9
My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
Your solution seems to work perfectly .
Keep the playerbase divided , make fun of the "Doom" sayers while offer soothing words to those in doubt and ... end up with a Dilithium Bonus Weekend once every ... 3 months or so .
So please come out and share : you don't give a f#$% about the STF playerbase , you have your way of earning Dil (so you're good) , and as for the rest (if they're not as "good" as you) then they can go $%&^* themselfs .
How close am I to the truth ?
- As for the rest of you -- yes , this is one more nerf .
Cryptic is "reinvisioning" STO's entire economy , one piece at a time ( so ppl don't throw themselves out the window) , for the single reason of making you reach for your wallet more ... because (if I had to guess) , ships & lockboxes are not selling like they used to .
I am not calling "Doom" per se - BUT - in the last several months I have lost over 20 friends that have left the game because the changes/grinds etc became too much. For me that matters WAY more then the actual dilithium/implants/ec - whatever rewards - as I have lots of that - but the loss of friends in the game is a major problem from my perspective.
probably nailed it. its just a nerf.
Wasn't this the reasoning behind the removal of the Dill awards from the STF's in S.7 ?
Just sneaking it in from the back door I guess .
Problem is , most of the players who could do 1+1 have left this game already ... , so I'm not really expecting a lot of outrage .
Wonder if Mav over at Jupiter Force will pick on any of the big changes in this coming weekends podcast - he seems to have been moving away from STO for awhile now.
Oh Wise One ... please tell us ... what do you think ppl are going to do now ?
See their choices just got reduced to :
1) Grind A LOT for very little .
2) Shoot dino's in the face all day long . (soon to be nerfed , err 'improved')
3) Reach for that wallet .
I wouldn't expect that one to last much longer either, partner.
I've seen this in other games. It changes hands from person A to person B, many things are altered in a manner to make Person B look good to executives who don't see (or care) the "WHY" or "HOW" just that numbers are up. Person B leaves, leaving a mess behind them.
Not saying it will happen here, but it SURE LOOKS FAMILIAR.