That I find is simple excuse. I never focus on my character's rear when playing. I am watching where I am going and what is around me. If you are staring at basically what amounts to a cartoons butt when playing, then the issues are deeper then I thought.
It is the simple third person view that is usually used I am talking about. It is not about focus, but about what is simply there. You can't avoid looking at the butt if you are stuck in third person mode since it is part of being in third person mode. This could be avoided if we had non-standard player models, but either way, you either use first person mode or you are forced to look at a pixelated butt as well as the rest of your character. Since you are forced to look at your character's butt, then you can either go with staring at something you don't want to see so try to avoid looking at your character or make it tolerable. What you are talking about is simply not there. I was talking about the entire behind of a character and not just one specific area. If I mean the buttocks, then I will say butt. If all I was interested was pixelated butts, then there are far easier and better methods than Star Trek Online. There are better F2P MMOs for that type of stuff.
That I find is simple excuse. I never focus on my character's rear when playing. I am watching where I am going and what is around me. If you are staring at basically what amounts to a cartoons butt when playing, then the issues are deeper then I thought.
There's no 'issues' with doing that. A male's brain evolved to be attracted to the shape of a female, and the attraction that a healthy brain experiences cannot distinguish between fantasy or reality.
It's the same as being attracted to women in swimsuit magazines, as they're merely ink on paper, and to a more extreme example, perfectly healthy men can be attracted to mere drawings if they bare the resemblance to a woman's shape enough.
I'm sorry, but accusing men of being mentally unhealthy if they consider a game's characters eye candy is just wrong.
The simplest and probably most popular reason why guys play female characters on MMOs. I rather look at a women's behind all day than a males. Attributing more reason to such an action is simply not true for most cases.
This post must be the most common single statement in forums across the internet apart from "cake is a lie".
If it were so true why do you need to tell everyone so often? Just play as your "waifu" or whatever and expect some heckling.
There's no 'issues' with doing that. A male's brain evolved to be attracted to the shape of a female, and the attraction that a healthy brain experiences cannot distinguish between fantasy or reality.
It's the same as being attracted to women in swimsuit magazines, as they're merely ink on paper, and to a more extreme example, perfectly healthy men can be attracted to mere drawings if they bare the resemblance to a woman's shape enough.
I'm sorry, but accusing men of being mentally unhealthy if they consider a game's characters eye candy is just wrong.
You're using the pretense of science to justify knuckle-dragging perpetual adolescence here.
You don't speak for everyone, nor do your 'facts'. Some people are creeped out by others obsessing about their digital pretend girlfriends/alter-egos. I'm not, though I almost never play a female character.
What does creep me out is how often these guys have to loudly tell everyone that their eyes are on the pretend rear of their pretend character in a video game. And the only offense I take is at the horrible fashion sense most of these people have in their characters: all-white miniskirt and gogo boots "innocent" fantasy avatars look more like drag queens than anything.
I'd prefer seeing more serious, Trek like outfits too... there are bajilion people with skimpy characters as it is... and one of reasons why I don't roll KDF character is, that I'd die inside from seeing all the skimpy Orions around... my friend was kind enough to warn me.
All in all, it's people's choice, but I personally think there are enough skimpy outfits as it is. If they add more? I'll live, if I don't have to use them, so they surely won't make any $$ on me for these outfits. Simply as that.
[10:20] Your Lunge deals 4798 (2580) Physical Damage(Critical) to Tosk of Borg.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator "bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh." "Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness."~Day[9] "Your fun isn't wrong."~LaughingTrendy
I just don't want it in STO. I f you got hangups because your wife, or girlfriend won't wear hoo-hah clothes for you, you should discuss that with them. See a shrink if your parents didn't let you run around with your goodies hanging out when you were a young girl, don't bring it into a game where people want to play serious. Just sayin'.
Not only are you presumptuous and judgemental but you also completely missed the point by 70k lightyears. :rolleyes:
Nobody here is in seriousness advocating full nudity or downright obscene outfits.
Fact is, Star Trek is rife with revealing outfits throughout pretty much every single incarnation of it.
I'm sorry, but with the preponderance of free pornography on the internet, if you find the models in STO attractive, you should definitely talk to somebody, before it gets out of hand. Pardon the pun.
Seriously, open a dictionary before you start spewing such tripe.
I'm sorry, but with the preponderance of free pornography on the internet, if you find the models in STO attractive, you should definitely talk to somebody, before it gets out of hand. Pardon the pun.
He's using selectively-chosen pseudo-science to justify his fixations. It's a way of justifying just about anything these days from bullying to road rage.
You're using the pretense of science to justify knuckle-dragging perpetual adolescence here.
Okay, your first fallacy is referring to it as "knuckle-dragging perpetual adolescence". It has nothing to do with adolescence at all. And excuse me for not addressing the rest of the insult, but I do believe that is just pure name-calling.
You don't speak for everyone, nor do your 'facts'. Some people are creeped out by others obsessing about their digital pretend girlfriends/alter-egos. I'm not, though I almost never play a female character.
I did not claim to speak facts, I merely used reasonable assertions. And getting 'creeped out' by mere attraction to characters or other aspects of art is not the fault of the one that has that attraction. If you don't like it, you don't like it. There's no need to offend someone over it, and you're certainly not justified in ridiculing them.
What does creep me out is how often these guys have to loudly tell everyone that their eyes are on the pretend rear of their pretend character in a video game. And the only offense I take is at the horrible fashion sense most of these people have in their characters: all-white miniskirt and gogo boots "innocent" fantasy avatars look more like drag queens than anything.
Guess what man... you can ignore them. It's as simple as that. There are so many things they probably don't like about you or I that they don't say anything about either. It's a matter of respect, and son, telling someone how 'bad' or 'wrong' it is to enjoy media a certain way, unless it directly harms another person, is not as easily justified as you seem to want it to be.
Also, if you're getting upset because of how fictional characters dress, you might want to compare that to your irrational persecution of how people enjoy their video games and how you're offending them.
I'm sorry, but with the preponderance of free pornography on the internet, if you find the models in STO attractive, you should definitely talk to somebody, before it gets out of hand. Pardon the pun.
Why? So you think people with different opinions than what you deem supposed to be 'normal' deserve to be 'fixed'? I'm sorry, but that's not how it works.
He's using selectively-chosen pseudo-science to justify his fixations. It's a way of justifying just about anything these days from bullying to road rage.
I would appreciate it if you wouldn't put words in my mouth. Thank you.
OOH!! OOH!!! Maybe like a longer skirt option for the 21st century formal wear!!
I mean, what is this? A cocktail party? The top, I really don't mind, but the skirt is the major "I won't buy this EVER" factor for me. If we get a long skirt to go with it, it is an instant buy. And by long skirt, I mean near the ankles.
I like the short skirt, but I'd like an option to either have different lengths available, or to vary the hem length. Because 9 Million (or so, lol) PC's all running around with the same exact skirt for a formal event, just is kind of odd, lol.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
butcher suspect, "What'd you hit me with?"
Temperance Brennan, "A building"
What is it with you kids and your pixel TRIBBLE. You know going out and meeting real girls is far healthier than drooling over your female toons ENORMOUS (unrealistic) breast's and scantily clad body, forming unreal expectations in your mind of what a women is/should be !
Frikin perverts the lot of ya :P
Season 9, Attack of the 50 foot woman with lasers in her frikin TRIBBLE !
Too late, I already made the VLK-9A Valkerie BattleMech in Battletech. The armoured bra-top loweres down so the medium pulse lasers can fire!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
butcher suspect, "What'd you hit me with?"
Temperance Brennan, "A building"
Im going to go out on a limb and say, let's compromise:
Yes, skimpy clothes on women is canon. Its controversial but its canon. We also have alot of it already for women in game so I don't think we need anymore.
However, there are straight women and TRIBBLE men who play this game who may not appreciate that straight men and lesbians can have fanservice for their female characters and boffs and not for their males.
And before someone makes the argument against that, Gene Roddenberry insisted that males wear the female skant uniform in Season 1 of TNG because gender norms were no longer relevent in the 24th Century and men and women could wear whatever they felt like as long as it was within the dress code required for their jobs.
You want more skimpy clothes for women? Even it out first.
In do remember in the first episode, of TNG, early in the episode when the camera was in a corridor, you did see a guy in a normal top, and a skirt-type bottom. Don't really remember any other examples, however.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
butcher suspect, "What'd you hit me with?"
Temperance Brennan, "A building"
Your opinion on a ship is a completely different subject than what we are discussing at this time.
You may find the concept is the same, and in some ways it is, but I feel it's irrelevant to this topic.
No, I have to disagree with you here. What is being discussed, first and foremost, is peoples' opinions. Now granted, in this thread, it's specifically clothing. However, pick any subject or item(s) you choose. You will always have people wanting it, and people that think it should be banned. And then you have the vast range of people in-between. It's first & foremost, an opinion. No other data, just opinions
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
butcher suspect, "What'd you hit me with?"
Temperance Brennan, "A building"
Is exactly the same, you dont like some type of costume and you demand that they should not be introduced, and that is selfish, and not really the Star Trek moral and values.
I really dont care what type of costumes they introduce, but I am not that selfish to say no to this or that. If ppl want them, good for them.
Actually, there, I kind of have to say, for him to say "I don't want this kind of outfit made available", is no more selfish than the people saying "I want this kind of outfit made available".
It's all a amtter of what differing people want & don't want. One is not automatically any more selfish, than the other.
And, btw, the only real argument that I feel is valid, is about having more options, on how to dress one's character. Whether it be male, female, Klin, cat, or anything else under the sun one could think of. (Actually one of the reasons I enjoy playing the various Sims games so much, you can really customize what your character wears.)
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
butcher suspect, "What'd you hit me with?"
Temperance Brennan, "A building"
The OP wasn't clear about if it was skimpy female clothing or skimpy male clothing. So if we have the Orion Female uniform and Mirror Universe uniform, then males should get similar options. The Cropped Winter Jacket should be available for everyone not just females. There is also skimpy male clothing in Star Trek so we should add more skimpy male clothing and skimpy female clothing. Lots of MMOs with just skimpy females, but not many with skimpy males and Star Trek has always been about criticizing society.
Okay, your first fallacy is referring to it as "knuckle-dragging perpetual adolescence". It has nothing to do with adolescence at all. And excuse me for not addressing the rest of the insult, but I do believe that is just pure name-calling.
I did not claim to speak facts, I merely used reasonable assertions. And getting 'creeped out' by mere attraction to characters or other aspects of art is not the fault of the one that has that attraction. If you don't like it, you don't like it. There's no need to offend someone over it, and you're certainly not justified in ridiculing them.
Guess what man... you can ignore them. It's as simple as that. There are so many things they probably don't like about you or I that they don't say anything about either. It's a matter of respect, and son, telling someone how 'bad' or 'wrong' it is to enjoy media a certain way, unless it directly harms another person, is not as easily justified as you seem to want it to be.
Also, if you're getting upset because of how fictional characters dress, you might want to compare that to your irrational persecution of how people enjoy their video games and how you're offending them.
Why? So you think people with different opinions than what you deem supposed to be 'normal' deserve to be 'fixed'? I'm sorry, but that's not how it works.
I would appreciate it if you wouldn't put words in my mouth. Thank you.
"If you don't like X don't do X" statements are hopelessly, pathetically overused and useless for anything approaching meaningful discussion.
They are extremely easy to turn around too: If you don't like my opinion, don't read it and don't respond to it. See the problem? I hope you do.
Using a passive-aggressive tone and whining about words being put in your mouth is especially funny considering that a breath later you say I was committing acts of "irrational persecution".
By all means, have a pretend girlfriend in a video game if you wish. Don't use pseudoscience or statistics taken out of context to vindicate it.
That's exactly what I think. But why don't you go ahead and tell me how it DOES work.
There's nothing to "get out of hand" with. Enjoying media this way has absolutely no harmful effects whatsoever. There is no evidence to support your claim at all.
Now it's your turn. Define "normal". Explain how things could in fact get out of hand, and why these guys need to go talk to somebody. Also, explain who this 'somebody' is that they need to go talk to.
They are extremely easy to turn around too: If you don't like my opinion, don't read it and don't respond to it. See the problem? I hope you do.
No, because you voicing your 'opinion' is insulting others who are in no way harming anyone, while their opinions are purely innocent. It is in no way equal. In other words, their opinions aren't harming anyone, while your opinions are potentially harming them.
Using a passive-aggressive tone and whining about words being put in your mouth is especially funny considering that a breath later you say I was committing acts of "irrational persecution".
You can actually detect my tone? Because I was not aware that I was doing anything to display any tone. Please point to the text that implies a tone.
By all means, have a pretend girlfriend in a video game if you wish. Don't use pseudoscience or statistics taken out of context to vindicate it.
There you go, putting more words in my mouth. I was never using "pseudoscience" or "statistics taken out of context". And I'm not the one who is claiming to have a "pretend girlfriend in a video game".
And besides, I'm not trying to vindicate anything, as your accusations do not hold any weight aside from the childish insults I'm defending my fellow posters from. I'm merely giving you the benefit of the doubt and trying to talk some sense into you, nothing more.
Bottom line. I believe that you are in the wrong for attacking them. You are twisting the blame to them and faulting them when they are doing nothing wrong. And you're acting as if your actions are perfectly justified. Your only defense is using personal attacks and dancing around my points without directly addressing them. At least capnkirk4 is making an effort.
My GOD OP I think you broke them.
This has been one of the most amusing threads I have read today.
Would I like skimpier clothing options? Sure why not, I'm a healthy 54 year old male and I like looking at my female bridge officers backsides, so sue me.
Would I like more clothing options, kimonos, yukatas, flowing robes? Sure if they could do it properly and not make it look like it was blowing in a fierce wind all the time.
But to be honest the latest offerings from the developers leaves me with serious doubts about what to expect.
If something is not broken, don't fix it, if it is broken, don't leave it broken.
What Cryptic wants to do is extremely held up by CBS/Paramount apparently. This is why we have the stupid Uniform/Off Duty outfit separation. This is why we're so limited in costumes in general.
Yeah, the limitations suck. I was so looking forward to men in TNG season 1 skants when i joined.
The fact is the die is already cast, we already have iron bikini clad Orion slave girls running all over the place so this argument is moot, the only question now is accessibility.
If something is not broken, don't fix it, if it is broken, don't leave it broken.
I'm not sure how I should react to being called immature by someone who is probably less than half my age, I suppose I could post a picture of my drivers license but that would be foolish and I should note that in no way did I say that I was looking down on anyone else in this thread, I was just doing as many others expressing my amusement at how this discussion got completely blown out of proportion. So tell me sir how your launching into a personal attack against me supports any contribution you've made to this discussion?
If something is not broken, don't fix it, if it is broken, don't leave it broken.
Comments
It is the simple third person view that is usually used I am talking about. It is not about focus, but about what is simply there. You can't avoid looking at the butt if you are stuck in third person mode since it is part of being in third person mode. This could be avoided if we had non-standard player models, but either way, you either use first person mode or you are forced to look at a pixelated butt as well as the rest of your character. Since you are forced to look at your character's butt, then you can either go with staring at something you don't want to see so try to avoid looking at your character or make it tolerable. What you are talking about is simply not there. I was talking about the entire behind of a character and not just one specific area. If I mean the buttocks, then I will say butt. If all I was interested was pixelated butts, then there are far easier and better methods than Star Trek Online. There are better F2P MMOs for that type of stuff.
It's the same as being attracted to women in swimsuit magazines, as they're merely ink on paper, and to a more extreme example, perfectly healthy men can be attracted to mere drawings if they bare the resemblance to a woman's shape enough.
I'm sorry, but accusing men of being mentally unhealthy if they consider a game's characters eye candy is just wrong.
Helpful Tools: Dictionary.com - Logical fallacies - Random generator - Word generator - Color tool - Extra Credits - List of common English language errors - New T6 Big booty tutorial
This post must be the most common single statement in forums across the internet apart from "cake is a lie".
If it were so true why do you need to tell everyone so often? Just play as your "waifu" or whatever and expect some heckling.
You're using the pretense of science to justify knuckle-dragging perpetual adolescence here.
You don't speak for everyone, nor do your 'facts'. Some people are creeped out by others obsessing about their digital pretend girlfriends/alter-egos. I'm not, though I almost never play a female character.
What does creep me out is how often these guys have to loudly tell everyone that their eyes are on the pretend rear of their pretend character in a video game. And the only offense I take is at the horrible fashion sense most of these people have in their characters: all-white miniskirt and gogo boots "innocent" fantasy avatars look more like drag queens than anything.
All in all, it's people's choice, but I personally think there are enough skimpy outfits as it is. If they add more? I'll live, if I don't have to use them, so they surely won't make any $$ on me for these outfits. Simply as that.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator
"bIghojchugh DaneH, Dumev pagh. bIghojqangbe'chugh, DuQaHlaH pagh."
"Learn lots. Don't judge. Laugh for no reason. Be nice. Seek happiness." ~Day[9]
"Your fun isn't wrong." ~LaughingTrendy
Find me on Twitterverse - @jodarkrider
Not only are you presumptuous and judgemental but you also completely missed the point by 70k lightyears. :rolleyes:
Nobody here is in seriousness advocating full nudity or downright obscene outfits.
Fact is, Star Trek is rife with revealing outfits throughout pretty much every single incarnation of it.
Seriously, open a dictionary before you start spewing such tripe.
He's using selectively-chosen pseudo-science to justify his fixations. It's a way of justifying just about anything these days from bullying to road rage.
Real Klingons would have PVP matches to determine who was right. Because the warrior's way.
Indeed, some people are unfortuantely just incapable of holding a debate like mature adults.
(*Setting temperature to 70 degrees Kelvin*)
butcher suspect, "What'd you hit me with?"
Temperance Brennan, "A building"
I did not claim to speak facts, I merely used reasonable assertions. And getting 'creeped out' by mere attraction to characters or other aspects of art is not the fault of the one that has that attraction. If you don't like it, you don't like it. There's no need to offend someone over it, and you're certainly not justified in ridiculing them.
Guess what man... you can ignore them. It's as simple as that. There are so many things they probably don't like about you or I that they don't say anything about either. It's a matter of respect, and son, telling someone how 'bad' or 'wrong' it is to enjoy media a certain way, unless it directly harms another person, is not as easily justified as you seem to want it to be.
Also, if you're getting upset because of how fictional characters dress, you might want to compare that to your irrational persecution of how people enjoy their video games and how you're offending them.
Why? So you think people with different opinions than what you deem supposed to be 'normal' deserve to be 'fixed'? I'm sorry, but that's not how it works.
I would appreciate it if you wouldn't put words in my mouth. Thank you.
Helpful Tools: Dictionary.com - Logical fallacies - Random generator - Word generator - Color tool - Extra Credits - List of common English language errors - New T6 Big booty tutorial
Comic-Con called and gives its regards. :rolleyes:
I like the short skirt, but I'd like an option to either have different lengths available, or to vary the hem length. Because 9 Million (or so, lol) PC's all running around with the same exact skirt for a formal event, just is kind of odd, lol.
butcher suspect, "What'd you hit me with?"
Temperance Brennan, "A building"
Too late, I already made the VLK-9A Valkerie BattleMech in Battletech. The armoured bra-top loweres down so the medium pulse lasers can fire!
butcher suspect, "What'd you hit me with?"
Temperance Brennan, "A building"
In do remember in the first episode, of TNG, early in the episode when the camera was in a corridor, you did see a guy in a normal top, and a skirt-type bottom. Don't really remember any other examples, however.
butcher suspect, "What'd you hit me with?"
Temperance Brennan, "A building"
No, I have to disagree with you here. What is being discussed, first and foremost, is peoples' opinions. Now granted, in this thread, it's specifically clothing. However, pick any subject or item(s) you choose. You will always have people wanting it, and people that think it should be banned. And then you have the vast range of people in-between. It's first & foremost, an opinion. No other data, just opinions
butcher suspect, "What'd you hit me with?"
Temperance Brennan, "A building"
Actually, there, I kind of have to say, for him to say "I don't want this kind of outfit made available", is no more selfish than the people saying "I want this kind of outfit made available".
It's all a amtter of what differing people want & don't want. One is not automatically any more selfish, than the other.
And, btw, the only real argument that I feel is valid, is about having more options, on how to dress one's character. Whether it be male, female, Klin, cat, or anything else under the sun one could think of. (Actually one of the reasons I enjoy playing the various Sims games so much, you can really customize what your character wears.)
butcher suspect, "What'd you hit me with?"
Temperance Brennan, "A building"
Correction, we need more outfits period, particularly off-duty & formal sets. As well as more pallette choices.
butcher suspect, "What'd you hit me with?"
Temperance Brennan, "A building"
"If you don't like X don't do X" statements are hopelessly, pathetically overused and useless for anything approaching meaningful discussion.
They are extremely easy to turn around too: If you don't like my opinion, don't read it and don't respond to it. See the problem? I hope you do.
Using a passive-aggressive tone and whining about words being put in your mouth is especially funny considering that a breath later you say I was committing acts of "irrational persecution".
By all means, have a pretend girlfriend in a video game if you wish. Don't use pseudoscience or statistics taken out of context to vindicate it.
Now it's your turn. Define "normal". Explain how things could in fact get out of hand, and why these guys need to go talk to somebody. Also, explain who this 'somebody' is that they need to go talk to.
But its use fits this subject, so its supposed overuse in other subjects is completely irrelevant.
No, because you voicing your 'opinion' is insulting others who are in no way harming anyone, while their opinions are purely innocent. It is in no way equal. In other words, their opinions aren't harming anyone, while your opinions are potentially harming them.
You can actually detect my tone? Because I was not aware that I was doing anything to display any tone. Please point to the text that implies a tone.
There you go, putting more words in my mouth. I was never using "pseudoscience" or "statistics taken out of context". And I'm not the one who is claiming to have a "pretend girlfriend in a video game".
And besides, I'm not trying to vindicate anything, as your accusations do not hold any weight aside from the childish insults I'm defending my fellow posters from. I'm merely giving you the benefit of the doubt and trying to talk some sense into you, nothing more.
Bottom line. I believe that you are in the wrong for attacking them. You are twisting the blame to them and faulting them when they are doing nothing wrong. And you're acting as if your actions are perfectly justified. Your only defense is using personal attacks and dancing around my points without directly addressing them. At least capnkirk4 is making an effort.
Helpful Tools: Dictionary.com - Logical fallacies - Random generator - Word generator - Color tool - Extra Credits - List of common English language errors - New T6 Big booty tutorial
This has been one of the most amusing threads I have read today.
Would I like skimpier clothing options? Sure why not, I'm a healthy 54 year old male and I like looking at my female bridge officers backsides, so sue me.
Would I like more clothing options, kimonos, yukatas, flowing robes? Sure if they could do it properly and not make it look like it was blowing in a fierce wind all the time.
But to be honest the latest offerings from the developers leaves me with serious doubts about what to expect.
Yeah, the limitations suck. I was so looking forward to men in TNG season 1 skants when i joined.
you can enjoy a pretty lady without needing to ask her to loose her clothes.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.