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Feds getting annother new ship...
specter222
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
Looking at the post by Branflakes made just a while ago it seems like the feds are getting another new ship, the Avenger Class Battle Cruiser , I find this really annoying as just recently Geko said that the first new C Store KDF ship in over 2 years has been delayed until next year sometime due to there not being enough time while working on Voth ships, seems that lack of time only applies to KDF ships.
It seems that cryptics shamefull treatment of the KDF is to continue, I would like to say I am surprised but by now I doubt any KDF player is surprised when cryptic pulls more TRIBBLE like this.
Edit.
Oh and something I forgot to mention, based on whats on tribble it will also be able to cloak (The fed cloak console on tribble has Battle Cruiser added to its description) taking one of the KDF's last unique elements away from us. It really is getting to the point now that I am seriously considering just walking away from STO which would be a real shame as I have been here since open Beta.
It seems that cryptics shamefull treatment of the KDF is to continue, I would like to say I am surprised but by now I doubt any KDF player is surprised when cryptic pulls more TRIBBLE like this.
Edit.
Oh and something I forgot to mention, based on whats on tribble it will also be able to cloak (The fed cloak console on tribble has Battle Cruiser added to its description) taking one of the KDF's last unique elements away from us. It really is getting to the point now that I am seriously considering just walking away from STO which would be a real shame as I have been here since open Beta.
Post edited by specter222 on
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Should we be surprised? No. This is what Cryptic always does with the KDF.
Oh, and mark my words, the next ship will be a Romulan one. Cryptic will string us along with promises (IF they even mention of addressing it at all) of a new KDF ship, but will not deliver.
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
The KDF has to be the most poorly managed faction in the history of gaming. I'll say it again, Cryptic should be ashamed of their treatment of the KDF.
The unique element I was referring to is our cloaking battlecruisers, not the cloak itself, after the feds get a cloaking battle cruiser the only thing left to the KDF that is truly ours will be our BoP's and lets be honest since the romulans arrived the BoP is looking increasingly outdated.
How about that T5 KDF science ship?
Heck I would just be happy right now if they change the Fleet B'rel to move the extra eng console to an extra Tac console. Who the heck decided that the Fleet B'rel needed 4 engineering consoles? and only 3 Tac consoles? Lame!!!
Balance pass please!!
"February 2nd, 2012 - Two Year Anniversary! - The Empire gets the new Bortas class flagship. The new Odyssey class is on display in the shipyard at Earth Space Dock. We're told that the Bortas will also be displayed at Qo'noS shipyard, sometime in the future."
Yes, it's been that long since the last endgame c-store ships for the KDF. We're about to go 2 full years without anything new at T5.
And a bunch of cloaking ships for Starfleet goes against the theme of everything that is Star Trek. It has never been the overall theme for Starfleet in every TV series, every movie. Not while Gene Roddenberry was alive, and not even after his death. In every show & movie, Starfleet did its business in the open. That was it's style. Roddenberry's Starfleet did not lurk in cloaks. Not his White Knights of the franchise.
Cryptic will milk the cash cow for all it has got and so long as the majority of Starfleet and Romulan players throw their resources into every new shiny that comes along, that isn't the KDF player base.
Small arguement. Archer used a Suliban cloak (once), Kirk stole a romulan cloak and used it (once), That was a secret mission deliberately to steal that tech too. TNG Enterprise gets a recovered phasing cloak being developed by starfleet. And uses it once. And Defiant had a cloak and used it often, many times in open defiance of the treaty with the Romulans.
Not sure if they ever cloaked the Voyager.
So Starfleet is not above using cloaking devices. They are just the last to the game with them.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
- "So, we've been working on the cool new KDF Battle Cruiser."
+ "Ehm, oh? Stats gonna be any good?"
- "Yeah, comparable or better to all previous Battle Cruisers, we're thinking."
+ "Awesome, sounds great. One small thing, let's just make it a fed ship instead. KDF don't really need a new Battle Cruiser, they've got plenty - the feds have none."
- "... Ehm, oh. ... I see."
+ "Oh, and while you're at it, you might want to consider giving it a hangar bay too. Just a thought, but a cloaking fed Battle Cruiser would be nifty in its own right. Battle Cruisers are awesome, we're sure more people would love to be able to fly them."
- "But, ehm, they could, right, on a KDF character?"
+ "Yeeeaah, mkay. I think we're done here. If you could get me these TPS reports before Friday that'd be great, mmkay? I'm sure you got the memo."
You don't have as many ships as the Federation. True.
But the KDF has always been the underdog in STO. KDF players have done more with less.
We have this same conversation every single time a new Federation ship comes out. The dead horse is barely recognizable as an equine life form at this point.
You've gotten the Fleet Kamarag, and you're getting the Fleet veteran bird-of-prey, and the Fleet Kar'fi (not sure if any other Fleet ships are in the pipe).
If you're going to live under the Federation and Romulan Republic's roof, while we pay the bills -- a little gratitude for what you do get would be appreciated.
EDIT
Oh, Mr iconians? Trolololooooooololololoooooooo. Now begone.
I'd say this is pretty much a slap in the face backhand style they have stolen the Klingon's honor and spat on it. Not too worry though you will have plenty of opportunities to buy lock box ships those will never be pushed back like some ships.:rolleyes:
Really man a quote from office space?
Maybe if they threw something at the "bottomless pit" once in a decade it wouldn't be so bottomless after all. Food for thought.
No it's not the same conversation. Two weeks ago, we were told by Crp.Geko that the one ship dStahl promised was pushed back to next year due to their ship artists being overwhelmed with creating Voth ships and just can't find the time to finish it.
2 weeks later -> BANG - a Federation battlecruiser! That's the issue here, not whining because Feds got something, but because they got something that was promised for the KDF and delayed because it hinders the development of S8.
Funny how they weren't so overwhelmed with the Voth ships to make this one.
This right here has to be the dumbest, most ego-centric thing I have read in a long time. I hope you're proud of yourself.
Kamarag and Fleet Kamarag anniversary ships (which came one year after the Bortasqu'). They throw things at the bottomless pit. Just not as much as they do for the Federation and Romulan Republic. Would be nice if it was more, but it's dishonest to say they don't throw anything at the KDF. And to say 'once in a decade' is really just hyperbole.
And who is to say the Federation battlecruiser wasn't being worked on far before 2 weeks ago? I'm not going to accuse you of thinking this ship was put together in 2 weeks, but as the past has shown -- multiple ships have taken years to put together, and certain ships (like the Andorian escort) were being created before the year of hell (2011) and were shelved up until recently when they were finished. I'm not going to speculate this was the case, and for all intents and purposes you very well could be right in which case this could be construed as a dishonest maneuver on Cryptic's part. But by the same token, it could very well be this ship existed in a half-finished state that they were able to finish -- as opposed to doing far more work on the KDF ship. I do cede that Cryptic has their priorities wrong at times (in my opinion, anyway).
The KDF forums have enough dumb, ego-centric things written in it based on a false sense of self-entitlement. I don't see how what I wrote would be much different, other than the fact it's not part of the minority KDF player echo chamber. But thanks for not challenging the argument made.
There is some hope for a Fleet Guramba and Fleet Kar'fi, I think. As for when we'll get these, and how good they'll be compared to Federation or Romulan equivalents. . .who knows? Cryptic loves to leave the KDF twisting in the wind.
How nice, a troll. Of course, he won't get banned for stirring up flamefests or anything.
Introducing reality-based facts in the KDF echo chamber isn't really considered trolling. I consider it more of a public service. But you're free to disagree.
I was waiting for someone to take that!
Those are completely isolated incidents.
What is Starfleet's SOP? Did they ever mass produce cloak capable ships? Because not even the Defiant-class were cloak capable, only the special, lead vessel. Not in TOS, even after Kirk & co stole a cloaking device. Not even in the TMP timeframe where Kirk & co return home with a captured Klingon BOP. Not even in TNG/DS9/VOY timeframe, years after those earlier TOS/TMP developments, was Starfleet fielding cloak capable vessels.
And lastly, in a war that pushed the Federation and the rest of the Alpha Quadrant to its very knees, with catastrophic losses that even Starfleet could hardly replace... the Dominion War... and Starfleet was not fielding cloak vessels. A war that stretched the Federation to its very limits with massive loss of life and ships, and Starfleet never fielded cloak vessels. In an alliance with both the Klingon Empire AND Romulan Star Empire... and Starfleet never fielded cloak vessels. Even after the good will immediately after the Dominon War, with all 3 major powers of the Alpha Quadrant having lost alot, and Starfleet never fielded cloak vessels.
THAT is the theme of Starfleet. Again, Roddenberry's Shining White Knights don't skulk in cloaks.
You do realize that we're talking C-Store ships here,right? We have been requesting C-Store ships for a year now. Not everyone is in a fleet and not everyone's fleet has T3 shipyard, you know. We're talking about a plain single damned T5 C-Store ship for the faction that every KDF player could buy and enjoy if he/she wants.
And yes, a 'decade' is a hyperbole, but oddly enough seems less of a hyperbole when a faction is waiting for 2 years for a store ship in a game based on starships.
lol
Also it's funny that you mention the possibility of the ship being half-finished. That's exactly what Geko said about the KDF ship - that it's half done. And yet, somehow the suposed Fed. half ended being made even though the KDF playes have waited for more than year and a half since the last C-Store release while the Feds. only couple of months.
For technicality purposes, the Federation was GIVEN the cloaking device BY the Romulans, with the stipulation that it only be used in operations against the Dominion.
Further technicalities: One could argue that The Treaty of Algeron is no longer in effect, as the Romulan Empire that the Federation signed the treaty with, no longer exists.
USS Immortal NX-93608-F (Oddyssey Tactical Cruiser)
VADM Rogueshadow IRW Kirino Kosaka (Valdore Retrofit)
LT General Morbo IKS Karac (Bortasqu War Cruiser)
LT General Posu IKS Saya Takagi (Chel Grett Warship)
This is where I normally mention the moving of goal posts. I never see the argument "C-store ship". It's always "a ship". I never see anyone discern between fleet ships and c-store ships unless it fits their narrative. And on the KDF forums (and this thread espeically), the narrative is always "we don't get anything, and the things we do get don't count". I don't disagree not everyone has a tier 3 shipyard or ship provisions, etc., but it's not anything I ever see mentioned in any of the "Federations have a new ship and we don't" threads as an issue.
I honestly haven't paid any attention, so I'm taking your words at face value. What I do know is that I don't know how 'finished' the KDF ship is, and neither do you. I also cede that I don't know how 'finished' the Federation ship was when Mr. Rivera made that comment, and neither do you. A lot of work goes into a particular ship, and some parts are easier/quicker to solve than others. I would have to be privy to Cryptic's works-in-progress to really make a judgment call over whether it'd have been more profitable/fair to push one out before the other -- but given that the KDF is subsidized by the Federation and Republic players, I would say the scales tip in the Federation ship's direction. But again, I don't have possession of all the facts, and neither do you or anyone else not a Cryptic employee.
It's not moving of goal posts. This has been a thing since forever, if you haven't been folowing that's your fault.
We have always discussed C-Store ships, especially because the KDF barely has any at T5 that have fleet versions, so KDF players are forced to pay much more than Fed. players for those fleet ships you talk about. And even when we buy those fleet ships, we can't customize them, or change windows or hull material because it has been broken for over a year and they admited they know it....well at least before Geko told us that that's not so important aparently.
We've alwyas discussed about new C-Store T5 ships that could be upgraded at a later date with the discount.
I'd really love to know from where are you pulling out this ridiculous "subsidizing" nonesence, or are you actually trolling at this point as others have suggested?
And how am I suposed to "subsidize" anything when the last product Cryptic offered me was in February 2012?
Should I write them a check on a 1000 pounds for nothing, out of the kindness of my heart all in good hope that they *might* make a KDF ship before my grandchildren are born?
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
You discuss c-store ships because it fits your narrative. Not because it's necessarily true, per say. Although I do agree that there are bugs with the ship costume editor which do need to be addressed, asap. The original point remains is that Cryptic does throw you a bone every once in a while, even if it isn't in the exact same fashion as they bring it to the Federation/Republic.
I'm pulling this 'nonsense' from multiple dev interviews in the past whenever the subject of KDF content comes up (in this case ships), and you have your right to your opinion, but you don't have the right to change the facts. The fact remains that Cryptic pushed ships to the c-store many moons ago to bring up the variety there, putting forth the same amount of work/effort as they did for the Federation ships.
And they didn't make much of a profit. Money spent on certain KDF ships actually ended up being a monetary loss to Cryptic because the sales were not enough to compensate for the cost of creating said ships. If you'd like, I can do some digging and cite my sources, if you don't believe me.
Since KDF ships aren't making money, then the money for the creation of new KDF ships and content comes from sales elsewhere in the game. Namely Federation and Republic players.
That's called subsidizing. And the KDF survives off of the profits reaped from the Federation and Romulan Republic. You get thrown a bone every once in a while, but even after Dstahl stated he was pursuing the "if we build it, they will come" line of thought in terms of the KDF, even after "it was built" come Legacy of Romulus... the KDF numbers are still not enough to warrant the direction of company resources to the faction. They built it, players did not come.
So, the KDF continues to be subsidized from profits elsewhere in the game. Unfortunately, you just have to make do with what Cryptic can afford to throw at you from time to time. It's sad, but it's reality.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
Ahem...so basically:
Scene 1. A person with a blue t-shirt enters a store. Can I have a coke please? Yes, that would be 3.50 sir. Here you go, thank you come again.
Scene 2. A person with a red t-shir enters the same store. Can I have a coke please? 10 bucks a**hole! Now get out of my face before I call the cops on you!
And this seems ok to you?
You know, we're all people and we're all Cryptic's costumers. It's sheer nonsence having to pay more for the same service because you like to play Klingon.
Ofcourse they didn't make as much as they wanted. The KDF had next to no content back then, only a handfull of badly copy/pasted Federation story arcs. The KDF was locked behind 25 levels of Federation gameplay back then. Therefore only a small amount of die-hards played the faction. And that's why they didn't make as much money as the wanted.
Cryptic needs to make a full product before attempting to sell it, that's a leason they still haven't learned.
I believe you on this one as I also know it. It's Cryptic that I started not to believe.
Again, tell me what have they released for the KDF in the store in the past 20 months so we could make them money?
LMAO!!!
But players did not come?
Hmmmm I wonder why.....surely can't be because LoR introduced the largest power creep seen so far in STO and they slapped it on only one faction? Nah that surely couldn't be it. :rolleyes:
Hmmm...maybe it's because our last T5 C-Store ship was released 20 months ago and the faction doesn't have anything to compensate for almost 2 years of power creep? Nah, I must be delusional, that can't be it! :rolleyes: I mean, what player wouldn't want to purposely gimp themselves by playing a faction stuck in 2012?
What really is unfortunate is that this type of amateurish aproach by Cryptic ensured that STO will never reach it's full potential and be the game it could have been only if they paid a bit more attention and had a vision. That is the real sad part, not that KDF players would have to be satisfied with thrown bones.