I don't do much ground PvP anymore because I ran out of inventory space for the PvP powerups. So instead of dumping all my PvE powerups for space I dumped the PvP types, which put me at a disadvantage when playing against live players.
In space, there is plenty of cheese, plenty of broken and plenty plenty of omfg that's so OP. That line of argument just doesn't wash since there are far less toys and abilities in play on the ground. It seems that the more I talk to people and the more I read on the forums about Ground gripes (PvP AND PvE), it basically boils down to there being people who can live with (PvE) or even like (PvP) the Ground engine in this game and others who simply can't/don't. A matter of preference and possibly a nagging wish that ground combat was more like some of the FPS's out there that maybe many players are used to.
A 5v5 with able, well geared ground players is not so different to one in space in terms of balance. And just like how the not-so-experienced Space PvPer can't understand why they are dying so quick, the same is true in Ground PvP. Gear, Rep and other passives are just as necessary in Ground PvP as they are in Space. And about the kits, well, it's a simple truth that you have to be just as quick and just as smart with your use of abilities (despite the 'it's just about gear and spamming abilities' myth) on the ground as you do in space and you have to know what your Captain can and cannot do just as much as you do your ship in space PvP. Once triple activating (which I will concede is BS that you should need to) your abilities becomes second nature, a lot of that 'wtf? I pressed that......' feeling will disappear too.
I'm not saying the cheese and whatever on the ground is cool, far from it, but it must be said that a lot of what I'm reading in this thread can be applied to Space PvP just as easy as to ground.
I love both and I'm no expert in either.
"So my fun is wrong?"
No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
Shields... what are they good for?
This means that I have never really seen shields last beyond one or maybe two shots from most weapons being used. Even when fully speced into them. And completely useless when one uses a Melee Weapon. (Not that Melee weapons do ALOT of damage)
Armor doesn't feel as resistible.
This means that, for me, Armor doesn't seem to reduce the incoming damage as well as it probably should. Not that it should be so tough that at least a pair of Tacs can't take you down, or to make Tacs useless, but there are plenty of sceneros where Armor just does not feel like it's as good as it should be in the ability to reduce damage from what I've seen. Of course I am no expert, I haven't taken the time to fully test how well each armor works against different attacks and styles. And this is just from what I have witnessed in some ground PVP Prior to LoR
Some maps have too many "Holes"
What this means is that there are some maps whose bugs, or glitched areas are pronounced enough to make the maps not as fun to participate in. One excellent example of this is Shanty Town. Another, is the Open PVP zone Otha (The Ground version of Ker'rat).
Not enough Kit Styles
There really aren't enough combination of Kit powers to be fun to use. And one Kit was introduced in an STF before the Queued versions were introduced, and has never been re-released. I'm not saying that we need a Customizable Kit System, but I would love to see more varied Kits being released in the Future.
Bugs, Glitches, and/or Exploitations
There are a few bugs, glitches, or maybe even undiscovered exploits in ground that also turns me sour. It could be anything from Animation Glitches, to knock down Explotation, to the previous Cryo gun damage.. There always seems to be something that, while seemingly small, affects Ground in a fairly fundamental way. But in such a way that PVP becomes less and less enjoyable while on the ground unless you are abusing it.
Skills also aren't really an issue with me, though some of the newer traits introduced have had me scratching my head and wondering just what Cryptic was thinking when they introduced it.
Tactical Officers are Main, everything else takes a back seat.
What I mean here is that I see more Tactical officers being viable in Ground then Sci or Engineer. And with the way the damage is delt, a Healer Sci + Engi doesn't even feel as viable in a team option since Tacs do so much damage on the ground that a Sci or an Engi can't really keep up as well in the normal Medic sense of the Idea. But that is how things always felt to me.
Granted I could just be so in experienced that some of the issues I mentioned above really aren't that bad. And are just blatant because of my lack of experience with ground. How ever, those areas above are the ones that typically keep me from wanting to play ground PVP more then space PVP.
You think that your beta test was bad?
Think about this: American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
It's funny to see the comments of the clueless space folks .
Wouldn't necessary call my self "Clueless" When it comes to ground PVP. I mean it is the only place an Engineer can do something in regard to PVP.. :rolleyes:
But I obviously don't know near as much as you ground and pounders who spend more time at it.
You think that your beta test was bad?
Think about this: American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
On a scale of 1-10 ground combat on STO is a 2 on the best of days. It has nothing to do with kits or skills or anything else. There's no duck and cover, no fps or tps mechanics of any type. You simply stand there and shoot, throw a grenade, or heal until one kills the other.
Ground combat in STO would have to be completely 100% redesigned from the ground up before there was even a remote chance of it becoming even remotely interesting other than to a very very few amount of people.
Space PVP suffers much of the same as the maps are too small, there aren't enough enemies, and the couple of PVP modes are just thrashed together garbage for the sake of saying the game has PVP.
At this rate there's a better chance of a poker mini-game ever being added than there is a total redesigned being down like would be the case with pvp and specifically ground pvp.
I do both ground/space pvp equally for the most part. What do i win?:)
On a more serious note i have a tip, or several tips to people that are thinking of getting they're feet wet in ground pvp, or are just frustrated. Note that one thing that is needed on ground that isn't really teachable is reaction time. So ground does favor teenagers lol.
Lets say you want to go bust some skulllz in the ground Qs, but are new at it. My advise is to start with a SCI. Yes, not a tac lol. Remember the bit about reaction times? Well, sci has this kit called medic. Every power in the kit is a heal. These heals can be used on yourself, or your teammates. But your new, so your probably only going to be able to focus on yourself at first. What these heals do is slooow down the pace of ground pvp a bit. It takes much more focus fire and determination to kill a self healing medic, then a tac. More time to kill you = more time for you to think, and learn.
If you have a sci character, look at the skill sheet. If you specced 6-9 points into the Medic skill(9 is best ofc), and 6ish points into combat armor you should be able to try out your tanking skillz asap. You will of course want points in some other skills as well to have a more fleshed out character, but this will give you the backbone you need to stand. You definitely don't need 100k skill points to be useful, but obviously if your making a ground specced character, go for it. I have a space tac, that i also use occasionally for ground. She routinely gets very high damage numbers in ground pvp, but she is geared decently with middle range stf gear.
Lastly do these things!
1) Crouch (reduces damage to you by an additional 25%, on average)
2) If your a sci, get the full mk xi or mk xii omega force stf set.
3) Keybind your heals to your mouse side buttons. This will free up your hands and speed up your reaction times, which is required to be effective.
4) Face the enemy when your taking damage! This prevents the enemy from getting a flanking damage bonus against you. This is also required for survival. Gives a whole new meaning to face tanking! lol
5) Learn to anticipate incoming damage spikes. As a sci, think of yourself as a prevention specialist. A tac coming in fully buffed? Give his target a Vascular Regenerator heal over time to prevent a one shot. This goes into team medic territory, but also a applies to self tanking. Feel the flow of combat, slooow it downnn.
Note that one thing that is needed on ground that isn't really teachable is reaction time.
so you are saying in a game that is almost synonym with lag and low ping reaction time is important :rolleyes:
the activation time for space powers is stupid beyond reason ...some people have 500ms ping ,you cant make reaction time games in a game like this.This is not call of duty or team fortress to join a low ping server.
this thing that most annoys me is the time you need before the skills are activated, if you use fast kits like medic or analyst the toon just wont take his hand off of his arm LCD, looks like he is playing gta san andreas for the first time while im trying to pvp
after that is the kit limitation, and the fact that we have to chose ground or space in the skill points, lack of p2w in ground is one of the reasons too ..
With ground PVP there is something that is reeeeely OP and game braking.. if they fix A, the next day they broke B.
They fixed Cryo gun and they release mega knockback. And the fleet premade, most of them dont have any problem on using those exploits.
I mean, I remember when a ground PVP bootcamp coach with his premade fleet knock me like half a map and I couldn`t even move or react.
Space has a lot of broken stuff, in ground is just always one, but is game braking. Imagine, that in space, Photonic Shockway effect has a 1 minute duration (same as the cooldown). Well, that is Ground PVP today.
And if the devs ignore Space PVP problems.. well.. on ground PVP they not even bother..
this thing that most annoys me is the time you need before the skills are activated, if you use fast kits like medic or analyst the toon just wont take his hand off of his arm LCD, looks like he is playing gta san andreas for the first time while im trying to pvp
after that is the kit limitation, and the fact that we have to chose ground or space in the skill points, lack of p2w in ground is one of the reasons too ..
You're being ridiculous, people don't play Ground because there's not P2W? What kind of joke is that?
On a scale of 1-10 ground combat on STO is a 2 on the best of days. It has nothing to do with kits or skills or anything else. There's no duck and cover, no fps or tps mechanics of any type. You simply stand there and shoot, throw a grenade, or heal until one kills the other.
Thats a myth by the way and exactly the reason why lots of players get totally annihilated when they come to ground.
Its like in space.. you see some ship thats not distributing shield power, not cycling epts to harden shields and no tac teams.. you know its a newbie and will blow up easily. On ground you just look whos "simply STANDING there and shoots" cause thats the guy without dodge bonus and most likely without any ground knowledge; the perfect victim.
Same can be said about cover.. its there. Theres tons of objects to go cover a few seconds behind to regenerate your shield or gain a second until the hypo is up.. and thats all thats really needed if you know how to move Of course for those special people that expect some glowing sign to appear "Press X to cover here ->" there is no cover and tbh there never will be enough cover for them either.
if you pug into a ground pvp you will most probly find one or two guys just hanging for themselves, im not even talking about pug or premades, it is horrible ...
IMO 95% players have space skill points and traits and when they meet ground specialist they are losing.
Second reason , cheap ground tactic with caitian , cloak , cryo launcher. Why caitian ? coz he decloak, jumping around you and carving you. You are dead.
Third , most people have not keybinds and they are not to fast active their powers during fights. And if you can not back up here for some cover (sometimes i receiving damage even if i am behind wall ) and activate you abilities , you are dead.
Fourth, stupid respawn points in arena. If you respawning and enemy is right behind you, you are dead.
When i was beggining with STO two years ago , so i expected something decent like in Mass Effect , but no, ground is very bad , like in 10 years old fantasy mmo game.
Any new kit or something p2w can not save it.
Eventually i can play ground pvp with my friends , coz they are space specialist too and they not using any exploits. Still it is stupid , but fun. Do you remeber on Bomberman? So about the same...
I still PvP sometimes. What keeps me from doing it more: The Catians jumping to get flanking even though they are in front. Catians on rooftops throwing cloaked grenades the whole match. Chain stun/knockdown, My gun takes so many shots to kill yet a stupid lunge can 1 shot kill.
To explain the problem with science kits vs Tac kits:
Tacs get to pre-buff then engage with guns uninterrupted - Science has to debuff a target during the fight or choose a kit power over a gun shot.
When you have to change targets because they took cover or died, a Tac keeps his buff and selects a new target - science debuffed the one but now is without anything vs the next target.
All the reputation traits favor tacs (like in space) as they automate healing or proc off crit which Tacs have the most by far.
The Science players who say it is balanced or science is better are teamed with Tacs who give them Strike Team and Tactical Initiative. This is the real issue, Teamwork. Too many think that the classes are balanced for random teams when in reality the strength of each is enhanced by good team players of a different class.
I will not blame the game (or the premades) because I prefer a style where premades have a smaller advantage. I prefer a game where everyone can do something, not this premade will almost always win 15-0 or 30-0 because they can mitigate damage too well for pugs to overcome.(the same applies to space). To me a good PvP game rewards the losers, not with credits, but in the match allowing them some satisfaction. The reason I think many hate PvP in STO is you cannot do anything unless on a coordinated team if fighting against one. In a typical PvP game you can kill an opponent by outplaying him, in STO you have to outplay all 5. If I had 4 other guys and tons of time that might be fun at times, but I want to jump in and pew pew then do something else for a while. I can headshot the best player on the other game I play and he dies. On STO there is nothing I can do unless I happen to catch him without his support team there. It is just a matter of preference to me.
I like Kerrat, Otha, Shanty Town, and Cap/hold the best. They come the closest to a dynamic battlefield environment where strategy and positioning come into play, at least a little.
exactly, if you think space pvp is hard to learn you whould try ground, the difference between a good team and a bunch of noobs is just like ... jeez ...
1) The only reason I have 66k skill points in Ground skills is because I'm required to have 66k skill points in Ground skills. I have the minimum allowed.
2) I have 8 Aliens and a Reman. Each of the Aliens has a single Ground trait, since they could only select 8 of 9 as Space. The Reman has a single Ground trait (the Species trait).
3) I don't do Ground PvE (outside of leveling). As such, my Ground gear is TRIBBLE because all you need is TRIBBLE gear to do the Ground PvE as you're leveling.
So...minimum Ground skills allowed, minimum Ground traits allowed, and TRIBBLE Ground gear...that's why I don't do Ground PvP.
Yep, Geko has been talking about a kit revamp. Won't make any difference to me, though...because again, I've got the min allowed Ground skills, the min allowed Ground traits, and TRIBBLE Ground gear.
So okay, I don't want to "weaken" a toon by doing Ground...why not just take one of the Universal Slots that is sitting there as a Foundry toon doing nothing and roll a Ground guy?
The reason I didn't buy STO after the beta was because of Ground. Around a year later, when I got an email asking me to check out where STO was...I couldn't remember why I wasn't playing STO. I had been following the development from back when Perpetual had the license. I downloaded and installed the game for the free trial thing, created the toon, jumped once, and uninstalled the game. I remembered why I wasn't playing STO.
Outside of training BOFFs or switching ships, I'm not going to Ground. I'd rather pop a freighter or look for somebody that popped a freighter than go to Ground. Luckily enough, there are obviously enough people that feel the same because there are so many getting popped above Sol, Qo'noS, and even New Romulus.
Don't get me wrong, the artists, environmental guys, etc, etc, etc...have done an awesome job with the look of Ground. It came a long way with LoR...but it is still Ground. It's still the same goofy animations, the same clipping on costumes, etc, etc, etc...
For the folks not bothered by all those things, though, I do hope Geko gets somewhere with the kit revamp and it improves things for those folks that enjoy or want to enjoy Ground...
Oh god get out of my MIND!!! God do I agree with you there. I am playing Star Trek online... not Ground Trek. Very well writen, Kudos sir.
I like ground, but only STFs. I que sometimes for ground PvP and folks there are just .... insane. I cant imagine premade vs premade match, who knows what that looks like. I would like to learn to ground PvP but Im afraid it would take too much time, and yet I would not be satisfied with result after all. Personally, I find that control and response in activating powers is to slow. Or, maybe I'm doing everything wrong. Nevertheless it is an uncharted territory for me.
[10:49] [Combat (Self)] Your Proton Barrage deals 96581 (43411) Proton(Critical) to Seto.
Poor soul didnt have time to log out.
The problems with the premades are quite common, it's just the same for Space, but faster.
I mean, you will never succeed alone against a team of 5 people coordinating togheter, never, let's be real, it's common sense.
Most of the time I play alone, just pugging and when you have a premade on the other side it's not fun and you gonna have a bad time, but hey, it's just the way that the game works. And you can't blame the premade team, you can't, because is not their fault that you don't have your own team, it's not their fault that you don't have a friend or two to play with, you can't blame them because they're just having fun with their friends. The only thing left to do is try to stick to the end of match, don't rage quit, and say GG at the end.
From time to time I'm invited to a premade team to play against another premade and it's fun as hell, if you have 2 well balanced teams, you're going to have a great time, doesn't matter if you win or lose, it's the ride. The enjoyment of 5 guys coordinating togheter against other 5 guys coordinating togheter, it's fun.
The problems with the premades are quite common, it's just the same for Space, but faster.
I mean, you will never succeed alone against a team of 5 people coordinating togheter, never, let's be real, it's common sense.
Most of the time I play alone, just pugging and when you have a premade on the other side it's not fun and you gonna have a bad time, but hey, it's just the way that the game works. And you can't blame the premade team, you can't, because is not their fault that you don't have your own team, it's not their fault that you don't have a friend or two to play with, you can't blame them because they're just having fun with their friends. The only thing left to do is try to stick to the end of match, don't rage quit, and say GG at the end.
From time to time I'm invited to a premade team to play against another premade and it's fun as hell, if you have 2 well balanced teams, you're going to have a great time, doesn't matter if you win or lose, it's the ride. The enjoyment of 5 guys coordinating togheter against other 5 guys coordinating togheter, it's fun.
You can blame them for camping Newbies! F.., K.., H..... S....... I witnessed all of them recently camping PUGs with an amount of more than 80% of Newbies on the team. And then you ask why so few new players stick with Ground PvP?
And then there are some especial guys who perform camping in accordance with talking trash on those newbies.
Ground community will never grow, as long it lacks good manners.
edit:
BTW: It is possible to beat even premades with an pug (as long it does not consists of newbies). We forced one of those "famed" premades out of the arena match with an klingon pug-team couple of days ago.
Comments
Strangely they don't have space PvP powerups.
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
A 5v5 with able, well geared ground players is not so different to one in space in terms of balance. And just like how the not-so-experienced Space PvPer can't understand why they are dying so quick, the same is true in Ground PvP. Gear, Rep and other passives are just as necessary in Ground PvP as they are in Space. And about the kits, well, it's a simple truth that you have to be just as quick and just as smart with your use of abilities (despite the 'it's just about gear and spamming abilities' myth) on the ground as you do in space and you have to know what your Captain can and cannot do just as much as you do your ship in space PvP. Once triple activating (which I will concede is BS that you should need to) your abilities becomes second nature, a lot of that 'wtf? I pressed that......' feeling will disappear too.
I'm not saying the cheese and whatever on the ground is cool, far from it, but it must be said that a lot of what I'm reading in this thread can be applied to Space PvP just as easy as to ground.
I love both and I'm no expert in either.
No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
Shields... what are they good for?
This means that I have never really seen shields last beyond one or maybe two shots from most weapons being used. Even when fully speced into them. And completely useless when one uses a Melee Weapon. (Not that Melee weapons do ALOT of damage)
Armor doesn't feel as resistible.
This means that, for me, Armor doesn't seem to reduce the incoming damage as well as it probably should. Not that it should be so tough that at least a pair of Tacs can't take you down, or to make Tacs useless, but there are plenty of sceneros where Armor just does not feel like it's as good as it should be in the ability to reduce damage from what I've seen. Of course I am no expert, I haven't taken the time to fully test how well each armor works against different attacks and styles. And this is just from what I have witnessed in some ground PVP Prior to LoR
Some maps have too many "Holes"
What this means is that there are some maps whose bugs, or glitched areas are pronounced enough to make the maps not as fun to participate in. One excellent example of this is Shanty Town. Another, is the Open PVP zone Otha (The Ground version of Ker'rat).
Not enough Kit Styles
There really aren't enough combination of Kit powers to be fun to use. And one Kit was introduced in an STF before the Queued versions were introduced, and has never been re-released. I'm not saying that we need a Customizable Kit System, but I would love to see more varied Kits being released in the Future.
Bugs, Glitches, and/or Exploitations
There are a few bugs, glitches, or maybe even undiscovered exploits in ground that also turns me sour. It could be anything from Animation Glitches, to knock down Explotation, to the previous Cryo gun damage.. There always seems to be something that, while seemingly small, affects Ground in a fairly fundamental way. But in such a way that PVP becomes less and less enjoyable while on the ground unless you are abusing it.
Skills also aren't really an issue with me, though some of the newer traits introduced have had me scratching my head and wondering just what Cryptic was thinking when they introduced it.
Tactical Officers are Main, everything else takes a back seat.
What I mean here is that I see more Tactical officers being viable in Ground then Sci or Engineer. And with the way the damage is delt, a Healer Sci + Engi doesn't even feel as viable in a team option since Tacs do so much damage on the ground that a Sci or an Engi can't really keep up as well in the normal Medic sense of the Idea. But that is how things always felt to me.
Granted I could just be so in experienced that some of the issues I mentioned above really aren't that bad. And are just blatant because of my lack of experience with ground. How ever, those areas above are the ones that typically keep me from wanting to play ground PVP more then space PVP.
Think about this:
American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
www.divisionhispana.com
lolground.
You mad, bro?
I play ground in good games.
Wouldn't necessary call my self "Clueless" When it comes to ground PVP. I mean it is the only place an Engineer can do something in regard to PVP.. :rolleyes:
But I obviously don't know near as much as you ground and pounders who spend more time at it.
Think about this:
American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
it's funny to see the comment of the clueless ground folks
so that works both ways .:rolleyes:
Ground combat in STO would have to be completely 100% redesigned from the ground up before there was even a remote chance of it becoming even remotely interesting other than to a very very few amount of people.
Space PVP suffers much of the same as the maps are too small, there aren't enough enemies, and the couple of PVP modes are just thrashed together garbage for the sake of saying the game has PVP.
At this rate there's a better chance of a poker mini-game ever being added than there is a total redesigned being down like would be the case with pvp and specifically ground pvp.
Of course.
www.divisionhispana.com
On a more serious note i have a tip, or several tips to people that are thinking of getting they're feet wet in ground pvp, or are just frustrated. Note that one thing that is needed on ground that isn't really teachable is reaction time. So ground does favor teenagers lol.
Lets say you want to go bust some skulllz in the ground Qs, but are new at it. My advise is to start with a SCI. Yes, not a tac lol. Remember the bit about reaction times? Well, sci has this kit called medic. Every power in the kit is a heal. These heals can be used on yourself, or your teammates. But your new, so your probably only going to be able to focus on yourself at first. What these heals do is slooow down the pace of ground pvp a bit. It takes much more focus fire and determination to kill a self healing medic, then a tac. More time to kill you = more time for you to think, and learn.
If you have a sci character, look at the skill sheet. If you specced 6-9 points into the Medic skill(9 is best ofc), and 6ish points into combat armor you should be able to try out your tanking skillz asap. You will of course want points in some other skills as well to have a more fleshed out character, but this will give you the backbone you need to stand. You definitely don't need 100k skill points to be useful, but obviously if your making a ground specced character, go for it. I have a space tac, that i also use occasionally for ground. She routinely gets very high damage numbers in ground pvp, but she is geared decently with middle range stf gear.
Lastly do these things!
1) Crouch (reduces damage to you by an additional 25%, on average)
2) If your a sci, get the full mk xi or mk xii omega force stf set.
3) Keybind your heals to your mouse side buttons. This will free up your hands and speed up your reaction times, which is required to be effective.
4) Face the enemy when your taking damage! This prevents the enemy from getting a flanking damage bonus against you. This is also required for survival. Gives a whole new meaning to face tanking! lol
5) Learn to anticipate incoming damage spikes. As a sci, think of yourself as a prevention specialist. A tac coming in fully buffed? Give his target a Vascular Regenerator heal over time to prevent a one shot. This goes into team medic territory, but also a applies to self tanking. Feel the flow of combat, slooow it downnn.
Anyway.. /end
so you are saying in a game that is almost synonym with lag and low ping reaction time is important :rolleyes:
the activation time for space powers is stupid beyond reason ...some people have 500ms ping ,you cant make reaction time games in a game like this.This is not call of duty or team fortress to join a low ping server.
lol
after that is the kit limitation, and the fact that we have to chose ground or space in the skill points, lack of p2w in ground is one of the reasons too ..
They fixed Cryo gun and they release mega knockback. And the fleet premade, most of them dont have any problem on using those exploits.
I mean, I remember when a ground PVP bootcamp coach with his premade fleet knock me like half a map and I couldn`t even move or react.
Space has a lot of broken stuff, in ground is just always one, but is game braking. Imagine, that in space, Photonic Shockway effect has a 1 minute duration (same as the cooldown). Well, that is Ground PVP today.
And if the devs ignore Space PVP problems.. well.. on ground PVP they not even bother..
Division Hispana
www.divisionhispana.com
You're being ridiculous, people don't play Ground because there's not P2W? What kind of joke is that?
www.divisionhispana.com
It's called trolling.
Lion Heart of Hammer Squadron
Not true!
Ground has a lot of different game-breaking things, too!
Thats a myth by the way and exactly the reason why lots of players get totally annihilated when they come to ground.
Its like in space.. you see some ship thats not distributing shield power, not cycling epts to harden shields and no tac teams.. you know its a newbie and will blow up easily. On ground you just look whos "simply STANDING there and shoots" cause thats the guy without dodge bonus and most likely without any ground knowledge; the perfect victim.
Same can be said about cover.. its there. Theres tons of objects to go cover a few seconds behind to regenerate your shield or gain a second until the hypo is up.. and thats all thats really needed if you know how to move
i only do 1vs1 in ground
Second reason , cheap ground tactic with caitian , cloak , cryo launcher. Why caitian ? coz he decloak, jumping around you and carving you. You are dead.
Third , most people have not keybinds and they are not to fast active their powers during fights. And if you can not back up here for some cover (sometimes i receiving damage even if i am behind wall ) and activate you abilities , you are dead.
Fourth, stupid respawn points in arena. If you respawning and enemy is right behind you, you are dead.
When i was beggining with STO two years ago , so i expected something decent like in Mass Effect , but no, ground is very bad , like in 10 years old fantasy mmo game.
Any new kit or something p2w can not save it.
Eventually i can play ground pvp with my friends , coz they are space specialist too and they not using any exploits. Still it is stupid , but fun. Do you remeber on Bomberman? So about the same...
To explain the problem with science kits vs Tac kits:
Tacs get to pre-buff then engage with guns uninterrupted - Science has to debuff a target during the fight or choose a kit power over a gun shot.
When you have to change targets because they took cover or died, a Tac keeps his buff and selects a new target - science debuffed the one but now is without anything vs the next target.
All the reputation traits favor tacs (like in space) as they automate healing or proc off crit which Tacs have the most by far.
The Science players who say it is balanced or science is better are teamed with Tacs who give them Strike Team and Tactical Initiative. This is the real issue, Teamwork. Too many think that the classes are balanced for random teams when in reality the strength of each is enhanced by good team players of a different class.
I will not blame the game (or the premades) because I prefer a style where premades have a smaller advantage. I prefer a game where everyone can do something, not this premade will almost always win 15-0 or 30-0 because they can mitigate damage too well for pugs to overcome.(the same applies to space). To me a good PvP game rewards the losers, not with credits, but in the match allowing them some satisfaction. The reason I think many hate PvP in STO is you cannot do anything unless on a coordinated team if fighting against one. In a typical PvP game you can kill an opponent by outplaying him, in STO you have to outplay all 5. If I had 4 other guys and tons of time that might be fun at times, but I want to jump in and pew pew then do something else for a while. I can headshot the best player on the other game I play and he dies. On STO there is nothing I can do unless I happen to catch him without his support team there. It is just a matter of preference to me.
I like Kerrat, Otha, Shanty Town, and Cap/hold the best. They come the closest to a dynamic battlefield environment where strategy and positioning come into play, at least a little.
Oh god get out of my MIND!!! God do I agree with you there. I am playing Star Trek online... not Ground Trek. Very well writen, Kudos sir.
Poor soul didnt have time to log out.
I mean, you will never succeed alone against a team of 5 people coordinating togheter, never, let's be real, it's common sense.
Most of the time I play alone, just pugging and when you have a premade on the other side it's not fun and you gonna have a bad time, but hey, it's just the way that the game works. And you can't blame the premade team, you can't, because is not their fault that you don't have your own team, it's not their fault that you don't have a friend or two to play with, you can't blame them because they're just having fun with their friends. The only thing left to do is try to stick to the end of match, don't rage quit, and say GG at the end.
From time to time I'm invited to a premade team to play against another premade and it's fun as hell, if you have 2 well balanced teams, you're going to have a great time, doesn't matter if you win or lose, it's the ride. The enjoyment of 5 guys coordinating togheter against other 5 guys coordinating togheter, it's fun.
www.divisionhispana.com
You can blame them for camping Newbies! F.., K.., H..... S....... I witnessed all of them recently camping PUGs with an amount of more than 80% of Newbies on the team. And then you ask why so few new players stick with Ground PvP?
And then there are some especial guys who perform camping in accordance with talking trash on those newbies.
Ground community will never grow, as long it lacks good manners.
edit:
BTW: It is possible to beat even premades with an pug (as long it does not consists of newbies). We forced one of those "famed" premades out of the arena match with an klingon pug-team couple of days ago.