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4 beam arrays vs 6 beams arrays
raj011
Member Posts: 987 Arc User
Hi all I was wondering which is best to have with 4 beams i have noticed that the power does not decline as fast as 6 beams but with 4 beams will it give me more damage because more power is going in to the beams or will the 6 beams give me more damage instead? Also is it best to have multiple beam array tactical consoles or one beam array console and one torpedo console?
Trying to maximize the damage with my AC-R and odyssey class standard
Thanks
Trying to maximize the damage with my AC-R and odyssey class standard
Thanks
Post edited by raj011 on
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You will be doing less damage with 4 beams. You need to spec yourself correctly and equip emergency power to weapons to counter the massive drain from the beam arrays. I use 6 beam arrays on my FAHCR and my weapon power doesn't drop below 90 during combat.
I imagine the new Romulan Beam Arrays are every beamboat lover's wetdream, what with the whole 'no energy drain' attribute.
It is only the rep beam array from the weapon set and you can only mount 1 of it per ship. At least that is waht the description says.
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Yeah, limit one and no accuracy bonus, though its still fairly nice everywhere else and Rom Plasma beams ARE pretty nasty. Better for managing drain though is a combo of 6 beam arrays, then mounting the kinetic cutting beam and assimilated module for the Omega Weapon 2-piece proc. When that ability procs, you get basically a full salvo at zero drain, and with so many weapons blazing away it procs pretty often.
Well that sucks.
Would be a bit op if you could mount more then 1 of it.
U.S.S. Helios -Vesta Class / R.R.W. Dark Science - Dyson Surveillance Science Destroyer
U.S.S. Donut - Fleet Advanced Research Vessel Retrofit
TheWiseGuys
No more OP than the Escort builds flying around, but I see your point.
/thread
Sometimes they fire from the same firing point so it looks like less beams. Monitoring your weapon recycling times on the toolbar will better tell you if they're actually firing
And yeah, 6+KCB is generally the sweet spot. There are functional builds with 7-8, but those are usually more build-specific rather than general-purpose.
7 beams + the KCB is optimal if- and it's a big if- you can keep weapons power pegged. If you don't use an A2B build, with Dulmur, and engineer power abilities, it might be best to keep it to 6+KCB+torp.
I do use a torpedo (the wide-angle) because I like it, but I've parsed it out both ways and even with TS1 the torp hurts me- albeit slightly- in the DPS department, vs. having another beam firing at will.
What does KCB stand for?
Kinetic Cutting Beam. It's from the Omega reputation.
Also don't forget the romulan experemental beam array, a beam that doesn't use weapon power.
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As for torp's I gave up on them unless I used 2 RCS consoles because it seemed more of a wasted slot when the majority of ships I am fighting were small fast moving and liked to stay on my flank. I could never turn into them fast enough to be able to use them effectivly on anything but other cruisers or dreadnoughts. So I swapped the torp for a fourth beam array and DPS improved for me.
Mines are a must have on all my builds, it's like pooping out 4 white or green torps. With multiple enemies it's hit fire at will and shields go down. mines bring the hulls to 50% or less so when i get to targeting them they are near dead already.
Good to keep weapon batteries on hand as well as emergency to weapons for that extra kick now and again but weapons power doesnt seem to be a huge issue since i have never seen it go below 70 unless I forgot to set power levels.
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Having the DEM Doff is an expensive move, out of reach for most players. Can't recommend that to anyone realistically.
8 BAs won't work, even over capped w/ EPtW. You'll do more damage with 7
7 BAs is marginally better than 6.
6 BAs is pretty decent, your drain is manageable here.
I'm using 5 + 1 Romulan Experimental, +1 KCB, + 1 Rom torp
The cutting beam pulls its weight damage wise, and the rom torp more then enough. Mixing burst/sustained damage is important.
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Like eclipse4g said, it's the Omega Kinetic Cutting Beam. It's a beam weapon with a 360 degree firing arc, and it does kinetic damage. Once you've dropped the targets' shields, the KCB will really tear through their hull. It takes a while to unlock but, when you do, it's absolutely worth the trouble.
Keep calm, and continue firing photon torpedoes.
8 beams can work and 8 beams would do more damage then just 7 beams. However this is not a good choice at all vs other options. Also the wide angle quantum torp is a good option and in fact a better option then the HYT rom torp option. It's a beam boat and using a torp with 90 degree firing arc means it's only firing 1/2 the time. Wide angle torp would be firing most of the time and should be used with torp spread. As regards the KCB it actually does significantly less damage then a beam array. However it is required for the 2 set piece bonus and it does only use 8 weapon power. So it's used mainly for those 2 things and not it's actual damage output.
Looking at my parse of the last eSTF I did was 10,810dps. Engineer using a fleet assault cruiser refit aux2bat build. 1x experimental rom beam, 6x rom beams, 1x KCB damage looked like this.
plasma beam array fire at will III = 5,635dps
romulan plasma beam array = 2,904dps
experimental rom beam FAW III = 869dps
Directed energy modulation = 608dps
Cutting beam = 543dps
pet damage = 180dps
plasma fire = 71dps
Total beam array damage is 5,365+2,904+869=9,138dps. Now divide that by the number of beams gives us the amount each beam did. 9,138/7=1,305dps. So each beam array does 1,305dps vs 543dps for the KCB. So I wouldn't say the cutting beam is pulling it's weight. But again for the 2 less power it uses and for the 2 piece bonus it's needed.
The experimental rom beam/zero point energy conduit/rom torp combo is a good choice for PvP and not PvE. The 3 piece bonus cooldown is to long for PvE. It is a great bonus for burst damage and PvP however. As is the HYT for the burst needed on PvP. But neither is very good for PvE and is a dps loss.
Trust me I've tried every combination I could think of and 1 experimental, 6 rom plasma beams and 1 KCB works the best for eSTF overall damage.
The problem is total weapon power usage and most especially because the weapons are in sync (same reload time). An escort DHC fore/turrets aft setup works because the weapons are out of sync (differing reload times). Although the dhc/turret does go in sync every 9 seconds or so the majority of the time it's out of sync. Weapon power use is almost instant and recovery is almost instant as well. No console or skill can change this. The only help is resistance to weapon power drain via DEM with the DEM doff, Nadion inversion and the 2 piece bonus from Omega Adapted Borg Technology Set.
Let's quickly math the damage of 8 beams. I'll use 500 damage at 50 power as the reference. Starting with weapon power at 125 it looks like this.
8 beam arrays
beam 1 hits for 1,250 power then drops to 115
beam 2 hits for 1,150 power then drops to 105
beam 3 hits for 1,050 power then drops to 95
beam 4 hits for 950 power then drops to 85
beam 5 hits for 850 power then drops to 75
beam 6 hits for 750 power then drops to 65
beam 7 hits for 650 power then drops to 55
beam 8 hits for 550 power then drops to 45
total damage = 7,200
Notice the last beam hits for 44% of the 1st beams damage
1 experimental beam array and 7 beam arrays
beam 1 hit for 1,250 power stays at 125 via experimental rom beam
beam 2 hits for 1,250 power then drops to 115
beam 3 hits for 1,150 power then drops to 105
beam 4 hits for 1,050 power then drops to 95
beam 5 hits for 950 power then drops to 85
beam 6 hits for 850 power then drops to 75
beam 7 hits for 750 power then drops to 65
beam 8 hits for 650 power then drops to 55
total damage=7,900
Notice last beam hits 52% of the 1st beams damage
1 experimental rom beam, 6 beams, and 1 Cutting beam (using the KCB in the 4th slot at 66% damage)
beam 1 hit for 1,250 power stays at 125 via experimental rom beam
beam 2 hits for 1,250 power then drops to 115
beam 3 hits for 1,150 power then drops to 105
KCB 4 hits for 693 power then drops to 97 power drops by 8 via KCB
beam 5 hits for 970 power then drops to 87
beam 6 hits for 870 power then drops to 77
beam 7 hits for 770 power then drops to 67
beam 8 hits for 670 power then drops to 57
total damage=7,623
Notice the last beam hits for 53.6% of the 1st beams damage. While this shows as doing less total damage then the previous example the power levels on average would be significantly higher with the omega 2 piece bonus. So total damage will be higher.
The 3 examples is more or less what you may be thinking about using as you're gearing up. However looking at each you should rightly conclude that 8 beams in the 1st example is not a good choice. You'd be better off using 5-6 beams, and 2-3 torpedos or torps and mines. In the 2nd example you'd be better off with 1 experimental rom beam, 6 beams, and 1 torpedo. The 3rd example is your best choice. But with the last you must have the omega 2 piece bonus.
After extensive testing I came to the conclusion that a beam boat and or weapons that are in sync should not exceed 60 weapon power drain or you loose dps vs swapping out some beams for weapons like torps or mines to stay within this rule.
As for tac +x% damage consoles. People don't seem to understand the scaling of them. They seem to think diminishing returns kicks in and you get less of a bonus per console after the 1st. This is completely false. Each console adds exactly the same amount as the 1st console. If the 1st increased beam damage by 50 the 2nd would increase damage by another 50 as well. It's additive to base damage and not multiplicative. Also damage is further increased based on power level. A torp console is the same except you don't get the extra damage from a higher weapon power level.
Let's say we average weapon power at 100. Using beam arrays with a base damage of 228 a +28.1% mk xii blue console increases damage per beam by 64. And let's say that without any consoles the beams hit for 800 at 100 power. Adding the console the beam would now hit for 864. The rom torpedo would have to use the generic torp console which would increase it's damage by 20% for a mk xii purple. Let's try using differing weapons, beams, KCB and Rom Torp.
no consoles
6 beams hitting for 800dps each*6=4,800dps
1 KCB hitting for 600dps
1 Rom Torp hitting for (1,609*3)/6=805dps
Total=6,205dps
1x 20% torp console
6 beams hitting for 800dps each*6=4,800dps
1 KCB hitting for 600dps
1 Rom Torp hitting for (1,931*3)/6=966dps
Total=6,366dps (total increase is 161dps)
1x 28.1 beam console
6 beams hitting for 864dps each*6=5,184dps
1 KCB hitting for 600dps
1 Rom Torp hitting for (1,609*3)/6=805dps
Total=6,589dps (total increase is 383dps)
1x 28.1% beam console and 1x 20% torp console
6 beams hitting for 864dps each*6=5,184dps
1 KCB hitting for 600dps
1 Rom Torp hitting for (1,931*3)/6=966dps
Total=6,750dps (total increase is 545dps)
2x 28.1 beam console
6 beams hitting for 928dps each*6=5,568dps
1 KCB hitting for 600dps
1 Rom Torp hitting for (1,609*3)/6=805dps
Total=6,973dps (total increase is 768dps)
Now let's use my ship as an example. I use 4x 28.1% plasma beam consoles and 2x 9% plasma sci consoles. Also 7.6% from rom singularity harness 2 piece bonus. Using 1 exp rom beam, 6 rom beams and 1 kcb. Damage looks like this.
4xplasma consoles=64x4=256 extra damage per beam
2xplasma sci consoles=20.5x2=41
1xrom 2 piece set bonus=17
So each rom beam should do 800+256+41+17=1,114
7 beams=1,114*7=7,798dps
1 KCB=600dps
total=8,398dps (this is 2,193dps more then the 1st example)
While my math isn't exact it's close enough to give you the general idea.
HYT isn't recommended on a beam boat since you benefit more from AP:B and FAW.
KCB suffers from kinetic damage resistance on shields but it will do more damage overall than another beam array. (Your damage numbers seem low for it.)
False, the Rom torps can be shot down plus the 3 piece hyperflux's damage is split between the plasma fire and beam damage so it's not good for burst. The debuff might even be cleared by Hazard Emitters.
2 mins is comparable to a captain CD and is fine regardless.
I run rom 3 piece with 5 arrays and KCB and works great for ESTF's. 5-6 is the sweet spot for beam damage. (Though I'm tac nor running an a2b build to your eng that is running one.)
It's hard to argue against my own parsing when it comes to the Kinetic cutting beams total damage. Have looked at hundreds of my own parses. I'm not a fan of using the rom torpedo. I can see the benefits of using it while gearing up. The 3 piece bonus is nice for getting those 8k+ hits and 18k crits with the experimental rom beam. The hull melt can be cleared sure. But if it isn't is does a decent amount of damage. I did however use it while gearing up as it was my best option at the time.
5-6 beam arrays is not the sweet spot. Reread my post and the math. It is however gear, ship, skill points, set piece bonuses etc dependent. I should not say this is better then that without quantifying it. There are to many factors involved. However for me as an engineer by the time you have the gear, ship, build, skill points, etc I have the 1 exp rom beam, 6 rom beams and 1 kcb does work the best. Argue all you want I've tested every combination I could think of on this engineer. Now as a tac without having nadion inversion and my build, ship, gear, etc etc this may not be the best option for you. I can't say for sure as my tac uses DHC/turret combo. So never really tested it. But as a Tac you should be doing about 15k dps in a beam boat. If you aren't then i'd suggest trying something different.
what about 4 beams and 4 torpedoes?
Torps have a shared cooldown so you'll be waiting to cycle through. And are near useless unless you get the shields down or are using the ones with extra penetration.
Cool down is not that long, i torpedo spread with WAQT and then fired with next torpedo instantly.
And no 4 beams and 4 torps is a terrible option. Where you gonna stick the torps? 4 up front or 2 up front and 2 in the rear. How often will all of them be able to shoot? 50% of the time? It's all about being able to use every weapon slot the greatest majority of the time. This is why a wide angle quantum torp works so well. Uptime is greater then 90%. It beats the Romulan torpedo as it's uptime is greater. Otherwise the Romulan torpedo would win out. Now if you had a faster turning ship that's a different story. But the OP is talking about an Oddy and an Assault Cruiser Refit.
*Since the B'rel can fire torpedoes while cloaked, it's possible to load up torpedoes on the front and just keep whittling your enemies down without being seen. Not the most effective method, but it can be fun.
Keep calm, and continue firing photon torpedoes.
The Kinetic Cutting Beam is fantastic. Yes it cuts hull decently. But the real bonus, as some people have mentioned, is the 2 piece Omega (weapon) set bonus.
We all assume you are running the Omega console, because it is the best console in the game for DPS. With the console, you get the 2 piece bonus, which adds a % proc to grant +10 weapon power and (the big one) +(lots) of weapon power drain resistance. This will hold your dps very high, even (maybe I should say especially) with 7 beam arrays alongside your kcb.