Tholians are easy to beat there are skills n powers to get around there procs if your to clueless to work it out ask on here on how to beat them meny will be more then happy to help.
but the way u gone about this post gets me to think nOOb and move on.
Your not actually forced to fight Tholians unless you want to, so instead of asking them to be removed why not just avoid them.
I was once DKnight1000, apparently I had taken my own name so now I'm DKnight0001. If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why. When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
As Mr Spock would say, highly illogical, having earned all the tholian kill accolades, I'd say the Tholians are not a problem, in ground combat the only tholians you have to worry about are the captains who require some tactical thinking and strategy to deal with.
But on the whole, they are an interesting fight.:rolleyes:
"The meaning of victory is not to merely defeat your enemy but to destroy him, to completely eradicate him from living memory, to leave no remnant of his endeavours, to crush utterly his achievement and remove from all record his every trace of existence. From that defeat no enemy can ever recover. That is the meaning of victory."
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
The most annoying thing about the Tholians is that the Red Matter Capacitor, despite saying "repairs all disabled subsystems" does not do so when their phased tetryon weapons proc on you.
But this is just yet another bug fix that cryptic will never get around to.
It's not just their proc, it's all sources of weapon subsystem damage. This "bug" mysteriously popped up in the very same tribble update before S6 that added Tholians.
If you don't like the Tholians, you'll LOVE the Elachi. Have never had such a frustrating fight than ones I have had with the Elachi. It made me long to fight Tholians.
If the OP thinks tholians are bad he'll loathe the ability spamming elachi in missions like defense of new romulus.
Really? I did not have any problem with the Elachi. I mean sure they were kind of annoying but the worst thing they did was hug my ship too much. (I was stuck in the old big D at the time so that did not help)
Even the mission everyone is crying about where you have to defeat about 20 ships or something and this one super ship was not that bad. You just needed to fly it like you would a BoP. (Though I suppose not everyone knows how to do that...)
Tholians are easy to beat there are skills n powers to get around there procs if your to clueless to work it out ask on here on how to beat them meny will be more then happy to help.
but the way u gone about this post gets me to think nOOb and move on.
Skills... I hope you mean like literal skill not in-game skills because Power Insulators will NOT stop their proc from working 100% of the time. Nor would any of them get you free of their webs.
While I agree removing the Tholians is not a good option I do think that they should suffer the same resistance and science fail that we do. I mean why is our Science and Drain so heavily nerfed but theirs is fine? Besides the Borg and the Iconians no one should really be running around with ships that are so much more awesome than ours when we are flying the top of the line for our factions. (When you get it properly set up anyway)
Really? I did not have any problem with the Elachi. I mean sure they were kind of annoying but the worst thing they did was hug my ship too much. (I was stuck in the old big D at the time so that did not help)
Even the mission everyone is crying about where you have to defeat about 20 ships or something and this one super ship was not that bad. You just needed to fly it like you would a BoP. (Though I suppose not everyone knows how to do that...)
Skills... I hope you mean like literal skill not in-game skills because Power Insulators will NOT stop their proc from working 100% of the time. Nor would any of them get you free of their webs.
While I agree removing the Tholians is not a good option I do think that they should suffer the same resistance and science fail that we do. I mean why is our Science and Drain so heavily nerfed but theirs is fine? Besides the Borg and the Iconians no one should really be running around with ships that are so much more awesome than ours when we are flying the top of the line for our factions. (When you get it properly set up anyway)
Yeah, I find it really funny that ya'll wanted access to the cloak/battlecloak. . .but now that you have pet Romulans, most of you can't see to figure out how to use the cloak properly. It's all about positioning and timing. Keep a close eye on where the heck the enemy NPC ships are in relation to your ship, and target carefully.
I look forward to eventually tangling with this dreaded menace people keep talking about. Maybe I'll do it on Elite. . .
One thing that bugs me about the Tholians is when the Tarantula teleports you in front of it, and does nothing else. It doesn't hold you in a tractor beam or fire at you with a powerful frontal attack.
Aside from that, it's nice to see Cryptic introducing new enemies into the game that are not just another generic mob to shoot at. It requires actual thinking to overcome your opponents...
Yeah, I do find it odd that the Tarantula doesn't immediately begin charging its frontal blast weapon when it does that - it DOES have one. Perhaps it was deemed too unfair should you get webbed immediately after the teleport? (Then again, the Elachi are more than happy to spam you with invasive scans while you're being targeted by their cone-attacks.)
Emergency Power to Weapons is a must, as is Beam Fire At Will or some kind of Point Defense system. Between BFAW II and a PDS, I can melt cages and walls pretty effectively on my Fed cruiser, and Charged Particle Burst does the trick on my Romulan Tal'shiar battlecruiser.
I agree with the OP's frustration; Tholians mostly just spam system offline attacks and while they can be countered, it doesn't make them any less annoying. Most fights with their ships last for ages, purely because you used all your emergency abilities only to get the same system(s) knocked offline again straight away, or the webs end up in that weird state where you can't seem to target the nodes with anything.
I don't want them gone from the game though, it'd just be nice to see them overhauled a bit; maybe have their abilities drain your systems rather than knock them offline randomly, so you have more time to respond. It'd be nice to see the mesh "cages" still allow ships to move through at higher speeds, but with increased damage if they do-so. Maybe it's just me but I always seem to be the one they trap in those things and I never have the abilities I need to break through when it happens, or they don't actually target (or hit) any of the nodes so I have to either hope a charitable team-mate clears it from outside, or I have to wait it out.
So yeah, they're really annoying, but the game is the better for having them included; but having unique and interesting mechanics shouldn't mean incredibly annoying ones.
OK guys the title of this is just an expression saying that the Tholians are the most annoying enemies look all they do is the same god damn thing again and again heres an example:
1st they shoot you
2nd they starting to remove your weapons
3rd depend on the level group is there they shoot there electrical charges and is so not effective against me but I think cryptic made does just to mess with your computer and mix you up so your screen gets full of electric for nothing
4rth now they start putting these caging spam
And they restart the same cycle over and over.
Now I am trying to target the little nodes on the side to get out but you know what I am clicking a lot and it does nothing on them, I look at my weapon power fully charged but still my weapons wont work this issue needs to be fixed.
I've never had any problem with Tholians on my Fed Tac Armitage-class. Set carrier pets to intercept, that will help with the Tholian webs and torpedoes, and just DPS anything else to death.
Oh noes, an enemy which actually requires some thought to kill.
Keep Engineering Team or EPTW handy to restore weapon power if taken offline.
Use cannon scatter volley/BFAW to get rid of the webs alternatively get a point defence system.
Easy to beat if you think a little. My only criticism of the Tholians is that Cryptic are using them a little TOO much at the moment. Almost every new end game or PvE event now has Tholians flying around.
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My only criticism of the Tholians is that Cryptic are using them a little TOO much at the moment. Almost every new end game or PvE event now has Tholians flying around.
hey, better tholians than the borg, who have been done to death in EVERYTHING, not just STO
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EptW and Weapons Batteries put weapons back online (Red Matter Cap is still bugged) and CSV and FAW take care of add and nets. I wish the Devs would fix the Red Matter Cap so I don't have to wait for one of my others to come off of CD. What is annoying, the Warp Core power that brings weapons back online shared CD with batteries and RMC.
Hi, my name is: Elim Garak, Former Cardassian Oppressor
LTS, here since...when did this game launch again?
The Tholians used to TRIBBLE me off when they were first introduced, but they've had some balance passes. They are a lot less spammy about the disable weapons than they were before. Originally in a Fleet Alert against them, your weapons were down pretty much the entire time regardless of what you had to counter it. I don't think you could shoot your own way out of the webs at first either.
Now, as soon as I see a web start to form, I look for a node in front of me, target it, destroy it, fly straight out, and I'm clear by the time the web fully forms. I laugh at the notion that we need those reputation consumables to deal with the webs. They're better off using the web walls to hide from me. For the weapons offline, I carry a red matter capacitor. If you don't have it, weapons batteries, EPtW or Eng Team work just as well.
I agree with the OP's frustration; Tholians mostly just spam system offline attacks and while they can be countered, it doesn't make them any less annoying. Most fights with their ships last for ages, purely because you used all your emergency abilities only to get the same system(s) knocked offline again straight away, or the webs end up in that weird state where you can't seem to target the nodes with anything.
1.) Pretty much what he said.
Tholians add some fun abilities into the mix, but they use the weapon disabling a bit too often. You can run two or three counters to that and still have your weapons knocked out for half of the fight. That shouldn't happen, if a ship is set up to counter something by all means let it be effective. One fix could be that after having a sub knocked out you're immune to that for the duration it would have had. Say something disables weapons for 15 seconds? If you fix it right away you have 15'ish seconds left were your weapons can't get disabled.
2.) Some other thing that happened way too often for me: you dive in and aggro a group of tholians with a Tarantula - they will cast like three nets around you, silly but okay. Then the Tarantula uses its teleport, kindly pulls you out of the webs and lets you fly away merrily. That's just... stupid really. They shouldn't use teleport on ships that are cought in nets.
3.) Is it intended that only the bottom nodes are targetable from inside a web, while from the outside both top and bottom can be targeted? If so that would add needless confusion especially to new players who can't figure out what the heck to do, while doing nothing to raise the challenge for experienced players who know "just target bottom".
4.) Please make the camera not be blocked by the web? Suddenly having your view jerked around because the net whacks your camera is probably more annoying and dangerous than all of the Tholian abilites combined.
Jellico....Engineer ground.....Da'val Romulan space Sci
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Also, warp cores just added a new way to get a free single system repair: Search for [WCap] under warp cores. Right now, you can expect to spend a few million for one, but it's coming down pretty rapidly and should stabilize in the next couple weeks.
WCap warp cores do NOT repair your subsystem when fighting tholians. I believe the issue is that cryptic did their usual sloppy coding for the WCap. It turns your guns back on, but doesn't remove the debuff. So your guns turn back on for half a second, then immediately shut off again, making the whole thing pointless.
I find Tholians incredibly annoying to fight. They aren't difficult. They're not gonna kill me. Even solo'ing scimitar nodes in a bop in Azure. They're just going to waste my time repeatedly. It's like other MMO's that put mobs in the game that stun you alot. That's not difficulty. That's annoyance. There's nothing challenging or fun about fighting tholians, just tedium.
Tholians seem to be designed around the idea of making cruisers better in STO without fixing the underlying problem of why cruisers suck. Instead of addressing it, they made tholians who are countered with engineering boffs and beam weapons. It's bad design. They should fix the underlying issues, rather then make one specific enemy around cruiser's strengths. (Tholian rep rewards also seem to be cruiser-focused)
Really, I don't see what the issue is, other then they are annoying.
I flew, for ages, a mirror recon sci, which I used as a tank/torp ship, and haven't had any issues, honestly. I mean, lets be honest, science ships suck balls overall, least weapons, skills that are nerfed to all hell (seriously, even the names are padded), the only thing they have going for them at all is healing which is quickly being outpaced due to the dev team's foresight to always add things that add more dps, anyway, I'm digressing. Point is, my little missile ship/science vessel can kill those TRIBBLE, and if that thing can, anyone can.
"Oh no, they shut down my weapons for 2-3 seconds!" Seriously, that's about how long it is if you use a human crew with leadership on your both slots. Webs? A joke, all it takes as has been pointed out would be Repulsors, TS, FAW, any number of teleports, intercept mode on pets, gravity well, Tyken's rift (though who uses that is lost on me), the list goes on.
Really, spheres are a bigger threat and annoyance, they run and can actually hurt (on elite in groups). The Tholians fly so slow there are old people with perpetual blinkers on telling them to pull to the side of the road and let people pass and do pretty much nothing in the way of damage.
Short version to the OP... Really? Of all the things that really do need to be fixed, from the cruiser and sci ship issues, to the stability of the game client (akin to a bunny on crystal meth), and new issues, like Rommy balancing and ships, you're going to say that Tholians need to be nuked and made easier then they already are?
While fighting Tholians is extremely annoying and one of my top 3 most hated enemies to fight, I definitely don't think they should be removed from the game. They're a cool enemy and while they are annoying to fight, they're not overpowered.
Also, removing a lore enemy from the game due to gameplay reasons makes me have a sad.
"You hurt me long ago; my wounds bled for years. Now you are back, but I am not the same."
Comments
but the way u gone about this post gets me to think nOOb and move on.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
But on the whole, they are an interesting fight.:rolleyes:
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
It's not just their proc, it's all sources of weapon subsystem damage. This "bug" mysteriously popped up in the very same tribble update before S6 that added Tholians.
Really? I did not have any problem with the Elachi. I mean sure they were kind of annoying but the worst thing they did was hug my ship too much. (I was stuck in the old big D at the time so that did not help)
Even the mission everyone is crying about where you have to defeat about 20 ships or something and this one super ship was not that bad. You just needed to fly it like you would a BoP. (Though I suppose not everyone knows how to do that...)
Skills... I hope you mean like literal skill not in-game skills because Power Insulators will NOT stop their proc from working 100% of the time. Nor would any of them get you free of their webs.
While I agree removing the Tholians is not a good option I do think that they should suffer the same resistance and science fail that we do. I mean why is our Science and Drain so heavily nerfed but theirs is fine? Besides the Borg and the Iconians no one should really be running around with ships that are so much more awesome than ours when we are flying the top of the line for our factions. (When you get it properly set up anyway)
Yeah, I find it really funny that ya'll wanted access to the cloak/battlecloak. . .but now that you have pet Romulans, most of you can't see to figure out how to use the cloak properly. It's all about positioning and timing. Keep a close eye on where the heck the enemy NPC ships are in relation to your ship, and target carefully.
I look forward to eventually tangling with this dreaded menace people keep talking about. Maybe I'll do it on Elite. . .
Aside from that, it's nice to see Cryptic introducing new enemies into the game that are not just another generic mob to shoot at. It requires actual thinking to overcome your opponents...
...or one hell of a powerful AoE volley.
The rest is just effective power management.
I don't want them gone from the game though, it'd just be nice to see them overhauled a bit; maybe have their abilities drain your systems rather than knock them offline randomly, so you have more time to respond. It'd be nice to see the mesh "cages" still allow ships to move through at higher speeds, but with increased damage if they do-so. Maybe it's just me but I always seem to be the one they trap in those things and I never have the abilities I need to break through when it happens, or they don't actually target (or hit) any of the nodes so I have to either hope a charitable team-mate clears it from outside, or I have to wait it out.
So yeah, they're really annoying, but the game is the better for having them included; but having unique and interesting mechanics shouldn't mean incredibly annoying ones.
Game Balance - Ship Size and Wingmates
*needed to lengthen*
Whiner
But then I like squishing spiders IRL.
Keep Engineering Team or EPTW handy to restore weapon power if taken offline.
Use cannon scatter volley/BFAW to get rid of the webs alternatively get a point defence system.
Easy to beat if you think a little. My only criticism of the Tholians is that Cryptic are using them a little TOO much at the moment. Almost every new end game or PvE event now has Tholians flying around.
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A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
LTS, here since...when did this game launch again?
Now, as soon as I see a web start to form, I look for a node in front of me, target it, destroy it, fly straight out, and I'm clear by the time the web fully forms. I laugh at the notion that we need those reputation consumables to deal with the webs. They're better off using the web walls to hide from me. For the weapons offline, I carry a red matter capacitor. If you don't have it, weapons batteries, EPtW or Eng Team work just as well.
1.) Pretty much what he said.
Tholians add some fun abilities into the mix, but they use the weapon disabling a bit too often. You can run two or three counters to that and still have your weapons knocked out for half of the fight. That shouldn't happen, if a ship is set up to counter something by all means let it be effective. One fix could be that after having a sub knocked out you're immune to that for the duration it would have had. Say something disables weapons for 15 seconds? If you fix it right away you have 15'ish seconds left were your weapons can't get disabled.
2.) Some other thing that happened way too often for me: you dive in and aggro a group of tholians with a Tarantula - they will cast like three nets around you, silly but okay. Then the Tarantula uses its teleport, kindly pulls you out of the webs and lets you fly away merrily. That's just... stupid really. They shouldn't use teleport on ships that are cought in nets.
3.) Is it intended that only the bottom nodes are targetable from inside a web, while from the outside both top and bottom can be targeted? If so that would add needless confusion especially to new players who can't figure out what the heck to do, while doing nothing to raise the challenge for experienced players who know "just target bottom".
4.) Please make the camera not be blocked by the web? Suddenly having your view jerked around because the net whacks your camera is probably more annoying and dangerous than all of the Tholian abilites combined.
i3-2100 3.10GHz
8GB Kingston HyperX Fury Blue 1333Mhz DDR3 RAM CL9
ASUS DirectCU II GTX 660 OC 2GB GDDR5
[
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
500 years in the future and we still look like schmucks when getting our ID photos taken...
I find Tholians incredibly annoying to fight. They aren't difficult. They're not gonna kill me. Even solo'ing scimitar nodes in a bop in Azure. They're just going to waste my time repeatedly. It's like other MMO's that put mobs in the game that stun you alot. That's not difficulty. That's annoyance. There's nothing challenging or fun about fighting tholians, just tedium.
Tholians seem to be designed around the idea of making cruisers better in STO without fixing the underlying problem of why cruisers suck. Instead of addressing it, they made tholians who are countered with engineering boffs and beam weapons. It's bad design. They should fix the underlying issues, rather then make one specific enemy around cruiser's strengths. (Tholian rep rewards also seem to be cruiser-focused)
I flew, for ages, a mirror recon sci, which I used as a tank/torp ship, and haven't had any issues, honestly. I mean, lets be honest, science ships suck balls overall, least weapons, skills that are nerfed to all hell (seriously, even the names are padded), the only thing they have going for them at all is healing which is quickly being outpaced due to the dev team's foresight to always add things that add more dps, anyway, I'm digressing. Point is, my little missile ship/science vessel can kill those TRIBBLE, and if that thing can, anyone can.
"Oh no, they shut down my weapons for 2-3 seconds!" Seriously, that's about how long it is if you use a human crew with leadership on your both slots. Webs? A joke, all it takes as has been pointed out would be Repulsors, TS, FAW, any number of teleports, intercept mode on pets, gravity well, Tyken's rift (though who uses that is lost on me), the list goes on.
Really, spheres are a bigger threat and annoyance, they run and can actually hurt (on elite in groups). The Tholians fly so slow there are old people with perpetual blinkers on telling them to pull to the side of the road and let people pass and do pretty much nothing in the way of damage.
Short version to the OP... Really? Of all the things that really do need to be fixed, from the cruiser and sci ship issues, to the stability of the game client (akin to a bunny on crystal meth), and new issues, like Rommy balancing and ships, you're going to say that Tholians need to be nuked and made easier then they already are?
Also, removing a lore enemy from the game due to gameplay reasons makes me have a sad.