Yes we do but it does not apply. What you are referring to is this:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Cryptic/PWE is not the federal government.
And I agree with everyone that a spam banning feature that doesn't have a human being monitoring/reviewing permanent bans before they go into effect to prevent the gross miscarriages of "justice" we are witnessing is a colossally stupid idea that never should have been implemented.
If they want to block spam, including the most prominent companies into a blacklist is the most logic choice. Sure I don't like being banned for just typing that name and I can fully understand why you are upset.
On the other hand: Did you really post the name of the company to show somebody what spam is? Really, this is like showing somebody what a bank-robbery is, by going into a bank with a gun.
I mean, come on: how long has he been offline to not know what spam is? 20 years?
So if you read your first post from this point of view, I can't just bash Cryptic without knowing what exactly you wrote.
If you see a light at the end of a wormhole, it's probably a photon torpedo.
The incompetence combined with unbelievably bad customer service is just shocking. First you have a spam filter that works like it was designed by high school kids. The message the the OP sent should never have triggered a spam filter to begin with, its poor/lazy programming that it did. Then you add in the fact that whoever designed it obviously is not actually a player of STO, nor did they bother to consult with anyone who is. If they had they would have know or been told that the vast majority of players either turn off system messages or relegate them to a tab of the chat window they don't use as there primary tab. The reason why is simple, system messages show the fly in spam and other junk that we simply don't want clogging up our chat window, but since the designer doesn't play the game he wouldn't know that. The correct way to deliver a warning would be to make it an Admin message, like the you have been idle 50 minutes message or the we are about to take the server down for maintenance yet again messages. Those we cannot turn off and will always see, therefor the warning would actually be delivered so innocent players wouldn't get banned by your poorly designed spam filter.
Then as if all that wasn't bad enough you throw in terrible customer service reps who take forever to get back to the players who have been screwed, people waiting a week for there account to be fixed is simply unacceptable. When someone contacts customer service about any issue, let alone one this serious, they should get a reply within 24 hours, and that reply should actually be HELPFUL.
Keep going like this and STO will join every other star trek series in never seeing a season 8, bad programming combined with terrible customer service is a sure way to kill the game we all love.
In Cryptic's defence, this is what a lot of people asked for not too long ago in another thread; a stringent auto block system to deal with the spam. It has its issues, but its important to point them out so it can be improved, rather than just attacking Cryptic and each other.
If they want to block spam, including the most prominent companies into a blacklist is the most logic choice. Sure I don't like being banned for just typing that name and I can fully understand why you are upset.
On the other hand: Did you really post the name of the company to show somebody what spam is? Really, this is like showing somebody what a bank-robbery is, by going into a bank with a gun.
I mean, come on: how long has he been offline to not know what spam is? 20 years?
So if you read your first post from this point of view, I can't just bash Cryptic without knowing what exactly you wrote.
While the OP's issue was slightly different, something similar could happen simply like this:
1) Person A returns to game after having been away for 3 months.
2) Person A discovers there are 50 messages in inbox, and goes to read them.
3) Person A sees 2 messages are fleetmembers asking 'where did you vanish' and 48 are from [company X] marketing cheap credits.
4) Person A says 'hello' on fleet, and gets greeted by others. 'welcome back'
5) Person A says 'damn, you wouldn't believe it, I was away 3 months and I have mailbox full of TRIBBLE from [company X], don't those people ever get tired spamming.
6) Person A waits for a moment, but nothing appears on fleet channel. Person A thinks maybe the chat glitched. Person a hits enter-arrow-enter to repost.
7) Person A is permanently banned. Welcome back to STO, goodbye.
Judging from previous posts, the part 5 & 6 could be to fleet chat, or simply a private message for a friend - the latter probably being a much more likely thing to occur.
(Note on part 6: person A is complitely tired of watching the 'has received TRIBBLE from lockbox' spam every other minute, so has disabled the system channels spamming it)
In Cryptic's defence, this is what a lot of people asked for not too long ago in another thread; a stringent auto block system to deal with the spam. It has its issues, but its important to point them out so it can be improved, rather than just attacking Cryptic and each other.
auto blocking is not the same as a poorly implemented auto banning system for use of a single word. No one asked for that. Infact, people were asking for the spam mail to stop... i don't recall anyone saying chat was being infected with gold sellers and asking for a resolution.
And this is the problem with any completely automated system. No matter how much planning Cryptic put into the system it is run by a machine that is incapable of independent thought. Yes, it is working as designed and stopping EC spammers, but it is also catching innocent, paying customers in the crossfire. You should find this very unacceptable, Cryptic.
Therefore, I posit a solution:
Put the human back in the equation. I know that makes me sound radical in this day-and-age of automatic automated automation, but please hear me out, Cryptic.
Allow the players to police EC-selling spam messages (both in chat and the in-game mail system). I for one have always reported those spamming, gold-selling turds. I can't stand them, and I'm sure there are plenty of others with a similar mindset.
Once an account has been reported by players multiple times for posting EC selling spam, the game will then kick it over to the automated system's filters. "Why more than one report?" you may ask. This is to prevent griefing or harassment. Requiring reports from three or four players should be sufficient.
Yes, this will allow EC sellers to get off a post or two before getting the ban-hammer, but it will also eliminate the drive-by banning of innocent players of which the current system seems so fond.
Thank you for taking the time to read this message, Cryptic.
PS: And let's face it...any player lame (or dumb) enough to actually buy EC from these hackers can use Google to find them.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Command Officers of the USS Wyvern (from left to right): Aurellia Eshkah (Tactical); Indigo Shae (Engineering); Nysiay Chysiayki (VA, Ship Captain) Jeclia Sek (Science); Vally Mantivour (Security)
In Cryptic's defence, this is what a lot of people asked for not too long ago in another thread; a stringent auto block system to deal with the spam. It has its issues, but its important to point them out so it can be improved, rather than just attacking Cryptic and each other.
I'm not sure who decided the system to be put in place, but this whole system is classic 'How not to do Customer service 101' stuff. The people working in customer service should hopefully have educations in the relevant fields (such as communication) and if there is one thing that most people in the industry know, it's that the customer doesn't usually know what they want or what they are talking about (generally), as such, they should know that using knee jerk forum responces for the basis of a customer service system is NOT a good idea.
I really do hope that PWE reviews thier customer service policies in regards to how tickets are handled, how chat is monitered and how autobans are handed out, because right now, after 3 years, all I've seen is innocent people getting hurt by the system with the intended targets still operating regardless.
For whatever reason, I have never received any spam mails in-game (maybe I'm not considered profitable enough to get scammed?), so I probably won't get banned, after all I don't know the scam so I can't say words I don't know...
However, in my opinion the auto-ban is idiotic. Even Seven of Nine would find this "too efficient"
As it has been stated before, suspicious chat should be flagged and viewed by staff. Or maybe make the scam words filtered as profanity, with exclusion from profanity filter, so they can't be viewed even if somebody turns off profanity filter (I'm barely making any sense here, bad syntax is bad). Not sure how that would work, it's just an idea. But the current system is way too general and strikes way too randomly. Even an "[Admin]Warning! [Enter Warning Text Here]" would be better since [Admin] chat can't be blocked.
Just do something better than that current system...
As much as I hate getting spam mail, I cannot fathom this being a justifiable response to that problem.
Cryptic, if you cannot investigate individual gold sellers to determine if they're real or not, then just leave it all alone and we can continue putting them on ignore one by one. I would rather suffer that inconvenience than be a party to this ridiculous system.
The only reason you could justify doing this is if you've calculated you lose more income from the currency trading outside your game than you would lose from innocent, banned players... and that's kinda evil.
Honestly, what's wrong with the system as it is now is that it doesn't conduct a sanity check - here's how I'd "fix" it: if the account is new, pass the ban as it's currently implemented (two violations and you're done). If the account is over, say, a month old, fire off an [Admin] warning in-game as well as a warning email and implement, say, a 72-hour chat ban on top of that, unless and until the email is acknowledged. If the email goes unacknowledged, ban the whole account like usual. If the email is acknowledged, take the chat ban off, but put the account on probation for, say, a week. If the ban is triggered again within that week, it elevates to a permanent ban. If the account manages to get through that week without triggering it again, the probation is lifted and the account is back to square one as far as bans are concerned.
Yeah, it means some spam has the chance of getting through a bit more often, but it should also result in far fewer threads like this.
They clearly need to get this fixed A.S.A.P.!All I did was mention a in- game channel,and got a permaban warning for linking.I didn't link anything!,And im not about to lose my account over this.PLEASE fix this:eek:
Just to make sure everyone knows the right thing to do to respond to this extreme form of censorship.
All threads will be merged with this one so direct ALL your friends and fleet members here. Get them to post even if it's just a "This is a bad decision please change or remove it".
This will get a change if enough people show disapproval of it. If it continues, further action might be necessary like walking out on the game like so many did at the start of season 7.
So now this has been moved to the bug forum. Is it a bug or is it working as intended?
It was merged with a thread I started. Looks like mine was bigger at the moment when they were compared. And yes, I posted mine in gameplay bugs section. Should post it in general discussion tho.
May 2013, automatic permanent ban for mentioning gold-seller sites pwebranflakes: this system is currently in place and working the way it should. moradum: I got banned for saying "I started my day with cutting off 3 MM off of the bottom of my cabinet"
I usually support Cryptic but not with this. I am finding myself walking very careful with what I say because two people I know have been banned for saying absolutely nothing related to spam sites.
NERF CANNONS - THEY NEED A 50% NERF
CRUISERS NEED A 206% HULL BUFF
I am not affected by this issue but I support the people who have been wrongly banned. I really think Cryptic needs to rethink this policy. I liked the idea of a warning dialog that you have to scroll / accept as an alternative. Or better yet just muzzle the person who sends these messages over and over. Then suspend their account for x days where x increases exponentially per offense.
It is pretty stupid to auto ban people on a 5 char string. Accidents happen with tens of thousands of players.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
I will pass along your feedback, but this system is currently in place and working the way it should.
Then I sincerely hope 'the way it should' gets reviewed and altered very bloody quickly. This is a grotesquely ill-advised and badly thought out system that serves as a minor inconvenience, at best, to any actual gold-spammer, as they simply abandon that account and create a new one, but can be a fairly major hassle for a legitimate player who doesn't want to lose the time, effort and possibly money they've put into that account.
If you see anyone trying to trick others, please report them to a GM immediately so an investigation take place and appropriate action taken.
To note: Players are given a detailed warning stating what they did wrong, and to not do it again, before being banned -- continuing to do it past the warning will cause the ban. The warning is there for a reason
From what I've seen, the warning is NOT detailed, it simply warns about 'posting links to prohibited sites', even when the system is triggered by something other than a link, and even this somewhat vague and possibly inaccurate warning is not displayed when certain settings are set differently from the defaults. A warning should be given, but given in a way that makes it clear what, precisely, you're being warned about, and also in a way that is not easy to intentionally bypass, far less inadvertently do so.
Well, at least spammers reacted to this "feature" - they changed the name of "company" from e---- to something else already. Mmm, fresh flavour of spam.
May 2013, automatic permanent ban for mentioning gold-seller sites pwebranflakes: this system is currently in place and working the way it should. moradum: I got banned for saying "I started my day with cutting off 3 MM off of the bottom of my cabinet"
Its your own fault for even talking about it. Get off your RP'er high horse and just delete the stupid email. How hard is it to just block the name and delete the mail? There is no reason to chat about it.
Don't be foolish and chat about it! I applaud Cryptic for taking action!
Its your own fault for even talking about it. Get off your RP'er high horse and just delete the stupid email. How hard is it to just block the name and delete the mail? There is no reason to chat about it.
Don't be foolish and chat about it! I applaud Cryptic for taking action!
I nominate this post for the title of "Most obvious troll attempt in STO history". Do I have a 2nd?
Its your own fault for even talking about it. Get off your RP'er high horse and just delete the stupid email. How hard is it to just block the name and delete the mail? There is no reason to chat about it.
Don't be foolish and chat about it! I applaud Cryptic for taking action!
You can't be THAT clueless... Check the post in which the guy says he was banned for saying:
"I began my day from shaving 3mm off my cabinet"
May 2013, automatic permanent ban for mentioning gold-seller sites pwebranflakes: this system is currently in place and working the way it should. moradum: I got banned for saying "I started my day with cutting off 3 MM off of the bottom of my cabinet"
I got banned for saying "I started my day with cutting off 3 MM off of the bottom of my cabinet"
and bam, perma banned, not even a courtesy email and there's no human alive that's working the tickets atm.
I think its because maybe you cut off to much... DIY, should not be for the faint hearted. I am so glad we have an auto ban for DIY issues, this really could get well out of hand.
Imagine the chat in game, I hope MFI and Ikea are also banned, how about B&Q, those should be in the auto ban also...
Yeah I for got, me, you, carpet, hello, help, hi, low, sideways, MDF, wood, saw, chain, garden and least we forget coal. Should all be auto ban also, as these can lead to mass suicide of DIY fanatics...
I hope CRAPTIC you have got the message, as I now have lost 2 fleet members to your terrible auto ban system.
Christ, what more do we need, auto surge to blow up our computers!
I think its because the filter saw it as something-something-net.
May 2013, automatic permanent ban for mentioning gold-seller sites pwebranflakes: this system is currently in place and working the way it should. moradum: I got banned for saying "I started my day with cutting off 3 MM off of the bottom of my cabinet"
Comments
Good point; well presented.
If they want to block spam, including the most prominent companies into a blacklist is the most logic choice. Sure I don't like being banned for just typing that name and I can fully understand why you are upset.
On the other hand: Did you really post the name of the company to show somebody what spam is? Really, this is like showing somebody what a bank-robbery is, by going into a bank with a gun.
I mean, come on: how long has he been offline to not know what spam is? 20 years?
So if you read your first post from this point of view, I can't just bash Cryptic without knowing what exactly you wrote.
Then as if all that wasn't bad enough you throw in terrible customer service reps who take forever to get back to the players who have been screwed, people waiting a week for there account to be fixed is simply unacceptable. When someone contacts customer service about any issue, let alone one this serious, they should get a reply within 24 hours, and that reply should actually be HELPFUL.
Keep going like this and STO will join every other star trek series in never seeing a season 8, bad programming combined with terrible customer service is a sure way to kill the game we all love.
While the OP's issue was slightly different, something similar could happen simply like this:
1) Person A returns to game after having been away for 3 months.
2) Person A discovers there are 50 messages in inbox, and goes to read them.
3) Person A sees 2 messages are fleetmembers asking 'where did you vanish' and 48 are from [company X] marketing cheap credits.
4) Person A says 'hello' on fleet, and gets greeted by others. 'welcome back'
5) Person A says 'damn, you wouldn't believe it, I was away 3 months and I have mailbox full of TRIBBLE from [company X], don't those people ever get tired spamming.
6) Person A waits for a moment, but nothing appears on fleet channel. Person A thinks maybe the chat glitched. Person a hits enter-arrow-enter to repost.
7) Person A is permanently banned. Welcome back to STO, goodbye.
Judging from previous posts, the part 5 & 6 could be to fleet chat, or simply a private message for a friend - the latter probably being a much more likely thing to occur.
(Note on part 6: person A is complitely tired of watching the 'has received TRIBBLE from lockbox' spam every other minute, so has disabled the system channels spamming it)
I got banned for saying "I started my day with cutting off 3 MM off of the bottom of my cabinet"
and bam, perma banned, not even a courtesy email and there's no human alive that's working the tickets atm.
auto blocking is not the same as a poorly implemented auto banning system for use of a single word. No one asked for that. Infact, people were asking for the spam mail to stop... i don't recall anyone saying chat was being infected with gold sellers and asking for a resolution.
This was not at all what we wanted.
Therefore, I posit a solution:
Put the human back in the equation. I know that makes me sound radical in this day-and-age of automatic automated automation, but please hear me out, Cryptic.
Allow the players to police EC-selling spam messages (both in chat and the in-game mail system). I for one have always reported those spamming, gold-selling turds. I can't stand them, and I'm sure there are plenty of others with a similar mindset.
Once an account has been reported by players multiple times for posting EC selling spam, the game will then kick it over to the automated system's filters. "Why more than one report?" you may ask. This is to prevent griefing or harassment. Requiring reports from three or four players should be sufficient.
Yes, this will allow EC sellers to get off a post or two before getting the ban-hammer, but it will also eliminate the drive-by banning of innocent players of which the current system seems so fond.
Thank you for taking the time to read this message, Cryptic.
PS: And let's face it...any player lame (or dumb) enough to actually buy EC from these hackers can use Google to find them.
Command Officers of the USS Wyvern (from left to right):
Aurellia Eshkah (Tactical); Indigo Shae (Engineering); Nysiay Chysiayki (VA, Ship Captain)
Jeclia Sek (Science); Vally Mantivour (Security)
I'm not sure who decided the system to be put in place, but this whole system is classic 'How not to do Customer service 101' stuff. The people working in customer service should hopefully have educations in the relevant fields (such as communication) and if there is one thing that most people in the industry know, it's that the customer doesn't usually know what they want or what they are talking about (generally), as such, they should know that using knee jerk forum responces for the basis of a customer service system is NOT a good idea.
I really do hope that PWE reviews thier customer service policies in regards to how tickets are handled, how chat is monitered and how autobans are handed out, because right now, after 3 years, all I've seen is innocent people getting hurt by the system with the intended targets still operating regardless.
However, in my opinion the auto-ban is idiotic. Even Seven of Nine would find this "too efficient"
As it has been stated before, suspicious chat should be flagged and viewed by staff. Or maybe make the scam words filtered as profanity, with exclusion from profanity filter, so they can't be viewed even if somebody turns off profanity filter (I'm barely making any sense here, bad syntax is bad). Not sure how that would work, it's just an idea. But the current system is way too general and strikes way too randomly. Even an "[Admin]Warning! [Enter Warning Text Here]" would be better since [Admin] chat can't be blocked.
Just do something better than that current system...
Ok... I think... that just has to go into sig.
Cryptic, if you cannot investigate individual gold sellers to determine if they're real or not, then just leave it all alone and we can continue putting them on ignore one by one. I would rather suffer that inconvenience than be a party to this ridiculous system.
The only reason you could justify doing this is if you've calculated you lose more income from the currency trading outside your game than you would lose from innocent, banned players... and that's kinda evil.
Yeah, it means some spam has the chance of getting through a bit more often, but it should also result in far fewer threads like this.
All threads will be merged with this one so direct ALL your friends and fleet members here. Get them to post even if it's just a "This is a bad decision please change or remove it".
This will get a change if enough people show disapproval of it. If it continues, further action might be necessary like walking out on the game like so many did at the start of season 7.
It is through repetition that we learn our weakness.
A master with a stone is better than a novice with a sword.
Has damage got out of control?
This is the last thing I will post.
It was merged with a thread I started. Looks like mine was bigger at the moment when they were compared. And yes, I posted mine in gameplay bugs section. Should post it in general discussion tho.
pwebranflakes: this system is currently in place and working the way it should.
moradum: I got banned for saying "I started my day with cutting off 3 MM off of the bottom of my cabinet"
Good luck with that option. Cryptic/PWE have an F rating with the BBB. However, here is the link to submit a complaint through the BBB.
Cryptic's BBB Rating
PWE's BBB Rating
CRUISERS NEED A 206% HULL BUFF
It is pretty stupid to auto ban people on a 5 char string. Accidents happen with tens of thousands of players.
- Judge Aaron Satie
Then I sincerely hope 'the way it should' gets reviewed and altered very bloody quickly. This is a grotesquely ill-advised and badly thought out system that serves as a minor inconvenience, at best, to any actual gold-spammer, as they simply abandon that account and create a new one, but can be a fairly major hassle for a legitimate player who doesn't want to lose the time, effort and possibly money they've put into that account.
From what I've seen, the warning is NOT detailed, it simply warns about 'posting links to prohibited sites', even when the system is triggered by something other than a link, and even this somewhat vague and possibly inaccurate warning is not displayed when certain settings are set differently from the defaults. A warning should be given, but given in a way that makes it clear what, precisely, you're being warned about, and also in a way that is not easy to intentionally bypass, far less inadvertently do so.
pwebranflakes: this system is currently in place and working the way it should.
moradum: I got banned for saying "I started my day with cutting off 3 MM off of the bottom of my cabinet"
it would be handy to get rid of people u hate muhahahahahaha
does this work with /PM ? or is it just zone?
i would report all the spam mail i get from golders if my mail could open without crashing the game.
PLS give us a DELETE all mail button and a PLS dont tell me when i sold TRIBBLE on exchange
Don't be foolish and chat about it! I applaud Cryptic for taking action!
I nominate this post for the title of "Most obvious troll attempt in STO history". Do I have a 2nd?
You can't be THAT clueless... Check the post in which the guy says he was banned for saying:
"I began my day from shaving 3mm off my cabinet"
pwebranflakes: this system is currently in place and working the way it should.
moradum: I got banned for saying "I started my day with cutting off 3 MM off of the bottom of my cabinet"
Perhaps 3m is banned?
CRUISERS NEED A 206% HULL BUFF
I think its because maybe you cut off to much... DIY, should not be for the faint hearted. I am so glad we have an auto ban for DIY issues, this really could get well out of hand.
Imagine the chat in game, I hope MFI and Ikea are also banned, how about B&Q, those should be in the auto ban also...
Yeah I for got, me, you, carpet, hello, help, hi, low, sideways, MDF, wood, saw, chain, garden and least we forget coal. Should all be auto ban also, as these can lead to mass suicide of DIY fanatics...
I hope CRAPTIC you have got the message, as I now have lost 2 fleet members to your terrible auto ban system.
Christ, what more do we need, auto surge to blow up our computers!
www.EliteDefenseStarfleet.com
Best fleet in Star Trek Online...
We even have our own merchandise!!! Come join us today...
www.cafepress.com/elitedefensestarfleet
I think its because the filter saw it as something-something-net.
pwebranflakes: this system is currently in place and working the way it should.
moradum: I got banned for saying "I started my day with cutting off 3 MM off of the bottom of my cabinet"
According to brandon its working as intended, so I see no reason this is in the bug forums. Other than hiding it.