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Nerf need to Defense of new romulus

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    carasucia83carasucia83 Member Posts: 568 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I think the cone weapon thing would be solved by simply making it's firing arc 45 degrees instead of what appears to be 360 degrees. Calling for a nerf is knee jerk and ultimately makes the game boring (it's happened on many occasions). Better that they readdress the mechanics.
    "So my fun is wrong?"

    No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
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    p2wsucksp2wsucks Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Here, let me give you all a freebie

    Now, about the Elachi's so-called "cone of doom" weapon...

    It's energy based, it's Disruptor in damage, it can knock a sub-system offline, and it's treated like a High Yield Plasma/Tricobalt, meaning it blasts the first thing it runs into...it's energy based, meaning you can easily counter it with RSP...it's also not instant, and has to travel, meaning you can GTFO of the way.

    Gee, 10 Elachi Cone weapons are trained on me...hit RSP and put on the trolololol face.

    It also has a limited firing arc and a easily seen activation cue. I just avoid being in front of it no?
    [Zone] Dack@****: cowards can't take a fed 1 on 1 crinckley cowards Hahahaha you smell like flowers
    Random Quote from Kerrat
    "Sumlobus@****: your mums eat Iced Targ Poo"
    C&H Fed banter
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    p2wsucksp2wsucks Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I think the cone weapon thing would be solved by simply making it's firing arc 45 degrees instead of what appears to be 360 degrees. Calling for a nerf is knee jerk and ultimately makes the game boring (it's happened on many occasions). Better that they readdress the mechanics.

    If we're talking about the same thing it's not 360, it's like D's weapon from the KA STF.
    [Zone] Dack@****: cowards can't take a fed 1 on 1 crinckley cowards Hahahaha you smell like flowers
    Random Quote from Kerrat
    "Sumlobus@****: your mums eat Iced Targ Poo"
    C&H Fed banter
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    carasucia83carasucia83 Member Posts: 568 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    No, not it's arc on activation. The targeting arc.
    "So my fun is wrong?"

    No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
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    arvistaljikarvistaljik Member Posts: 126 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I personally don't think the entire mission needs a nerf, but cutting the number of Elachi ships down by 25-30% would be nice.

    It isn't that they are hard to deal with individually, it's the fact that you're dealing with so many of them and can't keep track of them all.
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    jaegernljaegernl Member Posts: 506 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Oh man, I loved that part of the mission. That battle was challenging, but glorious. Once I get my ship fully equiped, I'm definatly gonna do it again on VA level.
    Isaac the Adequate - Level 70 Oath of Devotion Paladin
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    warzeriorwarzerior Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    IMO they need to buff all the allied Ships, to make it more epic.

    I did it just by doing cloak runs, apparently the "shield" on the Command Dreadnaught wasn't real or something? But it doesn't heal either.

    It was a very long drawn out fight to say the least.
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    sgtstarfallsgtstarfall Member Posts: 205 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Please don't nerf! The challenge was amazing! Sure, I died about 3 times, but this was the only mission that ever forced me to use my skills effectively!

    For people who have trouble getting out of the cone of death, there are 3 things that'll help immensely:
    Emergency Power to Engines - easy getaway to speed out of there! :D
    Auxiliary Power to Dampeners + Brace for Impact - somewhat easy getaway, but you also get major resistance against kinetic damage, so the cones won't damage you too much anyways
    Singularity Power: Subspace Jump (or whatever it was called) - Clean getaway no matter what level...unless you jump into another cone?

    As for those common fire, a simple Tact/Sci Team should deal with most damage. EPtS is also very nice to use. The 3 times I died were times when they whittled me down with sheer number of shield penetrating firepower - I died with all shields up.
    __________________________________________________
    All hands! Prepare the popcorn and tinfoil hats! :D
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    cptshephardcptshephard Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    This one did take me a while to complete. I'd agree that the ally ships need to be buffed a little, or maybe more of them added to make it feel like an epic "Sacrifice of Angels" fight, at the end of mine it was me and a Defiant fighting the command ship. Not sure what happened to the other allied ships that arrived. I think I died about five times, which is pretty good from what I've heard from other people. Dying didn't bother me, I followed the mission instructions and engaged the medium ships, then the smaller support craft, then the larger ships and I feel like I did okay. It was just such a tedious fight.
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    penthaligonpenthaligon Member Posts: 88 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I skipped this mission. It's pretty boring when all you do is get wiped around the floor. It's not Star Trek when you have to find exploits in the game to win, it was a bad end to an otherwise good story arc. This needs to be completable by all builds, not to shepherd players down certain avenues.

    To skip the mission just go into the contacts list (L) and press skip. You will be able to play past it and back to fun.
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    eisenw0lfeisenw0lf Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    The one thing that irritates me about these threads is that everyone keeps blaming the mission and almost no one asks for advice. Instead there are even people who claim that everyone who finished the mission either bought their success by cstore or used 'exploits' (WTF?).

    When I started this game I absolutely sucked. It makes me cringe just to think about my early builds. They lacked everything. No firepower, no tanking capabilities and I ignored most of the class specific powers instead of using them in moments they were made for. I had no idea which BOff powers are must-have and which ones I should avoid for my class, nor did I have any knowledge of which powers I should constantly cycle with keybinds. I failed in PvE missions over and over again, particularly in STFs. However, instead of blaming the missions for my failures and bombarding the forums about it I looked for advice, started asking people what I should focus on and made my own tests-builds. I eventually got a lot better and now there is no mission I couldn't handle.

    Instead of demanding nerfs for this mission you people could easily just post your ship and BOff setup. 99% of all failures, as I experienced the hard way, are a result of an inconsistent build. These things can easily be sorted out if you let people help you.
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    mirai222mirai222 Member Posts: 337 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    eisenw0lf wrote: »
    The one thing that irritates me about these threads is that everyone keeps blaming the mission and almost no one asks for advice.

    The mission is broken. Advice is a workaround. There's nothing wrong with a workaround, if players want to get past the mission, or figure out how to deal with an extra challenge. However, the the mission still needs to be fixed. It's not working as intended. The ally ships are supposed to stay in the fight to help you out, but they get wiped out very quickly.


    There's nothing wrong with blaming the mission when the mission clearly isn't working properly.
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    questeriusquesterius Member Posts: 8,327 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    mirai222 wrote: »
    The mission is broken. Advice is a workaround.

    There's nothing wrong with blaming the mission when the mission clearly isn't working properly.

    That's the problem. The mission is working fine. Ran it without going below 50% health before maintenance. This is seriously annoying to see people moaning about the mission being broken while it is not.

    I mentioned the Elachi strengths and weaknesses and even hinted what gear to use.
    People, i know the Elachi is a different style of opponent than you faced until now but they're actually easy to beat if you're on top of your game.

    Now stop complaining the mission is broken.
    This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
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    markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,231 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Here, let me give you all a freebie

    Now, about the Elachi's so-called "cone of doom" weapon...

    It's energy based, it's Disruptor in damage, it can knock a sub-system offline, and it's treated like a High Yield Plasma/Tricobalt, meaning it blasts the first thing it runs into...it's energy based, meaning you can easily counter it with RSP...it's also not instant, and has to travel, meaning you can GTFO of the way.

    Gee, 10 Elachi Cone weapons are trained on me...hit RSP and put on the trolololol face.
    Yeah when I did it I realized my D'D wasn't fast enough to dodge all the cones so I decided to simply tank them. Worked great. EptS+Aux2Batt jack my shield power and resist up high enough that even getting double blasted wasn't enough to KO me. :D

    I SSSOOO want to try this in a 5-man team..... what sort of madness would ensue from that? :D

    Actually... on the tribble forum one of the guesses people had was that there were too many ships because the game was spawning the mission as if you had team mates or something(even though you didn't).
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
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    mirai222mirai222 Member Posts: 337 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    questerius wrote: »
    That's the problem. The mission is working fine. Ran it without going below 50% health before maintenance. This is seriously annoying to see people moaning about the mission being broken while it is not.


    Being able to beat the mission without getting killed doesn't demonstrate that it isn't broken. I don't care whether you can beat it or not. I don't care what your build is. The mission isn't doing what it's supposed to be doing. The allies are getting squashed as soon as they show up. They're supposed to stick around and help you out.
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    questeriusquesterius Member Posts: 8,327 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    mirai222 wrote: »
    Being able to beat the mission without getting killed doesn't demonstrate that it isn't broken. I don't care whether you can beat it or not. I don't care what your build is. The mission isn't doing what it's supposed to be doing. The allies are getting squashed as soon as they show up. They're supposed to stick around and help you out.

    It's a token that the mission is doable if you know what you're doing and hence that the mission is not broken.

    You may repeat the tune that it is broken as many times as you like but that does not make it true.

    I get it. New faction, new opponent, different playstyle. This does not add up to a broken mission though.

    I am not the only one who has given pointers so learn from them.
    This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
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    mirai222mirai222 Member Posts: 337 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    questerius wrote: »
    It's a token that the mission is doable if you know what you're doing and hence that the mission is not broken.

    You may repeat the tune that it is broken as many times as you like but that does not make it true.

    I get it. New faction, new opponent, different playstyle. This does not add up to a broken mission though.

    You're clearly not reading what I'm posting, so I'll leave you with your misconceptions. I only care that the developers are seeing that the mission isn't working as intended.
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    loverofwarsloverofwars Member Posts: 399 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    i kinda have to agree on something needing done with this mission or the only ship we get to do it in i did it once then the old bug of completing everything told to warp out do so and not finished have to repeate second time round i gave up frustrated at how long it even takes to turn around to fight the ships jumping behind you i died three times in total from both trys i asked a friend to help me if they could in there much faster speeder fed escort they managed to do all three waves with me getting 6 kills in all fairness i was using dual beams so need to be faceing with the 6.3 turn rate the ship has for me to kill but still they where able to complete it with me with double the numbers of enemy ships in about 15 mins bit less compared to my first try over 40 or longer i wouldnt say it needs nerfing just a super temp turn boost for the mission so i can get to the battle alot of the time my friend was there a 30 sec maybe one min before i turned around and got into the fight it would be a good mission in a different ship or beam arrays they work well on that ship better then trying turrets and dual beams:P
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    jexsamxjexsamx Member Posts: 2,802 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    It was definitely a great challenge.

    Beat it on the first try, only one death, took around half an hour. Basically I lured off some of the ships in groups of one or two, tanked like Waterworld, and whittled them down until finally it was the two dreadnaughts, a few support ships, and some escorts that I'm pretty sure where respawning.

    The T'varo's core rebooter and the temp-health power were invaluable.
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    baelogventurebaelogventure Member Posts: 1,002 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Another thing about the Elachi, which is true of their ships and ground forces...

    They have extremely powerful shielding, but their hull is pretty squishy...even 1 drop of Plasma Mines will start to quickly erode their hull with it's 4 DOTs.

    This was my build on Tribble, before I decided to climb into my Holodeck C-Store Ships with max crafted gear and start the rofl-stomping of the Elachi.

    Base D'Deridex.

    Fore - 3 DHC, 1 DC. Plasma. All Common Mk7 except for the Rare Caustic
    Rear - Plasma Mine, 2x Plasma Turrets. All Common Mk7.

    Deflector - Mk7 Uncommon Positron. Random Drop.
    Engine - Mk4 Efficient. Quest Reward.
    Shield - Mk7 Common Covariant.
    Singularity - Mk6 Uncommon Quest Reward.

    Engineer Consoles - Mk4 Rare RCS, Mk7 Rare SIF, Mk6 Uncommon Victorium, all quest rewards

    Sci Consoles - Mk7 Common Emitter Array, drop. Mk6 Rare Field Generator, quest reward.

    Tac Consoles - 2x Mk6 Common Plasma Damage, drops.

    BOff Seating.

    Lt Tac - Tac Team, CSV.
    Lt Sci - Hazard Emitter, TSS.
    Lt Engi - EPtS, X2Damp
    Cmd Engi - EPtE, RSP, X2SIF, Aceton Beam.


    I died exactly twice...once due to lag, the other due to me being *stupid* and not skipping the Reinforcements cutscene.

    This mission is NOT THAT HARD and I didn't even find any of these so-called "exploits" nor did I have C-Store ships on Tribble...

    So, what's the frickin' problem?
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    velktravelktra Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    P.S. Target a command ship, It doesn't matter what one you pick, since you only need to destroy one and mission complete.

    There is only one command ship. Killing the other two dreadnaughts will not end the mission. Believe me, I tried that.
    Demons run when a good man goes to war.
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    mirai222mirai222 Member Posts: 337 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    So, what's the frickin' problem?

    The problem is that the ally ships are being quickly wiped out. They should be staying in the fight. It's something that needs to be corrected soon.
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    baelogventurebaelogventure Member Posts: 1,002 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Ahh, okay...I gotcha, I thought you were complaining about something else...needless to say, I never depend on allied ships in those situations, I almost expect them to be borked by the badguys.
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    topsettopset Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I loved this mission tbh, yes I died a few times but all it required was a rethink and to actually think strategically and tactically. First couple of attempts I was just on autopilot, fly in and unload.

    Once that didn't work you have to think about it, FLANK the fleet, use your cloaking device (you have it for a reason!), and pick them off. Stay out of range of the main boss, thin the field, then unload on the boss.

    Seriously, this was one of the most fun PvE missions I've played - it doesn't need a nerf!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Kirk's Protege.
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    mandarsmashmandarsmash Member Posts: 78 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    While I would agree to some of the previously mentioned adjustments to this mission (make the allied ships more useful by having them never disabled and always at least 1 HP), I was able to solo this mission in a D'Deridex, admittedly with a whack of consoles available to me. However, the consoles only made the job quicker.

    Ultimately, what you have to remember is that the first two waves, you must try to eliminate as many enemy ships as possible, preserving as many friendly ships as you can. Why? So they can act as a distraction while you do your work.

    When the Command Ship shows up, you must concentrate all fire on it, ignoring all others, including the Dreadnaught. Strafing runs and Warp Plasma at point blank for as long as you can, tanking as much as you can. The goal is to have enough singularity charge to activate Singularity Jump. You want to save Singularity Jump for when you're right on top of the Command Ship and when the cones are about to fire. Jump to safety while leaving as strong a singularity on top of the Command Ship to add to the direct hull damage Warp Plasma is providing. If needed, exit firing range, cloak, and patch up. As long as you don't take too long, the Command ship will not heal back too much of what you've done. If Singularity Jump is unavailable, then just using Evasive Maneuvers is enough to get you out of there. It's just that you will have gone without doing as much damage.

    For those who bought the Legacy pack, having the consoles from that pack are handy. For instance, the first two consoles will allow you to get back into the fight almost immediately. The third console helps passively keep your shields up slightly longer, and the the fourth console from the D'D can help you get in close without harm. Just remember to stop on top of the Command Ship to drop your load on it.

    Again, though, those consoles help a lot, but are not necessary. What practically is necessary is a ship that can last long enough to do this. The Mogai (or lower) just don't have the lasting power, let alone the ability to equip Eject Warp Plasma, for this strategy to work.

    However, with this strategy, I was able to wear down the Command Ship without being defeated once. I did this on my second try, after experiencing what most others here have experienced, facing utter defeat after watching the rest of my fleet get decimated and having no back up left.

    As it is, I expect most people to get frustrated with this mission and possibly give up, or require help finishing it. While having a challenge is a nice change to some (having that many massive damage cones pointed at you requires some tactical sense), I don't think it should be quite this challenging on Normal as a regular single-player campaign mission, especially in comparison to the rest of the game.

    This mission, honestly, felt like the single-player version of an Elite STF. You can do it, if you have a decent build and already know what to do. Even harder to do without blowing up at least once.

    I assume (haven't tried it yet) that with a good enough ship with enough firepower and survivability, this mission is as simple as dodge the cones, keep firing. However, at the level that it is given, it is very difficult for the average player. It should feel epic, but should not suddenly become impossible after watching your fleet get obliterated. While other ships have the speed to get out of the cones without resorting to Singularity Jump, it's a matter of doing enough damage that it won't be healed back up when you come around for another pass of whatever you do. Again, at that level, it's very difficult without dying multiple times due to lack of help.
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    gpgtxgpgtx Member Posts: 1,579 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    the issue is it's balanced for the allied ships to be there. the issue comes in that the allies die during the cut scene

    after the cut scene of them warping in i was on a respawn timing and only 4 ships where left on a repair timer

    IE the mission is broken no matter if ti is winnable or not it is not as designed and not working as intended and needs to be fixed i play on advanced and i had to turn it down to normal just to compete this horrible mess

    if the allied ships where immortal like the t'varos on the sector patrols this mission would no longer be broken and be working as in tended
    victoriasig_zps23c45368.jpg
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    avengerkid1993avengerkid1993 Member Posts: 323 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I think cryptics guys don't know hw is facing 3 Dreadnought with a T3 ship (that is also ugly)
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    pmadi32382pmadi32382 Member Posts: 47 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I have to say as someone who was struggling with this mission like many others here, dying repeatedly and never finishing. I just finished the mission dying only twice. I am a science character flying the DD and I changed two things about my approach.

    I had been doing the hit and run as others have said going at the command ship with EWP and the singularity jump but I wasn't having success. I switched from beam weapons and a couple of torps front and aft to DHC and turrets, keeping the torpedoes.

    The only other thing I did differently was that I made sure to heal all of the Romulan ally ships between each wave. You are given as much time as you need to do so until you cross the marked area. Like others have said I don't rely on my allies to win me the battle but I use them as a distraction for the enemies to have something else to shoot at.

    With these changes in place I finished the mission in 10 minutes again only dying 2 times as opposed to dying 15+ times previously and never finishing the mission. I don't know if that will work for everyone, but once I made those changes I breezed through the mission.

    The other key is to only go after the command ship as once it is destroyed all other enemy vessels warp out.

    Hope those suggestions help others.
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    markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,231 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    i kinda have to agree on something needing done with this mission or the only ship we get to do it in i did it once then the old bug of completing everything told to warp out do so and not finished have to repeate second time round i gave up frustrated at how long it even takes to turn around to fight the ships jumping behind you i died three times in total from both trys i asked a friend to help me if they could in there much faster speeder fed escort they managed to do all three waves with me getting 6 kills in all fairness i was using dual beams so need to be faceing with the 6.3 turn rate the ship has for me to kill but still they where able to complete it with me with double the numbers of enemy ships in about 15 mins bit less compared to my first try over 40 or longer i wouldnt say it needs nerfing just a super temp turn boost for the mission so i can get to the battle alot of the time my friend was there a 30 sec maybe one min before i turned around and got into the fight it would be a good mission in a different ship or beam arrays they work well on that ship better then trying turrets and dual beams:P
    Yeah, Elachi love to use Subspace Jump. DHCs are not quite as useful then.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
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    lan451lan451 Member Posts: 3,386 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Just did this mission and it's totally not working right.

    Everything was cool until the command ship showed up. That SOB decided that he wasn't going to leave me alone. Ever. Even after I died he wouldn't lose target lock on me. I cloak and he doesn't lose target lock on me. Just keeps shooting. He followed me all the way to the spawn point and just camped me for about 10 minutes. He was using something that was killing me in just a few seconds. Finally broke away and went around the back to the where the Belfast and the Kirk were (am Fed ally) and waited for him to lumber his TRIBBLE across the map to find me. Didn't bother with the other ships, because my 1 D'Dex vs. 3 dreadnoughts doesn't work. Anyway once he finally caught up to me I was able to kill it with the Kirk and Belfast. Took about an hour total.

    On one hand it made the Elachi feel like a powerful enemy to be feared and that I had really just stopped an invasion. On the other hand it FREAKING PISSED ME OFF SO BAD OMG.

    So there's that lol.
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    Mine Trap Supporter
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