T4 Placate was already nerfed OP, have you even played this game long enough to remember? Chance on every crit to placate with no limitations on how many procs stacked? Yeah, was a little bit overboard. But it was fixed, and quite well. 2/12 seconds is NOTHING in this game.
If you've having problems with getting a random Placate on you every 12 seconds, then you need to learn how to multitask and then mitigate that tiny, nearly insignificant 2 second blur. Your TB gets dislodged, big deal. Adapt.
You can get destroyed in under two seconds. And if you're placated, you can't even see where it's coming from.
Are you saying that it's ok first this always on passive to have the ability to negate BO skills, all the way up to LtC, without any consequence or opportunity cost? Even for things like the borg tractor with long CDs?
Items are as big a problem as rep--the KHG shield has a freebie placate too and its even worse than the T4 rommie rep.
Rep is easy to fix, well maybe not easy to implement but the solution is obvious, just make a PVP rep system and ignore all the others while in PVP.
The items are not so easy. Cryptic makes money selling ships, if ships are nerfed in PVP, some of the wallet heroes will yell very loudly. Betrayal. No more sales.
That isn't a solution though... it just creates the same problem that every other failed MMO has had. PvP Rep = death of PvP plain and simple.
I agree the items are all an issue.
This is my fix... and perhaps it is simply an added PvP mode. But here it is.
Everyone gets a PvP ship doll. (like your shuttle one)
This doll is a COPY of your current ship one... meaning you can slot any ship you currently have accept a shuttle... this is the ship that is activated when you enter a PvP instance. Have the instance disable all passive bonuses and rep skills.
Make that doll ONLY accept items that have a -p after there name... just like shuttles only equip -s items.
Add vendors that dispense... all MK XII - p purple items. Yes this means every weapon type with 2-3 different mod types... Acc x 2 dmg.... Acc crthx2... Crth Crtdx2. Those 3 would be good starts and a good choice system.
Add regular shields... and regular engines and deflectors. Again with 2-3 different mod choices on each... that are suited in general to pvp.
Make the cost of ALL these items from the vendors ..... ZERO. Thats right let everyone gear up in standard purple gear for pvp from day one... we can all handle day one noobs being geared up it won't hurt us. IT will remove one of the main complaints of the new PvP player... I don't have good gear... no longer an issue.
NOW you add a special pvp gear vendor. Here you add the KHG shields and the Maco stuffs... and even the lowbie ship consoles... but you add -p versions. Now someone like Bort can make adjustments to these items for pvp that will not Pis@ off 99% of the population that needs there maco +plasma resist to fight borg... all the STF gear can loose its +10-20% extra vs plasma weapons right of the top... and things like the KHG placate can be tweaked with out effecting the PvE versions. Perhaps even the most of annoying p2w consoles could be tamed to be acceptable... imagine a Gravity pulse that lasted a max of 5-10s... would it still be an issue in pvp ?
If you already have a Standard PvE version of any of the gear.... create a Discount at the special pvp version vendor... or even make it a free unlock from him. In typical Cryptic style I am sure it would become a double charge... but we might be able to get them to add a 50% discount for owners for the pve version or something. (I would be fine with having to repurchase a handful of gear... if it meant a much more balanced system). I think it would be cool to see people using standard hyper impulse engines and regular gear again... the sets have been a defeacto required thing now for so long we take them for granted... having talked to so many of these new people that have been around since people started doing things like boot camp... I can see how frustrating it is to realize you can't have maco or khg for a month... and even the basic borg set takes a week of pve to aquire. Having -p tamed down versions that where good but not required would be perfect imo.
Why not? It was downgraded to only be used once every 12 seconds for a 2 second burst. 2 seconds IS a long time, if you're unprepared. Going into a PvP zone unprepared would be akin to shaking a Klingon's hand and then giving him a Polygeminus Grex: not smart.
By the way, how long does a TB last? 10 seconds? Timing is KEY. T4 Rom's a good a defense against certain painful/annoying combi-strikes. TB/Assimilated TB+GW+VM being the most common. Breaking that TB's nice, could care less about the second, third is merely annoying.
I routinely run against Fed/KDF who habitually make it a point to use the AMS console whenever it comes up just because they can, as well as JS/SS. If I can use something that took me time, money, and effort to get to counter someone's free boff Sci spam, why not? Normally I don't have much in the way of CC/LD'ing someone, so T4 Romulan makes up for it.
TL;DR: it's all about timing. If you get taken out in 2 seconds, either rethink your build or know your enemy.
Crazy thought here... if people are using there "free" boff skills against you... why not counter with the "free" boff skills that counter the "free" boff skills they are using against you.
Ya I know... that's sort of like playing a game or something... how boring.
It cant be beneficial if both have it.Its a way to loose your target every few seconds .Its the most annoying thing with no logic behind it.You loose your target enough to be annoying but not long enough to use it in your advantage...stupid system is stupid.
I hoped the nukara grind system will have a passive to give immunity to New Romulus placate but is not there.
In a 1v1 it is equally beneficial for both, but if one doesnt have it, obviously him respeccing to obtain the placate anyhow will be beneficial for him. Just a matter of how you look at it.
In any way i think both tier 4 passives have their uses, I for one wouldnt bother putting the placate on my big TRIBBLE Sci healer recluse because it makes very little sense (For one of the reasons that my can hardly keep my weapons on target haha)
On escorts in a premade match however, doing the alpha on (especially) the Sci that keeps trying to jump on you and nuke off your APA it can do wonders ^^
I dont think it is that OP that make people believe it is, it is the massive amount of grind time to obtain it which is the OP part about it IMO.
Grinding Rom marks and the ec spent to get your Rom rep to tier 4 is a joke.
Take a polarize hull or an omega if you hate tractors so much.
Just like I figured, Cryptic was aiming at the laziest players with these ****ing rep features.
Hurr. TL;DR you missed the point. It's very useful against Sci captains. If I can avoid that SubNuke for 12 moar seconds, then great. If not, oh well. You call it lazy, I call it efficient. An MVAE getting +20% shields every now and then? Hahah, yeah, that's what, 2 hits from a DHC? High horse mode: ON.
On escorts in a premade match however, doing the alpha on (especially) the Sci that keeps trying to jump on you and nuke off your APA it can do wonders ^^
which is why its broken--you want a placate, fine, go slot the boff ability and give up somethin to get it, but this stuff that is free disable your enemies weapons and skills every couple of seconds with no skill cost to you at all, its just wrong. It's also the natural progression for item-/power-creep, its just going to keep getting worse.
Hurr. TL;DR you missed the point. It's very useful against Sci captains. If I can avoid that SubNuke for 12 moar seconds, then great. If not, oh well. You call it lazy, I call it efficient. An MVAE getting +20% shields every now and then? Hahah, yeah, that's what, 2 hits from a DHC? High horse mode: ON.
No one missed anything.
It's lame **** that was poorly thought out by Cryptic.
And if you have problems with tractors in PvP, you suck balls.
The irony of this is how many people arguing this is OP are actually using it?
The further insult is all the crying over this rep skill yet many PvPers are running around using glitched theta and warp and no one says a bl00dy word about it.
I have the rep skill yes, it also doesnt really bother me in PvP.
Out of all the rep, thats about the only 'skill' worth having, all the others are total TRIBBLE, the shield regen which was really op on release was nerfed to the point of near non existance, what about the trait that ignores shields? Ive seen people proc that on nearly every volley of fire, basically negating even buffed shields.
Its not the T4 rom skill that slows matches down, its all the cross heals, runaway resistances, ott buffs, pet spam and invisible plasma/theta.
The irony of this is how many people arguing this is OP are actually using it?
The further insult is all the crying over this rep skill yet many PvPers are running around using glitched theta and warp and no one says a bl00dy word about it.
I have the rep skill yes, it also doesnt really bother me in PvP.
Out of all the rep, thats about the only 'skill' worth having, all the others are total TRIBBLE, the shield regen which was really op on release was nerfed to the point of near non existance, what about the trait that ignores shields? Ive seen people proc that on nearly every volley of fire, basically negating even buffed shields.
Its not the T4 rom skill that slows matches down, its all the cross heals, runaway resistances, ott buffs, pet spam and invisible plasma/theta.
The shield regen is TRIBBLE ? really having twice as much natural regen... isn't good enough ? lol
The shield passive is almost as dumb as the Placate. Frankly ALL of the rep including the tier2s need to get the heck out of pvp.... its terrible terrible game design. I mean its expected from Cryptic.
So if I am hearing this... Invis Theta and Warp Pee is a problem ... but invisi players isn't ?
One the EWP / Theta issue... I agree cryptic needs ot look into the reasons the engine doesn't always render it... however REDUCE your graphic settings. It works for most people. The only time I don't see warp plasma is when there is 4 carriers in a match and so much spam its not even pvp anymore anyway.
I find the placate to be more of annoyance than a true game-changer. When an escort placates. . .yeah, that can be dangerous, at least to me. But that's because I'm running an attack-oriented Hegh'ta that relies on being able to hit hard, fast, and get out of dodge when things turn sour. It can't take a lot of punishment, and a 2 second placate is enough time for a skilled escort player to turn around and deliver a volley right in my face.
That, and the placate has a really annoying tendency to proc right when I'm getting ready to hammer an alphastrike into a gap in a tough opponent's defenses (gaps that don't show up often).
Lastly; You can see someone who's placated you. At least, if you're close enough. They're a sort of shimmer on the screen. I've managed to keep my eyes on a target that's placated me and oriented myself to be aimed at him right when his placate ends, ready unleash a volley on him. So there's that.
My PvP toon is Krov, of The House of Snoo. Beware of my Hegh'ta of doom.
Honestly! The placate ONLY LASTS 2 SECONDS! If even that long! If you want to complain, complain that it doesn't last long enough! :rolleyes:
Doesn't even take a full second to break any channeled abilities. Something that would otherwise require the use of an ability with a CD of itself to break...
All abilities have CD once you use them, and reputation abilities usually have a longer cooldown (such as the T5 Omega). And the other abilities that can break those hold of which you speak? Those abilities last for 16 seconds. So, complain about nerfing the 2 second duration when the other abilities last for 16 seconds really makes no sense at all. :rolleyes:
All abilities have CD once you use them, and reputation abilities usually have a longer cooldown (such as the T5 Omega). And the other abilities that can break those hold of which you speak? Those abilities last for 16 seconds. So, complain about nerfing the 2 second duration when the other abilities last for 16 seconds really makes no sense at all. :rolleyes:
so for you its normal in a dogfight both ships to get invisible from time to time ...only to loose the target ?
how about TB? You cant even use battlecloak to stop TB but placate works.even a trillion points in sensors and aux you still wont be able to counter it.
Maybe for you its normal to have powers without any way to counter them ,for normal people who like to pvp not search targets every few seconds that placate is just BS.
Why can people not accept that the game is working as the Dev's intend it to? This is a skill that is only active for 2 second. I fail to see were it is game breaking like many of you are claiming.
Indeed. An ability, ANY ability that only lasts 2 seconds is not going to provide any sort of tactical advantage. If anything, only lasting 2 seconds means it is really is not even worth getting. All of my characters, all 4 of them, simply got the shield buff instead.
Wow. A passive ability, one of the currently 4 soon to be 6 that you can select, by itself makes tractor beams nearly worthless, removes a Sci Vessels only advantageous perk over a Carrier, along with a host of other things. And yet even then the community cannot come to a consensus on if it is a bad thing or a good thing. Astonishing. Oh and let us not forget it forced cryptic to create an immunity buff to the silly thing to be granted after it expired because of how crazy it got.
Simple fix. -X% target energy weapon damage (like aceton beam) and allow it to stack to a maximum of Y stacks. Better for PvP, better for PvE, and maybe just maybe those silly rabbits will have to run two copies of APO and a PH again to have their immunity to denoob tractor spam! Or A2B + PH + APO. Or, getting really crazy, APO3! with cooldown doffs and a PH for giggles. If only there was a subnuke doff, er, if only fleet shields didn't protect so well against the subnuke doff I should say and the denoob would still work....
Good thing I plan ahead and picked up some yellowstones, or would have if I cared. Just gotta watch out for that new HE doff soon to be released that gives you a % chance to have HE reapplied after using it.
The shield regen is TRIBBLE ? really having twice as much natural regen... isn't good enough ? lol
The shield passive is almost as dumb as the Placate. Frankly ALL of the rep including the tier2s need to get the heck out of pvp.... its terrible terrible game design. I mean its expected from Cryptic.
So if I am hearing this... Invis Theta and Warp Pee is a problem ... but invisi players isn't ?
One the EWP / Theta issue... I agree cryptic needs ot look into the reasons the engine doesn't always render it... however REDUCE your graphic settings. It works for most people. The only time I don't see warp plasma is when there is 4 carriers in a match and so much spam its not even pvp anymore anyway.
I'm already on reduced GPU settings, which is utterly pathetic really considering the age of the game and the machine I'm using.
The rep is far from 'invisi players', they drop out of view for a maximum of 2 seconds randomly, as long as you are cycling your buffs correctly, it makes no difference at all.
The shield regen is far from twice as powerful, by the looks of it, it scales with your shield natural regen, big, slow covariant shields get a bigger boost, typically regenerative gets virtually nothing.
Indeed. An ability, ANY ability that only lasts 2 seconds is not going to provide any sort of tactical advantage. If anything, only lasting 2 seconds means it is really is not even worth getting. All of my characters, all 4 of them, simply got the shield buff instead.
Again, the issue isn't the 2 second placate... it's the fact that it freely and very easily breaks things like Tractor Beams, Sensor Analysis, Tachyon Beam, etc etc.
Seriously, does that make sense to you? Your random turret firing off the back Crits me for 500 damage and that somehow makes me lose my Tractor lock?
Again, the issue isn't the 2 second placate... it's the fact that it freely and very easily breaks things like Tractor Beams, Sensor Analysis, Tachyon Beam, etc etc.
Seriously, does that make sense to you? Your random turret firing off the back Crits me for 500 damage and that somehow makes me lose my Tractor lock?
To be honest, it points to a larger issue that goes beyond the placate.
That same piddly Turret crit...consider all the other things that it can trigger and does as well, eh? Whether it's a heal proc or acc debuff...there's no scaling nor threshold involved.
Might be a different story if there was a threshold involved...
A <100 Critical is not the same as a 20000+ Critical...even a 10k Crit. Something with some wallop to it is one thing...a critical tickle is still a critical tickle.
Again, the issue isn't the 2 second placate... it's the fact that it freely and very easily breaks things like Tractor Beams, Sensor Analysis, Tachyon Beam, etc etc.
Seriously, does that make sense to you? Your random turret firing off the back Crits me for 500 damage and that somehow makes me lose my Tractor lock?
Not a fan of it either, but Scis can lead w/a jam sensor and then spam sci abilities which do little to no damage, eg tbs/vm/tssw/ss/psw1 etc. Tbh, the shield placate repair (not a fan of this too) is not nothing and if they're giving up that I don't mind the placate as much since they nerfed it some.
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Comments
You can get destroyed in under two seconds. And if you're placated, you can't even see where it's coming from.
Are you saying that it's ok first this always on passive to have the ability to negate BO skills, all the way up to LtC, without any consequence or opportunity cost? Even for things like the borg tractor with long CDs?
That isn't a solution though... it just creates the same problem that every other failed MMO has had. PvP Rep = death of PvP plain and simple.
I agree the items are all an issue.
This is my fix... and perhaps it is simply an added PvP mode. But here it is.
Everyone gets a PvP ship doll. (like your shuttle one)
This doll is a COPY of your current ship one... meaning you can slot any ship you currently have accept a shuttle... this is the ship that is activated when you enter a PvP instance. Have the instance disable all passive bonuses and rep skills.
Make that doll ONLY accept items that have a -p after there name... just like shuttles only equip -s items.
Add vendors that dispense... all MK XII - p purple items. Yes this means every weapon type with 2-3 different mod types... Acc x 2 dmg.... Acc crthx2... Crth Crtdx2. Those 3 would be good starts and a good choice system.
Add regular shields... and regular engines and deflectors. Again with 2-3 different mod choices on each... that are suited in general to pvp.
Make the cost of ALL these items from the vendors ..... ZERO. Thats right let everyone gear up in standard purple gear for pvp from day one... we can all handle day one noobs being geared up it won't hurt us. IT will remove one of the main complaints of the new PvP player... I don't have good gear... no longer an issue.
NOW you add a special pvp gear vendor. Here you add the KHG shields and the Maco stuffs... and even the lowbie ship consoles... but you add -p versions. Now someone like Bort can make adjustments to these items for pvp that will not Pis@ off 99% of the population that needs there maco +plasma resist to fight borg... all the STF gear can loose its +10-20% extra vs plasma weapons right of the top... and things like the KHG placate can be tweaked with out effecting the PvE versions. Perhaps even the most of annoying p2w consoles could be tamed to be acceptable... imagine a Gravity pulse that lasted a max of 5-10s... would it still be an issue in pvp ?
If you already have a Standard PvE version of any of the gear.... create a Discount at the special pvp version vendor... or even make it a free unlock from him. In typical Cryptic style I am sure it would become a double charge... but we might be able to get them to add a 50% discount for owners for the pve version or something. (I would be fine with having to repurchase a handful of gear... if it meant a much more balanced system). I think it would be cool to see people using standard hyper impulse engines and regular gear again... the sets have been a defeacto required thing now for so long we take them for granted... having talked to so many of these new people that have been around since people started doing things like boot camp... I can see how frustrating it is to realize you can't have maco or khg for a month... and even the basic borg set takes a week of pve to aquire. Having -p tamed down versions that where good but not required would be perfect imo.
By the way, how long does a TB last? 10 seconds? Timing is KEY. T4 Rom's a good a defense against certain painful/annoying combi-strikes. TB/Assimilated TB+GW+VM being the most common. Breaking that TB's nice, could care less about the second, third is merely annoying.
I routinely run against Fed/KDF who habitually make it a point to use the AMS console whenever it comes up just because they can, as well as JS/SS. If I can use something that took me time, money, and effort to get to counter someone's free boff Sci spam, why not? Normally I don't have much in the way of CC/LD'ing someone, so T4 Romulan makes up for it.
TL;DR: it's all about timing. If you get taken out in 2 seconds, either rethink your build or know your enemy.
Ya I know... that's sort of like playing a game or something... how boring.
Grinding Rom marks and the ec spent to get your Rom rep to tier 4 is a joke.
Take a polarize hull or an omega if you hate tractors so much.
Just like I figured, Cryptic was aiming at the laziest players with these ****ing rep features.
In a 1v1 it is equally beneficial for both, but if one doesnt have it, obviously him respeccing to obtain the placate anyhow will be beneficial for him. Just a matter of how you look at it.
In any way i think both tier 4 passives have their uses, I for one wouldnt bother putting the placate on my big TRIBBLE Sci healer recluse because it makes very little sense (For one of the reasons that my can hardly keep my weapons on target haha)
On escorts in a premade match however, doing the alpha on (especially) the Sci that keeps trying to jump on you and nuke off your APA it can do wonders ^^
I dont think it is that OP that make people believe it is, it is the massive amount of grind time to obtain it which is the OP part about it IMO.
Hurr. TL;DR you missed the point. It's very useful against Sci captains. If I can avoid that SubNuke for 12 moar seconds, then great. If not, oh well. You call it lazy, I call it efficient. An MVAE getting +20% shields every now and then? Hahah, yeah, that's what, 2 hits from a DHC? High horse mode: ON.
No one missed anything.
It's lame **** that was poorly thought out by Cryptic.
And if you have problems with tractors in PvP, you suck balls.
Learn to make a proper build.
The further insult is all the crying over this rep skill yet many PvPers are running around using glitched theta and warp and no one says a bl00dy word about it.
I have the rep skill yes, it also doesnt really bother me in PvP.
Out of all the rep, thats about the only 'skill' worth having, all the others are total TRIBBLE, the shield regen which was really op on release was nerfed to the point of near non existance, what about the trait that ignores shields? Ive seen people proc that on nearly every volley of fire, basically negating even buffed shields.
Its not the T4 rom skill that slows matches down, its all the cross heals, runaway resistances, ott buffs, pet spam and invisible plasma/theta.
The shield regen is TRIBBLE ? really having twice as much natural regen... isn't good enough ? lol
The shield passive is almost as dumb as the Placate. Frankly ALL of the rep including the tier2s need to get the heck out of pvp.... its terrible terrible game design. I mean its expected from Cryptic.
So if I am hearing this... Invis Theta and Warp Pee is a problem ... but invisi players isn't ?
One the EWP / Theta issue... I agree cryptic needs ot look into the reasons the engine doesn't always render it... however REDUCE your graphic settings. It works for most people. The only time I don't see warp plasma is when there is 4 carriers in a match and so much spam its not even pvp anymore anyway.
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That, and the placate has a really annoying tendency to proc right when I'm getting ready to hammer an alphastrike into a gap in a tough opponent's defenses (gaps that don't show up often).
Lastly; You can see someone who's placated you. At least, if you're close enough. They're a sort of shimmer on the screen. I've managed to keep my eyes on a target that's placated me and oriented myself to be aimed at him right when his placate ends, ready unleash a volley on him. So there's that.
Doesn't even take a full second to break any channeled abilities. Something that would otherwise require the use of an ability with a CD of itself to break...
...it's a little annoying.
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so for you its normal in a dogfight both ships to get invisible from time to time ...only to loose the target ?
how about TB? You cant even use battlecloak to stop TB but placate works.even a trillion points in sensors and aux you still wont be able to counter it.
Maybe for you its normal to have powers without any way to counter them ,for normal people who like to pvp not search targets every few seconds that placate is just BS.
yes it come in at number 2 number 1 was the idiot that decided to release the JHAS and thought well its not OP at alll
lemme guess ,you dont have one :rolleyes:
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Click here to view my DeviantArt.
Its pretty junk really.
Simple fix. -X% target energy weapon damage (like aceton beam) and allow it to stack to a maximum of Y stacks. Better for PvP, better for PvE, and maybe just maybe those silly rabbits will have to run two copies of APO and a PH again to have their immunity to denoob tractor spam! Or A2B + PH + APO. Or, getting really crazy, APO3! with cooldown doffs and a PH for giggles. If only there was a subnuke doff, er, if only fleet shields didn't protect so well against the subnuke doff I should say and the denoob would still work....
Good thing I plan ahead and picked up some yellowstones, or would have if I cared. Just gotta watch out for that new HE doff soon to be released that gives you a % chance to have HE reapplied after using it.
So there's never been a patch that does more than just add new features?
/cough
I'm already on reduced GPU settings, which is utterly pathetic really considering the age of the game and the machine I'm using.
The rep is far from 'invisi players', they drop out of view for a maximum of 2 seconds randomly, as long as you are cycling your buffs correctly, it makes no difference at all.
The shield regen is far from twice as powerful, by the looks of it, it scales with your shield natural regen, big, slow covariant shields get a bigger boost, typically regenerative gets virtually nothing.
Again, the issue isn't the 2 second placate... it's the fact that it freely and very easily breaks things like Tractor Beams, Sensor Analysis, Tachyon Beam, etc etc.
Seriously, does that make sense to you? Your random turret firing off the back Crits me for 500 damage and that somehow makes me lose my Tractor lock?
To be honest, it points to a larger issue that goes beyond the placate.
That same piddly Turret crit...consider all the other things that it can trigger and does as well, eh? Whether it's a heal proc or acc debuff...there's no scaling nor threshold involved.
Might be a different story if there was a threshold involved...
A <100 Critical is not the same as a 20000+ Critical...even a 10k Crit. Something with some wallop to it is one thing...a critical tickle is still a critical tickle.
Not a fan of it either, but Scis can lead w/a jam sensor and then spam sci abilities which do little to no damage, eg tbs/vm/tssw/ss/psw1 etc. Tbh, the shield placate repair (not a fan of this too) is not nothing and if they're giving up that I don't mind the placate as much since they nerfed it some.
Random Quote from Kerrat
"Sumlobus@****: your mums eat Iced Targ Poo"
C&H Fed banter