Althrough i understand your motives, i think you should see the bigger picture of this.
The devs would just slap a hangar on the GCS and pretend it would be fixed. It wouldn't help anyone, it woul djust make thie ship and the game more un-typical to Star Trek.
(It's not about if carriers are common, it's about preserving the feeling and the spirit of how Star Trek works. It doesn't matter if some ships where actually capable to be used as carriers or not.)
Hanger alone won't fix Galaxy but it can be added to what ever they do. Me personally, all BO slots universal then a hanger and there you go. the ship becomes a multi mission vessel see saw on screen.
at first i was not against a hangar, but when i saw what some player wanted to do with them ( full tractor beam setup ) i am now against it.
we have enought spam and all this things already.
you have done right to bring the discussion on this possibility angrytarg, it was neccesary that we see the good and the bad of this idea.
even if the galaxy have the capacitie to be a carrier it will not be a good thing in this game.
and where will it stop, if the galaxy get a hangar? how many bigger ship than him can pretend to have one then?
before we known we will be invaded by carrier.
and on top of beeing not really fun to fight, a game with only carrier is not a star trek game indeed.
That's never going to happen. At least as long as Geko works for the company. And probably Stahl. It's just not something the designers want to do to the game. They've shot down that idea more than a few times in the past.
That's never going to happen. At least as long as Geko works for the company. And probably Stahl. It's just not something the designers want to do to the game. They've shot down that idea more than a few times in the past.
why they do it with the ENTIRE BOP line, we are asking for ONE ship fed side and the zen version 2. But then Geko and Stahl are morons
Almost every starfleet ship has the shuttle bay in the back. There are only a few exceptions that confirm the rule, like the Defiant that launched shuttles from below. By this logic, every Starfleet starship is capable of launching fighters.
Also good luck providing cover while you have to lower your aft shields and expose your warp nacelles to an unshielded attack.
You know this got me thinking, wouldn't it be cool if Space Combat Shields would fall for longer and you could target specif hull points and like Nacelles and damage them and different points would slow movement, crew regen, shield regen, ect. and it would visually show as well. how cool would that be?
why they do it with the ENTIRE BOP line, we are asking for ONE ship fed side and the zen version 2. But then Geko and Stahl are morons
Because the Bird Of Prey is such a small ship with weak shields and hull, its like a fighter designed for Strafing runs IMO, more so then the average Escort.
anybody from the uk seen the new startrek mag that comes with a die-cast ship ? , first edition comes with the enterprise-D . it lists nearly every stat of the ship . got a copy yesterday
You know this got me thinking, wouldn't it be cool if Space Combat Shields would fall for longer and you could target specif hull points and like Nacelles and damage them and different points would slow movement, crew regen, shield regen, ect. and it would visually show as well. how cool would that be?
Get out.
Because the Bird Of Prey is such a small ship with weak shields and hull, its like a fighter designed for Strafing runs IMO, more so then the average Escort.
But the BOP is an ENTIRE LINE. I askin for one ship and a ZEN ship at that. and universal BO would be Canon.
Giving the Gal an all universal BOFF layout is nonsense and the essence why people don't take the whole issue seriously. If you make her all universal she would render every other ship obsolete. The BOPs are a exception because their base stats limit them quite harshly. You cannot substitute anything with a BOP because it is a ship line for it's very own purpose. Making the Galaxy uni however would make all other cruisers at least useless since anything can be done with the galaxy - the game doesn't work like that, it's based on fix stats and roles for ships people have to buy with real money.
If we had a game where we could freely spec our vessel and essentially have the same base stats only influenced by size and power output it would be different. But that's not how the game works.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
why they do it with the ENTIRE BOP line, we are asking for ONE ship fed side and the zen version 2. But then Geko and Stahl are morons
Go to the Klingon section of the forum and start a thread asking the KDF players what do their BoPs give away in order to have the all universal Boff slots. I'm sure that you'll get a lot of very detailed explanations. Then you'll understand why this will never work for a ship like the Galaxy class in game.
You know this got me thinking, wouldn't it be cool if Space Combat Shields would fall for longer and you could target specif hull points and like Nacelles and damage them and different points would slow movement, crew regen, shield regen, ect. and it would visually show as well. how cool would that be?
HAH! This partially reminded me of some similar mechanics that we had in Bridge Commander. That would be very cool to have indeed!
Unfortunately, I can't see this ever happening in STO because it will be "ZOMG!!! Too complicated!!!" and there would be such whining by people who can't win by just endlessly spamming spacebar that will melt down the servers. It is the sad truth in STO. Everything is made too easy so someone doesn't dare waste a brain cell to get anything done. I'm far behind expecting challenging or intelectual combat in STO. I'm here for the Trek fun, as long as that lasts before they start docking Borg ships at ESD.
...
HAH! This partially reminded me of some similar mechanics that we had in Bridge Commander. That would be very cool to have indeed!
Unfortunately, I can't see this ever happening in STO because it will be "ZOMG!!! Too complicated!!!" and there would be such whining by people who can't win by just endlessly spamming spacebar that will melt down the servers. It is the sad truth in STO. Everything is made too easy so someone doesn't dare waste a brain cell to get anything done. I'm far behind expecting challenging or intelectual combat in STO. I'm here for the Trek fun, as long as that lasts before they start docking Borg ships at ESD.
True, and on the other hand there's the MMO mechanics stuff with 100000 different combinations of consoles, BOFF powers and weapons and so on. I think Cryptic just saw Trek through the eyes of a clasical MMO, instead of it becoming a synergy of MMO and simulation. I think more micromanaging (energy allocation for example) and less console of the month would have been much cooler IMO. If you know the game "TNG: the final unity" then you know what i am talking about.
I mean for someone starting with STO, a simulation wouldn't be much more complicated and more difficult to find out how everything works.
In my experience in a MMO, players prefer to have their powers sorted in a action bar or even allocated to certain keys, and just do the same routine over and over again. But if STO where more like a simulation, a pleyer had to react much more intuitive and situation dependent.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Sorry guys have to disagree. It's a nice easy modification to an existing ship and the universal BO slots would make the ship worth it, it will still be as slow as it is now, same console and weapons layout, but it gains versitility. Not to mention it makes more sense for the feds in general and the Galaxy specifically.. Note the BO slots rank would also remain the same.
Sorry guys have to disagree. It's a nice easy modification to an existing ship and the universal BO slots would make the ship worth it, it will still be as slow as it is now, same console and weapons layout, but it gains versitility. Not to mention it makes more sense for the feds in general and the Galaxy specifically.. Note the BO slots rank would also remain the same.
An all uni-Galaxy is nonsense. Speed doesn't matter when you have BA's, Commander Tac, Lt. Comm Eng or Sci and batteries, EPTX, Aux2 Bat, purple techies/warp theorist(or is it engineers?) and the ability/skills that boost all ship powers when eptx and batteries are used.
Fixing engineer boff skils to make them on par with tactical/sci skills would go a long way to making the Galaxy (and other cruisers) more "versatile" . At best the Galaxy could use a little bit more of a sci bent (Lt. Comm'Sci) before they start plopping uni-boff stations.
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that can only happen when they ditch the entire established design of boff powers, completly dumping the poxy tank, healer, damage dealer rpg trinity model out of the game.
You mean something like the Elder scrolls have for several years?
I don't know if it is even possible to balance such a system to work in a MMO, since virtually every BOFF power had to be somehow equal to all others, at least if they are at the same rank.
To be honest i don't know if and how such a system is doable, maybe someone else has a sudden inspiration how to do it.
But i certaily whould L O V E to have such a system.
Just the idea of having complete control about which BOFF powers i want to have is revolutionary and has much potential IMO.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
examples:
apo draining aux to simulate ecm throwing off targetting as a defence boost
aux2sif draining aux acting as temporary hp boost
polarise hull draining aux for a resistance boost
power to shields drain power from shields while active and cause more bleed through, to pay for a % boost to shield cap
make extend shield increase resiliance to bleedthrough at the cost of losing regeneration & aux + shield power
and TSS, would then be a boost to regeneration, at the cost of shield cap & aux power
torp spread and grav well being as effective over 10 minutes as each other
tykens and scatter volley same idea
even nasty things like taking aceton beam and making it cause those hit by it to suffer a dot % of their own energy weapon potential dps, rather than a flat dot, but flat-lining the aux power of the one who fired it as a cost.
all powers working out being of equivalent usefulness with different delivery methods is entirly possible. you just stop pretending that cooldown timers should be the primary ability managment system in a 2010+ game.
So it's basicly a "give and take basis" system. For me that sounds much more like a serious/beliveable game system then the classical MMO stuff we have. In fact this is more a simulation/MMO system i do prefer, than the WOW stylish button+CD smashing most MMO players have been brainwashed with.
+1
EDIT:
in order to have such a system, Ship stats must have a much bigger impact to strategy and space combat tactics.
Like Crew ACTUALLY repairing the ship, maneuverability, ship power generation and so on.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
All Uni would allow people to make the ship want they want and fix the major issue with the Galaxy. And again it be canon, easy to do, and make the swhip worth the price it is. sorry i don't want another bundle group
Just going to say, I won;t be playing STO's Galaxy any time soon.
stardestroyer001, Admiral, Explorers Fury PvE/PvP Fleet | Retired PvP Player
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Or we could just do away with the whole false sense of balance and let the ships and players create their own sandbox.
The only area you would need "balance" would be in PvP.
And that could easily be solved by having separate "arenas" for ships to compete in.
In PvE balance doesn't matter much.
You can scale anything PvE side to match anything you put out.
And it would actually create a need for Fleets and specialized abilities.
Science powers would have to be powerful in order to counter NPC abilities and ships.
Cruisers would have to be what they are in the shows just to allow the group to compete.
Escorts would have to be there to either drop a shield facing for a Science power, or to cripple ships with incredible alpha strikes against unshielded targets.
Balance can go out the window. It was never here to begin with.
In PvP you have scenarios that would pit certain ship classes against each other.
Capture the Flag(Ship) would feature Science Vessels nuking each other for control of an unfinished semi operation enemy flagship full of fancy new tech.
Capture and Hold would feature all three ships.
Limits of type of ship allowed per match would be in place to prevent abuse from any one ship type being present. (Massive Negh'Var sitting at a single capture point and holding it forever for example)
First Strike would feature Escorts.
The Goal is to take out the Enemy shipyard(s) or some other point of strategic importance.
Each side has a single NPC Capital Vessel. Rewards are given for taking it out, but they can be ignored.
Slugfest (reminiscent of SFC)
An all Cruiser slugfest. The last man, or team, standing wins.
Someone should start a thread about this topic at the Builds, Powers, and Game Mechanics Forum.
I think at this point, much more people could be interested in this and maybe after 3 years STO, more people will agree then 2 years ago.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
that... is actually REALLY FAR from the truth...
in order to have functional pve that is both functional and engaging, it must also be balanced. and it must be mechanically sound.
you can go back as for as turok's nuke gun. it would kill anything in the game with one hit... but you got enough ammo for 6 shots in the whole game.
in order to have any real sandbox content you must have a way of making all(or at least most of) the tools available useful with areas of excelence, even if those ares are duplicated by other tools.
otherwise, you may as well only give players one tool, be that a power or weapon to go mad with. all rocket matches in quake or halo for example.
My apologies.
When I say that balance doesn't matter in PvE.
I mean between the various ship classifications.
In PvE, it doesn't matter if a Cruiser could 1v5 Escorts. Or 1v5 Science Ships.
What matters is that the content is balanced around the available powers and ships.
So a Cruiser that can go 1v5 against Escorts would be considered OP in PvP. In PvE if the content is designed correctly, it isn't OP.
heh. oh, its still space magic. its just a way of de-spamming the power usage mechanic and taking load off of the interface.
...
Surely it's space magic, but it's one i could live with much better.
The biggest problem is (as always) the money. How is Cryptic supposed to sell its Lockboxes if they can't put some Over Powered super duper alien ship into them?
I mean serioulsy, most of them outperform the average Starflet/KFD ship by far.
(Galor, Moonbosh, Jem Hadar Dread, Heavy Escort Carrier, D'Kora and so on.)
Some of them aren't supposed to outperform other ships so Cryptic is clearly more concered about the money than making a good Trek game.
Yeah i know money is important... blah blah blah. But make qualitative product is a also important.
The IP owners should take a closer look on what Cryptic is doing. (If i whould be that, i certainly knew what to do :cool: )
Well a give and take system would be at least comprehensible (some powers at least).
If it where up to me all the "magic" like debuffing and jokes like that would be removed.
But the average MMO player would burst into tears if there wouldn't be any magical content.
I somtimes gives me a good laughter if i look at some MMO games where even Warriors and more other down-to-earth classes can't manage to get along without some magic tricks. I think most modern games have lost any connection to reality, lol. Classes are just a vehicle to give players different pro and cons, nothing else. Personally i always hated magical classes, and i found it laughable to see some atificial made up balance that made games completely unbeliveable.
But on the other hand sometimes it's a good tool to direct a game into the right direction.
Universal BOFF stations on ships? Heck yeah, there could be other mechanics being implemented to give weaker ships some advantage, like shorter respawn times, lower repair costs, and so on.
Why not make ships the way so they do support different playstyles?
Escorts could get some synergy buffs if several are working together, while big Cruisers where more ideal to solo roam and so on.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
It would be interesting if a dev is reading this topic regulary.
I would like to know what they are thinking about it, no matter what their boss is saying, and what their prefered sollution would be.
Maybe i am a bit naive about it, but i can't imagine that everyone at Cryptic hates the GCS.
EDIT:
I think the simplest sollution would be to make the ensign Engineering and the Lt. Science into universal stations.
The other old ships like the Assault Cruiser and Star Cruiser (and their KDF counterparts ) should get the same.
So older ships (in STO terms) would get a bit more versatility. I think that Cryptic won't boost them to be on par with newer ships, so a bit more versality wouldn't hurt anyone.
They wouldn't be in competition to newer Lockbox ships, but they would be playable at least.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
I'm in full agreement with Veraticus with regards to BOFF seating in PvE and PvP. Make the two systems separate from each other, allow us, the fans to choose what we want for officer seating on our favourite ships. Even if it had to be 750 Zen or even 1000 Zen per ship per character. Lets face it, such a system would have to operate like this so that Cryptic would have a steady income. Especially since some people wouldn't bother buying the newer ships and say stick with a Galaxy. Cryptic rely on us buying new ships etc to keep the game afloat, so here both sides win we get the officer layouts we really want and Cryptic get their monies.
I love the idea of keeping PvP distinct from PvE. Like you say having one ship decimate a whole fleet of NPC's is standard in this game, having the same in PvP is not. Have the ship classes put down with standardised stats with each class having it's perks. Not only would it fix the PvP issues I think it would make a lot more people interested in it since with standardisation across the ship types it becomes a matter of skill and not how many lobi crystals you have to buy the latest and greatest OP consoles (AoE subnuc for example).
Would be a lot of work, but I'd happily have an entire season dedicated to bug fixes and core game mechanic improvements such as this.
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All valid points but that is some other ship, not the Galaxy, the Galaxy is effectively a battleship and an old flagship of the Federation, during the Dominion war, they could dish out devastating damage so again Cryptic tries to rewrite Star Trek lore.
The Galaxy is NOT a tank, anymore then the Intrepid is NOT a Science Vessel
There is no over arching or definitive "Star Trek Lore" (unless you're referring to Data's "brother"). Star Trek: The Next Generation (and other iterations) were TV shows. In the shows the Federation are the GOOD guys while the Klingons (or Romulans or Ferengi or Breen or Jem H'adar; ad infinitum, ad nauseum) are the BAD guys. The BAD guys aren't supposed to win. They're supposed to lose. If the episode has been written using the tried and true "Mighty Heroes" formula then the GOOD guys (that's the Federation) will get curb stomped once or twice, regroup... then, in the last 15 minutes, come back and wax the BAD guys TRIBBLE and hand it back to him.
THIS, however, is a game... an MMO, to be exact. The Feddy Bears are only the GOOD guys if you happen to BE a Feddy Bear. IF, however, you happen to be a Kleenex then the Feddy Bears are the BAD guys and they're supposed to LOSE!. Both Feddy Bear and Kleenex players are paying customers... so Cryptic has to balance things between 'em in a way that you don't have to do for a TV show where the story is set and told only from one perspective.
As an in game Tank the Galaxy is formidable. As a tank it doesn't NEED overwhelming offensive ability because it has the durability to hang in a firefight as long as it takes to whittle 'em down. And if you want to talk TV show canon THAT'S actually more canon since Picard's ship was more likely to throw only what firepower was needed at the opponent to get them to back off till the issue can be discussed in a civilized manner. Deadly force was to be avoided unless absolutely necessary and used as a last resort only reluctantly. It was the Defiant that tended to come screaming in, cannons blazing, and instantly turn anything in front of it into a spreading firecloud of blood and superheated plasma. :P
*STO*Its mission: To destroy strange new worlds, to seek out new life and new civilizations... and then kill them, to boldly annihilate what no one has annihilated before!
There is no over arching or definitive "Star Trek Lore" (unless you're referring to Data's "brother"). Star Trek: The Next Generation (and other iterations) were TV shows. In the shows the Federation are the GOOD guys while the Klingons (or Romulans or Ferengi or Breen or Jem H'adar; ad infinitum, ad nauseum) are the BAD guys. The BAD guys aren't supposed to win. They're supposed to lose. If the episode has been written using the tried and true "Mighty Heroes" formula then the GOOD guys (that's the Federation) will get curb stomped once or twice, regroup... then, in the last 15 minutes, come back and wax the BAD guys TRIBBLE and hand it back to him.
THIS, however, is a game... an MMO, to be exact. The Feddy Bears are only the GOOD guys if you happen to BE a Feddy Bear. IF, however, you happen to be a Kleenex then the Feddy Bears are the BAD guys and they're supposed to LOSE!. Both Feddy Bear and Kleenex players are paying customers... so Cryptic has to balance things between 'em in a way that you don't have to do for a TV show where the story is set and told only from one perspective.
As an in game Tank the Galaxy is formidable. As a tank it doesn't NEED overwhelming offensive ability because it has the durability to hang in a firefight as long as it takes to whittle 'em down. And if you want to talk TV show canon THAT'S actually more canon since Picard's ship was more likely to throw only what firepower was needed at the opponent to get them to back off till the issue can be discussed in a civilized manner. Deadly force was to be avoided unless absolutely necessary and used as a last resort only reluctantly. It was the Defiant that tended to come screaming in, cannons blazing, and instantly turn anything in front of it into a spreading firecloud of blood and superheated plasma. :P
Seriously we had this over and over.
First: this isn't a Fed vs KDF thing nor a Crusier vs Escort issue.
Second: We all know this is a MMO, but thankfully the (un) holy trinity has been abandoned long ago, and frankly it was a terrible decision to put Star Trek ships into such a mechanic in the first place.
Third: The Galaxy -R isn't a good tank in STO, this has been explained numerous times in this thread alone.
Three Engineering Ensign powers share too many cooldowns with each other, even a T5 Star Cruiser is a much better tank.
Fourth: The GCS was very well a ship that could serve as Battleship, as seen at numerous Dominion War Battles.
Fifth: To make it a extreme tank isn't even nearly how this ship is supposed to be, it is like making the Defiant a healer ship. The GCS should be one of the most versatile ships in this game, but they made it the exact opposite.
Sixth: Compared to ANY OTHER SHIP, flying the Galaxy -R is just a pain, especially if you're a fan of the GCS.
As i said, this is not only a FED side thing, many KDF players i know want this ship to be rewoked too, because it is one of the most iconic ships in Star Trek hisotry and yet, Cryptic made it the worst ship in the Game.
If anything this is a Star Trek Fans vs Cryptic thing, if that's even possible.
To start a artifical hostility between FED and KDF in this thread isn't required or appropriate at all.
thank you.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
that can only happen when they ditch the entire established design of boff powers, completly dumping the poxy tank, healer, damage dealer rpg trinity model out of the game.
They could start by upping the DOT damage types like Aceton Beam, Eject Warp Core Plasma and others on the higher end abilities (where cruisers get them). It wont unbalance the game, nor will it be the same as direct damage skills of tactical.
Comments
Hanger alone won't fix Galaxy but it can be added to what ever they do. Me personally, all BO slots universal then a hanger and there you go. the ship becomes a multi mission vessel see saw on screen.
we have enought spam and all this things already.
you have done right to bring the discussion on this possibility angrytarg, it was neccesary that we see the good and the bad of this idea.
even if the galaxy have the capacitie to be a carrier it will not be a good thing in this game.
and where will it stop, if the galaxy get a hangar? how many bigger ship than him can pretend to have one then?
before we known we will be invaded by carrier.
and on top of beeing not really fun to fight, a game with only carrier is not a star trek game indeed.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
That's never going to happen. At least as long as Geko works for the company. And probably Stahl. It's just not something the designers want to do to the game. They've shot down that idea more than a few times in the past.
why they do it with the ENTIRE BOP line, we are asking for ONE ship fed side and the zen version 2. But then Geko and Stahl are morons
Get out.
Because the Bird Of Prey is such a small ship with weak shields and hull, its like a fighter designed for Strafing runs IMO, more so then the average Escort.
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But the BOP is an ENTIRE LINE. I askin for one ship and a ZEN ship at that. and universal BO would be Canon.
If we had a game where we could freely spec our vessel and essentially have the same base stats only influenced by size and power output it would be different. But that's not how the game works.
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Go to the Klingon section of the forum and start a thread asking the KDF players what do their BoPs give away in order to have the all universal Boff slots. I'm sure that you'll get a lot of very detailed explanations. Then you'll understand why this will never work for a ship like the Galaxy class in game.
HAH! This partially reminded me of some similar mechanics that we had in Bridge Commander. That would be very cool to have indeed!
Unfortunately, I can't see this ever happening in STO because it will be "ZOMG!!! Too complicated!!!" and there would be such whining by people who can't win by just endlessly spamming spacebar that will melt down the servers. It is the sad truth in STO.
I mean for someone starting with STO, a simulation wouldn't be much more complicated and more difficult to find out how everything works.
In my experience in a MMO, players prefer to have their powers sorted in a action bar or even allocated to certain keys, and just do the same routine over and over again. But if STO where more like a simulation, a pleyer had to react much more intuitive and situation dependent.
An all uni-Galaxy is nonsense. Speed doesn't matter when you have BA's, Commander Tac, Lt. Comm Eng or Sci and batteries, EPTX, Aux2 Bat, purple techies/warp theorist(or is it engineers?) and the ability/skills that boost all ship powers when eptx and batteries are used.
Fixing engineer boff skils to make them on par with tactical/sci skills would go a long way to making the Galaxy (and other cruisers) more "versatile" . At best the Galaxy could use a little bit more of a sci bent (Lt. Comm'Sci) before they start plopping uni-boff stations.
You mean something like the Elder scrolls have for several years?
I don't know if it is even possible to balance such a system to work in a MMO, since virtually every BOFF power had to be somehow equal to all others, at least if they are at the same rank.
To be honest i don't know if and how such a system is doable, maybe someone else has a sudden inspiration how to do it.
But i certaily whould L O V E to have such a system.
Just the idea of having complete control about which BOFF powers i want to have is revolutionary and has much potential IMO.
+1
EDIT:
in order to have such a system, Ship stats must have a much bigger impact to strategy and space combat tactics.
Like Crew ACTUALLY repairing the ship, maneuverability, ship power generation and so on.
http://i1139.photobucket.com/albums/n543/imranbecks/390892_10150442227850791_728975790_10861831_1686847345_n.jpg
Just going to say, I won;t be playing STO's Galaxy any time soon.
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9
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The only area you would need "balance" would be in PvP.
And that could easily be solved by having separate "arenas" for ships to compete in.
In PvE balance doesn't matter much.
You can scale anything PvE side to match anything you put out.
And it would actually create a need for Fleets and specialized abilities.
Science powers would have to be powerful in order to counter NPC abilities and ships.
Cruisers would have to be what they are in the shows just to allow the group to compete.
Escorts would have to be there to either drop a shield facing for a Science power, or to cripple ships with incredible alpha strikes against unshielded targets.
Balance can go out the window. It was never here to begin with.
In PvP you have scenarios that would pit certain ship classes against each other.
Capture the Flag(Ship) would feature Science Vessels nuking each other for control of an unfinished semi operation enemy flagship full of fancy new tech.
Capture and Hold would feature all three ships.
Limits of type of ship allowed per match would be in place to prevent abuse from any one ship type being present. (Massive Negh'Var sitting at a single capture point and holding it forever for example)
First Strike would feature Escorts.
The Goal is to take out the Enemy shipyard(s) or some other point of strategic importance.
Each side has a single NPC Capital Vessel. Rewards are given for taking it out, but they can be ignored.
Slugfest (reminiscent of SFC)
An all Cruiser slugfest. The last man, or team, standing wins.
Wasn't there a thread not long ago of someone installing such lights on a Galaxy model?
@veraticus
Fully agreement here.
Someone should start a thread about this topic at the Builds, Powers, and Game Mechanics Forum.
I think at this point, much more people could be interested in this and maybe after 3 years STO, more people will agree then 2 years ago.
My apologies.
When I say that balance doesn't matter in PvE.
I mean between the various ship classifications.
In PvE, it doesn't matter if a Cruiser could 1v5 Escorts. Or 1v5 Science Ships.
What matters is that the content is balanced around the available powers and ships.
So a Cruiser that can go 1v5 against Escorts would be considered OP in PvP. In PvE if the content is designed correctly, it isn't OP.
Does that make more sense?
The biggest problem is (as always) the money. How is Cryptic supposed to sell its Lockboxes if they can't put some Over Powered super duper alien ship into them?
I mean serioulsy, most of them outperform the average Starflet/KFD ship by far.
(Galor, Moonbosh, Jem Hadar Dread, Heavy Escort Carrier, D'Kora and so on.)
Some of them aren't supposed to outperform other ships so Cryptic is clearly more concered about the money than making a good Trek game.
Yeah i know money is important... blah blah blah. But make qualitative product is a also important.
The IP owners should take a closer look on what Cryptic is doing. (If i whould be that, i certainly knew what to do
Well a give and take system would be at least comprehensible (some powers at least).
If it where up to me all the "magic" like debuffing and jokes like that would be removed.
But the average MMO player would burst into tears if there wouldn't be any magical content.
I somtimes gives me a good laughter if i look at some MMO games where even Warriors and more other down-to-earth classes can't manage to get along without some magic tricks. I think most modern games have lost any connection to reality, lol. Classes are just a vehicle to give players different pro and cons, nothing else. Personally i always hated magical classes, and i found it laughable to see some atificial made up balance that made games completely unbeliveable.
But on the other hand sometimes it's a good tool to direct a game into the right direction.
Universal BOFF stations on ships? Heck yeah, there could be other mechanics being implemented to give weaker ships some advantage, like shorter respawn times, lower repair costs, and so on.
Why not make ships the way so they do support different playstyles?
Escorts could get some synergy buffs if several are working together, while big Cruisers where more ideal to solo roam and so on.
I would like to know what they are thinking about it, no matter what their boss is saying, and what their prefered sollution would be.
Maybe i am a bit naive about it, but i can't imagine that everyone at Cryptic hates the GCS.
EDIT:
I think the simplest sollution would be to make the ensign Engineering and the Lt. Science into universal stations.
The other old ships like the Assault Cruiser and Star Cruiser (and their KDF counterparts ) should get the same.
So older ships (in STO terms) would get a bit more versatility. I think that Cryptic won't boost them to be on par with newer ships, so a bit more versality wouldn't hurt anyone.
They wouldn't be in competition to newer Lockbox ships, but they would be playable at least.
I love the idea of keeping PvP distinct from PvE. Like you say having one ship decimate a whole fleet of NPC's is standard in this game, having the same in PvP is not. Have the ship classes put down with standardised stats with each class having it's perks. Not only would it fix the PvP issues I think it would make a lot more people interested in it since with standardisation across the ship types it becomes a matter of skill and not how many lobi crystals you have to buy the latest and greatest OP consoles (AoE subnuc for example).
Would be a lot of work, but I'd happily have an entire season dedicated to bug fixes and core game mechanic improvements such as this.
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There is no over arching or definitive "Star Trek Lore" (unless you're referring to Data's "brother"). Star Trek: The Next Generation (and other iterations) were TV shows. In the shows the Federation are the GOOD guys while the Klingons (or Romulans or Ferengi or Breen or Jem H'adar; ad infinitum, ad nauseum) are the BAD guys. The BAD guys aren't supposed to win. They're supposed to lose. If the episode has been written using the tried and true "Mighty Heroes" formula then the GOOD guys (that's the Federation) will get curb stomped once or twice, regroup... then, in the last 15 minutes, come back and wax the BAD guys TRIBBLE and hand it back to him.
THIS, however, is a game... an MMO, to be exact. The Feddy Bears are only the GOOD guys if you happen to BE a Feddy Bear. IF, however, you happen to be a Kleenex then the Feddy Bears are the BAD guys and they're supposed to LOSE!. Both Feddy Bear and Kleenex players are paying customers... so Cryptic has to balance things between 'em in a way that you don't have to do for a TV show where the story is set and told only from one perspective.
As an in game Tank the Galaxy is formidable. As a tank it doesn't NEED overwhelming offensive ability because it has the durability to hang in a firefight as long as it takes to whittle 'em down. And if you want to talk TV show canon THAT'S actually more canon since Picard's ship was more likely to throw only what firepower was needed at the opponent to get them to back off till the issue can be discussed in a civilized manner. Deadly force was to be avoided unless absolutely necessary and used as a last resort only reluctantly. It was the Defiant that tended to come screaming in, cannons blazing, and instantly turn anything in front of it into a spreading firecloud of blood and superheated plasma. :P
Seriously we had this over and over.
First: this isn't a Fed vs KDF thing nor a Crusier vs Escort issue.
Second: We all know this is a MMO, but thankfully the (un) holy trinity has been abandoned long ago, and frankly it was a terrible decision to put Star Trek ships into such a mechanic in the first place.
Third: The Galaxy -R isn't a good tank in STO, this has been explained numerous times in this thread alone.
Three Engineering Ensign powers share too many cooldowns with each other, even a T5 Star Cruiser is a much better tank.
Fourth: The GCS was very well a ship that could serve as Battleship, as seen at numerous Dominion War Battles.
Fifth: To make it a extreme tank isn't even nearly how this ship is supposed to be, it is like making the Defiant a healer ship. The GCS should be one of the most versatile ships in this game, but they made it the exact opposite.
Sixth: Compared to ANY OTHER SHIP, flying the Galaxy -R is just a pain, especially if you're a fan of the GCS.
As i said, this is not only a FED side thing, many KDF players i know want this ship to be rewoked too, because it is one of the most iconic ships in Star Trek hisotry and yet, Cryptic made it the worst ship in the Game.
If anything this is a Star Trek Fans vs Cryptic thing, if that's even possible.
To start a artifical hostility between FED and KDF in this thread isn't required or appropriate at all.
thank you.
They could start by upping the DOT damage types like Aceton Beam, Eject Warp Core Plasma and others on the higher end abilities (where cruisers get them). It wont unbalance the game, nor will it be the same as direct damage skills of tactical.
From what I saw in DS9 the Galaxy acted more like a heavy cruiser than a battleship, especially when it was in squadrons.