Wow guys. My whole thread got moved into this one? I get that this is the place to discuss big TRIBBLE the Vulcan but my thread was about sexism in STO. Hope they're getting the message.
For what it's worth that image annoys me too. It's crude and shallow. The banner image needed both men and women being badasses, but they went from men being badasses to women being objects.
And yes men need a skant option! I don't know if I'd go as short as they did in the show due to practical considerations but, kilt-length (top of knee cap) is fine.
For what it's worth that image annoys me too. It's crude and shallow. The banner image needed both men and women being badasses, but they went from men being badasses to women being objects.
And yes men need a skant option! I don't know if I'd go as short as they did in the show due to practical considerations but, kilt-length (top of knee cap) is fine.
You think attractive people are crude and shallow? You think the woman is an object? You don't think she is being a badass? Why?
Doesn't anybody have a problem with how freakishly small her arms are?
Especially if you compare them to her chest, which would be further away than her arm in the picture.
Seriously, she looks like some Alien locked her up for several years, without giving her any activity besides producing milk.
Hah wow. Such a simple change, but so much better.
I totally agree about the arms thing. Horrible foreshortening there. It's like the artist tried but when they couldn't pull it off they just blew it off instead of trying again or trying a different pose.
And wow moving the eyes makes a world of difference. I think I'd be a lot less upset if they actually had her checking where she was shooting and appearing more like she knows what she's doing.
Attractive people aren't crude and shallow. The person who drew this kinda is though. The woman isn't an object, she's objectified, meaning more emphasis is being placed on her dreamy longing gaze at the viewer and her gigantic TRIBBLE than on her firing that phaser and being a Starfleet officer. It can be argued that her firing a phaser makes her a bit more badass, but it's instantly countered by the fact that she's not looking at what she's shooting. She's posing, if anything. They could've had her actually look determined to bring down her foe, or had her shirt closed, or given her pants so whatever she's running from doesn't get a view if her lovely Vulcan lady parts, but they didn't. They just drew her to be as attractively as they could using their standards of beauty as a guide.
You think attractive people are crude and shallow? You think the woman is an object? You don't think she is being a badass? Why?
The drawing is crude and shallow (the OP described the "image" as crude and shallow), not sure where you got your first sentence. And she's apparently not attractive to quite a few people. She's not an object, but emphasis is put on "her objects", here. lol (I have no problem with that point, however.)
Dreamy falling person not knowing where shooting as badass? Most certainly not.
TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class. Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider. Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Maybe next Season we will move away from 'badasses' and phasers and see an officer exploring a strange new world wielding a tricorder instead! Perish the thought.
Problem is all in your heads guys. It sounds like you have some internal sexism issues you need to overcome =/ Because all I see are your own psychological projections. =/
*Currently no Open variant of Fleet Odyssey Uniform. Hopefully that will be fixed soon.
And how many times did you see Dr. Beverly Crusher, or Captain Janeway, "wearing" their uniform so that their TRIBBLE hung out? I can't really remember any and I doubt they ever did, because to do so wouldn't be practical or professional. Ro Laren, Bajoran With An Attitude, sometimes took off her uniform coat but she had a perfectly decent shirt under it. Soooooooo...yeah.
And while you're thinking about that, how about thinking about what us ladies would like to see? Lets see some skin on the guys. Let their shirts rip TOS style. Let them roll up their sleeves. Let them take off their shirts altogether. And for equality's sake, give they guys some skirts!!! Kilts, togas maybe, and how about those first season TNG skant uniforms?
I agree with the first bit. But the second bit is just as bad, the other way round.
Problem is all in your heads guys. It sounds like you have some internal sexism issues you need to overcome =/ Because all I see are your own psychological projections. =/
*Currently no Open variant of Fleet Odyssey Uniform. Hopefully that will be fixed soon.
Try again.
Handsome Phaser Guy: Above average attractive MAN. Wearing closed up practical uniform with trousers. Firing Phaser and looking at a target.
Pretty Phaser Lady: Above average VULCAN FEMALE. Wearing breast dangling top, sex object skirt, with silly boots uniform. Firing Phaser and not even looking at the target.
Hard to see how my view is sexist at all!
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
I agree with the first bit. But the second bit is just as bad, the other way round.
Try again.
Handsome Phaser Guy: Above average attractive MAN. Wearing closed up practical uniform with trousers. Firing Phaser and looking at a target.
Pretty Phaser Lady: Above average VULCAN FEMALE. Wearing breast dangling top, sex object skirt, with silly boots uniform. Firing Phaser and not even looking at the target.
Hard to see how my view is sexist at all!
You do know her uniform is like the open uniform variant available IN-GAME?
She is wearing Sierra Skirt 2, and presumably Sierra boots that are also available in game.
You do know her uniform is like the open uniform variant available IN-GAME?
She is wearing Sierra Skirt 2, and presumably Sierra boots that are also available in game.
You are having a laugh.
Did I say it wasn't in game?
nopeski.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
OK, so you just object to her sexiness. You, sir, are a prude of the first order.
I advise you to never visit Drozana or the Orions will make your head go pop.
Silly:D
I have no problem with people wearing them ingame. I object to it been used for advertising.
Why would I visit Drozana? The damn blue lights play havoc with me head.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
OK, so you just object to her sexiness. You, sir, are a prude of the first order.
Sexiness has a time and a place. But when you're in uniform (well, half in uniform) as a Starfleet officer, especially in combat and apparently having just jumped out of a shuttle, sexy is not appropriate. The time to draw attention to feminine attributes is when you're being a woman first and foremost i.e. intimate social gatherings. If they had drawn her standing with a cocktail glass in a dark club? Fine. Cleavage ahoy. But NOT when you're on duty and in imminent peril. A real person in that situation wouldn't be trying to advertise, she would be trying to stay alive. To draw particular attention to the fact that the character is a well endowed female even when it has no relevance to the situation she's in, is in fact detrimental to the situation she's in, is what is objectionable.
Handsome Phaser Guy: Above average attractive MAN. Wearing in-game uniform that also resembles those worn in the shows, and gives him the appearance of a confident Starfleet officer. Firing Phaser at a target.
Pretty Phaser Lady: Above average VULCAN FEMALE. Wearing in-game uniform that exposes her cleavage, looks almost nothing like the uniforms in the shows, and gives her the appearance of a below-average Starfleet officer who doesn't know what she's doing. Firing Phaser in no particular direction, not checking her aim.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them." -Thomas Marrone
Ok, sure, she is infected with a drunk disease. But it happened. Maybe that happened to Pretty Phaser Girl?
*******************************************
A Romulan Strike Team, Missing Farmers and an ancient base on a Klingon Border world. But what connects them? Find out in my First Foundary mission: 'The Jeroan Farmer Escapade'
And how many times did you see Dr. Beverly Crusher, or Captain Janeway, "wearing" their uniform so that their TRIBBLE hung out? I can't really remember any and I doubt they ever did, because to do so wouldn't be practical or professional. Ro Laren, Bajoran With An Attitude, sometimes took off her uniform coat but she had a perfectly decent shirt under it. Soooooooo...yeah.
You are right.With plastic surgery all women should be able to hide their TRIBBLE because if you see something that clearly turns them into objects.
You are either the pope or you dont know that women have TRIBBLE and burka is not a starfleet uniform.
You are missing the point. The point is the objectification of women is rampant in our society and it needs to be fixed. You can argue that men are also objectified but not at all to the extent that women are.
I totally agree that a woman should be allowed to wear whatever they want, including revealing tops, but the artists should have been more sensitive to the stereotypical sexy sci if girl image they were propagating.
By the way, if you're not a woman yourself you need to shut up before you make yourself look any more sexist. And that comment about the burka is rather uncalled for if you're not Muslim yourself.
While some people get hung up on the uniform, I don't care. Imagine her in a full TNG uniform. She would still be insulting.
Why? First, that vacant open mouthed stare that says she's not all there. That look, and looking at the viewer makes no sense at all in her presumed situation. Its not an emotionless Vulcan look.
Second, what the heck is her hair doing? It is not moving away from her path of motion, its blowing in the wind in an unnecessary over-glamorized effect. Oh yeah, and how often did we see a Vulcan with her hair resembling that in Star Trek? Only in the Mirror Universe.
Third, she has a phaser ready to fire but she doesn't look where she is aiming. She doesn't think its important. Anyone handling a weapon like that had better still be in basic training. Too bad she has captain pips.
Fourth, why is she falling? That doesn't look elegant, graceful, or any sort of badass.
Fifth, she is clearly wearing a lot of makeup. But she's on duty? And a vulcan?
So who cares what she is wearing when everything else is wrong? The pose, the physics, the look, the scene is all ridiculous and when you combine everything together it makes her look like a sex object and nothing more, because she clearly isn't being portrayed as a badass, competent, thinking, Vulcan captain in Starfleet.
She's nothing but Trek flavored eye candy in that picture. That is why it is offensive. If she were more than just eye candy, it would be fine, but nothing in the picture indicates that.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them." -Thomas Marrone
Suggestions to make the phaser lady better:
Explosion in the background, then it can explain her weird pose.
Make her skin, lips, and make up more greenish for that Vulcan and/or Romulan look. Since their blood are green, their skin shouldn't be as fleshed out.
Of course, move her eyes towards where the phaser is pointing at.
Add a few small scratches on her uniform or dust it up a little. Right now it s too clean right now to be in combat.
Lastly, lessen the cleavage a little. Right now, her uniform doesn't look like it has been unzipped, it just looks like it is a low cut top.
Comments
On the forums September 2009
And yes men need a skant option! I don't know if I'd go as short as they did in the show due to practical considerations but, kilt-length (top of knee cap) is fine.
You think attractive people are crude and shallow? You think the woman is an object? You don't think she is being a badass? Why?
I totally agree about the arms thing. Horrible foreshortening there. It's like the artist tried but when they couldn't pull it off they just blew it off instead of trying again or trying a different pose.
And wow moving the eyes makes a world of difference. I think I'd be a lot less upset if they actually had her checking where she was shooting and appearing more like she knows what she's doing.
On the forums September 2009
On the forums September 2009
The drawing is crude and shallow (the OP described the "image" as crude and shallow), not sure where you got your first sentence. And she's apparently not attractive to quite a few people. She's not an object, but emphasis is put on "her objects", here. lol (I have no problem with that point, however.)
Dreamy falling person not knowing where shooting as badass? Most certainly not.
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
Handsome Phaser Guy: Above average attractive MAN. Wearing in-game uniform. Firing Phaser.
Pretty Phaser Lady: Above average VULCAN FEMALE. Wearing in-game uniform*. Firing Phaser.
Problem is all in your heads guys. It sounds like you have some internal sexism issues you need to overcome =/ Because all I see are your own psychological projections. =/
*Currently no Open variant of Fleet Odyssey Uniform. Hopefully that will be fixed soon.
And how many times did you see Dr. Beverly Crusher, or Captain Janeway, "wearing" their uniform so that their TRIBBLE hung out? I can't really remember any and I doubt they ever did, because to do so wouldn't be practical or professional. Ro Laren, Bajoran With An Attitude, sometimes took off her uniform coat but she had a perfectly decent shirt under it. Soooooooo...yeah.
I agree with the first bit. But the second bit is just as bad, the other way round.
Try again.
Handsome Phaser Guy: Above average attractive MAN. Wearing closed up practical uniform with trousers. Firing Phaser and looking at a target.
Pretty Phaser Lady: Above average VULCAN FEMALE. Wearing breast dangling top, sex object skirt, with silly boots uniform. Firing Phaser and not even looking at the target.
Hard to see how my view is sexist at all!
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
You do know her uniform is like the open uniform variant available IN-GAME?
She is wearing Sierra Skirt 2, and presumably Sierra boots that are also available in game.
You are having a laugh.
Did I say it wasn't in game?
nopeski.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
OK, so you just object to her sexiness. You, sir, are a prude of the first order.
I advise you to never visit Drozana or the Orions will make your head go pop.
Silly:D
I have no problem with people wearing them ingame. I object to it been used for advertising.
Why would I visit Drozana? The damn blue lights play havoc with me head.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Sexiness has a time and a place. But when you're in uniform (well, half in uniform) as a Starfleet officer, especially in combat and apparently having just jumped out of a shuttle, sexy is not appropriate. The time to draw attention to feminine attributes is when you're being a woman first and foremost i.e. intimate social gatherings. If they had drawn her standing with a cocktail glass in a dark club? Fine. Cleavage ahoy. But NOT when you're on duty and in imminent peril. A real person in that situation wouldn't be trying to advertise, she would be trying to stay alive. To draw particular attention to the fact that the character is a well endowed female even when it has no relevance to the situation she's in, is in fact detrimental to the situation she's in, is what is objectionable.
Fixed that for you.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone
TNG. Season 1. Episode 2. The Naked Now. Infected with a disease, Crusher unzips her top and makes a pass at Picard.
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/File:Crusher_and_Picard_get_close.jpg
Ok, sure, she is infected with a drunk disease. But it happened. Maybe that happened to Pretty Phaser Girl?
A Romulan Strike Team, Missing Farmers and an ancient base on a Klingon Border world. But what connects them? Find out in my First Foundary mission: 'The Jeroan Farmer Escapade'
You are right.With plastic surgery all women should be able to hide their TRIBBLE because if you see something that clearly turns them into objects.
You are either the pope or you dont know that women have TRIBBLE and burka is not a starfleet uniform.
I totally agree that a woman should be allowed to wear whatever they want, including revealing tops, but the artists should have been more sensitive to the stereotypical sexy sci if girl image they were propagating.
By the way, if you're not a woman yourself you need to shut up before you make yourself look any more sexist. And that comment about the burka is rather uncalled for if you're not Muslim yourself.
On the forums September 2009
in s8 that chick will get a ghost suit or a bear costume .Happy?
Why? First, that vacant open mouthed stare that says she's not all there. That look, and looking at the viewer makes no sense at all in her presumed situation. Its not an emotionless Vulcan look.
Second, what the heck is her hair doing? It is not moving away from her path of motion, its blowing in the wind in an unnecessary over-glamorized effect. Oh yeah, and how often did we see a Vulcan with her hair resembling that in Star Trek? Only in the Mirror Universe.
Third, she has a phaser ready to fire but she doesn't look where she is aiming. She doesn't think its important. Anyone handling a weapon like that had better still be in basic training. Too bad she has captain pips.
Fourth, why is she falling? That doesn't look elegant, graceful, or any sort of badass.
Fifth, she is clearly wearing a lot of makeup. But she's on duty? And a vulcan?
So who cares what she is wearing when everything else is wrong? The pose, the physics, the look, the scene is all ridiculous and when you combine everything together it makes her look like a sex object and nothing more, because she clearly isn't being portrayed as a badass, competent, thinking, Vulcan captain in Starfleet.
She's nothing but Trek flavored eye candy in that picture. That is why it is offensive. If she were more than just eye candy, it would be fine, but nothing in the picture indicates that.
My boxed copy doesn't have him on the front
Quoted for truth.
The new background is full of New Romulus stuff. So it's possible that a new background - and with it, a new mascot - will come around every season.
That doesn't mean we'll necessarily get Handsome Phaser Guy back, but at least "Pretty Phaser Lady" might not be permanent.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone
CO noob and STO veteran.
You are all awesome. All 38 pages and counting of you.
Not as awesome as Handsome Phaser Guy, but still awesome.
Explosion in the background, then it can explain her weird pose.
Make her skin, lips, and make up more greenish for that Vulcan and/or Romulan look. Since their blood are green, their skin shouldn't be as fleshed out.
Of course, move her eyes towards where the phaser is pointing at.
Add a few small scratches on her uniform or dust it up a little. Right now it s too clean right now to be in combat.
Lastly, lessen the cleavage a little. Right now, her uniform doesn't look like it has been unzipped, it just looks like it is a low cut top.