Given the lengths you need to go to in order to connect the mines, namely camouflaging their launch and positioning your opponent where you need them to go (by maneuvering in a manner that makes them moving towards your mines the ideal move from their PoV) along with the fact that you've already got a 2-5 sec~ wait for the mines to go live, I mean, no offense, but I just don't see a need to make them blow up your team or yourself.
They're a pocket PSW available 5 sec after you want it, can blow up bad guys who're bunched up, and can be dealt with in dozens of little ways. Heck, they even have a distinctive flash when they're ready to select a target.
I really, really, really am against nerfing the tric mines.
Also if you put pets on intercept they make short work of any mine...and since the pvp is full of pets...
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I'm with corsair, I tried tric mines out a few days ago on the Fleet Recon and honestly 29 times out of 30 the thing will die to random TRIBBLE fire just about the second it gets deployed.
If someone one-shots me with a tric mine, hats off to them because I'll be damned if I can see how they'll incubate and protect the poor thing long enough.
I'm with corsair, I tried tric mines out a few days ago on the Fleet Recon and honestly 29 times out of 30 the thing will die to random TRIBBLE fire just about the second it gets deployed.
If someone one-shots me with a tric mine, hats off to them because I'll be damned if I can see how they'll incubate and protect the poor thing long enough.
I've managed five one-shots with 'em so far in Ker'rat. I can't see them ever, ever being useful for 5v5 arena play (too long to go live, too vulnerable to being cleared) and maybe, maybe having a niche place in cap'n'hold. even then, trics auto boom after a minute or so, so it's not like you can effectively deny a point to your enemy by making it too dangerous to approach without a proper mine clearer... which would be no fancier than someone with CSV and good eyes, or tractor beam repulsors and an IQ half that of Gomer Pile.
The only way to make them work more than once (when you instagib the enemy Raptor/Defiant/BoP/Vor'cha in your plasma cloud one time, they usually stop falling for it after that point) is dropping them when there's a huge amount of sound FX and visual FX flying around, as they've got about a million different tells on launching them. Of course, when things are that hectic, usually someone will pop off with some kind of AoE and probably wipe your mines out before they're even live.
even then, trics auto boom after a minute or so, so it's not like you can effectively deny a point to your enemy by making it too dangerous to approach without a proper mine clearer...
That would make too much sense, this is a Cryptic game! We know not their mysterious ways!
Just going to add that I've been sploded twice now with almost full shields and resists, I was all for buffing mines but potentially one shotting is too much.
Just going to add that I've been sploded twice now with almost full shields and resists, I was all for buffing mines but potentially one shotting is too much.
And self aware. :eek:
The counter to mines is: don't hit them. Seriously. they got buffed because they rarely did damage to enemies as it was.
The counter to mines is: don't hit them. Seriously. they got buffed because they rarely did damage to enemies as it was.
Or Scatter Volley at the mine layer, or Warp Poo near the mine layer, or FAW near the mine layer, or Grav Well near the mine layer, or Tykens Rift near the mine layer, or Photonic Shockwave near the mine layer, or Tractor Beam Repulsor near the mine layer, or torpedo spread near the mine layer, or set fighters to intercept near the mine layer, or... uh, I think that's all of 'em.
So, yeah. There ya go. Really, unless you're using torps and Projectile Doffs to reduce the Tric mine's cooldown, you're going to need to have two to make any kind of use of Dispersal Pattern Beta given its 30 sec cooldown.
For the record, and I'm just floating the idea, howabout moving dispersal patterns over to the Engineering BOffs? It's fit great with the fact that Engineers on ground are all about setting people up the bomb... and tanking.
no. have you ever seen a photonic fleet and about 10 carrier pets sucked into a grav well with a tric mine? now you might even add some warp pee... its a beautiful sight. all the colors combined with pretty explosions...
sometime you even catch a player with it.
so the moral would be: tric mines are good for lolz and if that isnt a viable goal in pvp i dont know what is.
no. have you ever seen a photonic fleet and about 10 carrier pets sucked into a grav well with a tric mine? now you might even add some warp pee... its a beautiful sight. all the colors combined with pretty explosions...
sometime you even catch a player with it.
so the moral would be: tric mines are good for lolz and if that isnt a viable goal in pvp i dont know what is.
so slap on a tric mine launcher or two and do an arena. 9 matches out of 10 you will not see a single tric explosion. The mines will be destroyed by some AoE ability before having a chance to 'splode.
I used to run Kar'fi with the tric-frigaes and two tric launchers back in the day, but stopped it when more people started doing AoE. (ie. when FAW got more widely used, when we got escorts and cruisers with more sci abilities etc,)
oh yes the karfi is fun but at the moment i mostly pug with my orb and i do have 1 tric mine.
do i have the best setup? probably not. does it work? most of the time it does. is it fun? oh yes it is
i figure i dont lose that much with one weapon slot and it is great to clear spam
Tric mines in PvP (both Ker'rat and Arena play) are in the same class as EmoeJoe's Tric Torp+PSW 3 suicide bomber BoP.
Fun, but ultimately, nothing close to a top-notch practical choice for team play.
The one saving grace of the mines over the torpedos is that there is no self-damage coming off of them.
true enough but the sad part is, how often does one need the top choice for team play?
my fleet has 5 members and due to differences in work schedule its highly unlikely that we have a full premade unless its on a weekend. and on a weekend often people have some rl things to do so it happens very seldom that i pvp with a 5 man team.
most of the time i queue solo or with 2-3 people. now sometimes there are truly exciting games that are even, where you have to use all your abilities, think, coordinate and can use your ship/build to its full potential. but sadly that doesnt happen so often.
now when i pug in my sci orb i have a lot of fun and am quite successful. i have my uni lt cmdr as eng so i run gw, vm and warp plasma which works nice to kill pets, and slow down enemies. also i carry a few heals with aux to sif, extend, tss, he and sci team.
the general idea is from a bop build that mav posted in his sci thread and it works well in premades and in pugs.
no the tric mine i carry is mostly for the fun part. i have different weapons in my inv so i can switch if necessary but honestly most of the time the mine is just fine. i have killed people with it and i mostly killed vast amounts of pets with it. and when you have 10 little pets and a whole photonic fleet sucked in your well and kill them with one mine it is fun.
and maybe another word to gw: yes it is fairly weak, yes even with an aftershock proc, wp, vm and target engines people might escape but it is good at clearing spam especially with wp combined and maybe that mine.
Warp Plasma? Scatter Volley? Evasive Maneuvers and manual targeting?
When someone launches mines you have, on the order, of 5 seconds before they're even dangerous. With mine outlines turned on, you shouldn't ever miss them being deployed. Even if Husanak (sp?) is skulking around around dropping quad trics at 100k damage a piece. Really, they're still ****-all-useless in PvP, nice damage (which'll probably get nerfed due them crushing bosses and gates) but ****-ing-point-less when you're giving up one to weapon slots for something that'll be smoked the moment you pop them out.
Warp Plasma? Scatter Volley? Evasive Maneuvers and manual targeting?
When someone launches mines you have, on the order, of 5 seconds before they're even dangerous. With mine outlines turned on, you shouldn't ever miss them being deployed. Even if Husanak (sp?) is skulking around around dropping quad trics at 100k damage a piece. Really, they're still ****-all-useless in PvP, nice damage (which'll probably get nerfed due them crushing bosses and gates) but ****-ing-point-less when you're giving up one to weapon slots for something that'll be smoked the moment you pop them out.
I beg to differ. I have replace my previous mine with one of these based on personal experience. I was killed twice by one of these with full shields and hull. I can do the same for myself on my sci sci.
Warp Plasma? Scatter Volley? Evasive Maneuvers and manual targeting?
When someone launches mines you have, on the order, of 5 seconds before they're even dangerous. With mine outlines turned on, you shouldn't ever miss them being deployed. Even if Husanak (sp?) is skulking around around dropping quad trics at 100k damage a piece. Really, they're still ****-all-useless in PvP, nice damage (which'll probably get nerfed due them crushing bosses and gates) but ****-ing-point-less when you're giving up one to weapon slots for something that'll be smoked the moment you pop them out.
Spellings right... and for the record... my record is 295k now.... 4 of them pretty much one shot a tac cube. I was half paying attention and then the cube went 90%-2%... lol
I do tend to agree they are mostly useless in pvp... not completely useless... what I don't care for is if you where to say build a team around trying to land them... (if anyone is that much of a ****) we could end up back in the mine spam days of old... where everyone on a team is pumping out spam mines... and one or two guys in this case are trying to hid clusters of trics in there hoping the other sides aoe misses a couple.
Really if the dmg gets toned down 2 much... even for pve it would make more sense to spam plasma mines or something.... I would vote leave them be... a team that does control them has basicly removed 1-2 weapons slots off an enemy ship... and with the current state of shield resist tanking... I'm not sure thats something many teams could afford.
Maybe Cruiser mine layers with Sci ships TBR'ing people into minefields might be a viable tactic for connecting players with mines. Time to experiment! Given their lethality, maybe they should unmask once they start homing in? Or possibly no masking, but live instant launch w/ self-damage potential? Something?
As far as PvE... IDK, they are murderously powerful, but you do need to take time out of what you're doing, fly over, plant the mines, and have them last long enough to go live and hit whatever you're setting them up on. Okay, they're nice as fire-and-forget lane traps for BoPs and probes, but even then, not every ship/cappy combo is going to have them doing enough damage to kill BoP's or probes instantly (actually, for my Tac/Cruiser, they're only guaranteed kills when dropped with APA or critting, and that's w/ Mk XI [CritD]x3). They only last about a minute once deployed, too.
Borticus, if you're watching, was there ever any consideration of moving mines over to Engineering instead of Tactical (to go along with Engi's dropping mines in Ground combat)?
[Combat (Self)] officer Tricobalt Mine deals 68910 (128884) Kinetic Damage(Critical) to Vor'cha Battle Cruiser with Mine Explosion.
[Combat (Self)] officer Tricobalt Mine deals 95663 (120652) Kinetic Damage(Critical) to Rival Bird-of-Prey with Mine Explosion.
[Combat (Self)] officer Tricobalt Mine deals 101648 (126637) Kinetic Damage(Critical) to Rival Bird-of-Prey with Mine Explosion.
[Combat (Self)] officer Tricobalt Mine deals 122292 (124291) Kinetic Damage(Critical) to Vor'cha Battle Cruiser with Mine Explosion.
[Combat (Self)] officer Tricobalt Mine deals 71868 (109794) Kinetic Damage(Critical) to Raptor Escort with Mine Explosion.
[Combat (Self)] officer Tricobalt Mine deals 41407 (53914) Kinetic Damage to Rival Raptor Escort with Mine Explosion.
[Combat (Self)] officer Tricobalt Mine deals 46450 (48116) Kinetic Damage to Rival Bird-of-Prey with Mine Explosion.
I see one hit with almost 50% dmg reduction and the rest around 20-25%. So I guess that first hit was the only one, that really hit some shield facing, unless anybody can tell me what a PVE Vor'cha uses to get 50% resi. The thread starter had a minor negative resistance when he got hit. So either he didnt have shield where he got hit or he had shields but got debuffed like an ***. It seems almost fine to me, since most people say that they dont get those kills. But if really 50% of Trico dmg bypasses the shields 120k Crits are a problem. Its one thing to have an one-shot-kill weapon against shieldless ships, which is tricky to handle but if you can vaporize people, that are not suffering from multiple debuffs, with full shields, it becomes a brain afk op weapon.
Comments
hmm... mines don't but torps do...
i think mines should too. More bang for the bucks!
They're a pocket PSW available 5 sec after you want it, can blow up bad guys who're bunched up, and can be dealt with in dozens of little ways. Heck, they even have a distinctive flash when they're ready to select a target.
I really, really, really am against nerfing the tric mines.
If someone one-shots me with a tric mine, hats off to them because I'll be damned if I can see how they'll incubate and protect the poor thing long enough.
vids and guides and stuff
[9:52] [Zone #11] Neal@trapper1532: im a omega force shadow oprative and a maoc elite camander and here i am taking water samples
I've managed five one-shots with 'em so far in Ker'rat. I can't see them ever, ever being useful for 5v5 arena play (too long to go live, too vulnerable to being cleared) and maybe, maybe having a niche place in cap'n'hold. even then, trics auto boom after a minute or so, so it's not like you can effectively deny a point to your enemy by making it too dangerous to approach without a proper mine clearer... which would be no fancier than someone with CSV and good eyes, or tractor beam repulsors and an IQ half that of Gomer Pile.
The only way to make them work more than once (when you instagib the enemy Raptor/Defiant/BoP/Vor'cha in your plasma cloud one time, they usually stop falling for it after that point) is dropping them when there's a huge amount of sound FX and visual FX flying around, as they've got about a million different tells on launching them. Of course, when things are that hectic, usually someone will pop off with some kind of AoE and probably wipe your mines out before they're even live.
That would make too much sense, this is a Cryptic game! We know not their mysterious ways!
vids and guides and stuff
[9:52] [Zone #11] Neal@trapper1532: im a omega force shadow oprative and a maoc elite camander and here i am taking water samples
i mean we want to stay canon after all
My stomach is clear and my mind is full of bacon!
And self aware. :eek:
Your Ramming Speed III deals 52098 (99235) Kinetic Damage(Critical) to Remus.
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
My character Tsin'xing
Or Scatter Volley at the mine layer, or Warp Poo near the mine layer, or FAW near the mine layer, or Grav Well near the mine layer, or Tykens Rift near the mine layer, or Photonic Shockwave near the mine layer, or Tractor Beam Repulsor near the mine layer, or torpedo spread near the mine layer, or set fighters to intercept near the mine layer, or... uh, I think that's all of 'em.
So, yeah. There ya go. Really, unless you're using torps and Projectile Doffs to reduce the Tric mine's cooldown, you're going to need to have two to make any kind of use of Dispersal Pattern Beta given its 30 sec cooldown.
For the record, and I'm just floating the idea, howabout moving dispersal patterns over to the Engineering BOffs? It's fit great with the fact that Engineers on ground are all about setting people up the bomb... and tanking.
"I'm sorry, Dave. I'm afraid I can't do that."
yup, a small damage boost, while all normal transphasics got a bleedthrough buff
| Join Date: January 2009 | Computer | Fleet: Broken Wings |
No.
/10chars and a slice of pizza.
no.
They're still irellevant in PvP, and barely useful in PvE. Taking them down another 20% will make them irellevant everywhere
no. have you ever seen a photonic fleet and about 10 carrier pets sucked into a grav well with a tric mine? now you might even add some warp pee... its a beautiful sight. all the colors combined with pretty explosions...
sometime you even catch a player with it.
so the moral would be: tric mines are good for lolz and if that isnt a viable goal in pvp i dont know what is.
My stomach is clear and my mind is full of bacon!
so slap on a tric mine launcher or two and do an arena. 9 matches out of 10 you will not see a single tric explosion. The mines will be destroyed by some AoE ability before having a chance to 'splode.
I used to run Kar'fi with the tric-frigaes and two tric launchers back in the day, but stopped it when more people started doing AoE. (ie. when FAW got more widely used, when we got escorts and cruisers with more sci abilities etc,)
do i have the best setup? probably not. does it work? most of the time it does. is it fun? oh yes it is
i figure i dont lose that much with one weapon slot and it is great to clear spam
My stomach is clear and my mind is full of bacon!
Fun, but ultimately, nothing close to a top-notch practical choice for team play.
The one saving grace of the mines over the torpedos is that there is no self-damage coming off of them.
true enough but the sad part is, how often does one need the top choice for team play?
my fleet has 5 members and due to differences in work schedule its highly unlikely that we have a full premade unless its on a weekend. and on a weekend often people have some rl things to do so it happens very seldom that i pvp with a 5 man team.
most of the time i queue solo or with 2-3 people. now sometimes there are truly exciting games that are even, where you have to use all your abilities, think, coordinate and can use your ship/build to its full potential. but sadly that doesnt happen so often.
now when i pug in my sci orb i have a lot of fun and am quite successful. i have my uni lt cmdr as eng so i run gw, vm and warp plasma which works nice to kill pets, and slow down enemies. also i carry a few heals with aux to sif, extend, tss, he and sci team.
the general idea is from a bop build that mav posted in his sci thread and it works well in premades and in pugs.
no the tric mine i carry is mostly for the fun part. i have different weapons in my inv so i can switch if necessary but honestly most of the time the mine is just fine. i have killed people with it and i mostly killed vast amounts of pets with it. and when you have 10 little pets and a whole photonic fleet sucked in your well and kill them with one mine it is fun.
and maybe another word to gw: yes it is fairly weak, yes even with an aftershock proc, wp, vm and target engines people might escape but it is good at clearing spam especially with wp combined and maybe that mine.
My stomach is clear and my mind is full of bacon!
When someone launches mines you have, on the order, of 5 seconds before they're even dangerous. With mine outlines turned on, you shouldn't ever miss them being deployed. Even if Husanak (sp?) is skulking around around dropping quad trics at 100k damage a piece. Really, they're still ****-all-useless in PvP, nice damage (which'll probably get nerfed due them crushing bosses and gates) but ****-ing-point-less when you're giving up one to weapon slots for something that'll be smoked the moment you pop them out.
I beg to differ. I have replace my previous mine with one of these based on personal experience. I was killed twice by one of these with full shields and hull. I can do the same for myself on my sci sci.
Spellings right... and for the record... my record is 295k now.... 4 of them pretty much one shot a tac cube.
I do tend to agree they are mostly useless in pvp... not completely useless... what I don't care for is if you where to say build a team around trying to land them... (if anyone is that much of a ****) we could end up back in the mine spam days of old... where everyone on a team is pumping out spam mines... and one or two guys in this case are trying to hid clusters of trics in there hoping the other sides aoe misses a couple.
Really if the dmg gets toned down 2 much... even for pve it would make more sense to spam plasma mines or something.... I would vote leave them be... a team that does control them has basicly removed 1-2 weapons slots off an enemy ship... and with the current state of shield resist tanking... I'm not sure thats something many teams could afford.
As far as PvE... IDK, they are murderously powerful, but you do need to take time out of what you're doing, fly over, plant the mines, and have them last long enough to go live and hit whatever you're setting them up on. Okay, they're nice as fire-and-forget lane traps for BoPs and probes, but even then, not every ship/cappy combo is going to have them doing enough damage to kill BoP's or probes instantly (actually, for my Tac/Cruiser, they're only guaranteed kills when dropped with APA or critting, and that's w/ Mk XI [CritD]x3). They only last about a minute once deployed, too.
Borticus, if you're watching, was there ever any consideration of moving mines over to Engineering instead of Tactical (to go along with Engi's dropping mines in Ground combat)?
I see one hit with almost 50% dmg reduction and the rest around 20-25%. So I guess that first hit was the only one, that really hit some shield facing, unless anybody can tell me what a PVE Vor'cha uses to get 50% resi. The thread starter had a minor negative resistance when he got hit. So either he didnt have shield where he got hit or he had shields but got debuffed like an ***. It seems almost fine to me, since most people say that they dont get those kills. But if really 50% of Trico dmg bypasses the shields 120k Crits are a problem. Its one thing to have an one-shot-kill weapon against shieldless ships, which is tricky to handle but if you can vaporize people, that are not suffering from multiple debuffs, with full shields, it becomes a brain afk op weapon.