I'd just like to add that there is a nice Mk XI Cov. Cap.x2 20% Plasma resist shield sold by the STF merchants that has been working well for me with the other three items of the Borg set. It is very easy to get as it only costs two rare borg salvage to get the requisition, and there really isn't anything else to spend the rare salvage on anyways.
Pretty simple. Borg shield.
I wouldnt know why you would not recommend this shield. 15% plasma resist, and the highest shield regen around. using 2 Emergency power to shields on a rotation has the highest shield uptime against borg. Its always been the best shield against borg. there is no real burst anyway so no problem if the capacity is somewhat lower.
Especially with the drains of the borg (Shield neutralizers) its even more valuable and Covariants have no real purpose here imo.
For the offensive;
Loads of hull debuffs, Beta etc. on Elite, since they have way more hull hitpoints.
Otherwise i would use omega to get loose of tractor beams.
Pretty simple. Borg shield.
I wouldnt know why you would not recommend this shield. 15% plasma resist, and the highest shield regen around. using 2 Emergency power to shields on a rotation has the highest shield uptime against borg. Its always been the best shield against borg. there is no real burst anyway so no problem if the capacity is somewhat lower.
Especially with the drains of the borg (Shield neutralizers) its even more valuable and Covariants have no real purpose here imo.
For the offensive;
Loads of hull debuffs, Beta etc. on Elite, since they have way more hull hitpoints.
Otherwise i would use omega to get loose of tractor beams.
What about the Omega Shield with 3 borg pieces?
The omega shield has over 1000 more shield hitpoints (at Mk XII) and only 5% less Plasma resist, and only 30 less shield regen points per 6 seconds.
You don't get the +5 to shields, but you do get the speed (escape) boost from Energy DMG.
You do still get the Borg set powers, except Tractor beam... which with it's recharge time makes that a negligible loss, IMO.
To qualify, I'm not saying it's better, just curious about people's thoughts on that setup vs. all borg set-up.
But to touch on the overall problem with these new sets: they are not THAT much better than the borg set. Especially when you consider how much more TIME is spent acquiring them. 15 STFs and 1 Story mission gets you the full Borg Set. It takes 60 STFs (without any luck Chip drops or Tech drops) to get the basic Mk X new set stuff.
It's clear that these news sets need love to make them better than he borg set, which I think is supposed to be the point. Right? The story fluf talks about how hard this gear is to make, only given out to proven captains, and is specifically designed for fighting Borg. OR, you can have this old stuff that's technically more effective in a lot of ways. O_o
Third, a question: I'm sure I'll take some heat for this. I know it's still a raw wound with a lot of people, but I have to ask. How would you adapt your builds above to the Jem'Hadar bug, with the universal boff slots and everything?
Obviously that gives your build a lot of potential flexibility, so I'm curious how you, personally, would make the most of that given your guidelines above.
You can run the bug like a Fleet Escort....
But I would contemplate running it with two lt. science and see what I could do with that. Maybe 2x transfer shield strengths, or 2x hazard emitters, or an extra tractor beam. Although you loose the 2nd engineering skill which is a pain.
The problem that I have found with APO3 + CRF/CSV 2 is the long cooldown with omega. Yes, you can get more damage out of omega 3/csv 2, but then you are left with just CSV 2 or 1 by iteself for the next 2 rounds. It would be interesting to measure how much damage 3 rounds of attacking would go. I think over time, CSV 3 would do more. I use AP Beta a lot because the cooldown is much shorter (it the same as CSV). The comparison would be:
Beta also has a shorter duration de-buff, so its a bit of a wash.
But honestly, if you find using a commander level cannon skill and a lt. commander attack pattern skill better, thats perfectly fine. I tried to leave the rare BO skills out of this build in order for the less experience folks (with less energy credits to spare) to be able to put something together easier.
Pretty simple. Borg shield.
I wouldnt know why you would not recommend this shield. 15% plasma resist, and the highest shield regen around. using 2 Emergency power to shields on a rotation has the highest shield uptime against borg. Its always been the best shield against borg. there is no real burst anyway so no problem if the capacity is somewhat lower.
I find the regen shields no mattter how good they are, go down fast and you take huge hits to your hull. As an escort, thats bad news! So I tend not to recommend it.
If you find it works better in your own experience, thats fine. Shields are the least important thing really out of the rest of the set, the important thing is to get the 3x borg pieces so you get the random shield/hull heals!
If you've got a spare tact skill slot, fill it with attack pattern beta. This helps your team tremendously, especially when taking down large borg and those pesky nanite spheres.
What you must not do is equip is equip your escort with beams. I've seen escorts in Elite STF missions, fly about firing soley beams and the odd quantum torp. Suffice to say they did virtually nothing to the target and against a shielded one even less.
When it comes to STF it's time to get serious about your build, no room for warm "it's Trek" or "but I like it" builds.
What an excellent guide and brilliant all round contributions. I've been playing for nearly a year and have spent most of that time as a Sci VA. I have a TAC VA now and I was really pleased too see my build is a very close match to yours and explains how I can do so much damage. I would love it if we could have a glossary of the abbreviations though, I know what most of them are but some I can't think of right away, perhaps there is one on this forum somewhere already.
One point, someone said TS is now more powerful than HY, is that TS3 v HY3? Wouldn't the damage be shared across multiple targets with TS which then just agro every bit of Borg kit to come and get you, wouldn't it be better to slaughter them one at a time really quickly and move on to the next rather than try to damage many targets in a longer time and have them all reap their revenge on you?
Oh I did notice something interesting last night. The Jem'Hadar ship is the only escort to get a bonus to engine power (+5), which makes it uniquely suited to equip the quad phaser cannons off the Sao Paulo. I think those have a -10 energy power hit, which the Bug's inherent bonus cuts in half for you. Kind of a sweet little bonus.
One point, someone said TS is now more powerful than HY, is that TS3 v HY3? Wouldn't the damage be shared across multiple targets with TS which then just agro every bit of Borg kit to come and get you, wouldn't it be better to slaughter them one at a time really quickly and move on to the next rather than try to damage many targets in a longer time and have them all reap their revenge on you?
Torpedo spread is IIRC 85% of a High Yield for each target. That means even if you are hitting just TWO targets you are being more efficient with your damage output. Taking the time to target one without the spread fire abilities will slow you down quite a bit, which is why most people are using the spread abilities now.
And with STF's, probably 75% of the time you are able to take advantage of hitting multiple targets. Even hitting TWO of the transfer nodes at once (or regen probes in cure) can really help (if you get on top of one, like 1km away, you can be in range for another one too). Plus, all the other random spawns in the area can get hit by your weapons too (the Raptors in Cure, the Spheres in Khitomer Accord, etc.).
You WILL get a lot of agro with this method, which is why the builds I suggest are so defensively-orientated, because you WILL need to be able to take damage from multiple targets and survive. I tend not to rely on team mates to help keep me healed, but even if just one person is randomly giving you heals it will keep you alive in the Normal level STF's no problem.
As for Torpedo Spread 3... I left that out of the builds on purpose. If you are lucky enough to get that skill on a BO, sure go ahead and use it. But right now TS3 BO's are 20,000,000+ on the Exchange.
Torpedo spread is IIRC 85% of a High Yield for each target. That means even if you are hitting just TWO targets you are being more efficient with your damage output. Taking the time to target one without the spread fire abilities will slow you down quite a bit, which is why most people are using the spread abilities now.
And with STF's, probably 75% of the time you are able to take advantage of hitting multiple targets. Even hitting TWO of the transfer nodes at once (or regen probes in cure) can really help (if you get on top of one, like 1km away, you can be in range for another one too). Plus, all the other random spawns in the area can get hit by your weapons too (the Raptors in Cure, the Spheres in Khitomer Accord, etc.).
You WILL get a lot of agro with this method, which is why the builds I suggest are so defensively-orientated, because you WILL need to be able to take damage from multiple targets and survive. I tend not to rely on team mates to help keep me healed, but even if just one person is randomly giving you heals it will keep you alive in the Normal level STF's no problem.
As for Torpedo Spread 3... I left that out of the builds on purpose. If you are lucky enough to get that skill on a BO, sure go ahead and use it. But right now TS3 BO's are 20,000,000+ on the Exchange.
Wow, thanks a lot for the great advice, I'll go change my setup right now, may even get the TS3 BO if I like it.
This guide is wonderful, though what I did for the MVAE was had one Tac Boff with CRF I, and the other one with CSV I.
But my setup is just like the OP's example of the MVAE except 1 CSV to CRF.
Thank you for the help with the build and for posting this guide (especially for a noob like me).
That works good too. Lets you run the Scatter Volley for the groups, rapid fire for the larger individual targets.
If you are tac officer you have the "faster BO recharge" ability, which will make the canon skills global cooldown irrelevant, allowing you to re-use one or the other for little while instead of switching.
And now, here are some examples of actual STF Escort builds for reference...
Advanced Escort or MVAM Escort
Forward Weapons: 3x Dual Heavy Cannons (same type), 1x Quantum Torpedo
Rear Weapons: 3x Turrets (same type as front cannons)
Engineering Consoles: EPS console (for Energy Transfer), Neutronium Alloy (For general damage resist)
Science Consoles: Assimilated Module (Borg Console), Graviton Generator, Biofunction Monitor (Or Grappler OR Impulse Capacitance Cell)
Tactical Consoles: 3x of the Energy Weapon type you are using (Ex. Phaser Relay, Plasma Infuser, etc.), 1x Zero Point Quantum Chamber (for Quantum Torpedoes)
Devices: Subspace Field Modulator (defensive buff, similar to Brace for Impact) plus one of the Following - Red Matter Capacitor, Rechargeable Shield Battery, Scorpion Fighters, or Shield batteries
Bridge Officer Skills (Advanced Escort) -
Commander Tactical: Tactical Team 1, Torpedo Spread 2, Canon Scatter Volley 2, Attack pattern Omega 3 (Omega will break Borg Tractor beams while Alpha and Beta will not)
Lt. Commander Tactical: Tactical Team 1, Torpedo Spread 2, Cannon Scatter Volley 2
Lt. Science: Transfer Shield Strength 1, Hazard Emitters 2 (these two are reversible if you wish)
Lt. Engineering: Emergency Power to Shields 1, Reverse Shield Polarity 1
Ensign Science: Tractor Beam
Bridge Officer Skills (MVAM Escort) -
Commander Tactical: Tactical Team 1, Torpedo Spread 2, Canon Scatter Volley 2, Attack pattern Omega 3
Lt. Tactical: Tactical Team 1, Canon Scatter Volley 1
Lt. Commander Science: Transfer Shield Strength 1, Hazard Emitters 2, Gravity Well 1
Lt. Engineering: Emergency Power to Shields 1, Reverse Shield Polarity 1
Ensign Tactical: Torpedo Spread 1
I routinely run almost all my ships with the Borg Assimilated Regenerative Shields without any problems. The reason they don't work well with the above set-up is because there is no Field Generator to boost their max shield level. Replace the Neutronium Armor with a Field Generator Mk XI to take full advantage of the Borg shield's high regen rate. Also, the last time I checked, resists are only effective with actual damage that hits the hull, namely bleed-through damage or unshielded direct hits. Since your shields take far more abuse than your hull, statistics favor reinforcing them first, then your hull next.
I run an MVAM with the following specs for elite space STF's:
-Weapons-
Fore: 3 Mk XI DHC's, 1 Mk XI quantum torpedo launcher
Aft: 2 Mk XI turrets, 1 chroniton mine launcher, quantum torpedo launcher, or tricobalt device launcher
Basically use Crowd Management mode for the initial combat phases. If you have trouble surviving, a Tank mode sci BO is available with multiple shield support skills to minimize system damage stats. Once you get to the elite tactical cubes, swap in Tykens1 + 2 to prevent 1-shot deaths of both yourself and your team mates.
I routinely run almost all my ships with the Borg Assimilated Regenerative Shields without any problems. The reason they don't work well with the above set-up is because there is no Field Generator to boost their max shield level. Replace the Neutronium Armor with a Field Generator Mk XI to take full advantage of the Borg shield's high regen rate. Also, the last time I checked, resists are only effective with actual damage that hits the hull, namely bleed-through damage or unshielded direct hits. Since your shields take far more abuse than your hull, statistics favor reinforcing them first, then your hull next.
Basically use Crowd Management mode for the initial combat phases. If you have trouble surviving, a Tank mode sci BO is available with multiple shield support skills to minimize system damage stats. Once you get to the elite tactical cubes, swap in Tykens1 + 2 to prevent 1-shot deaths of both yourself and your team mates.
Hope this helps...
I just ran a RA with the regen Borg shields... The "normal" cubes sucked away almost all the shield power (down to just a sliver on each facing), while after I switched back to the Aegis the shields were only taken down to ~50% in the same situation. The following weapons fire from the cubes was able to penetrate the shielding while using the Borg regen shield, while the Aegis shield was able to keep going just fine.
This game has been unbalanced with Cap vs. Regen shields since day 1, a higher cap is almost always better sadly...
As for the Field Generator console, I always run that on the non-sci builds. I'll test running that instead of the Neutronium with the MVAM/Advanced to see how well that works.
I'm interested in your use of Tykens Rift to fight the Tac Cube though. I didn't think energy levels had huge effects on torp fire from PVE opponents.
I just ran a RA with the regen Borg shields... The "normal" cubes sucked away almost all the shield power (down to just a sliver on each facing), while after I switched back to the Aegis the shields were only taken down to ~50% in the same situation. The following weapons fire from the cubes was able to penetrate the shielding while using the Borg regen shield, while the Aegis shield was able to keep going just fine.
This game has been unbalanced with Cap vs. Regen shields since day 1, a higher cap is almost always better sadly...
As for the Field Generator console, I always run that on the non-sci builds. I'll test running that instead of the Neutronium with the MVAM/Advanced to see how well that works.
I'm interested in your use of Tykens Rift to fight the Tac Cube though. I didn't think energy levels had huge effects on torp fire from PVE opponents.
Energy levels won't affect the torpedo fire but a Tyken's will cripple a Cube, it'll drain all the power from weapons, shields, engines and auxiliary leaving it all but defenceless. If there's even one competent Tac/ Escort in the instance then the Cube will be exploding in a few seconds. Without there shields the Cube's don't last long at all.
Torpedo spread is IIRC 85% of a High Yield for each target. That means even if you are hitting just TWO targets you are being more efficient with your damage output. Taking the time to target one without the spread fire abilities will slow you down quite a bit, which is why most people are using the spread abilities now.
And with STF's, probably 75% of the time you are able to take advantage of hitting multiple targets. Even hitting TWO of the transfer nodes at once (or regen probes in cure) can really help (if you get on top of one, like 1km away, you can be in range for another one too). Plus, all the other random spawns in the area can get hit by your weapons too (the Raptors in Cure, the Spheres in Khitomer Accord, etc.).
You WILL get a lot of agro with this method, which is why the builds I suggest are so defensively-orientated, because you WILL need to be able to take damage from multiple targets and survive. I tend not to rely on team mates to help keep me healed, but even if just one person is randomly giving you heals it will keep you alive in the Normal level STF's no problem.
As for Torpedo Spread 3... I left that out of the builds on purpose. If you are lucky enough to get that skill on a BO, sure go ahead and use it. But right now TS3 BO's are 20,000,000+ on the Exchange.
Well I just got a TS3 BO on the exchange for 13 million and fitted it all up as you suggested, then went for a run on infected space normal. Wow, impressive, I watched the spread hit a nanite sphere and take it down by about 30-40%, same spread hit a probe and totalled it, OK they were both also gratefully receiving a shed load of AP fire at the same time. The other thing you forgot to mention though is how freaking awesome it looks! Thanks again.
Energy levels won't affect the torpedo fire but a Tyken's will cripple a Cube, it'll drain all the power from weapons, shields, engines and auxiliary leaving it all but defenceless. If there's even one competent Tac/ Escort in the instance then the Cube will be exploding in a few seconds. Without there shields the Cube's don't last long at all.
Good to know. I'll test this out for sure.
Its sad though that its so difficult to swap bridge officers... I wish they skills they had would just pop into the hotbar instead of disappearing and you have to manually rummage through the skills to find the ones that are missing. :mad:
I just ran a RA with the regen Borg shields... The "normal" cubes sucked away almost all the shield power (down to just a sliver on each facing), while after I switched back to the Aegis the shields were only taken down to ~50% in the same situation. The following weapons fire from the cubes was able to penetrate the shielding while using the Borg regen shield, while the Aegis shield was able to keep going just fine.
This game has been unbalanced with Cap vs. Regen shields since day 1, a higher cap is almost always better sadly...
As for the Field Generator console, I always run that on the non-sci builds. I'll test running that instead of the Neutronium with the MVAM/Advanced to see how well that works.
I'm interested in your use of Tykens Rift to fight the Tac Cube though. I didn't think energy levels had huge effects on torp fire from PVE opponents.
Sorry, but your numbers aren't adding up. On my MVAM,
Borg Shields + Field Generator Mk XI = 7796 total shield energy
Aegis + Field Generator Mk XI = 10291.
7796 / 10291 = ~0.7575.
This means that the Aegis shields have only +24% more shields than the Borg set shields. If your Borg Shields are being completely drained by one Borg Shield Neutralizer, then your Aegis will come out with 24% or less capacity, and they will take much longer to recover. Were your tests done with or without a Field Generator?
As it stands now, I'll gladly trade 24% shield capacity for +108% extra shield regen rate, especially when taking sustained weapon fire. Also, TSS + EPTS + Borg Shields can outpace the Borg Shield Neutralizer depending on how much Aux power you run. However, the simplest solution is a quick Hazard Emitters 1.
No player ship can withstand an elite tactical cube's fully powered attacks without some kind of targeting disruption or energy drain. So long as your team runs the right skills, elite tactical cubes can be killed without players suffering multiple deaths.
Lastly, I don't recall ever being hit by Borg Shield Neutralizer in STF's...
This means that the Aegis shields have only +24% more shields than the Borg set shields. If your Borg Shields are being completely drained by one Borg Shield Neutralizer, then your Aegis will come out with 24% or less capacity, and they will take much longer to recover. Were your tests done with or without a Field Generator?
I'll check again, but I've been running around constantly swapping between the MACO, Aegis and Borg shields lately. I can't find any benefit of running the extra shield regeneration.
And yes they are current with field generators.
One thing to mention, if you have "less" total shields, then tactical team won't be able to re-route as effectively as it does with a high-cap shield. It takes all those extra shield points that aren't being used and throws them to where they need to be instantly, which means your high-cap shield won't drop to zero as a low-cap shield, even with a higher regen rate.
Lastly, I don't recall ever being hit by Borg Shield Neutralizer in STF's...
They were heavily nerfed in STF's (thank you Gozer!).
When they first came out for the Tribble testing, you would have to spend the whole time hull-tanking everything due to the fact your shields were constantly 100% drained! It was not fun.
I'll check again, but I've been running around constantly swapping between the MACO, Aegis and Borg shields lately. I can't find any benefit of running the extra shield regeneration.
...<SNIP>...
The nice part about running high regen shields is that you are not at the complete mercy of your shield cooldowns to maintain shield defenses. Two EPTS instances are usually enough to keep your escort combat-capable without any extended downtimes for shield recovery. I used to use Covariant shields exclusively. Once I started playing with the Borg Shields, especially in PVP, I never looked back.
PVP is a completely different story, and I make no claims to any of this as being PVP worthy.
I also make no claims as being a "hard-math" person, someone who spends their time reading and going through all the numbers in the game.
What this thread about above all else, is gameplay "technique" for Escorts in STF's. I'm sure there are numerically better approaches, and possibly setups you might enjoy yourselves, but this thread is indeed about pointing people in the right direction and helping players be more effective in general.
HOWEVER, I really do want to see as much feedback and as many different layouts as possible. I'd like to add some more "unorthodox" builds to the second post soon
Hey guys as I was saying earlier I run the Shield Emitter Amplifier (13% regeneration rate) as well as the Field Generator (35% capacity) with the borg shields try it. Using this combo with even a mid aux level makes your shields pop back up crazy fast. Try it
PVP is a completely different story, and I make no claims to any of this as being PVP worthy.
I also make no claims as being a "hard-math" person, someone who spends their time reading and going through all the numbers in the game.
What this thread about above all else, is gameplay "technique" for Escorts in STF's. I'm sure there are numerically better approaches, and possibly setups you might enjoy yourselves, but this thread is indeed about pointing people in the right direction and helping players be more effective in general.
HOWEVER, I really do want to see as much feedback and as many different layouts as possible. I'd like to add some more "unorthodox" builds to the second post soon
PVP is actually a great way to optimize your builds, especially for STF's. PVP serves as a crucible to burn away inefficient builds until you are left with only the best possibilities. It also teaches escort captains how to hit and run, using their superior mobility and firepower to burn down much more heavily shielded opponents without getting killed in the process.
With regards to STF's, choosing the right gear and BO-skills definitely makes a difference. If your escort only goes "pew-pew" and dies shortly afterwards, then its DPS will be far lower than an escort which keeps itself alive by doing more than just DPS. Yes, CSV and Torp-Spread are excellent choices, but they should be backed up with crowd control and damage mitigation to maximize STF completion odds, especially when PUG's are concerned.
I did some quick "hard math" on the 3 different shield types I'm testing.
Aegis - 118 regen, 10291 PER shield facing, 41164 total shield strength.
MACO MK XI - 152 regen, 9812 PER shield facing, 39248 total shield strength.
Borg - 246 regen, 7796 PER shield facing, 31184 total shield strength.
This shows why the Borg shields have a big issue... They have 10,000 LESS total shield output. This means while using Tactical team, you have 25% LESS total shields to spread across your shield facings.
This is why the Borg shields drop so fast!
I'll have to test out using a regen console with 2x epts to see how that works keeping the regen shields alive, but its obvious now looking at the math why the Borg shields haven't been holding up very well.
It also makes a STRONG case for using MK XI MACO shields. Not much less total shield output compared to the Aegis, and you get the extra resilient factor of absorbing 5% of the hits.
It also teaches escort captains how to hit and run.
Which is exactly what NOT to do during STF's, and one of the main reasons I made this thread.
If you can't survive a certain situation for sure, then yes think about running (a good example is if you are solo-ing half of KA, and that big group of Probes and Spheres spawns from the gate after the other gate is destroyed... Best to run, cause you won't survive until the rest of the team comes to help). But the purpose of this thread is to build an Escort that can hold fast and pump out the DPS, in order to quickly take out primary targets.
I did some quick "hard math" on the 3 different shield types I'm testing.
Aegis - 118 regen, 10291 PER shield facing, 41164 total shield strength.
MACO MK XI - 152 regen, 9812 PER shield facing, 39248 total shield strength.
Borg - 246 regen, 7796 PER shield facing, 31184 total shield strength.
This shows why the Borg shields have a big issue... They have 10,000 LESS total shield output. This means while using Tactical team, you have 25% LESS total shields to spread across your shield facings.
This is why the Borg shields drop so fast!
I'll have to test out using a regen console with 2x epts to see how that works keeping the regen shields alive, but its obvious now looking at the math why the Borg shields haven't been holding up very well.
It also makes a STRONG case for using MK XI MACO shields. Not much less total shield output compared to the Aegis, and you get the extra resilient factor of absorbing 5% of the hits.
Borg Shield Neutralizer is a flat shield drain per facing -- Tactical Team makes no difference whatsoever here. And no, Borg shields don't go down fast at all on my ship, so there must be more going on with your build than what was already mentioned.
I already mentioned that Borg shields are already known to have 24% less shield capacity in a prior post, so the above does not provide any new insight. However, they also have twice the recharge rate of Aegis Covariants across all 4 shield facings. Shields still recharge once every 6 seconds. Borg shields regenerate 984 shields accross all 4 facings per 6 seconds, or 164 shields / sec. Aegis recharge 478 / 6 sec, or 78.66 / sec. Factor in the Borg Shield regen procs, and the Borg shield wins in sustained combat. The only time the Aegis has an advantage is when your ship takes big damage via alpha strike. However, in elite STF's, ships take huge damage numbers in every fight, every second, thereby forcing the escort to constantly run away to recover more frequently. Elite Tactical Cubes do hit over 40k per shot at full power, so no shield will provide adequate protection as-is, even with tactical team up.
It also teaches escort captains how to hit and run.
Which is exactly what NOT to do during STF's, and one of the main reasons I made this thread.
If you can't survive a certain situation for sure, then yes think about running (a good example is if you are solo-ing half of KA, and that big group of Probes and Spheres spawns from the gate after the other gate is destroyed... Best to run, cause you won't survive until the rest of the team comes to help). But the purpose of this thread is to build an Escort that can hold fast and pump out the DPS, in order to quickly take out primary targets.
Stationary camp-and-pew-pew basically reduces your ship's defense to zero, thereby increasing the damage taken per hit. This is perfectly fine in normal STF's where things don't hit hard, but in elite, survival is required if you do not want damaged systems to pile up and ultimately cripple your ship's ability to finish the elite STF. I guess our different STF difficulty preferences explains our divergent tactics.
And no, Borg shields don't go down fast at all on my ship, so there must be more going on with your build than what was already mentioned.
Factor in the Borg Shield regen procs, and the Borg shield wins in sustained combat.
I did more testing with the Borg shield, Field Generator, and regen console. Also with the Emergancy Power to Shield 1 and 2.
It is indeed a VERY good setup, and I'm going to add it as a "regen" build.
I still have issues with big hull damage hits with this setups, and times when the EPtS's aren't able to hold up for short periods allowing the shields to drop.
My question is, what power levels are you running?
Stationary camp-and-pew-pew basically reduces your ship's defense to zero, thereby increasing the damage taken per hit. This is perfectly fine in normal STF's where things don't hit hard, but in elite, survival is required if you do not want damaged systems to pile up and ultimately cripple your ship's ability to finish the elite STF. I guess our different STF difficulty preferences explains our divergent tactics.
You don't have to be 100% stopped to point and pew. Even going reverse gives you the "accuracy" defense bonus.
However, that is just an accuracy defense bonus, not an actual resist bonus. So moving wont save you from the huge torpedo hits.
And yes, I do run Elites, mostly Infected space due to the failure possibility on the other two. I've also completed KA with the secondary a few times with specifc skilled groups of people rather than pug groups. I don't have any defensive concerns with my current build minus the tactical cube of course.
I did more testing with the Borg shield, Field Generator, and regen console. Also with the Emergancy Power to Shield 1 and 2.
It is indeed a VERY good setup, and I'm going to add it as a "regen" build.
I still have issues with big hull damage hits with this setups, and times when the EPtS's aren't able to hold up for short periods allowing the shields to drop.
My question is, what power levels are you running?
The twin EPtS set-up usually works well in both PVP and PVE. I usually minimize big alpha-strike damage by maintaining 70+ defense at all times.
I typically run the following power-levels in attack mode:
Weapons - 125 / 100
Shields - 57 / 35
Impulse - 57 / 35
Aux - 51 / 30
When employing Aux-based abilities, I'll divert power to Aux with these settings:
Weapons - 63 / 25
Shields - 57 / 35
Impulse - 61 / 40
Aux - 113 / 100
I flip frequently between power-settings depending on what I need at the time.
You don't have to be 100% stopped to point and pew. Even going reverse gives you the "accuracy" defense bonus.
However, that is just an accuracy defense bonus, not an actual resist bonus. So moving wont save you from the huge torpedo hits.
And yes, I do run Elites, mostly Infected space due to the failure possibility on the other two. I've also completed KA with the secondary a few times with specifc skilled groups of people rather than pug groups. I don't have any defensive concerns with my current build minus the tactical cube of course.
I run my ship at 26+ impulse speed at all times -- this is the sweet spot for maintaining 70+ defense rating. The slower you go, the lower your defense drops, and the greater the damage you take per hit. I also use Brace-For-Impact very often because of how well it cuts down enemy torpedo damage. Transfer Shield Strength also helps out a a lot, though Tractor-Repulsors are frequently swapped in when nanite spheres get too close.
I run my ship at 26+ impulse speed at all times -- this is the sweet spot for maintaining 70+ defense rating. The slower you go, the lower your defense drops, and the greater the damage you take per hit.
Small question, if you are flying around so quickly I presume you aren't the primary damage dealer in your STF?
The massive downside of constant high speed movement and turning means you constantly leave the 2km sweet spot for Canon damage as well as leaving the 45 degree firing arc...
So the defensive bonus's for moving are offset by the offensive bonus's for staying put, meaning that a target you aren't raining down pain with 100% of your damage is going to stay alive longer, meaning you have to defend against it longer (and also takes longer for the STF to complete).
Small question, if you are flying around so quickly I presume you aren't the primary damage dealer in your STF?
The massive downside of constant high speed movement and turning means you constantly leave the 2km sweet spot for Canon damage as well as leaving the 45 degree firing arc...
So the defensive bonus's for moving are offset by the offensive bonus's for staying put, meaning that a target you aren't raining down pain with 100% of your damage is going to stay alive longer, meaning you have to defend against it longer (and also takes longer for the STF to complete).
My ship routinely grabs tac cube agro and lives through its onslaught, so that's a pretty big indicator about its relative damage output. The key to maximizing damage output is knowing when to go full auto without dying. Regarding exact numbers, there are no built-in stats-tracking for STF's yet, so your guess is as good as mine.
The escort's forward speed is only necessary until the elite tac-cube's energy levels are neutralized. After that, it's perfectly fine to engage it from a stationary point-blank position since its attacks will no longer 1-shot-kill you at that point. However, escorts are at the mercy of their team's damage mitigation builds if they bring none of their own. I routinely bring such skills to the table, and as a result, I can finish elite STF's without having to zerg-rush the cube.
I did more testing with the Borg shield, Field Generator, and regen console. Also with the Emergancy Power to Shield 1 and 2.
It is indeed a VERY good setup, and I'm going to add it as a "regen" build.
I was wondering if any one could see my post little alone was reading my posts. This setup also makes the beat use of shield recharges: battery's, science team, ttss, any thing else that add shields also helps with tact team because the time it takes to distribute shield is dependent on regeneration rate.
I typically run the following power-levels in attack mode:
Weapons - 125 / 100
Shields - 57 / 35
Impulse - 57 / 35
Aux - 51 / 30
How are you getting these numbers, what skills are you specked in?
I don't know if you remember one of my earlier posts, but if you have it the automated defence battery the one that's a tac console that is a 360 plasma turret does 45 damage it'll take care of most of those high yield plasma torpedoes.
Comments
I wouldnt know why you would not recommend this shield. 15% plasma resist, and the highest shield regen around. using 2 Emergency power to shields on a rotation has the highest shield uptime against borg. Its always been the best shield against borg. there is no real burst anyway so no problem if the capacity is somewhat lower.
Especially with the drains of the borg (Shield neutralizers) its even more valuable and Covariants have no real purpose here imo.
For the offensive;
Loads of hull debuffs, Beta etc. on Elite, since they have way more hull hitpoints.
Otherwise i would use omega to get loose of tractor beams.
What about the Omega Shield with 3 borg pieces?
The omega shield has over 1000 more shield hitpoints (at Mk XII) and only 5% less Plasma resist, and only 30 less shield regen points per 6 seconds.
You don't get the +5 to shields, but you do get the speed (escape) boost from Energy DMG.
You do still get the Borg set powers, except Tractor beam... which with it's recharge time makes that a negligible loss, IMO.
To qualify, I'm not saying it's better, just curious about people's thoughts on that setup vs. all borg set-up.
But to touch on the overall problem with these new sets: they are not THAT much better than the borg set. Especially when you consider how much more TIME is spent acquiring them. 15 STFs and 1 Story mission gets you the full Borg Set. It takes 60 STFs (without any luck Chip drops or Tech drops) to get the basic Mk X new set stuff.
It's clear that these news sets need love to make them better than he borg set, which I think is supposed to be the point. Right? The story fluf talks about how hard this gear is to make, only given out to proven captains, and is specifically designed for fighting Borg. OR, you can have this old stuff that's technically more effective in a lot of ways. O_o
But I would contemplate running it with two lt. science and see what I could do with that. Maybe 2x transfer shield strengths, or 2x hazard emitters, or an extra tractor beam. Although you loose the 2nd engineering skill which is a pain. Beta also has a shorter duration de-buff, so its a bit of a wash.
But honestly, if you find using a commander level cannon skill and a lt. commander attack pattern skill better, thats perfectly fine. I tried to leave the rare BO skills out of this build in order for the less experience folks (with less energy credits to spare) to be able to put something together easier. I find the regen shields no mattter how good they are, go down fast and you take huge hits to your hull. As an escort, thats bad news! So I tend not to recommend it.
If you find it works better in your own experience, thats fine. Shields are the least important thing really out of the rest of the set, the important thing is to get the 3x borg pieces so you get the random shield/hull heals! The fact that you can get them in MK XII trim is really the thing that makes them "better".
What you must not do is equip is equip your escort with beams. I've seen escorts in Elite STF missions, fly about firing soley beams and the odd quantum torp. Suffice to say they did virtually nothing to the target and against a shielded one even less.
When it comes to STF it's time to get serious about your build, no room for warm "it's Trek" or "but I like it" builds.
One point, someone said TS is now more powerful than HY, is that TS3 v HY3? Wouldn't the damage be shared across multiple targets with TS which then just agro every bit of Borg kit to come and get you, wouldn't it be better to slaughter them one at a time really quickly and move on to the next rather than try to damage many targets in a longer time and have them all reap their revenge on you?
Oh man that is so wrong, what's the point? Beams are for cruisers, cannons all the way for escorts, totally agree.
And with STF's, probably 75% of the time you are able to take advantage of hitting multiple targets. Even hitting TWO of the transfer nodes at once (or regen probes in cure) can really help (if you get on top of one, like 1km away, you can be in range for another one too). Plus, all the other random spawns in the area can get hit by your weapons too (the Raptors in Cure, the Spheres in Khitomer Accord, etc.).
You WILL get a lot of agro with this method, which is why the builds I suggest are so defensively-orientated, because you WILL need to be able to take damage from multiple targets and survive. I tend not to rely on team mates to help keep me healed, but even if just one person is randomly giving you heals it will keep you alive in the Normal level STF's no problem.
As for Torpedo Spread 3... I left that out of the builds on purpose. If you are lucky enough to get that skill on a BO, sure go ahead and use it. But right now TS3 BO's are 20,000,000+ on the Exchange.
Wow, thanks a lot for the great advice, I'll go change my setup right now, may even get the TS3 BO if I like it.
This guide is wonderful, though what I did for the MVAE was had one Tac Boff with CRF I, and the other one with CSV I.
But my setup is just like the OP's example of the MVAE except 1 CSV to CRF.
Thank you for the help with the build and for posting this guide (especially for a noob like me).
If you are tac officer you have the "faster BO recharge" ability, which will make the canon skills global cooldown irrelevant, allowing you to re-use one or the other for little while instead of switching.
I routinely run almost all my ships with the Borg Assimilated Regenerative Shields without any problems. The reason they don't work well with the above set-up is because there is no Field Generator to boost their max shield level. Replace the Neutronium Armor with a Field Generator Mk XI to take full advantage of the Borg shield's high regen rate. Also, the last time I checked, resists are only effective with actual damage that hits the hull, namely bleed-through damage or unshielded direct hits. Since your shields take far more abuse than your hull, statistics favor reinforcing them first, then your hull next.
I run an MVAM with the following specs for elite space STF's:
-Weapons-
Fore: 3 Mk XI DHC's, 1 Mk XI quantum torpedo launcher
Aft: 2 Mk XI turrets, 1 chroniton mine launcher, quantum torpedo launcher, or tricobalt device launcher
Equipment: Omega Shields + Omega Deflector (for tetryon proc damage), Borg Engines
Consoles:
EPS Flow Regulator Mk XI, Field Generator Mk XI
Borg Assimilated Console, Point Defense System
4x +26% damage consoles
-Bridge Officer Skills-
Cmdr-Tactical: Tactical Team 1, CSV1, CSV2, AP-Omega3
Lt-Tactical: Torpedo Spread 1, Torp-Spread2
Lt.Cmdr-Sci:
--Crowd Management BO: Hazard Emitters 1, Transfer Shield Strength 2, Tractor Beam Repulsors 2
--Tactical Cube Management BO: Hazard Emitters 1, Tykens Rift 1, Tyken's Rift2
--Tank Mode BO: Hazard Emitters 1, Transfer Shield Strength 2, Transfer Shield Strength 3
Lt-Engineer: EPTS-1, EPTS2
Ensign Tactical: Tactical Team 1
Basically use Crowd Management mode for the initial combat phases. If you have trouble surviving, a Tank mode sci BO is available with multiple shield support skills to minimize system damage stats. Once you get to the elite tactical cubes, swap in Tykens1 + 2 to prevent 1-shot deaths of both yourself and your team mates.
Hope this helps...
This game has been unbalanced with Cap vs. Regen shields since day 1, a higher cap is almost always better sadly...
As for the Field Generator console, I always run that on the non-sci builds. I'll test running that instead of the Neutronium with the MVAM/Advanced to see how well that works.
I'm interested in your use of Tykens Rift to fight the Tac Cube though. I didn't think energy levels had huge effects on torp fire from PVE opponents.
Energy levels won't affect the torpedo fire but a Tyken's will cripple a Cube, it'll drain all the power from weapons, shields, engines and auxiliary leaving it all but defenceless. If there's even one competent Tac/ Escort in the instance then the Cube will be exploding in a few seconds. Without there shields the Cube's don't last long at all.
Well I just got a TS3 BO on the exchange for 13 million and fitted it all up as you suggested, then went for a run on infected space normal. Wow, impressive, I watched the spread hit a nanite sphere and take it down by about 30-40%, same spread hit a probe and totalled it, OK they were both also gratefully receiving a shed load of AP fire at the same time. The other thing you forgot to mention though is how freaking awesome it looks! Thanks again.
Its sad though that its so difficult to swap bridge officers... I wish they skills they had would just pop into the hotbar instead of disappearing and you have to manually rummage through the skills to find the ones that are missing. :mad:
Sorry, but your numbers aren't adding up. On my MVAM,
Borg Shields + Field Generator Mk XI = 7796 total shield energy
Aegis + Field Generator Mk XI = 10291.
7796 / 10291 = ~0.7575.
This means that the Aegis shields have only +24% more shields than the Borg set shields. If your Borg Shields are being completely drained by one Borg Shield Neutralizer, then your Aegis will come out with 24% or less capacity, and they will take much longer to recover. Were your tests done with or without a Field Generator?
As it stands now, I'll gladly trade 24% shield capacity for +108% extra shield regen rate, especially when taking sustained weapon fire. Also, TSS + EPTS + Borg Shields can outpace the Borg Shield Neutralizer depending on how much Aux power you run. However, the simplest solution is a quick Hazard Emitters 1.
No player ship can withstand an elite tactical cube's fully powered attacks without some kind of targeting disruption or energy drain. So long as your team runs the right skills, elite tactical cubes can be killed without players suffering multiple deaths.
Lastly, I don't recall ever being hit by Borg Shield Neutralizer in STF's...
And yes they are current with field generators.
One thing to mention, if you have "less" total shields, then tactical team won't be able to re-route as effectively as it does with a high-cap shield. It takes all those extra shield points that aren't being used and throws them to where they need to be instantly, which means your high-cap shield won't drop to zero as a low-cap shield, even with a higher regen rate. They were heavily nerfed in STF's (thank you Gozer!).
When they first came out for the Tribble testing, you would have to spend the whole time hull-tanking everything due to the fact your shields were constantly 100% drained! It was not fun.
The nice part about running high regen shields is that you are not at the complete mercy of your shield cooldowns to maintain shield defenses. Two EPTS instances are usually enough to keep your escort combat-capable without any extended downtimes for shield recovery. I used to use Covariant shields exclusively. Once I started playing with the Borg Shields, especially in PVP, I never looked back.
I also make no claims as being a "hard-math" person, someone who spends their time reading and going through all the numbers in the game.
What this thread about above all else, is gameplay "technique" for Escorts in STF's. I'm sure there are numerically better approaches, and possibly setups you might enjoy yourselves, but this thread is indeed about pointing people in the right direction and helping players be more effective in general.
HOWEVER, I really do want to see as much feedback and as many different layouts as possible. I'd like to add some more "unorthodox" builds to the second post soon
PVP is actually a great way to optimize your builds, especially for STF's. PVP serves as a crucible to burn away inefficient builds until you are left with only the best possibilities. It also teaches escort captains how to hit and run, using their superior mobility and firepower to burn down much more heavily shielded opponents without getting killed in the process.
With regards to STF's, choosing the right gear and BO-skills definitely makes a difference. If your escort only goes "pew-pew" and dies shortly afterwards, then its DPS will be far lower than an escort which keeps itself alive by doing more than just DPS. Yes, CSV and Torp-Spread are excellent choices, but they should be backed up with crowd control and damage mitigation to maximize STF completion odds, especially when PUG's are concerned.
Aegis - 118 regen, 10291 PER shield facing, 41164 total shield strength.
MACO MK XI - 152 regen, 9812 PER shield facing, 39248 total shield strength.
Borg - 246 regen, 7796 PER shield facing, 31184 total shield strength.
This shows why the Borg shields have a big issue... They have 10,000 LESS total shield output. This means while using Tactical team, you have 25% LESS total shields to spread across your shield facings.
This is why the Borg shields drop so fast!
I'll have to test out using a regen console with 2x epts to see how that works keeping the regen shields alive, but its obvious now looking at the math why the Borg shields haven't been holding up very well.
It also makes a STRONG case for using MK XI MACO shields. Not much less total shield output compared to the Aegis, and you get the extra resilient factor of absorbing 5% of the hits. Which is exactly what NOT to do during STF's, and one of the main reasons I made this thread.
If you can't survive a certain situation for sure, then yes think about running (a good example is if you are solo-ing half of KA, and that big group of Probes and Spheres spawns from the gate after the other gate is destroyed... Best to run, cause you won't survive until the rest of the team comes to help). But the purpose of this thread is to build an Escort that can hold fast and pump out the DPS, in order to quickly take out primary targets.
Borg Shield Neutralizer is a flat shield drain per facing -- Tactical Team makes no difference whatsoever here. And no, Borg shields don't go down fast at all on my ship, so there must be more going on with your build than what was already mentioned.
I already mentioned that Borg shields are already known to have 24% less shield capacity in a prior post, so the above does not provide any new insight. However, they also have twice the recharge rate of Aegis Covariants across all 4 shield facings. Shields still recharge once every 6 seconds. Borg shields regenerate 984 shields accross all 4 facings per 6 seconds, or 164 shields / sec. Aegis recharge 478 / 6 sec, or 78.66 / sec. Factor in the Borg Shield regen procs, and the Borg shield wins in sustained combat. The only time the Aegis has an advantage is when your ship takes big damage via alpha strike. However, in elite STF's, ships take huge damage numbers in every fight, every second, thereby forcing the escort to constantly run away to recover more frequently. Elite Tactical Cubes do hit over 40k per shot at full power, so no shield will provide adequate protection as-is, even with tactical team up.
Stationary camp-and-pew-pew basically reduces your ship's defense to zero, thereby increasing the damage taken per hit. This is perfectly fine in normal STF's where things don't hit hard, but in elite, survival is required if you do not want damaged systems to pile up and ultimately cripple your ship's ability to finish the elite STF. I guess our different STF difficulty preferences explains our divergent tactics.
It is indeed a VERY good setup, and I'm going to add it as a "regen" build.
I still have issues with big hull damage hits with this setups, and times when the EPtS's aren't able to hold up for short periods allowing the shields to drop.
My question is, what power levels are you running? You don't have to be 100% stopped to point and pew. Even going reverse gives you the "accuracy" defense bonus.
However, that is just an accuracy defense bonus, not an actual resist bonus. So moving wont save you from the huge torpedo hits.
And yes, I do run Elites, mostly Infected space due to the failure possibility on the other two. I've also completed KA with the secondary a few times with specifc skilled groups of people rather than pug groups. I don't have any defensive concerns with my current build minus the tactical cube of course.
The twin EPtS set-up usually works well in both PVP and PVE. I usually minimize big alpha-strike damage by maintaining 70+ defense at all times.
I typically run the following power-levels in attack mode:
Weapons - 125 / 100
Shields - 57 / 35
Impulse - 57 / 35
Aux - 51 / 30
When employing Aux-based abilities, I'll divert power to Aux with these settings:
Weapons - 63 / 25
Shields - 57 / 35
Impulse - 61 / 40
Aux - 113 / 100
I flip frequently between power-settings depending on what I need at the time.
I run my ship at 26+ impulse speed at all times -- this is the sweet spot for maintaining 70+ defense rating. The slower you go, the lower your defense drops, and the greater the damage you take per hit. I also use Brace-For-Impact very often because of how well it cuts down enemy torpedo damage. Transfer Shield Strength also helps out a a lot, though Tractor-Repulsors are frequently swapped in when nanite spheres get too close.
The massive downside of constant high speed movement and turning means you constantly leave the 2km sweet spot for Canon damage as well as leaving the 45 degree firing arc...
So the defensive bonus's for moving are offset by the offensive bonus's for staying put, meaning that a target you aren't raining down pain with 100% of your damage is going to stay alive longer, meaning you have to defend against it longer (and also takes longer for the STF to complete).
My ship routinely grabs tac cube agro and lives through its onslaught, so that's a pretty big indicator about its relative damage output. The key to maximizing damage output is knowing when to go full auto without dying. Regarding exact numbers, there are no built-in stats-tracking for STF's yet, so your guess is as good as mine.
The escort's forward speed is only necessary until the elite tac-cube's energy levels are neutralized. After that, it's perfectly fine to engage it from a stationary point-blank position since its attacks will no longer 1-shot-kill you at that point. However, escorts are at the mercy of their team's damage mitigation builds if they bring none of their own. I routinely bring such skills to the table, and as a result, I can finish elite STF's without having to zerg-rush the cube.
I was wondering if any one could see my post little alone was reading my posts. This setup also makes the beat use of shield recharges: battery's, science team, ttss, any thing else that add shields also helps with tact team because the time it takes to distribute shield is dependent on regeneration rate.
How are you getting these numbers, what skills are you specked in?
I don't know if you remember one of my earlier posts, but if you have it the automated defence battery the one that's a tac console that is a 360 plasma turret does 45 damage it'll take care of most of those high yield plasma torpedoes.