PWI PvP Tournament [Now with sign-up dates in red]

opkossy · May 2014

@Entire post above:

sparkiesoft wrote: »

Okay so based off feedback, here are some projected changes. Keep in mind that these can and probably will change.

Getting everyone in the same gear and on a brand new server for this event is not possible. We don't have the tools and we're more than likely not going to get support from China anyways.

So now that's out of the way, here are some changes.

- Everything goes, charms, pots, etc.

- It goes from being 1 v 1 duels, to 5 v 5 (Maybe 3 v3, what do you think?) straight pvp.

- You have to create your own teams. There will also be a set limit of 2 of each class per team. (IE, no more than 2 clerics, sins, barbs, etc.)

-If we do it this way, the grand prize still remains, which means the winning team would have to split it with each individual.

- There is a 10 minute timer, instead of 5 (Maybe 15).

Thoughts, opinions?

Also, we may push this event back towards the end of June to allow more prep time.

Edit: We would also highly suggest the use of 3rd party communication software, such as Teamspeak, Vent, Skype, or Mumble. This will allow you to coordinate with your team easier.

Free Communication Software

Skype: http://www.skype.com/en/
Mumble: http://www.mumble.com/get-mumble.php

Paid

Teamspeak: http://www.teamspeak3.com/
Ventrillo: http://www.instantventrilo.com/

b:chuckle

Toraah - Archosaur · May 2014

Jarkhen - Archosaur wrote: »

Short of equalizing things that way, the best option at this point in my opinion is a straight 10v10, no restrictions:

Charms may be used.
Apoth may be used.
Genie may be used.
Defense charms may be used.
Gear may be swapped mid-fight.
If you die, you're out -- no resurrection from mystic buff or cleric.

20 minute timer. As before, milking the timer (e.g. by sitting in stealth) results in a disqualification. I would wait until the end of a fight before making a timer disqualification, because sometimes it's hard to tell the difference between that and waiting for cds. Non-stealth timer camping shouldn't much of an issue with a group pk format.

I really think Sparkie should take this into serious consideration. As mentioned, a 10v10 format allows for squads with successful teamwork having a chance against a squad of +12 jaded players, instead of being rolled by 3 or 5 top geared players.

I do think that the limit of 2 per class should still apply if this was the case.

Annalyse - Heavens Tear · May 2014

OPKossy wrote: »

@Entire post above:

b:chuckle

Sparkie really should just edit the first post whenever he makes changes though, because most people read the first post and then don't want to wade through 19 pages, so they reply based on what they read.

Azura - Lost City · May 2014

I think 5vs5 is better so we can have more teams competing.

Also I agree with the no resurrection rule. If someone dies, then you can't come back.

Jarkhen - Archosaur · May 2014

Azura - Lost City wrote: »

I think 5vs5 is better so we can have more teams competing.

Also I agree with the no resurrection rule. If someone dies, then you can't come back.

The problem with smaller group sizes is that it becomes more and more difficult to overcome e.g. a fully jaded squad. With 10v10 you have a lot more opportunity for significant focused fire to take down people who outgear you.

opkossy · May 2014

Annalyse - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Sparkie really should just edit the first post whenever he makes changes though, because most people read the first post and then don't want to wade through 19 pages, so they reply based on what they read.

This is a rather good point.

So I'll just have that bit pasted in for now til he adds more.

Ahira - Lost City · May 2014

random squads is the silliest idea i ever heard!

10v10 would be nice but i dont think we'd get as many teams so it would be less interesting. I would prefer the 5v5 rainbow squad format.

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands · May 2014

5v5 or 10v10 I still suggest rainbow squad (different class) for more diversity.

Azura - Lost City · May 2014

XX_Raider_Xx - Sanctuary wrote: »

5 v 5 is most realistic

- allows for "rainbow buffs" for 1 of each class

- still think limiting kiting, no stealth, and nerf aps to 3.0 max (sparked) are good "balancers"

- everything else seems cool

- NO NEEDING GUARDIAN SCROLLS - no loss of exp, gears, etc.

- really gonna have to fine tune "tiers" or brackets because I can stand pretty well against a similarly geared classes but no one carrying a +12 r999 weapon BUT a damn sin or other class with R999 +12 wep in g12-15 gears pops and ganks me it really b:angry so yeah i think perhaps setting up tiers or brackets needs to consider "overall refines" or soulforce in determining where a g12-16 with R999 +12 wep goes

I just feel a huge fail is going to happen and it will favor the cash shoppers and +10, +11, +12

Please don't limit aps. The higher the aps, the better. b:chuckle

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands · May 2014

Azura - Lost City wrote: »

Please don't limit aps. The higher the aps, the better. b:chuckle

Speaking of APS, I think they should make it in a place where bramble work.

XX_Raider_Xx - Sanctuary · May 2014

sounds like another boring pk event that favors the op and unbalance of the game that i wont be wasting my time with - oh well

opkossy · May 2014

XX_Raider_Xx - Sanctuary wrote: »

if bramble is used then allow weapon changes during combat so I can use purge weapon

b:victory

aps requires no skill and if this is about skill vs skill not just who has the biggest "gear" then nerfing aps even to 3.0 shouldn't be a issue. Especially for a class that can perma spark like no other classes can.

everyone QQd about aps nerfing including me but i find aps to be pointless now except in PVE.

Lol... why are you asking to have APS nerfed when it's not relevant in the gear bracket discussed here? And have you already forgotten that sparkie said he doesn't have tools to modify things like that?

Frankly, I'll be happy if people are stupid enough to APS in this because it'll give casters fun times with purify and help barbs out too. And if bramble's enabled wherever this takes place then even more lulz shall be had.

Verenor - Morai · May 2014

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands wrote: »

Speaking of APS, I think they should make it in a place where bramble work.

Will you ever drop that...b:worried use blazing barrier, it's a skill solely designed to be for PvP.

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands · May 2014

Verenor - Morai wrote: »

Will you ever drop that...b:worried

You speak like I asked 100 times, loll... it's the first and only time I spoke about it. xD

Eoria - Harshlands · May 2014

Verenor - Morai wrote: »

Will you ever drop that...b:worried use blazing barrier, it's a skill solely designed to be for PvP.

It'll most likely be held in the same space used for Theater of Blood anyway and everything works there. You just don't drop anything upon death.

Ulquiorraa__ - Raging Tide · June 2014

Man - Raging Tide wrote: »

Please do not allow buff Apothecary.

Namely Spirit of assault, Spirit of defense, Blinking Poultice, and Shining Pill.

Please do not allowed Purge weapons except for archers @ Man .

/being sarcastic .

Longknife - Harshlands · June 2014

Annalyse - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Sparkie really should just edit the first post whenever he makes changes though, because most people read the first post and then don't want to wade through 19 pages, so they reply based on what they read.

I missed it because it was in the quote box. Literally read everything but that and then was surprised to see it was actually in the first post.

Ahira - Lost City wrote: »

random squads is the silliest idea i ever heard!

To be honest? Random sounds fun as ****.

Let's be honest here: some people are simply better at playing this game than others. Certain teams are gonna smash the competition and there'll be limited -actual- competition where it's a toss-up which side will win. Randomized teams would negate this and make it all pretty interesting to see who can adapt with who and make it work.

I get some people will have their egos all bruised cause "omg I lost cuz random team" but personally I think it's more interesting than "Teams A, B and C will curbstomp teams D through Z and then team A will probably win."

10 vs. 10 also sounds good. Higher numbers = less stress on gear. 10 is just enough to fill one squad that can then communicate and cooperate. 5v5 the geared squads are gonna shine, 20v20 or so things can start to get messy on communication to the point where gear begins to shine again. Honestly, just take a hit on the prize, raise it to 500 gold thus making it 50 gold per squad member for 10v10's.

opkossy · June 2014

Longknife - Harshlands wrote: »

I missed it because it was in the quote box. Literally read everything but that and then was surprised to see it was actually in the first post.

Nah. I edited it in after. The quote box was posted a few pages after the initial and after Anne raised that point I figured it'd be a good idea to put it in.

Jarkhen - Archosaur · June 2014

Longknife - Harshlands wrote: »

10 vs. 10 also sounds good. Higher numbers = less stress on gear. 10 is just enough to fill one squad that can then communicate and cooperate. 5v5 the geared squads are gonna shine, 20v20 or so things can start to get messy on communication to the point where gear begins to shine again. Honestly, just take a hit on the prize, raise it to 500 gold thus making it 50 gold per squad member for 10v10's.

20v20 wouldn't be very viable anyway, since squad sizes are limited to 10.

Marengo - Lost City · June 2014

Ahira - Lost City wrote: »

random squads is the silliest idea i ever heard!

I suggested random squads because we have non random pvp almost daily xD
And my first suggestion was not even random, but 1 by1 picking teammates. In this case team leader should think twice whom he want in his squad keeping in mind he can lose another good player because his opponent may grab whom he wanted as a next step b:chuckle
+ not every pvper will show up anyway, some will have to work because of time difference or unexpected internet problems (and replacement is not always possible). I don't see a big difference whether ppl complain they messed up because of randomness of squads or other issues they didn't foresee lol

Socqar - Lost City · June 2014

Marengo - Lost City wrote: »

I suggested random squads because we have non random pvp almost daily xD
And my first suggestion was not even random, but 1 by1 picking teammates. In this case team leader should think twice whom he want in his squad keeping in mind he can lose another good player because his opponent may grab whom he wanted as a next step b:chuckle
+ not every pvper will show up anyway, some will have to work because of time difference or unexpected internet problems (and replacement is not always possible). I don't see a big difference whether ppl complain they messed up because of randomness of squads or other issues they didn't foresee lol

Problem is you may end up squading people who hates you

Would be weird tho to squad those annoying Stalkers instead of fighting them... And perhaps, as you say, different and funny.

I do like the idea tbh

Marengo - Lost City · June 2014

Socqar, it's same on nw, you have to assist enemies and fight against your friends and guildies sometimes. I don't think this may cause any serious trouble (except some extra efforts to clear blacklist b:laugh). Besides, there are people from other guilds who have enough skills but don't have enough strong friends to make a squad which can oppose best geared 10 ppl squad. Such flexible distribution would give them chance

Azura - Lost City · June 2014

Marengo - Lost City wrote: »

Socqar, it's same on nw, you have to assist enemies and fight against your friends and guildies sometimes. I don't think this may cause any serious trouble (except some extra efforts to clear blacklist b:laugh). Besides, there are people from other guilds who have enough skills but don't have enough strong friends to make a squad which can oppose best geared 10 ppl squad. Such flexible distribution would give them chance

That's because you get assigned with them. If you could kill your own allies in NW, I would do it ;o

LostPoet - Dreamweaver · June 2014

Hey Sparkie,

When you group PvP and not duals, it can be fun and all good. but there are some people on each server probably that are insanely geared. I know, there are about 3-5 people that out gear everyone on the entire server by a lot. With full nation wars gears, with JoSD / Diety, +12, cards re birthed already or lvl 80 and close to a 4 or 6 card set. When you said before that you would balance by gear and levels and so those players would be in a class of their own.

But, if you categorize R9-3rd +10, and 1 NW gear with them, or close or w/e the balance is broken. NO matter what you or anyone says. Players who want to throw money at the game in very large amounts significantly outgear players making them essentially invincible. (which they should be as they are paying for it. I'm not complaining here about cashers. Just saying there exists no endgame balance.)

b:surrender
PWI is broken on balance; not class balance, but time + cash. If you want to create a fair PvP event, set rules for what gear you can use.

Gear:
Its a PvP event. NOT A GvG(gear vs gear) event. Have all players get generic gears that everyone can obtain pretty easily putting players on the same level gear wise. TW, NW, Theater of Blood, the PvP tournament event thing, all are PvP things that allow people whatever gear they have / can afford. So why not make an event that's based on Skill?
Other games allow people to PvP in max gear. They can customize to a point, but everyone gets the max gear available for free for the PvP specific things. Creating balance. Why can't PWI do something similar?

TT90 Armor (Green or gold) No Refines
TT90 Ornaments (Green or gold) No Refines
Tome (Level 1 or 2) So easily obtainable by anyone
TT90 Cape or just No Cape
Rings (You can give out some generic rings which can be a participation prize)
No Cards

Tiering:
Can tier with Mirage sky / Arcane Sky lvl
Also using rebirth levels

Tier 1: Mirage sky 10 & 104,104,103 or Higher
Tier 2: Mirage sky 10 & 101,102,103 or Higher
Tier 3: Mirage sky 10 & 100,100,100 or Higher
Tier 4: Arcane sky 10 & 104,104 or Higher
Tier 5: Arcane sky 10 & 101,103 or Higher
Tier 6: Arcane sky 10 & 100,100 or Higher

Contest:
Doesn't matter now, but people have to form up their sqds.

1v1
3v3
5v5

What you think? Sparkie? Mods? Players?

A PvP event with equal gears can actually give under geared, people a fighting chance to show true skill. This can also allow players who do have great skill and potential that they are better than the OP cashers or players who've been in this game for 6 years who simply out gear people for being here so long.

b:victory

It will create an even playing field and new players can see what they have to learn from veterans, or (not to be rude here) allow players to shutup cocky players who talk behind they insane gears.b:shutup

hiitsmeguys · June 2014

So many complaints about people out gearing each other from people who pretend they're the real pros, yet are just trapped in poor gear.

Let me tell you something about the mmo genre, about 80% of your time playing the game is put towards gearing up, it's fairly consistent in most mmo's, more so those that have reached endgame.

A true pro mmo'er is unlike other gamers, the pro mmo'er can go into any f2p mmo and attain max endgame gears, game knowledge, understanding of skills and opponents within a relatively short time. This can all be done without spending a single dime on any f2p mmo.

It's ridiculous the people who sit around complaining about their lame gears due to their laziness, poor money and time management and general lack of knowledge.

I can assure you that many of the top geared players on multiple f2p mmo's have never spent money on their game. The lame casher excuse is getting old and used by people who are unable to see the big picture and unaware of the possibility to attain things without cashing.

If you want equal gear, go play a MOBA. If you want to work hard, achieve goals, build towards something in the future play an MMO. A pro mmo'er doesn't care who cashes and who doesn't.

I guess what i'm saying is, a lot of this game is based around gearing up. Not allowing people to use the gear they've attained would be absurd.

LostPoet - Dreamweaver · June 2014

hiitsmeguys wrote: »

So many complaints about people out gearing each other from people who pretend they're the real pros, yet are just trapped in poor gear.

Let me tell you something about the mmo genre, about 80% of your time playing the game is put towards gearing up, it's fairly consistent in most mmo's, more so those that have reached endgame.

A true pro mmo'er is unlike other gamers, the pro mmo'er can go into any f2p mmo and attain max endgame gears, game knowledge, understanding of skills and opponents within a relatively short time. This can all be done without spending a single dime on any f2p mmo.

It's ridiculous the people who sit around complaining about their lame gears due to their laziness, poor money and time management and general lack of knowledge.

I can assure you that many of the top geared players on multiple f2p mmo's have never spent money on their game. The lame casher excuse is getting old and used by people who are unable to see the big picture and unaware of the possibility to attain things without cashing.

If you want equal gear, go play a MOBA. If you want to work hard, achieve goals, build towards something in the future play an MMO. A pro mmo'er doesn't care who cashes and who doesn't.

I guess what i'm saying is, a lot of this game is based around gearing up. Not allowing people to use the gear they've attained would be absurd.

Lol. How many MMOs and MOBAs do you / have you played? Because I've played a lot of them, and most of them, within a certain time frame, or reasonable amount of cash, most players can achieve max level and gears. PWI, is no where near any of those games.

PWI does not guarantee max gears. Opening a card chest, open a pack, only has chances to get end game items. So, they are limited no matter how much time every player spends on those. Also note, without cash, very few players would be able to attain end game gears.

As for time, i know good players who have been in PWI for a long time, probably from the start, and because so, have very good, near end-game, gears. And that is still only a few people, but most of them had to make cash investments at some time. They just held onto it, and over time their investment boomed.

Do the math or read other peoples guides. Purely farming R9 from scratch is an insanely long process whether your a sin or even a BM (to fastest farming classes). Yes, MMOs take plenty of time and commitment and I have done so; gotten close to end-game gears, level, skills, etc... over a 1 year time frame. And only so efficiently because I had prior experience in PWI before i quit.

Other MMOs such as Guild Wars 2 also takes time to farm up the end-game gears, or the equivalent. But they've made it possible, that after so much time / money spent, you can guarantee your gear. to be done. Quests / achievements / events / instances can guarantee a full set of gear after so many set runs. As for PvP, they have extracted out the PvP completely giving all players balanced gears, so they can compete based on pure skill basis.

As for MOBAs, well that's pretty much what I play all the time along with most other gamers. WoW used to be the largest game with like a 19 mil player base or something around that. LoL now has like 30 mil something and Dota 2 has about 8 mil and growing daily. Players are moving to games with more balance where simply knowledge and skill are the true test of victory. *** was able to learn the adapt to that. Will PWI learn?

(I only do TW and some w/e in PWI anymore simply for all the time I have invested into this game. Once the next tier of gear and **** comes out... No need for me to waste time on a game with no end unless PWI can introduce something balanced.)

I'm not saying to not allow people to use their gear all the time. This is a unique, possible 1 time only event. So why not change it up? All the other PvP things players can use all the gear they want. Why not try something different.

Pretty sure every time PWI comes out with an new level of complexity added for end-game.
More players quit, and it also discourages new players because end-game is so far away, that for them to TW or be effective in any end-game event or dungeon, they need to spend a lot of time, leveling, then re-leveling twice, and obtaining all the gears and cards and shards and whatnot.
b:surrender

Eoria - Harshlands · June 2014

hiitsmeguys wrote: »

A true pro mmo'er is unlike other gamers, the pro mmo'er can go into any f2p mmo and attain max endgame gears, game knowledge, understanding of skills and opponents within a relatively short time. This can all be done without spending a single dime on any f2p mmo.

I lol'd. The majority of the top geared players on our server CS'd the **** out. Sure there are some that merched/farmed it, but most CS'd. Note I'm not talking about the people with like just r9rr +10/+11/+12 and morai shards. I mean with full jades/vit stones, full +12, and full maxed cardsets. It's pretty easy to tell who farmed/merched and who CS'd if you just pay attention.

bezmor · June 2014

Just was made aware of this last night lol sorry I dont follow forums like ever...
However :>

I made a video detailing my suggestions for this because A)i tihnk this event will be Epic

more people will see it that way vs just posting it here where only forum trolls read it and C) vids get auto linked to peoples social media (google is a god?) sometimes too so it will hopefully spread word more

Link to the video: Click here!
or copy paste for noobs:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hH34Ia1udpg

LAST:
things i forgot to say during the vid cause i forgoit...
-Time should be 10 mins, this way psys can cast buffs pre fight and last through and longer than this is really drawn out boring fights trust me ive been in 25 min 1v1 its just not worth the charm at that point lol (only shorter buffs that psy are sins see next point)

-There should be buffer time (10 secs maybe) for your team to buff (ie for sins, time to deaden, tidal, wolf emblem etc) then immediate follow by 3 second count down before fight starts. if this is possible; it depends on the environment the fights in but basically this prevents people from making excuses about buffs.

-If i didnt mention something its cause Im ok with it examples: purge R8 weps, meridian difference, neuma difference, mirage/archean sky lvl differences my reply to these is: take time to farm or just fight like a man and go ham

IF YOU DISAGREE:
IDGAF

but please leave a comment and id be happy to tell you why your wrong (I MEAN) discuss it with you
Bez

SHIMBERLY - Heavens Tear · June 2014

Tournaments should be in NPC gear only..IMO.It wil lshow the true skill of a player in most cases.b:bye

ovenusarmanio · June 2014

LostPoet - Dreamweaver wrote: »

-snip because this post is long-

Sparkie has already said the custom gear thing isn't going to happen for this, because he's unlikely to get any dev support from China. In other words, we're SOL on that one and will just have to content ourselves with the brackets. At least there will be brackets for people with lesser gear. If the gear brackets are done right, and all the gear brackets actually get a chance to be run, then people without insanely good gear will have a chance to participate.

PWI PvP Tournament [Now with sign-up dates in red]

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