Purify on R3 weapons is making 1 class Godlike - Nobody tought of that or what?
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Yup archers don't generally instantly kill me if I'm buffed...until that hax purge goes off, but purge has been here since the lg bow? And on HL everybody and their mother is an archer.
For there to be any sort of balance all procs should be removed.0 -
ArmaniEx - Harshlands wrote: »I'm not in favor of removing antistun, why because when you get purified your still dead , sins just going to freeze or restun you....having puri and no anti stun would be stupid. However, the speed proc could be removed,can always holy path and since I'm a wizard, demon leap is extra meters
Most people with combos of stunlock have the timing down to keep it going. Any proc screws that up, and they can be doing a different skill instead of the control one. That gives a good window to get out of there. And for the 2 that don't have skills to get away in time, they do have a spacebar. Jump away and the sin has to go in air to follow, which wastes time. Or the casters can already be in air, and simply drop wings. Then the sin is stuck trying to guess where you are going, and try to end up at the same height as you. But usually a drop, Holy Path, double jump fly means the sin is too far away to do anything.0 -
I don't see any issue with the purify proc at all. Skills that do not cause any damage will not trigger the proc. Various stuns (roar of the pride, voidstep, shadow teleport, soporific whisper, untamed wrath, chromatic seal), extreme poison, spark (genie skill), tangling mire, amplify damage, purge, elemental seal, dimensional seal, quid pro quo (to transfer sacrificial slash defense level reduction or curse from crimson soul powder), and a whole host of other skills can be used in combination to drastically reduce the caster's defenses before attacking.
The buff from the proc can be purged. A veno standing ahead of the caster can purge the antistun and speed boost (along with the rest of their buffs) as they try to run by.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Sylvae - Sanctuary wrote: »Most people with combos of stunlock have the timing down to keep it going. Any proc screws that up, and they can be doing a different skill instead of the control one. That gives a good window to get out of there. And for the 2 that don't have skills to get away in time, they do have a spacebar. Jump away and the sin has to go in air to follow, which wastes time. Or the casters can already be in air, and simply drop wings. Then the sin is stuck trying to guess where you are going, and try to end up at the same height as you. But usually a drop, Holy Path, double jump fly means the sin is too far away to do anything.
Adversity daggers have extra range, and notice how when you double jump a sin he's going to use that freeze skill..so ya jumping going to get you killed, that sin skill combined with range from dags is hax0 -
Its kind of very super entertaining to listen to the barbs in the NW squad rage in disbelief that despite being designed to pull a cata against 80 people from an opposing top tier TW faction they are now getting 1 shot while fully buffed by wizards. "Wtf...WTF! I just got hit 42k by a wizzy. Who's that wizzy? Aaagh. $%&@ wizzy they should not be able to hit 42k". I'm talking 200 vit, r9r or G16 with vit/josd barbs and magic defense ornies being ***** slapped and manhandled like Kossy's men treat her outside the game.
So in a skype call last night another BM and I were somewhat raging at the OPness of the purify proc and the fact that 20k hp wizzies have HA like defenses and you literally need all the lucky in the world to charm tick and roll multiple crit zerks to charm bipass while having none of them trigger purify so the wiz can't just blink away.
Then the question was posed as "would you rather they have GoF?" Sort of. And no. I think PWI gave wizards Purify proc in response to sins/BMs being able to stunlock them and them not having any real anti stun, and if they gave them GoF instead we'd be seeing full r9t3 catabarbs being hit by 90k and that's just wrong.Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory0 -
At the very least, it shouldn't proc when using skills. I don't even go to nw as a sin, why should I get punished like one?0
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Lol ya wizz can push over 30k Pdef fully buffed its hax, but a bm can now push insane Hp and mdef, barb over 50k Hp, clerics Psys and AA over 20k Hp ..so ya0
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There is no real counter to the purify proc
*looks through my post history*
Called itGifs are hard to make work here0 -
Joshcja - Sanctuary wrote: »There is no real counter to the purify proc
*looks through my post history*
Called it
Blade hurl, but most bm don't learn and/or use that skill. So no right to complain on my part.
I consistently catch up, and semi stun lock these people, but with 0 support, i die.
Yes people, blade hurl works, seeker skill also works. Learn to work together in nw and watch for buff icons.
*Sells blade hurl for 100m b:laugh*0 -
Yes, I'd rather have GoF on their weapon, because you see, dead wizzies do no damage. Whereas with purify spell, you just can't kill them unless you get lucky or they get unlucky. Even if you put all the non-purify-triggering-debuff in the world on a wizard, you probably still won't 1 shot them. So if disarming your opponent is the only way to counter purify spell, then it shouldn't be a morai/100 skill. Thats like making a veno's purge, BM's roar and a cleric's heal a morai/100 skill.Zsw -104 Sage Assassin
TehZsw - 100 Demon Archer
All Luck No Skillz PvPer: youtube.com/user/zsw0070 -
Zsw - Dreamweaver wrote: »Even if you put all the non-purify-triggering-debuff in the world on a wizard, you probably still won't 1 shot them. So if disarming your opponent is the only way to counter purify spell, then it shouldn't be a morai/100 skill. Thats like making a veno's purge, BM's roar and a cleric's heal a morai/100 skill.
I don't pvp beyond nw, tw, even than my role is to die. We got a few conditional stun skills in morai as a bm b:chuckle, but there is no protection against gof, while purify has a counter. 6 seconds is not long, but a chained attempt can work. It's just very rare to see people do it.
Only reason why i use it on all range classes, they hurt with their weapons on. When i close the distance and get in stun lock range, things are more evened out. But still, i agree, it is a pain and next to impossible to take down such OP casters. With gof, you can still kill the users "easily".0 -
There's a reason why magic classes have so much magic attack on their weapon and with +12, they can get insane amount of base mag damage . And there's also a reason why only physical classes have GOF on their weapon cuz their base physical attack on their weapon is very low so without GOF and relying on it, there's no way to kill high geared people. Archers get purge and not GOF cuz their base damage is not as low as physical classes and not as high as magic classes.
So, if you're planning on putting GOF on a caster's weapon, their damage should be like the physical classes out there.
On subject though, yes purify spell is broken. But people always find something to QQ about.
But this has really made wizards and clerics OP as hell .[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Jaabg - Sanctuary wrote: »I don't pvp beyond nw, tw, even than my role is to die. We got a few conditional stun skills in morai as a bm b:chuckle, but there is no protection against gof, while purify has a counter. 6 seconds is not long, but a chained attempt can work. It's just very rare to see people do it.
Only reason why i use it on all range classes, they hurt with their weapons on. When i close the distance and get in stun lock range, things are more evened out. But still, i agree, it is a pain and next to impossible to take down such OP casters. With gof, you can still kill the users "easily".
There are more counter towards GoF than purify. Don't consider gof as a proc on its own, consider it as a part of the person using it. If the person using it can't attack, (i.e. they are stunned, sealed, and then killed), then gof is effectively countered.
The chance of Gof procing is also a low constant. While purify spell has a higher proc chance while more people are attacking. So if we apply the same logic to Purify spell, it is actually counter productive because the same methods used to counter gof only increases the chance of purify activating.Zsw -104 Sage Assassin
TehZsw - 100 Demon Archer
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Longknife - Harshlands wrote: »Nemki doesn't count because his weapon is hax and everyone that was there swears that thing ****ing proc'ed 7 times in a row. Then I went to earth vector when it came off and it proc'ed again. b:laugh
Obviously yeah, **** like this can happen. But it's not as common as people are making it out to be. I think purify spell needs tweaking too, but I'm also a realist and I think people are exaggerating it's impact on NW in regards to flag carriers, though not exaggerating that it's overpowered.
Gotta camp dat WV and run like a ninny til IG cooldown and then attempt for a kill brah. Obviously black voodoo isn't meant to be the main voodoo! Why would a glass cannon class utilize a skill that makes them a glass cannon?!
And on a side note, can someone confirm this? I believe the BM sword cyclone skill or whatever shoots straight through defense levels, making the voodoo irrelevant. Given that Psys have balls defense aside from defense levels, your BM could be used in that case. I think I've also heard the BM mobile zhen shoots through IG effect, though I can't confirm. It will NOT however pierce Psy will or expel, so you'd wanna stun the Psy, THEN use it.
Well after a bit of testing I am in favour of believing Sword Cyclone bypasses defense levels.0 -
Jaabg - Sanctuary wrote: »Blade hurl, but most bm don't learn and/or use that skill. So no right to complain on my part.
I consistently catch up, and semi stun lock these people, but with 0 support, i die.
Yes people, blade hurl works, seeker skill also works. Learn to work together in nw and watch for buff icons.
*Sells blade hurl for 100m b:laugh*
Holy path dosen't need a weapon to work
(same with any other apoc/geni skill)
Blade hurl>hits wiz bare handed
Blade hurl>squad focuses wiz...as it quickly disappears into the sunset, can no longer run and stun
Blade hurl>gank>wiz dies>rest of wizzies squad attacks and rolls you with vital skills on CD and burnt sparks
The uncounterable thing about purify is the amount of resources it takes to compensate for it. Endgame = gear pvp in pwi is 100% resource based.
Any time you burn a spark use a pot or click your geni because the caster has purify, then the proc is doing its job just as well as when it actually procsGifs are hard to make work here0 -
i still think it would be better with no weapon procs at all. - for all classes -
that would take away a bit of the relying on luck and add a bit more of skill...
and would prolly increase veno population..
i also think the view of everyone is a bit bias.
in most cases of these balance QQs the caster target does have a higher grade gear or at least a lot higher refines/shards
so did everybody forget how extremely hard to kill bms and seekers of top gear are?
ideally all classes should be equal within their gear tier brackets..
ofc someone with better gear is dominating
the purify spell was a nice move in the right direction (after archers with their evil purge and assasins with the high damage and all the stuns and surprise buttseks)
but... imo the speed buff wasnt necessary... well not in that scale..i like potato0 -
Removing all weapon proc would be fine o: I guess a bit of adjustment to gears may be needed but it would remove all the luck reliance..Zsw -104 Sage Assassin
TehZsw - 100 Demon Archer
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Let's hope future weapons will have all three procs.
Things will be much more balanced if all classes had GoF, Spirit Blackhole, and Purify Spell.
Joking aside, this could actually happen in one form or another.....I can already see dual-proc weapons for "rank 10" or w/e.b:surrender[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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Maybe a bit racist, but you are playing a chinese game---don't expect them to take the luck an gambling part out
There really won't ever be a true balance- there is always a best class(es) Every so often maybe it'll shift one way, but it is sure to eventually shift another after everyone spends thier money.0 -
HexOmega - Dreamweaver wrote: »in most cases of these balance QQs the caster target does have a higher grade gear or at least a lot higher refines/shards
so did everybody forget how extremely hard to kill bms and seekers of top gear are?
ideally all classes should be equal within their gear tier brackets..
ofc someone with better gear is dominating
the purify spell was a nice move in the right direction (after archers with their evil purge and assasins with the high damage and all the stuns and surprise buttseks)
but... imo the speed buff wasnt necessary... well not in that scale..
Thing is, OP BMs and barbs can be safely ganked. Heck, my BM has stun locked a barb while purge spear autoing as another BM trip sparked. We had a few others around, and that R9 barb dropped like a rock.
That does not work on Purify, simply because without a veno around for guaranteed purge. And even then, purify can proc and render everything done useless, meaning repositioning. And with melee, that means everyone running in a perfect line for a phoenix one shot.
Also, with OP barbs/bms and such, anyone added on just makes it easier. However, randoms running in and beating up a purify user makes it less likely to kill the target. Whether it's from low damage skill spamming on their part, or because the clueless person uses auto-attack. And the game won't let you kill stupid people from your own nation, so you're kinda screwed. And it's that more = less thing that really makes it hard to beat.0 -
Because I haven't really said anything but called it and defined why purify is so damn OP
For squad play vs purify
(only works because AD has gone out of style)
Burn apoc>cleric sleep>high DPH ranged clas mele 3 spark 8 sec immune> cleric/archer freeze>kill
Its an example only, but simply put the only way to reliably kill a purify user is to disable them without apoc (stun is pretty weak here due to badge/fort) and place them in a situation where resources do not matter. NW = totaly useless. TW = depends on squad coordination, small group pvp... how good are your bm's again? Totaly useless if everyone's not top tier and skill and on a voice chat
1v1, as long as your not mele its just an OP proc and you should have one of those as well. (These fights can and will take forever though so not anywhere near a viable kill method in mass pvp)Gifs are hard to make work here0 -
soundslegit wrote: »I'm trying to convince a cleric in fac to recast the R8 wep she has for purify but someone has got it into her head that Nirvana is the one true path. I hope she reads this.
well the costs even with supply tokens to recast r8 weapon is still 100+ mil and thats if your farming everything yourself I've thought about it to get GoF on my seeks r8 weap but meh the 40 attack lvls from my 3rd cast more than makes up for that at this point if ur gonna get r8 for anything i'd go for the armor and 2nd cast it for the set bonus.
BTW good fix for the purify would make it only activate upon them using a skill not upon them being hit same thing every other class has to deal with I mean why if I'm brambled and I have zerk on a weapon does the zerk not activate when I'm attacked then why does a weapon with purge not activate the debuff when the person with that weapon attacks.
Its not so much the purify itself thats broken more in the way its activated it should only proc if they're using some sort of skill not being hit end of story.0 -
Ehh, I think the Purify itself is not bad but the additional speed and anti-stun is what really makes it OP.
I mean, Archers get Purge on their bow and other classes get SS and GoF which are pretty broken too so I don't see why casters don't deserve having Purify.
I just think it should be kept as to what the name really implies; a Purify to help casters counter stuns, sleep, debuffs and leave the anti-stun/speed buff out.[SIGPIC]http://i.imgur.com/MtwcqjL.png[/SIGPIC]
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purify is a defensive proc so it should activate when you take damage. it wont serve any purpose (saving AA from stunlock) if it activates upon using skillsplusonepostcount wrote: »...
BTW good fix for the purify would make it only activate upon them using a skill not upon them being hit same thing every other class has to deal with I mean why if I'm brambled and I have zerk on a weapon does the zerk not activate when I'm attacked then why does a weapon with purge not activate the debuff when the person with that weapon attacks.
Its not so much the purify itself thats broken more in the way its activated it should only proc if they're using some sort of skill not being hit end of story.
purify w/o anti-stun is useless as they would just re-stun.Desdi - Sanctuary wrote: »Ehh, I think the Purify itself is not bad but the additional speed and anti-stun is what really makes it OP.
I mean, Archers get Purge on their bow and other classes get SS and GoF which are pretty broken too so I don't see why casters don't deserve having Purify.
I just think it should be kept as to what the name really implies; a Purify to help casters counter stuns, sleep, debuffs and leave the anti-stun/speed buff out.0 -
Purify is fine. End of thread.
Now if you want to rename the thread and discuss the problem - Speed buffs on flag carriers, go right ahead.
No speed buff should be allowed for flag carrier. (Not archer buffs, barb buffs, charger orbs, purify, veno buffs, NOTHING.)0 -
Hannsel - Dreamweaver wrote: »purify w/o anti-stun is useless as they would just re-stun.
It still gives you time to pop a Sutra/IG/whatever or a Holy Path to run away though but I suppose it also depends on the class.[SIGPIC]http://i.imgur.com/MtwcqjL.png[/SIGPIC]
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Arawin - Raging Tide wrote: »Purify is fine. End of thread.
Now if you want to rename the thread and discuss the problem - Speed buffs on flag carriers, go right ahead.
No speed buff should be allowed for flag carrier. (Not archer buffs, barb buffs, charger orbs, purify, veno buffs, NOTHING.)
You forgot the Purify Spell proc in the list of speed buffs for flag carriers.[SIGPIC]Octavia is best pony![/SIGPIC]
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Purify Spell: Has a chance to remove debuff when being attacked,
and immune to stun and slow, and increase speed by 200%, lasts for 5 seconds
everything about this proc is overpowered, any other class that got good gear dies when being ganked, because of debuff and stun's, but that dont work on because the proc just removes all debuffs and stuns, i agree that right now you need to be a caster or you ****ed.
they really should nerf this proc, i can agree that casters should get a proc that can break stun, but not also remove debuffs, debuffing is a team effort trying to take down a strong player, and this proc is totaly underminding teamwork, to help break the stun a 3 sec anti stun and 100% speed for 3 sec, would be much more blanecd
the purify proc is so bad that if i see someone who is a r9r3 caster i run the other way, because you cant beat them0 -
Hannsel - Dreamweaver wrote: »purify is a defensive proc so it should activate when you take damage. it wont serve any purpose (saving AA from stunlock) if it activates upon using skills
purify w/o anti-stun is useless as they would just re-stun.
Name a class with an inexhaustable stun that has no chi cost or cooldown. Purify alone would give you time to react and do something unless you had like fifteen people on you; but in that scenario you really ought to die anyway.
I don't think the proc is too ridiculous in pvp, i do think though that it's extremely over powered in nation wars. I also think its the most OP third cast r9 proc. I think zerk is the weakest of the three with seekers having it being the only exception. Then again, barbs have their own purge now so really i guess only BMs and Sins got f-ked over in that regard.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
The other thing is, alot of caster carry Badge on their genie to break out of stun lock situations. But according to some of these posts, it is utterly useless. Why break the stun when they're apparently 100% guaranteed to be stunned no matter what right after, regardless of player skill or items? And do these people assuming purify being turned into holy would make it useless not have Badge on their genie? Because if they do.....0
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