I take issue with PWI and TW bidding

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Comments

  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    I figure they should get some credit since they had land before the reset, we'll see how they turn out in a few weeks.

    Although vicious would probably still beat em.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • DaKillanator - Raging Tide
    DaKillanator - Raging Tide Posts: 2,965 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    EvilMelania - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Here TW is only for the rich, big and high lvl guilds.
    Thanks for pointing out the obvious, I think nobody would dispute this...
    EvilMelania - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Sure i can join a high lvl guild
    Lolwut? Which one would that be?
    EvilMelania - Raging Tide wrote: »
    To feel important, to get high lvl as quick as possible? NO TY.
    Fundamental misunderstanding of reasons for joining a big fac is fundamental yo
    EvilMelania - Raging Tide wrote: »
    (saw a high lvl EA (100+) with his rep200k gear get killed by spider from weddingquest so high lvl does not automatically means a good player)
    You mean to tell me that some people suck at playing they class???b:shocked
    Blasphemy, once you reach 100, God beams down the knowledge of how to play your class correctly! So it has been written, and so it shall be!!!
  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    EvilMelania - Raging Tide wrote: »
    TW here on PWI is so much different then PWMS, there it was fun for all, big or small guild.
    There bids started at 150k and we could overbid all the time or switch to other terra. and always got the money returned if we losse the bid. Even richest guild started bids @150k there, that was usual.
    Now people think we could not afford a higher bid. Wrong, we just didnt know about "no overbid" possible here...


    That's cool, if it's so amazing there why don't you go back? Is it possibly because it changed?



    Here TW is only for the rich, big and high lvl guilds.

    duh


    Sure i can join a high lvl guild, but why?


    No you can't. There is not a single high level guild that will take you at your level on raging tide. High level guilds require a level of 90 or higher most of the time. Some require 100+. There is no high level guild on RT that would take a 7x

    To feel important, to get high lvl as quick as possible? NO TY.

    Yep, that's all high level guilds do. We sit around feeling important. Definitely don't prepare for TWs or anything.


    (saw a high lvl EA (100+) with his rep200k gear get killed by spider from weddingquest so high lvl does not automaticly means a good player) b:laugh

    People start new race and pay 2kk to join FC so they can lvl fast. Is that fun? Not for me. But what do i know. I just play for fun.

    I continue to have fun without lvling fast, and i will take on the name calling when some grinding char is upset that i farm 1 single mat just because i need it to lvl up my crafting.


    Replies in blue.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • truekossy
    truekossy Posts: 7,021 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Anyone else find it completely hilarious that the only ones QQing in this thread and making themselves look stupid are the level 7X people who obviously don't have a clue what the hell they're talking about? b:laugh
  • _Aubree__ - Dreamweaver
    _Aubree__ - Dreamweaver Posts: 197 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    angelmunchkin wrote: »
    Wow... s/he wasn't the one on a pedestal!

    FWI, to everyone... if someone takes your money and gives you nothing back for it, that's stealing.


    When you give someone your money for a chance at getting something, that is called gambling. No one stole coins. PWI did not pressure anyone into bidding. It is not mandatory.
  • angelmunchkin
    angelmunchkin Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    _Aubree__ - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    When you give someone your money for a chance at getting something, that is called gambling. No one stole coins. PWI did not pressure anyone into bidding. It is not mandatory.

    And I notice that you truncated my post while quoting it. I said it was gambling, you dolt! AND I did add that PWE should change the description of it from "bidding" to "gambling" to make it clear!

    Why say something I just said and then make it look like you were correcting me? That's just stupid!

    <gah>
    "People are capable of kindness beyond angels, yet we also commit sins that would put a demon to shame... We all stand precariously on the edge between darkness and light... And when we fall, we are greeted by only madness and chaos." ~Raogrimm: Galkan Talekeeper, FFXI.
  • _Aubree__ - Dreamweaver
    _Aubree__ - Dreamweaver Posts: 197 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    angelmunchkin wrote: »
    And I notice that you truncated my post while quoting it. I said it was gambling, you dolt! AND I did add that PWE should change the description of it from "bidding" to "gambling" to make it clear!

    Why say something I just said and then make it look like you were correcting me? That's just stupid!

    <gah>
    Not all bids are refundable FYI. They even disclosed the information of it NOT being refundable. Who is the dolt now?
  • angelmunchkin
    angelmunchkin Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    ME:
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Eoria - Harshlands View Post
    Let me take you off your pedestal right now.

    TW bidding has been this way for MONTHS. If you'd been paying attention to the bids, you'd have noticed how different it was from MS. Thus, the smart thing to do would have been to ask questions about it. PWI did not steal your 150k. It is in the stipulations of the new bidding system that you get ONE bid and ONE bid only so make it your best.

    Also, 16 people will not be able defend against 80 level 100+ godly-geared to decently-geared people. They will be rolled. Hard. This was the case on MY-EN (of which MS is close to) and it is the case here on PWI.

    Wow... s/he wasn't the one on a pedestal!

    FWI, to everyone... if someone takes your money and gives you nothing back for it, that's stealing. In every coin sink in this game (excluding TW), the players have gotten something for their coins. At least give them something for their money... a consolation prize or something. Some random TT mat's that they can either sell or use for their faction. Don't just take their money and keep it... that's not how "bidding" works... that's how "gambling" works. Giving the money back is better though. As for allowing bidding only once to prevent abuse of the system, there's nothing wrong with that. One chance to get the bid and if you don't, you get your money back and go on your way. Albeit, that still makes it so that only the richest factions will ever hold a territory, which is stupid... someone said earlier in this thread that richest does not make strongest. I agree with that.

    Otherwise, change the description of the system and clearly state it every time an offer is made, that the money is being gambled, not bid. Make the user click confirm 3 times (or more) so they have no excuse for not knowing that they are gambling with their factions coins. (and yes, I understand TW "bidding" has been this way for months, but there will always be new factions wanting to join TW, and they need to be made clearly aware.)

    YOU:
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by angelmunchkin View Post
    Wow... s/he wasn't the one on a pedestal!

    FWI, to everyone... if someone takes your money and gives you nothing back for it, that's stealing.

    When you give someone your money for a chance at getting something, that is called gambling. No one stole coins. PWI did not pressure anyone into bidding. It is not mandatory.

    ME:
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by _Aubree__ - Dreamweaver View Post
    When you give someone your money for a chance at getting something, that is called gambling. No one stole coins. PWI did not pressure anyone into bidding. It is not mandatory.

    And I notice that you truncated my post while quoting it. I said it was gambling, you dolt! AND I did add that PWE should change the description of it from "bidding" to "gambling" to make it clear!

    Why say something I just said and then make it look like you were correcting me? That's just stupid!

    <gah>

    YOU:
    _Aubree__ - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by angelmunchkin View Post
    And I notice that you truncated my post while quoting it. I said it was gambling, you dolt! AND I did add that PWE should change the description of it from "bidding" to "gambling" to make it clear!

    Why say something I just said and then make it look like you were correcting me? That's just stupid!

    <gah>

    Not all bids are refundable FYI. They even disclosed the information of it NOT being refundable. Who is the dolt now?

    My answer:

    You! Where exactly did you get lost? Perhaps a trip back to remedial reading class will benefit you. I was talking about TW... this whole thread has been about TW.
    "People are capable of kindness beyond angels, yet we also commit sins that would put a demon to shame... We all stand precariously on the edge between darkness and light... And when we fall, we are greeted by only madness and chaos." ~Raogrimm: Galkan Talekeeper, FFXI.
  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    truekossy wrote: »
    Anyone else find it completely hilarious that the only ones QQing in this thread and making themselves look stupid are the level 7X people who obviously don't have a clue what the hell they're talking about? b:laugh
    This is true of aproximately 90% of all threads.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • _Aubree__ - Dreamweaver
    _Aubree__ - Dreamweaver Posts: 197 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Since when are bids supposed to be always refunded? You say they should change to gambling, but really you guys should be more knowledgeable before you make decisions on things you can't afford.

    Yes I know it's about TW bids. So where did i get lost? Nothing was stolen it was offered up willingly without knowing.

    Caveat emptor
  • truekossy
    truekossy Posts: 7,021 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    This is true of aproximately 90% of all threads.

    I've been gone from forums way too long. We used to have idiots of all levels QQing and looking stupid. b:surrender
  • cuthebert
    cuthebert Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    I have read much of this thread and come to the conclusion that angelmunckin is either seriously mentally challenged, or an epic level troll, I think it is probably the later.
  • angelmunchkin
    angelmunchkin Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    cuthebert wrote: »
    I have read much of this thread and come to the conclusion that angelmunckin is either seriously mentally challenged, or an epic level troll, I think it is probably the later.

    Angelmunchkin "was" a legit player (PunkinKatt, see siggy). I quit this past week because of the attitudes of the player base.

    Not a troll, and nowhere near mentally challenged... I simply defend what I believe and I am not giving anyone the satisfaction of "thinking" that they won the argument or "taught me a thing or two" by simply disappearing. And that is what they would think... when the real reason I would disappear would be because I think you're all a bunch of crazy, greedy, elitist imbeciles. Many with obvious reading deficits.
    "People are capable of kindness beyond angels, yet we also commit sins that would put a demon to shame... We all stand precariously on the edge between darkness and light... And when we fall, we are greeted by only madness and chaos." ~Raogrimm: Galkan Talekeeper, FFXI.
  • angelmunchkin
    angelmunchkin Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    _Aubree__ - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Since when are bids supposed to be always refunded? You say they should change to gambling, but really you guys should be more knowledgeable before you make decisions on things you can't afford.

    Yes I know it's about TW bids. So where did i get lost? Nothing was stolen it was offered up willingly without knowing.

    Caveat emptor

    To my knowledge TW are the only bids that are not refunded (topic of this thread). That makes it gambling, not bidding... because bids ARE refunded if you're out bid in any kind of auction or bidding process. People just need to know the difference between bidding and gambling, and that is not a hard concept to grasp. No one said they couldn't afford it... the OP said it herself. As for being knowledgeable about it before making the decision, that is true, but it could also be somewhat obscure and in my post, I said that it should be made more clear.
    "People are capable of kindness beyond angels, yet we also commit sins that would put a demon to shame... We all stand precariously on the edge between darkness and light... And when we fall, we are greeted by only madness and chaos." ~Raogrimm: Galkan Talekeeper, FFXI.
  • cuthebert
    cuthebert Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    angelmunchkin wrote: »
    when the real reason I would disappear would be because I think you're all a bunch of crazy, greedy, elitist imbeciles.

    Huge generalizations and parinoid delusions can be a sign of mental issues.
  • angelmunchkin
    angelmunchkin Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    cuthebert wrote: »
    Huge generalizations and parinoid delusions can be a sign of mental issues.

    If you found any huge generalizations or paranoid delusions in that statement, then you're the one with issues. And you are obviously the troll, here. Jumping in at this late stage of the argument and making accusations toward me.

    Opportunistic troll.
    "People are capable of kindness beyond angels, yet we also commit sins that would put a demon to shame... We all stand precariously on the edge between darkness and light... And when we fall, we are greeted by only madness and chaos." ~Raogrimm: Galkan Talekeeper, FFXI.
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Ugh...ok people...let me put this in another perspective.

    Not refunding coin could be called a coin sink, yes, but that's not entirely it. Remember when bids were refunded in the old bidding system? What did people do?

    Some guilds would have fake bids just to raise the bid fee on that piece of land. If you were planning a gank and had to bid in a particular spot, your bid fee got raised and there was nothing you could do about it. The guilds doing this lose nothing - they get their fee refunded. Maybe some of the guilds were not fake, but some certainly did this just to be jackasses. Despite the fact that they never won a single bid, they raised the bid fee of a legitimate faction that was actually there to fight.

    This is probably one reason why you don't get your bid fee refunded anymore. I know that bidding no longer displays how much a faction paid, but a faction can easily put down say 5m on several pieces of its own land just to dissuade other factions. If their bid wins, they keep the land and get 10m; if their bid does not, they should not get it back.
    Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
    Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
    Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
    Qui: b:dirty
  • angelmunchkin
    angelmunchkin Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Ugh...ok people...let me put this in another perspective.

    Not refunding coin could be called a coin sink, yes, but that's not entirely it. Remember when bids were refunded in the old bidding system? What did people do?

    Some guilds would have fake bids just to raise the bid fee on that piece of land. If you were planning a gank and had to bid in a particular spot, your bid fee got raised and there was nothing you could do about it. The guilds doing this lose nothing - they get their fee refunded. Maybe some of the guilds were not fake, but some certainly did this just to be jackasses. Despite the fact that they never won a single bid, they raised the bid fee of a legitimate faction that was actually there to fight.

    This is probably one reason why you don't get your bid fee refunded anymore. I know that bidding no longer displays how much a faction paid, but a faction can easily put down say 5m on several pieces of its own land just to dissuade other factions. If their bid wins, they keep the land and get 10m; if their bid does not, they should not get it back.

    This is a good, and even logical, reason to change the system to the way it currently is... but for the new factions coming in, it would just make sense to call it a gambling system just to make it clear that, if you don't win, you lose the money. And make the system have multiple confirm buttons pop up so no one has any excuse for not knowing and plenty of opportunity to back out of their offer.
    "People are capable of kindness beyond angels, yet we also commit sins that would put a demon to shame... We all stand precariously on the edge between darkness and light... And when we fall, we are greeted by only madness and chaos." ~Raogrimm: Galkan Talekeeper, FFXI.
  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Or you could, you know, actually look it up and know what you're doing. But hey, you're right, they're totally taking advantage of newer guilds by keeping this information secret so that they waste an entire 150k which probably took like 4 hours to farm and is totally not chump change.

    I mean it's not like It was mentioned anywhere, they're just trying to steal our chump change!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • angelmunchkin
    angelmunchkin Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Or you could, you know, actually look it up and know what you're doing. But hey, you're right, they're totally taking advantage of newer guilds by keeping this information secret so that they waste an entire 150k which probably took like 4 hours to farm and is totally not chump change.

    I mean it's not like It was mentioned anywhere, they're just trying to steal our chump change!

    There is absolutely nothing wrong with adding something, IN-GAME, that will allow people to know exactly what they are getting into... it's not only convenient, but it also makes the process ABSOLUTELY CLEAR!

    Clarity = fewer (if any) complaints

    You're an a$$!
    "People are capable of kindness beyond angels, yet we also commit sins that would put a demon to shame... We all stand precariously on the edge between darkness and light... And when we fall, we are greeted by only madness and chaos." ~Raogrimm: Galkan Talekeeper, FFXI.
  • DaKillanator - Raging Tide
    DaKillanator - Raging Tide Posts: 2,965 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    angelmunchkin wrote: »
    You're an a$$!

    and you're an idiot.

    Choosing to be ignorant is not an excuse for stupidity. The forums and News Articles are here for everyone to read. If people choose not to read them, then they will suffer from their own lack of knowledge.
  • angelmunchkin
    angelmunchkin Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    DaKillanator - Raging Tide wrote: »
    and you're an idiot.

    Choosing to be ignorant is not an excuse for stupidity. The forums and News Articles are here for everyone to read. If people choose not to read them, then they will suffer from their own lack of knowledge.

    I didn't say anything about people reading or not reading forums or news articles. I said it wouldn't hurt to make the issue more clear in-game. I imagine most people avoid these forums for a reason... namely, the lack of civility when they have a question or complaint. Nobody is choosing to be ignorant.
    "People are capable of kindness beyond angels, yet we also commit sins that would put a demon to shame... We all stand precariously on the edge between darkness and light... And when we fall, we are greeted by only madness and chaos." ~Raogrimm: Galkan Talekeeper, FFXI.
  • DaKillanator - Raging Tide
    DaKillanator - Raging Tide Posts: 2,965 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    angelmunchkin wrote: »
    Nobody is choosing to be ignorant.

    Yes, they are. Here the forums are, and the News Article archive is only a click away. The knowledge on such things is right there, for anybody's use.

    Let me say that again: it's right there, for anybody's use. And it's free.

    If they choose not to use the very accessible forums, or read the untrolled news articles, then any lack of knowledge is their problem.

    It's people like you that demand for every bit of know-how in the game to be served on a silver platter to them that make games unchallenging for the rest of us...
  • angelmunchkin
    angelmunchkin Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    DaKillanator - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Yes, they are. Here the forums are, and the News Article archive is only a click away. The knowledge on such things is right there, for anybody's use.

    Let me say that again: it's right there, for anybody's use. And it's free.

    If they choose not to use the very accessible forums, or read the untrolled news articles, then any lack of knowledge is their problem.

    It's people like you that demand for every bit of know-how in the game to be served on a silver platter to them that make games unchallenging for the rest of us...

    I don't demand, or even expect, anything. I'm not the complainant. I've learned not to expect anything from PWE, and more especially, not from the player base. But I am also not forgetting that finding what you want in the EXTENSIVE (forum and news) ARCHIVES might be a bit hard, if not nearly impossible, to do. Also, that most people probably AVOID the FORUMS for a GOOD REASON... the reason I stated earlier.

    What does giving a clear description of something have to do with making a game less of a challenge? I didn't say to change the mechanics... just make the process more clear in written language. Make SURE they know what they are doing before they do it and plenty of opportunity to back out if they decide they don't want to take the risk.

    As I said before: Clarity = fewer (if any) complaints
    "People are capable of kindness beyond angels, yet we also commit sins that would put a demon to shame... We all stand precariously on the edge between darkness and light... And when we fall, we are greeted by only madness and chaos." ~Raogrimm: Galkan Talekeeper, FFXI.
  • Katzyn - Sanctuary
    Katzyn - Sanctuary Posts: 1,270 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Note -

    When you go to bid, it DOES say, in red text, "non-refundable". Not...really sure why anyone would expect their money back after reading that..
    Katzyn, level 101 Demon Veno
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  • _Aubree__ - Dreamweaver
    _Aubree__ - Dreamweaver Posts: 197 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Katzyn - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Note -

    When you go to bid, it DOES say, in red text, "non-refundable". Not...really sure why anyone would expect their money back after reading that..
    Some people have reading deficit. b:shutup

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