Seeker = Busted BM?

HappysHAIL - Harshlands wrote: »

The problem with sins?

Stun + Silence + Sleep + Root + Occult + Anti stun + Infinite Chi

..And then they run away.

Yea.. fun part of all that, is surviving it, then unleashing a chain of skills that picks on both of their defences.

vristion wrote: »

Yea.. fun part of all that, is surviving it, then unleashing a chain of skills that picks on both of their defences.

Its always easy to spot a person who has no idea what they're talking about. Come back @ endgame, bro.

You have obviously never in your life fought anything anywhere near 5.0 aps. If you did, you'd see why stuns and anti-stuns are so important to the PvP of this game. If a 5.0 character stuns you, you lost unless you IMMEDIATELY do something to prevent/break the stun. Seeker can't do this, unless he has a genie to do it for him. But even if you break his stun, good luck still being alive while he's cutting your face open 5 times a second. No attack you have, no attack you will ever use can drop him before he drops you. You have ranged skills but you don't have crowd-control that actually lets you sustain a ranged fight, so ultimately the sin will always teleport back to your face and just keep slicing and dicing. He can prevent your stuns, but you cant prevent his. And you have no hope of out-DPSing him... ever.

You might be able to **** him and everyone around him with Gemini Slash though, provided that someone doesn't stun you out of that long and obvious channel time.

Pray you get some CC and anti-CC in your 79/100 skills or your Sage/Demon skills. Otherwise you'll only be a factor one time per minute (When Blade Affinity lets you cast GS without looking like a giant target).

Edit: That being said, Seeker is still probably one of the more fun classes for me to play, just for the uniqueness factor of their combo/stance style. Hoping they work out the kinks in the near future, otherwise I'm going back to my mains.

vristion wrote: »

cool story breh...How bout you give seekers a chance to even get Endgame before coming in here with high and mighty endgame assumptions... And personal assumptions as well... 5.0 sins are quite beatable by any equally geared class...

Because everyone says the same thing and everyone gets *****. Yes, other classes can kill sins because the battlefield has hundreds of possible variables, including things as simple as whether or not he even saw you coming. But that isn't class balance, nor does it make the classes equal.

If you go head to head with a 5.0 assassin with the skills currently implemented, you will lose if he actually knows how to play. Providing that you and him share similar level of playing ability, you're fighting an extremely uphill battle.

I have such an interval sin, and I have a endgame wizard and psychic. After being on both ends of that spectrum, I can safely tell you it is not easy to go toe to toe with a 5.0 if you're not a 5.0 yourself. You have to find a way to keep him out of your face, or he'll shred you. Likewise, anyone who failed to keep my sin out of their face got shredded.

And as far as "equal gear" goes, the mere fact that a Seeker can't reach 5.0 kinda kills the concept of ever being truly equal. Nothing is equal to 5.0 dps, except more 5.0 dps.


As the game currently stands, with Seeker still being an incomplete class, you have no chance to win that fight; outside of having the advantage of a possible sneak attack, and/or the fact that Blade Affinity + Gemini = lethal. Outside of those two possibilities, you're looking at a total mismatch. He has more DPS than you. He crowd-controls better than you. He avoids crowd-control better than you. He has more consistent fighting abilities than you. At least from a PvP perspective.

So to repeat my original point: pray your endgame skills cover the Seeker's weaknesses. Right now its a dim outlook. It's not a bad class, but because of the way PvP in this game has evolved from the already existing content, this new incomplete content doesn't stack up yet.

Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »

catshop for R9 man. who wants Nirvana?

And as for people who don't want to send +$2,000 for pixles?

(b:pleased)
I love these thread. It's like de ja vu.

i persoanlly tihnk at this stage anyway, could be so wrong lol.

that seeker will be so fun to use in tw, with alot of range and aoe skills.

AND THAT IT IS HA ARMOR

and also tat it has both great phy att and metal dmg, there is this ulti sometihng like 400% weapon dmg 12 aoe range, 25 range i think, not sure. NEEDS NO CHI AT ALL. 15 SEC COLLDOWN lol. but take bout 4 sec to use, kinda like a mage ulti but no chi needed.

BUT

in pvp, especially 1 on 1, i dont tihnk it will be very fun. with 1 real stun, that has a COOLDOWN OF 3MINS !!?!?!? but 35meter range at lv10. and no anti stun so...kinda useless.

this could be potentially the ultimate tw char lol who knows. depends heavily on the lv11 skills too

ryukage wrote: »

Because everyone says the same thing and everyone gets *****. Yes, other classes can kill sins because the battlefield has hundreds of possible variables, including things as simple as whether or not he even saw you coming. But that isn't class balance, nor does it make the classes equal.

If you go head to head with a 5.0 assassin with the skills currently implemented, you will lose if he actually knows how to play. Providing that you and him share similar level of playing ability, you're fighting an extremely uphill battle.

I have such an interval sin, and I have a endgame wizard and psychic. After being on both ends of that spectrum, I can safely tell you it is not easy to go toe to toe with a 5.0 if you're not a 5.0 yourself. You have to find a way to keep him out of your face, or he'll shred you. Likewise, anyone who failed to keep my sin out of their face got shredded.

And as far as "equal gear" goes, the mere fact that a Seeker can't reach 5.0 kinda kills the concept of ever being truly equal. Nothing is equal to 5.0 dps, except more 5.0 dps.


As the game currently stands, with Seeker still being an incomplete class, you have no chance to win that fight; outside of having the advantage of a possible sneak attack, and/or the fact that Blade Affinity + Gemini = lethal. Outside of those two possibilities, you're looking at a total mismatch. He has more DPS than you. He crowd-controls better than you. He avoids crowd-control better than you. He has more consistent fighting abilities than you. At least from a PvP perspective.

So to repeat my original point: pray your endgame skills cover the Seeker's weaknesses. Right now its a dim outlook. It's not a bad class, but because of the way PvP in this game has evolved from the already existing content, this new incomplete content doesn't stack up yet.

Even a it stands, its compareing canned peaches to fresh oranges... In any game there will be a dominate 1v1 character... in this case I'd say sin ( I myself play sin btw) But for most part, unless you 1v1 all day (which i personally hate) then yes, that can be an arguable case on the sins part..

One thing about the sin though, in group PK they become one shot wonders. Who will be their biggest threat in TW? my predictions ARE the Seekers. As also a Cleric too and years of TW as one, I can imagine having a Seeker as my best group ally. With their fast ranged phy/mag attacks, I believe they will be able to nuke out a sin that is attacking a cleric..with very little effort Yea I know..sins can make shreaded noodles out of squishy clerics before they could be saved...but thats typically because I would say 75% of clerics dont know PK from their own ***.. but thats a whole nother debate.

Will seekers take the dominate role as a 1v1 PKer? not sure yet....still un finished, and quite honestly, as I said before in another thread, SOME classes don't even become good PK classes until they get the demon/sage addons.. (or just better) So still some things remain to be seen on their part.. But are Seekers showing some signs of holding their own and becoming a threat to other classes in mass PK (namely TW) ???? I'd say they have HUGE potential....


PvE? Whats to hate about AoE damage? 5.0 yea...spark it, tap it...it is one target.. Getting there is half the battle.... but then again, who really cares about PvE? , we still yet to see whats in store for the seeker in the engame PvE game..

vristion wrote: »

Even a it stands, its compareing canned peaches to fresh oranges... In any game there will be a dominate 1v1 character... in this case I'd say sin ( I myself play sin btw) But for most part, unless you 1v1 all day (which i personally hate) then yes, that can be an arguable case on the sins part..

One thing about the sin though, in group PK they become one shot wonders. Who will be their biggest threat in TW? my predictions ARE the Seekers. As also a Cleric too and years of TW as one, I can imagine having a Seeker as my best group ally. With their fast ranged phy/mag attacks, I believe they will be able to nuke out a sin that is attacking a cleric..with very little effort Yea I know..sins can make shreaded noodles out of squishy clerics before they could be saved...but thats typically because I would say 75% of clerics dont know PK from their own ***.. but thats a whole nother debate.

Will seekers take the dominate role as a 1v1 PKer? not sure yet....still un finished, and quite honestly, as I said before in another thread, SOME classes don't even become good PK classes until they get the demon/sage addons.. (or just better) So still some things remain to be seen on their part.. But are Seekers showing some signs of holding their own and becoming a threat to other classes in mass PK (namely TW) ???? I'd say they have HUGE potential....


PvE? Whats to hate about AoE damage? 5.0 yea...spark it, tap it...it is one target.. Getting there is half the battle.... but then again, who really cares about PvE? , we still yet to see whats in store for the seeker in the engame PvE game..

Thanks for repeating what I just said 5 minutes ago. Look above your post, bro.

I totally agree that they can wreck in TW, with the right people supporting them. Seekers by themselves are too vulnerable without any anti-stuns so they don't have much to guarantee their strikes. But in a TW with the correct party set-up and communication, the Seeker will be a definite threat.

However, like I said before, right now they're not 1v1 material at all. And that's why I attacked the view of Seeker vs Sin so harshly. Sins pretty much rule 1v1, and they rule PKing. It's pointless to pretend they don't when they're so rigged for it. TW is another issue all together.

Edit: read it wrong lol.

Yeah, it would seem Seeker is far more useful to 5 APS in PvE than we would have thought.

_Nicely_ - Archosaur wrote: »

Yes I can say a gemini slash with the soulseaver minouet debuff could be on par with the wizards ulti skills. Check the dmg the skill does in ecatomb.. and thats only at lvl 10 not 11.. soulsever minouet at max lvl has 50% chance to proc.. u do 2-3 range skills and ull get the debuff on ur opponent.. in tw where it is harder to target ranged attackers, i see it to have as much potential as a blade tempest of a wizard.. maybe even better with shorter cd n no chi cost

Soulsever Minuet Lv 11

Channel: 0.3 sec
Cooldown: 8 sec
Cast: 0.7
Mp: 70

Last 10minutes. When under this effect, each attack has 50% chance to place "Spirit Bore" debuff on target, last 30seconds. When use Gemini Slash on target will activate the debuff, which cause 7950 metal damage on target and reduce attack and defense lvl by 10 for 3minutes, debuff will disappear after active.

Sage: Chance to debuff increase by 15%
Demon: Def lvl decrease effect increase by 2

Gemini Slash Lv 11
Range: 28m
Channel: 3.333 sec
Cooldown: 15 sec
Cast: 2 sec
Mp: 150

Deal base phy damage plus 450% weapon damage plus 5300 extra phy damage to all nearby enemies within 12m of target and activate "Spirit Bore".

Sage: extra damage increase by 2000
Demon: 33% to reduce target's movement speed by 60% for 8 sec

(b:thanks)
http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=930712&page=67

Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »

gemini would be useful if it didnt take a whopping load to cast. -.-

All the other skills were fairly fast, that when i macroed gemini in a skill combo it was so slow compared, i thought 'WTF am i lagging?'
then i looked at the cast time and tossed it out.

it would have been useful in tw but sadly thats a place where 1-2sec means life or death....

Blade Affinity can cover that issue.

Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »

gemini would be useful if it didnt take a whopping load to cast. -.-

All the other skills were fairly fast, that when i macroed gemini in a skill combo it was so slow compared, i thought 'WTF am i lagging?'
then i looked at the cast time and tossed it out.

it would have been useful in tw but sadly thats a place where 1-2sec means life or death....

Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »

it can, but unless there is a situation where i absolutely need to use this specific skill, i can fit in 2-3 fast skills and possibly a crit in place of the seconds used for affinity and gemini =/

Well think of it as in comparison to a wizards nuke skill... if BT or BIDS has fast casting time, then the skill would be too OP. thats why you see lots of wizard using channeling pot dropping nuke in TW all the time.. same concept here

a good nuke could mean the difference between a succesfull lane push or a fail one. and seekers be given a reduced channeling time skill thats insta cast that basically saves u pot cooldown...plus the skill uses no chi to cast

and yes of corse u can fit in 2-3 fast skills rather than using gemini... wizards uses gush and other skill too to kill ppl off but what do you do when u see a cluster of 6 ppl in tw? do you pick off one by one with gushes? no u drop a nuke and kill em... same concept here too...

I was gonna say lol, that would be like Wizards never casting BIDS and BT, and lemme tell you. A wizard who never uses those two skills in a TW needs to be removed from his guild.

But seriously, the only major issue I see with Seekers in TW is just how vulnerable they are. They only get one speed skill (and its slower than BOTH of the BM and Sin speed skills, go figure), they only get one reliable stun, and no in-class anti-stuns. And of course they can't hold a candle to the raw survival power of a barb. Not to mention, their dps is a lot more limited since interval gear doesnt do for swords like it does for fists.

^ For those reasons, Seeker currently lacks the functionality to be a true front-line class in TW. HA alone doesn't prevent you from being CC'd, and consequently, demolished. However, they will be able to drop a nuke (Gemini) more often and with less cost than other classes. They also seem to have a better mid-range gameplan than BMs would, so that can possibly be exploited for the greater good as well.

I see their main strength in general as being the most flexible class when it comes to range and melee together, but that alone doesnt equal much factor (and thats moreso an issue with 5.0 being so horridly broken). But again, Gemini is a badass skill. If a Seeker lets his BM friends take the lead, run in and pop a few stuns for him, the Seeker can then be the clean-up crew with Gemini Slash, and possibly help pick off the leftovers with his ranged attacks, or Voidstep into someone's face for the last blow.

Good party set-ups and communication will make Seekers a threat in TW, for certain. But I'd still hope their 79/100 skills help patch up a few of the class' blatant flaws.

Anyone else think that Seekers are more likely to stat vit than BMs these days? Probably not as much as the old vit axe BM builds but they may have more hp than a BM as well.

so far with my seeker, I can see the potential of it being useful both as a PVE and PVP character. Just gotta choose the right skills for a target of a certain class for PVP. I rarely PK with my veno, but I'm gunna have fun learning the hard way of PVP with my seeker. XD