Demon VS Sage

Kimicat - Sanctuary
Kimicat - Sanctuary Posts: 36 Arc User
edited February 2010 in Wizard
OK peeps i am SOOOOO close to having to make this decision and every thread ive read is basically yelling at each other BLAH BLAH BLAH anyway. just tell me in plain terms PLEASE what is best for a wizard who does not pvp or tw demon or sage?
Post edited by Kimicat - Sanctuary on
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  • Esteban - Dreamweaver
    Esteban - Dreamweaver Posts: 61 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    http://i32.tinypic.com/2vjueyb.jpg
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  • Kimicat - Sanctuary
    Kimicat - Sanctuary Posts: 36 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    hey thats not nice im asking honestly and i dont want the arguement bs just a straight DEMON OR SAGE answer thanks
  • Adroit - Lost City
    Adroit - Lost City Posts: 4,628 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Esteban - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    http://i32.tinypic.com/2vjueyb.jpg

    ^ this. b:surrender
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  • Kimicat - Sanctuary
    Kimicat - Sanctuary Posts: 36 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    =/ *sigh* i need help seriously im tied between the two and cant make my decision. demon skills look really good to me but its hard to find the books BUT sage looks good too and the books are easy to find
  • Astoru - Heavens Tear
    Astoru - Heavens Tear Posts: 822 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    A wizard can go either way and be successful. Just look through the skill guides on ecatomb and decide what bonuses you want more
    ●Wizard (Male) - Fasditious and pretentious, carries the arrogance of intellectual superiority. Feels the need to remind everyone of his world-ending power, but grows a little manic and unhinged when he finally is allowed to unleash it. "Ahh-hahahahaha!! NOW YOU ALL BURN!!!!"
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  • /Groovy/ - Harshlands
    /Groovy/ - Harshlands Posts: 688 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Both are good in PvE.

    Sage might suit you better though as +50 chi skill is waaaaay more useful in PvE than taking away 50 chi from opponent... since mobs doesn't have chi b:chuckle

    Extra chi will help you spark more often = less mana pots usage during grind, TT or in instances.
    Packs World International
  • NonameWiz - Sanctuary
    NonameWiz - Sanctuary Posts: 506 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    You like to gain chi quickly = Go Sage

    You like to control people + fast channeling spells + more pdef (cost a lot) + cool animation when you use demon spark? = Go demon.

    Sometimes, there is only 1 reason that's enough to make your decision.

    Gratz to you in advance whichever path you take.
    Rank 8 Wizard: 1% farm b:shutup
  • Damaged - Lost City
    Damaged - Lost City Posts: 460 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Sage for the ultis and masteries for mass pvp e.g. TW

    Demon for small man pvp

    Speaking from experience y0
  • Mizuoni - Dreamweaver
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver Posts: 3,533 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Cholla - Harshlands wrote: »
    Demon gets several abilities to cast spells quickly when sutra is cooling down (which also helps them build chi quickly, but only in combat where sage can gain 50 chi every minute out of combat and without having to spam spells), and some reduced chi costs, and some stuns, and some heal over time, and improved defenses.

    sage gets improved ultimates, and sage black ice dragon strike looks very nice, and several chi building mechanisms, and they also get some abilities to reduce enemy defenses which do not stack with undine strike and their spark gives some damage reduction which does not stack with blue bubble.

    Both get various forms of improved damage.

    Basically, each winds up being better with certain skills than the other and you have to decide if you care about those skills.

    Cholla catches on quickly
    Sins are Scissors. Psychics are Rocks.
    Archers, Venos, Barbs, Wizards, BMs, Mystics, Seekers are Paper.
    ...and Clerics are Mushrooms.
    Paper beats Rock. Scissors beats Paper. Scissors also happens to beat Rock...until Rock gets 50k+ soulforce at which point Rock becomes an unstoppable killing machine that beats Paper... and would beat Scissors but it can't find Scissors, because Scissors are invisible.
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  • Damaged - Lost City
    Damaged - Lost City Posts: 460 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    damaged - Lost City wrote: »
    sage For The Ultis And Masteries For Mass Pvp E.g. Tw

    Demon For Small Man Pvp

    Speaking From Experience Y0

    Quoting My Own Post 'cos It Was That Dam Good
  • Shadowvzs - Lost City
    Shadowvzs - Lost City Posts: 877 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Damaged - Lost City wrote: »
    Sage for the ultis and masteries for mass pvp e.g. TW

    Demon for small man pvp

    Speaking from experience y0

    true, and in pve both 2 is good only need fast casting skills with 3rd spark (20%mana backb:pleased) nothing special
  • Lyzzern - Lost City
    Lyzzern - Lost City Posts: 193 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Demon has more overall damage, better daily skills and pwnage offense.
    Sage has Chi farming and sage BIDS (Which I honestly don't think it's THAT useful, you have 50% chance (Which means you CAN fail) to max you Crit % by 30% (3/10 chance) for 10 seconds (2-3 skills max)) Also I'm still trying to figure out if DPyro and GSnare overwrite Undine Strike, because if it does, SAGE FTL KTHXBYE?
    Yes, I am going Demon.
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    Asoteric Runewolf just pwned you b:victory

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  • Shadowvzs - Lost City
    Shadowvzs - Lost City Posts: 877 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Lyzzern - Lost City wrote: »
    Demon has more overall damage, better daily skills and pwnage offense.
    Sage has Chi farming and sage BIDS (Which I honestly don't think it's THAT useful, you have 50% chance (Which means you CAN fail) to max you Crit % by 30% (3/10 chance) for 10 seconds (2-3 skills max)) Also I'm still trying to figure out if DPyro and GSnare overwrite Undine Strike, because if it does, SAGE FTL KTHXBYE?
    Yes, I am going Demon.

    idk but in tw i prefer the ultis than fast skill and yes if i need fast casting then there the sutra if i am chi farmer like u said xD
    if we talk about pve then i dont got the out dding part because most of time u use the 2 basic skill, u do more skill/spark, i use more spark/x time, u do a bit mroe dmg with gush, i do a bit more dmg with each skill but if we talk about who have bigger chance for agro steal then yes maybe the demon (stealing agro != allways u do higher dmg).
    about ur calculation, 10sec enough for a sutra and few fast skill xD BUT everybody choose what he like. I dont say sage better or worse just different, i choosed sage and i really love what i choosed, and this the important :p
  • /Groovy/ - Harshlands
    /Groovy/ - Harshlands Posts: 688 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Lyzzern - Lost City wrote: »
    Demon has more overall damage
    That's new, care to explain? o.O
    Lyzzern - Lost City wrote: »
    Also I'm still trying to figure out if DPyro and GSnare overwrite Undine Strike, because if it does, SAGE FTL KTHXBYE

    I've heard they do overwrite Undine.

    Doesn't matter though since it seems they are barely used in PvP when you get 3rd spark, other combo is much better: Undine -> Sutra -> Sandstorm -> ultimate -> random skills if something somehow survived :p

    In PvE (and OP is focused on PvE only) sage version is much better - they are used as openers so reduced channeling doesn't matter while debuff is useful to finish mob faster (and using Undine in PvE is a waste of mana).
    Packs World International
  • Ursa - Dreamweaver
    Ursa - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,634 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Lyzzern - Lost City wrote: »
    Demon has more overall damage,
    O.o
    better daily skills and pwnage offense.
    ...
    Sage has Chi farming and sage BIDS (Which I honestly don't think it's THAT useful, you have 50% chance (Which means you CAN fail) to max you Crit % by 30% (3/10 chance) for 10 seconds (2-3 skills max))
    you don't have a clue...really...none at all.
    Also I'm still trying to figure out if DPyro and GSnare overwrite Undine Strike, because if it does, SAGE FTL KTHXBYE?
    Yes, I am going Demon.
    Debuff doesn't stack with undine.

    Good for you for going demon. Less competition for books on Sage side.
    ____________
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    George Carlin

    ~I listen to hardcore FIGHT songs when I visit the forum, just to get into the proper mood~

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  • FireWizardEX - Dreamweaver
    FireWizardEX - Dreamweaver Posts: 463 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Damaged - Lost City wrote: »
    Sage for the ultis and masteries for mass pvp e.g. TW

    Demon for small man pvp

    Speaking from experience y0
    is truth however it doesnt means sages are bad in 1v1 or demons isnt good in multy pvp
    NonameWiz - Sanctuary wrote: »
    You like to gain chi quickly = Go Sage

    You like to control people + fast channeling spells + more pdef (cost a lot) + cool animation when you use demon spark? = Go demon.

    Sometimes, there is only 1 reason that's enough to make your decision.

    Gratz to you in advance whichever path you take.


    like if sage is just for chi and nothing else^^
    beside the chi helps alot spaming for ulties, sage black ice dragon have a crazy efect and is a strong aoe, and i love masteries^^



    anyway for pve i dont see a big diff, i would choose sage for + chi which means + ultis or whatever, but demon is good at pve too, if u can get demon earth barrier u will have a crazy +150% pdef and pyro casts faster; and u can spend 1 spark in wellspring quaff wihtout big problems beside that boost in mp u get -20% chan for 15sec, it helps in dps; gush and sandstorm gets add dmg and WOP have more aoe range.

    all this is info u must choose by ur own
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  • Shadowvzs - Lost City
    Shadowvzs - Lost City Posts: 877 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Ursa - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    O.o
    Good for you for going demon. Less competition for books on Sage side.

    rofl XD i thinked only i am the alone who happy for a new demon wizz on server instead sage b:laugh
    if u can get demon earth barrier u will have a crazy +150% pdef and pyro casts faster; and u can spend 1 spark in wellspring quaff wihtout big problems beside that boost in mp u get -20% chan for 15sec, it helps in dps; gush and sandstorm gets add dmg and WOP have more aoe range.

    u really grind on physical mobs instead water mobs? and u realized that +30% eq pdef how much dmg absorb at 92+?
    sry i like better the 3rd spark with 20%mana recovery than loseing 1spark and wasteing mana faster in pve :)

    sry but i think what u said more pvp oriented :P
  • FireWizardEX - Dreamweaver
    FireWizardEX - Dreamweaver Posts: 463 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Ursa - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Good for you for going demon. Less competition for books on Sage side.

    and this is why i stop arguing agains sage haters^^
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Whiteleo - Lost City
    Whiteleo - Lost City Posts: 285 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    guys if u are telling x > x then you are completely wrong
    both sage and demon has pros and cons

    imo, sage for damage per hit and demon for damage per second.
    most of the sage skills are weak compare with demon skills.
    the only thing we can say is sage BIDS and elemental misery and chi skill.
    demons has so many useful skill then sage
    stone rain, ember storm, earth barrier , Dshrink, Dpyro, Gush , SS etc..
    and demon spark 25% att+ and HP heal just can't compare with sage spark.
    but yes, i go sage, why? i don't pvp much and my goal is DPH, not DPS.
    as said, it just depend on your preference. b:thanks
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  • Ursa - Dreamweaver
    Ursa - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,634 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Whiteleo - Lost City wrote: »
    guys if u are telling x > x then you are completely wrong
    both sage and demon has pros and cons

    imo, sage for damage per hit and demon for damage per second.
    most of the sage skills are weak compare with demon skills.
    the only thing we can say is sage BIDS and elemental misery and chi skill.
    Elemental misery? well said b:victory . And I have all of them. Quite a diff I might say, abut 1300-1500/hit more, easily.
    demons has so many useful skill then sage
    stone rain, ember storm, earth barrier , Dshrink, Dpyro, Gush , SS etc..
    you realize that full buffed because if diminishing returns that pdef advantage (sage has 120% pdef too) is actually close to what, 1%, IF u get to +1%.
    and demon spark 25% att+ and HP heal just can't compare with sage spark.
    Demon spark HEALS? since when?
    but yes, i go sage, why? i don't pvp much and my goal is DPH, not DPS.
    as said, it just depend on your preference. b:thanks
    yeah, I enjoy the sage advantages too. We have the biggest and baddest skill in game, 4th spam skill (SR), and PvE is free.
    But I can see why 1v1 the Demon has the upper hand. But seriously, for 1v1 PvP if u chose a wizard over an archer u have some serious problems upstairs.
    ____________
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    George Carlin

    ~I listen to hardcore FIGHT songs when I visit the forum, just to get into the proper mood~

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Whiteleo - Lost City
    Whiteleo - Lost City Posts: 285 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Ursa - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Demon spark HEALS? since when?

    ahh my bad, i confused with demon Dragon's Breath , rofl b:laugh
    Ursa - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    But I can see why 1v1 the Demon has the upper hand. But seriously, for 1v1 PvP if u chose a wizard over an archer u have some serious problems upstairs.
    because there is no choice , we love magic we go wizard
    archer can cast cool black ice dragon like wiz? b:chuckle
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  • Damaged - Lost City
    Damaged - Lost City Posts: 460 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Ursa - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    But I can see why 1v1 the Demon has the upper hand. But seriously, for 1v1 PvP if u chose a wizard over an archer u have some serious problems upstairs.

    Lol yea if you suck at PVP, how else do I solo 18k hp+ charmed barbs and +10 archers on a regular basis with non csed gear 1v1? b:kiss
  • Ehee - Lost City
    Ehee - Lost City Posts: 44 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    no money > sage
    some money > demon
    unlimited money > sage

    that is all
    me gush you.
  • Whiteleo - Lost City
    Whiteleo - Lost City Posts: 285 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Ehee - Lost City wrote: »
    no money > sage
    some money > demon
    unlimited money > sage

    that is all

    i have no money so.., i made da correct choice b:laugh
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  • Kristoph - Lost City
    Kristoph - Lost City Posts: 2,016 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Damaged - Lost City wrote: »
    Lol yea if you suck at PVP, how else do I solo 18k hp+ charmed barbs and +10 archers on a regular basis with non csed gear 1v1? b:kiss
    Soloing barbs with under 20k HP is easy... because we're made to do it. It's like saying archers can kill robe users easily.
    Wondering how much longer these **** packs are going to be around.
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Ehee - Lost City wrote: »
    no money > sage
    some money > demon
    unlimited money > sage

    that is all
    Whiteleo - Lost City wrote: »
    i have no money so.., i made da correct choice b:laugh

    b:laugh
    yay~ same here!
    high five!
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  • Cheaper - Heavens Tear
    Cheaper - Heavens Tear Posts: 128 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Kimicat - Sanctuary wrote: »
    OK peeps i am SOOOOO close to having to make this decision and every thread ive read is basically yelling at each other BLAH BLAH BLAH anyway. just tell me in plain terms PLEASE what is best for a wizard who does not pvp or tw demon or sage?
    Kimicat - Sanctuary wrote: »
    =/ *sigh* i need help seriously im tied between the two and cant make my decision. demon skills look really good to me but its hard to find the books BUT sage looks good too and the books are easy to find

    Let's just pretend all the books are free and you can get whatever book you want when you're ready, remove the money barrier for a sec. This would make the decision a lot easier.

    It's not easy to level up to 89 so choose very carefully. Pick the one you truly like. Simply looking over the skill effects gained from it being sage or demon, and what skills you use the most. You want effects you like on your favorite skills.

    A lot of the comments you may read are very one sided, don't let them confuse you. Sage can do 1v1 like a demon, and demon can AoE like a sage. Skill effects just help a little with certain things, but the skill damage on both sides are pretty much the same.

    This is a decision you wana make on your own.
    Just trying to make it easier to choose :)
    omg im posting stuff.
  • Kristoph - Lost City
    Kristoph - Lost City Posts: 2,016 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    You can't really go wrong either way... what you choose really doesn't matter, look at the tiny differences and try figuring out what you prefer.


    And to all the idiots who think demon barrier doesn't matter because of the way pdef works... use your common sense please. A demon mage can get the same pdef as a sage one with less pdef shards/gear, meaning you can trade stuff around which results in more HP with the same pdef.


    Learn how to build a damn mage, ffs.
    Wondering how much longer these **** packs are going to be around.
  • Damaged - Lost City
    Damaged - Lost City Posts: 460 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Kristoph - Lost City wrote: »
    Soloing barbs with under 20k HP is easy... because we're made to do it. It's like saying archers can kill robe users easily.

    Thanks for reinforcing my point, yaaay...

    Btw hurry up and get into Kamisama already so we can engage in primeval pixelated online f2p mmorpg combat
  • Lusca - Sanctuary
    Lusca - Sanctuary Posts: 754 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Cholla - Harshlands wrote: »
    b:laugh

    Trial and error tells me that a level 100 demon with 6269 unbuffed pdef would have a 1% damage reduction advantage over a level 100 sage with the same unbuffed pdef. This assumes that the wizards also have their cleric and blademaster buffs for physical defense and that the buffing blademaster was a sage. With any other assumptions (except for a brief burst of pdef from a demon buff), your wizards would need more unbuffed physical defense for their damage reduction difference to be 1%.

    But with this much physical defense and these buffs, our sage would have almost 89% damage reduction and our demon would have almost 90% damage reduction. This means that our demon could absorb almost 10% more physical damage than our sage. If this difference was worthless, then that +5% health offered by a sky demon's pearl must also be worthless.

    does no one read kristophs posts?

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