Petition to remove Defense Charms from the game

limonazza said:

eirghan wrote: »

Except that in addition to bolsters for defense (HP passive) we also saw two nerfs to it (the introduction of charm tick passive and penetration stats).



Once HP passive reaches end game so will everyone's charm tick passive and eventually, higher level penetration stats on star charts. It's basically impossible to survive without defense charms mitigating damage for a portion of the time you are attacked. As Asterelle mentioned, you can almost wait out an entire IG and your charm still will not tick due to the charm tick passive.



Defense charms are probably going to be somewhat necessary for open world PVP and TW. Anyway, nothing is finished yet, no one has even close to "end game" star charts (will they ever?), very few have level 5 charm tick passive, no one has completed both passives... And who knows, maybe there will be level ten of those passives as well.

bloodedone87 said:

Let me correct the title of this thread:
Petition to remove Defense Charms from game. Charms that only matters in PVP cause in PVE you can survive without them. Therefor charms that only 10% of pwi players care about cause thats your PvP atm in PWI.
BTW this is just a poll not a petition. Petition is something else.

dingo488 wrote: »

mp regen to be a significant stat (basically u cant random spam all ur skill but have to manage ur mana);
balance to damage and especially healing.

and then maybe we'd have a game where u actually have to be a skilled player, where frontline is frontline, backline is backline and everyone that doesnt play by those rules just gets destroyed.

doods00 wrote: »

They can , they aren't allowed too, literally. Everything they are allowed comes from china. Not sure if they translate it here or they get a rough translation and then do some clean up. there was more independence in the past with there being more differences but they have half attempted to line them up over the years.

dingo488 wrote: »

People are just randomly throwing arguments at eachother that dont even relate to eachother, and it feels to me people have a very poor understanding what Def Charms do in the bigger picture. Saying stuff like ''Defense charms are probably going to be somewhat necessary for open world PVP and TW' as a seeker and ''defense charms are a life saver'' are very much invalid arguments as your opponent has this ''live saver'' aswell. To explain what Defense Charms really do, there are 2 situations we need to take into account. 1v1 and large scale PvP.

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As its easiest to start with the 1v1 scenario Ill start there. Ill give classes +1 point for any positive factor and -1 point for anything negative. As defense charm ticks are completely based on time (cooldown) their effectiveness is dependant entirely on who you are fighting. Its all about how many of your hits (%) get cut by the defense charm which is tied to the interval between your hits.

Classes that have a short interval between hits are: Archers/Assassin/Duskblade ( + 1 )
Classes that have a long interval between hits are: Wizard/Seeker/Cleric ( - 1 )
The other classes are kinda in the middle

Now another factor is how reliant are these classes on the damage of a single skill or combo with a high cooldown. And need this combo to actively apply kill pressure.

Classes that are highly reliant on this: Wizard/Seeker/Blademaster ( - 1 )
Classes that dont depend on this at all: Archers/Assassin ( + 1 )
The other classes are kinda in the middle

As you can see its very similar to the previous category, but that makes sense due to balancing classes -> DPS vs DPH

Now another factor is the way to block charm usage thru stuns/paralysis. Since this can basically lock the opponent out of using their charms completely, no casters will be listed here since I feel purify proc helps this exact point to your own benefit.

Classes that have a lot of CC to do this: Assassins/Blademaster/Barbarian/Duskblade ( + 1 )
Classes that have next to no CC: Seeker/Archer ( - 1 )

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I feel these are the 3 main factors that come into play when it comes down to a 1v1 scenario. Most magic classes are left out due to the nature of our magic classes, most our magic classes are DPS classes tho their DPS isnt fast enough to stand out amongst all the classes in the game. Adding the scores paints a pretty good picture on how Defense Charms affect classes in a 1v1 Scenario.

Assassin: 3 points
Duskblade: 2 points
Archer: 1 point
Barbarian: 1 point
Wizard: -2 points
Seeker: -3 points

all classes that got no mention are on 0 points as I feel the defense charms dont give them an advantage/disadvantage over the average of all the classes in 1v1 scenario.

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Now the second category is large scale PvP. For this scenario I wont make a point system as its very easy to explain who benefits here and who doesnt. I want to compare how tanky someone is to how rich someone is to make it clear. We have 5 people:

Billy (seeker) is a millionaire (because seekers are really tanky)
Johnny (BM) is also a millionaire
Greg (Archer) is pretty poor
Sally (Wizard) is doing alright for herself
Dmitry (Cleric) is pretty poor

Now adding Defense Charms is like giving all 5 of these people 1 million bucks.

Billy and Johnny are still millionaire's.

but suddenly Greg, Sally and Dmitry are millionaire's too, and Billy and Johnny are like...wtf please

''But its nice that everyone is a millionaire right?''

No, its not. Billy and Johnny need to be millionaire's as they are frontline classes. (Tho Billy sometimes is a bit of a wuss and plays like he's a backline class, thats just Billy being a bad Billy -> Good Billy's are frontliners) And as frontliners Billy and Johnny have a hard life, they lose a lot of their wealth each second they are in the frontline. Greg, Sally and Dmitry are never in the frontline, they dont lose any of their money and suddenly they are in a more comfortable position than Johnny and Billy.

Billy and Johnny have a huge bulls-eye on their forehead, they get hit 20 times per second and their Defense charms will only block 8 of those hits! So 12 hits per second dont get blocked.

Greg, Sally and Dmitry are back out in a nice place, they get hit 5 times per second and their Defense Charms block all 5 of those! So 0 hits per second dont get blocked.

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Le Conclusion.

When it comes to 1v1 PvP, the classes that are highly reliant on DPH and have a low amount of CC get absolutely shafted (RIP Wizard/Seeker)

When it comes to large scale PvP, all frontline classes get shafted by Defense Charms as ranged classes gain an unfair amount of Defense.

Because everyone loves winners and losers, the biggest winner from Defense Charms are Archers.

Is this fair?
Yes, Archer have been a pretty weak class for a while now, so they definately need some love.

The biggest loser from Defense Charms are Seekers.

Is this fair?
No, Seekers used to be OP, but since cards came out the class was very much balanced, if not on the weaker side of the scale. These Defense Charms pretty much render them useless.