PVE Event that gives Tokens Please

SashaGray - Heavens Tear

you dont need r9s3 for BH100 or delta.

the endgame has always been geared towards PvP.

the PvE instances have not kept up with the power-creep of the gear.

nationwars is no-consequence and free, aside from HP pots and charms (if you chose to use them)

I dont see a legitimate reason to make PvP rewards PvE obtainable.

suck it up, cupcake

Cotillion - Dreamweaver

Deant - Raging Tide wrote: »

What is that got to do with it? Anyway - when i see TT squads there is no requirement, no requirement for BH/full delta/EU/AEU - NW (can go w/o squads like me) Nirvana died - ppl had requirements for that.

While I agree that there shouldn't be any requirement.....sadly we have dummies on DW who insist on requiring weapon and gear links for bh100. And looking for perfect rainbow squads for bhI Delta, which is a joke considering you can normally faceroll it if you even halfways know what you're doing with any mix of classes.
None of the PvE content in this game requires what comes from the NW rewards in any way.
It's really only gear to be used for PvP/NW/TW....PvP gear rewards from PvP content. Seems right to me.

SynfulDream - Dreamweaver

xvokcx wrote: »

We pve'rs want some way to get tokens also, only people who pvp have access to them , i'd say that's unfair bs..............

I was not a PVP player either and still am not outside of NWs but have found it to be pretty fun if you can get over some of the frustration in getting from one place to another. Has also honed how I use my skills and made me revamp my genie w/ new skills that have helped a lot in PVE. The only thing you lose in NWs are charms-doesn't affect experience at all. If you haven't tried, I would give it at least 2x's-the first is just finding your way around lol. Good luck

Annalyse - Heavens Tear

Nowitsawn - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Exactly this.

Saying that ''Nirvana is still farmable'' just makes me question your sanity. Even if you grind your *** off in there for an entire week, NW will earn you double the amount in 4 hours.

NW offers some nice rewards with the tokens, some of which are not tradeable. Having access to those through PvE means would only be fair, but as was stated before, it should not also give pvpers even more tokens.


My suggestion? You already need a token to enter NW, give PvE players the option of turning this token in for a weekly quest (=at the cost of passing up participating in the war). Would take a large amount of regular mobs to kill along with a few bosses and would generally take a few days to complete if you take it easy. The reward would be an average amount of tokens.

+1

I really like this idea. I've always been purely PvE, but since I could no longer farm Caster to complete my half done projects, I felt forced to try NW. And what did I find (despite all these people posting telling PvErs to try it because it's fun)? I hated it. But I feel that I have no other option really, since I don't want to be forced to buy the mats, so even though I dread it I make myself run it. If there was any PvE option available to get the same rewards, you would never see me in NW again.

Not to mention the fact that PWI gave us an expansion offering up this exciting new PvE gear and weapons, which a lot of us went for.... then turns around and offers rewards which you can only get by PvPing, which of course the gear we just went and bought is entirely unsuitable for.

And for those of you saying "why do you need better gear if you only PvE?" First of all, some of us like to have goals, and the goals might include upgrading gear. Secondly, there are a lot of things like full Warsong runs where people are picky and demand a certain level of gear. And maybe some people just want more survivability in certain situations, like wizards who run RB a lot, or barbs that want more HP than Morai gear can provide (it doesn't have a lot). It doesn't matter the reason, the choice is our own. And where we used to be able to farm the gear, NW effectively killed off the PvE instances and now we are stuck buying. And never having options at things like necklace engraving. So I think we have the right to be irritated about this.

Cotillion - Dreamweaver

IMO, this PvE argument is moot.

For PvE, g15 gear via Morai is available. It is available via farming PvE means and used for PvE content. The ease to farm this and cheap crafting costs, dirt cheap rerollable stats, plus superb bonuses that do not apply to PvP make this gear ideal for any and all PvE in PWI.

For PvP, upgrades and gear via NW are available. Obtainable via PvP means and only needed for PvP events/instances/circumstances. Nothing obtainable via NW is remotely needed for PvE.

Whats the problem?

**EDIT**
Also...if PvE is truly as dead as the advocates for this claim.....what do you need the gear for to begin with, then? There's nothing to use it in according to you, since you're not going to PvP in any way, shape or form.
And its a far stretch to say it's needed for any bh's.

MANray_ - Sanctuary

I'm not going to get into the reasons that may prevent some people from PvP'ing but the point that I would like to make is that most players have to cope with one form of disadvantage or another. Many of us wouldn't make it a habit to play for six hours straight even if we could afford to (much less the 12 hours some people are reporting) and there's plenty of players for whom charging zhen is out of the question. Many get disadvantaged because for whatever their reasons they choose not to join factions. Others have learned to live with low spec rigs and bad connections. Some of us deal with the consequences of our playstyle choices; I don't powerlevel and I won't acquire a herc.

My point is in here we are all equal, and whatever disadvantages irl circumstances or your personal choices impose on you it comes down to whether you can cope and continue playing or not. I don't mean to come across as mean or uncaring, but while it is legitimate to pursue the solution of problems that affect a large part of the population (eg timezones) it isn't reasonable to expect that whatever small inconvenience that aplies to any particular player will be acomodated by PWI. And yes, I am calling the effects of NW a small inconvenience for two reasons.

1. You still have PvE farming available to you. Granted it isn't as profitable as before BUT the prices of raps and cannies have gone down in proportion meaning all other things being equal you should still be able to acquire your gears in the same amount of time and through the same amount of effort.

"Oh, but there's also refines and sharding my gear" which brings me to

2. NW is far more inclussive than Nirvana ever was, and further is much more fun. Those complaining now were perfectly satisfied with a system that was exclusive of most low levels, casuals, f2ps, moderate CSers, etc. Yes, some people are now being excluded but not nearly as much as before so, overall, I would call this a good thing for the community at large. It really is very hard for me to simpathize with elitist entitlement, things are bound to change in MMOs and in every change there's bound to be losers. There wasn't much in the way of sympathy shown to many of us when the shoe was on the other foot, but now that the tables are turned it seems apparent many people are unwilling to follow the advice that was given to us. "Try merchanting, you'll make billions in a few months" or "Look for a faction that will magically solve all your problems" or "Support the game you freeloader"... How about "if you can't make it is because you're lazy and looking for handouts"? Well you're now in the same place as people who couldn't link weapons good enough to join your little clubs...

I don't agree with a PvE alternative to NW. It's a very different thing to talk about some adjustments to rewards for PvE content, but I would think the priority here should be the people impacted by DQ nerfs rather than the under 10 min Vana farmers...

Edit; And yeah, the most ridiculous part about this is that other than vanity or greedy speed farming you don't actually need gear that's better than TT99. G15 Morai already is overkill in terms of access to PvE content as it is...

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear

SashaGray - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I dont see a legitimate reason to make PvP rewards PvE obtainable.

I see a very legit reason to make nation war tokens "PvE obtainable". It would double (maybe triple) my rate of token acquisition. Kiyo can do enough damage to pull 1 freeloading leecher in to the top 5 in tiger event or 2-3 freeloading leechers in to the top 10. I can't wait to be rolling around in even more tokens.

Darkette - Sanctuary

Funny, I'm not finding PvE dead at all. Each morning I get on my veno, do BH79 and my Morei daily. At least twice weekly this includes a foray into BH89 which, done solo, takes a while. After that I get on my Barb and Cleric and multibox BH69 and usually a BH79 boss. Every few days I'll cleanup whatever Divine quests I've received. On any given day, if I have time, I take my veno into TT to grind for mats. If I'm feeling really energetic, I've also got a level 77 Psychic, 77 Cleric, 80 Archer, and 84 Sin to run through BHs. My days of doing PvE are pretty full. After that, I usually spend a few minutes on the forum or going over Class guides. Even if I had the desire, there'd be no time remaining for PvP, NW, or TW.

What does aggrieve me are statements like, "r9 is now the minimally acceptable gear." In and of itself, that attitude is exclusionary, elitist, and plays on the myth that those of us who aren't engaged in PvP are somehow lesser human beings. I'm fortunate enough to have the option to purchase r9, I've simply chosen not to engage in a vanity exercise that won't benefit me in a practical way.

I don't give a big flying fig if NW tokens are made available to PvE players or not. They're absolutely irrelevant to my goals. My Sin will go 5.0, but only so my choice of farming locations can be extended.

Nowitsawn - Heavens Tear

Cotillion - Dreamweaver wrote: »

IMO, this PvE argument is moot.

For PvE, g15 gear via Morai is available.

But, then again, so is yours.

Pve is a gear treadmill, simple as that. I don't think many people do pve for the fun factor, because then I doubt we'd have many old-time pve'ers around, as most dungeons and events kind of lose their charm after the second time around.

It's that carrot on a stick, that next upgrade to your equipment, that keeps a lot of people going. Seems like a useless goal for just pve? Well, it works fine as entertainment for a lot of people. Saying that XXX gear is good enough for pve is like saying ''you've finished the game, now get out'' to these people.

And now they see their goals being handed out to other people in an event that they don't want to (or, even worse; can't) join, and they're left behind with the way inferior method of inching toward that next upgrade, or are pretty much excluded from it entirely.

Eoria - Harshlands

SashaGray - Heavens Tear wrote: »

you dont need r9s3 for BH100 or delta.

the endgame has always been geared towards PvP.

the PvE instances have not kept up with the power-creep of the gear.

nationwars is no-consequence and free, aside from HP pots and charms (if you chose to use them)

I dont see a legitimate reason to make PvP rewards PvE obtainable.

suck it up, cupcake

This +1.

Darkette - Sanctuary

Nowitsawn - Heavens Tear wrote: »

But, then again, so is yours.

Pve is a gear treadmill, simple as that. I don't think many people do pve for the fun factor, because then I doubt we'd have many old-time pve'ers around, as most dungeons and events kind of lose their charm after the second time around.

It's that carrot on a stick, that next upgrade to your equipment, that keeps a lot of people going. Seems like a useless goal for just pve? Well, it works fine as entertainment for a lot of people. Saying that XXX gear is good enough for pve is like saying ''you've finished the game, now get out'' to these people.

And now they see their goals being handed out to other people in an event that they don't want to (or, even worse; can't) join, and they're left behind with the way inferior method of inching toward that next upgrade, or are pretty much excluded from it entirely.

I disagree. Having started in this game in 2008, I guess I'm an "old timer." Also, my goal has never included having the very best gear, though what I have is certainly adequate for my level and pertinent challenges. I started out with clerics and continued to reroll them until I was confident that I was competent. Now, I'm playing a variety of other classes with the same goal of being competent with each.

"End game" gear for my Barb will be TT99 because his purpose in life is to get my current alts through BH69. My 100 Cleric and and 96 Veno can get them through everythhing else. "End game" gear for my other alts will likely be a combination of TT99, Rank VIII, and Morei (my Sin being an exception for 5.0 aps).

In short, uber gear and ever higher levels haven't the same allure for me as just becoming good with my stable of Classes. I've gotten pretty damned good at multiboxing, and that has given me more satisfaction than anything else I've done in this game.

Eoria - Harshlands

Darkette - Sanctuary wrote: »

"End game" gear for my other alts will likely be a combination of TT99, Rank VIII, and Morei (my Sin being an exception for 5.0 aps).

For the price of r8 nowadays, you could get a g16 Nirv wep.

Darkette - Sanctuary

Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »

For the price of r8 nowadays, you could get a g16 Nirv wep.

Why? I don't level my alts above 100, and because it takes me a very long time to level, reputation is never a big issue. Again, having a G16 Nirvana weapon is irrelevant to my needs; in fact, for what I do it's a case of diminishing returns.

I've long subscribed to an old saying that goes: The greatest enemy of good is better.

Cotillion - Dreamweaver

Nowitsawn - Heavens Tear wrote: »

But, then again, so is yours.

Pve is a gear treadmill, simple as that. I don't think many people do pve for the fun factor, because then I doubt we'd have many old-time pve'ers around, as most dungeons and events kind of lose their charm after the second time around.

It's that carrot on a stick, that next upgrade to your equipment, that keeps a lot of people going. Seems like a useless goal for just pve? Well, it works fine as entertainment for a lot of people. Saying that XXX gear is good enough for pve is like saying ''you've finished the game, now get out'' to these people.

And now they see their goals being handed out to other people in an event that they don't want to (or, even worse; can't) join, and they're left behind with the way inferior method of inching toward that next upgrade, or are pretty much excluded from it entirely.

The argument is moot, because they want PvE rewards for PvP equipment. You think the complaints are bad now? Wait until those of us doing NW also get PvE rewards as well when NW isn't on. Then it's unfair because we get 2 or 3x the amount.

Nirvana excluded a lot of people. And the people outraged for a long time. Now...enter NW.
Its open to anyone and everyone over level 60. Its wide range of player levels and non-exclusive gear requirements make it essentially Nirvana-for-all.
Ofc people will complain regardless its what they wanted. It doesnt conform exactly how and when they wanted it, and so we get these topics. There's little to nothing (outside time schedules) thats preventing anyone over level 60 from entering. Lucky enough to land in the dominating nation, rack up some personal contribution and you're set.
People are not being excluded in any way (besides timing) and if they rather grind for the 2 hours NW is on, that was their choice to do so.

I am not saying the game is not 'over' for people who have enough gear for PvE content. They are saying that themselves. Because to them PvE is dead as has been stated many times by people in this topic. If its so dead to them, why do they want it?
All PvE farming, besides Nirvana, is still viable to upgrade gears if you don't want to go to NW. Honestly, I'm making more from PvE farming now that NW is here than I did before.
The markets and farming are still there....they've just shifted. And if they take the time to look and adjust to where and how it has shifted, rather than come here with topics about being entitled to PvE rewards because they refuse to do the event provided, they could do well.

Eoria - Harshlands

Darkette - Sanctuary wrote: »

Why? I don't level my alts above 100, and because it takes me a very long time to level, reputation is never a big issue. Again, having a G16 Nirvana weapon is irrelevant to my needs; in fact, for what I do it's a case of diminishing returns.

I've long subscribed to an old saying that goes: The greatest enemy of good is better.

But g16 Nirv is better than r8 and you can use it at level 100. Also, I doubt you get enough rep from quests to r8 at 100 without buying rep. 72 gold for r8 rep with gold at 1.6m = ~115m. 250 raps at about 400k + tt99 pataka = ~105m. The g16 also gives you the option of acc stashing and thus saving you a lot of money if your alts are on the same account. Or hell, even if they aren't, buying a Lunar wep so the g16 Nirv remains unbound will still be cheaper since you wouldn't have to r8 both cleric and veno.

It sounds like you're being willfully difficult just for the sake of it.

MANray_ - Sanctuary

Nowitsawn - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Pve is a gear treadmill, simple as that. I don't think many people do pve for the fun factor, because then I doubt we'd have many old-time pve'ers around, as most dungeons and events kind of lose their charm after the second time around.

Fair enough, but just the same as with gear upgrades you do have to realize things are bound to change, sometimes even at a moment's notice, and that you're not entitled to status quo. PvE content hasn't all become obsolete and worthless, just one instance and two items in commerce are impacted here. Yes, I do realize this was a big money maker for some but that really is an entirely different issue.

It's that carrot on a stick, that next upgrade to your equipment, that keeps a lot of people going. Seems like a useless goal for just pve? Well, it works fine as entertainment for a lot of people. Saying that XXX gear is good enough for pve is like saying ''you've finished the game, now get out'' to these people.

But their goals remain available to them, in fact for those merchanting or CSing they became easier to accomplish. As for some gear being good enough for PvE, the argument here is that they don't need any more to access content or progress through the game. It's one thing to complain about real obstacles to progression (eg the DQ nerf) quite another to get upset over the extras. Fashion is only available through the boutique and no one with any shred of common sense complains about that.

And now they see their goals being handed out to other people in an event that they don't want to (or, even worse; can't) join, and they're left behind with the way inferior method of inching toward that next upgrade, or are pretty much excluded from it entirely.

Now, this is just jealousy and greed. Their goals are now objectively easier to accomplish but the thing that upsets them is others can now get the same stuff? If they won't PvP then it really is their choice, if they can't, well, I do hope this gets resolved for the EU players, but certainly those that couldn't access Nirvana before outnumber those that can't access NW now.

Seriously man, most of the people complaining now are the same who were content shoving down their "let them eat cake" attitude down everybody else's throat. And in any event, they're much better off than the people trying to access Vana were not so long ago.

SMASHnHEAL - Dreamweaver

So my understanding on the matter is that pve players are upset at the fact that people are able to make more coin in the 2 hours of NW than they could in a day of farming, not necessarily that pve instances are dead.

The game doesn't just stop for the week when NW is not on, instances are still there and there is still a small profit to made during the week. If people are truly pve players then they would be farming these instances for the drops to upgrade their gear rather to sell to use the coin on who knows what. And yes I understand that selling mats then buying the gear you need is usually a lot cheaper.

All NW is doing is providing people with a means to get top tier gear faster which is largely designed for pvp anyway as let's face it before the update who really needed r9rr or even r9/g16 to do any instance in this game? Yes this is a little unfair to those that can not make it to NW or who refuse to do pvp but it does not stop people from enjoying the rest of the game. Maybe people will start running instances in groups for the rewards of completing them as a mmorpg should be rather, than the elitist farmers that solo everything. Since this update I have done more pve than before with warsong and lunar being extremely active (far better instances to play than boring nivana)

omgihateyou

WHY does anyone bother with these So called SUpply Tokens , it doesnt matter where they come from right now, They will be soon in packs in the Cash Shop available to everyone with a dollar in their pocket. Then NW will be as dead as it is Nirvana, the last decent instance that was -

Darkette - Sanctuary

Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »

It sounds like you're being willfully difficult just for the sake of it.

My route:

My veno, at level-96, has 37589 reputation (I've been playing her since early 2009).

Reputation is in Boutique for 45 Silver per 50 badges @ 25 rep per badge (or .1,250 rep per bundle)

Veno needs 162,411 rep for R8; so 162,411 / 1,250 = 130 bundles (rounded up from 129.9288)

45 silver x 130 = 58.5 gold

For shucks, let's say gold is selling for 1,550,000 each; that's a coin cost of 90,675,000 coins.

The R8 weapon will cost an additional 1M, for a grand total of about 91,675,000 coins.

Also, keep in mind I plan on equipping R8 chest and legs on my veno. Yes, yes, yes, I know Morei is better, but as I said, once my alts reach 100 I use them for nothing but supporting my other alts. Leveling to 101 just to equip Morei gear isn't worth it to me.


Going your route:

250 raps @ 400K each = 100,000,000 coins

Purchasing or crafting a comparable TT99 weapon will add several more million to this.


I grant you the G16 weapon is superior to the R8, but I don't need it. Currently, my only other alt capable of equipping it is level-84; she's not only on another account, but will take several more months before she reaches 100. Swapping weapons is a moot issue. Moreover, even if I could it would negate the possibility of me multiboxing the two alts.

My other principal alts are a Barb, Sin, Archer, and Psych, and I highly doubt they'll be sharing weapons.

I'm not being "difficult," merely pragmatic.

Eoria - Harshlands

Darkette - Sanctuary wrote: »

Stuff

lol. Rap and canny prices will continue to fall as more get into rotation and less people need them for gear and tt99 gold weps were already cheap to make for the most part. Meanwhile, gold will probably stay a constant 1.3m-2m depending on what's on sale.

g16 Nirvana and normal r9 are essentially becoming the minimal standards in terms of gear now.

Angel_Spawn - Sanctuary

Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »

lol. Rap and canny prices will continue to fall as more get into rotation and less people need them for gear and tt99 gold weps were already cheap to make for the most part. Meanwhile, gold will probably stay a constant 1.3m-2m depending on what's on sale.

g16 Nirvana and normal r9 are essentially becoming the minimal standards in terms of gear now.

Prices have already plummeted below 400k for raps, just a matter of time till people will no longer exchange tokens for raps/cannies in means of selling them, in stead they will get seals of war, rr8 mats (tradeable ones) or ws mats, I wonder how low is low enough which will result in every1 doing this, personally I already started it. b:lipcurl

SMASHnHEAL - Dreamweaver

Angel_Spawn - Sanctuary wrote: »

Prices have already plummeted below 400k for raps, just a matter of time till people will no longer exchange tokens for raps/cannies in means of selling them, in stead they will get seals of war, rr8 mats (tradeable ones) or ws mats, I wonder how low is low enough which will result in every1 doing this, personally I already started it. b:lipcurl

There has already been a small switch in Dreamweaver to Seal of Wars and the nivana market is flooded. I give it a week or two and what you said above will be the norm (I'm personally hoping the cost of seal of wars will drop some more before I start buying) b:thanks

Darkette - Sanctuary

Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »

lol. Rap and canny prices will continue to fall as more get into rotation and less people need them for gear and tt99 gold weps were already cheap to make for the most part. Meanwhile, gold will probably stay a constant 1.3m-2m depending on what's on sale.

g16 Nirvana and normal r9 are essentially becoming the minimal standards in terms of gear now.

And when there's sufficient economic justification to go with g16, I will adjust accordingly. My point being is that unlike the carrot-and-stick motivation suggested by an earlier poster, not all of us are dancing to that beat.

Many of you have a specific goal of achieving level cap with the very best gear possible. Nothing wrong with that; it's how the game was designed. Contrariwise, I have no particular desire to reach cap, and the "best" gear for me is that which allows me to complete desired tasks, no more, no less.

Several posters have suggested PvE'ers are QQing about not getting tokens other than in NW. I'm merely making the point that such is not the case for all of us; rather it's quite the contrary.

SashaGray - Heavens Tear

Darkette - Sanctuary wrote: »

And when there's sufficient economic justification to go with g16, I will adjust accordingly. My point being is that unlike the carrot-and-stick motivation suggested by an earlier poster, not all of us are dancing to that beat.

Many of you have a specific goal of achieving level cap with the very best gear possible. Nothing wrong with that; it's how the game was designed. Contrariwise, I have no particular desire to reach cap, and the "best" gear for me is that which allows me to complete desired tasks, no more, no less.

Several posters have suggested PvE'ers are QQing about not getting tokens other than in NW. I'm merely making the point that such is not the case for all of us; rather it's quite the contrary.

well if you are not dancing to the beat of the song thats written, dont expect the song to change to fit your dance.

Darkette - Sanctuary

SashaGray - Heavens Tear wrote: »

well if you are not dancing to the beat of the song thats written, dont expect the song to change to fit your dance.

Wow! Read much?

I don't do NW. I have no need for NW tokens.

Can I parse those two sentences in a way that makes it easier for you to understand?

Eoria - Harshlands

Darkette - Sanctuary wrote: »

Wow! Read much?

I don't do NW. I have no need for NW tokens.

Can I parse those two sentences in a way that makes it easier for you to understand?

Then why are you even posting on this thread if you have no interest in NW?

MANray_ - Sanctuary

There seems to be a certain inertia to item prices however, and I think the trend for raps right now is for them to stabilize around 400k (I sold last Sunday's batch for 450k each) with cannies at 80k on the 5 to 1 ratio. In any case I would be very surprised if raps got as low as 300k. The reason for this is that even as we've seen markets flooded with many people trying to cash in fast, and using their tokens to manufacture the easier to sell crystals, demand remains high probably out of fear that NW will get the nerf hammer. What we'll be seeing in the future is a number of players migrating to trading in potentially more profitable and harder to sell items, as well as keeping a larger number of tokens for personal use. Even those still trying to cash in are likely to limit supplies of crystals as better cash flows allow them to hold for better profits, while re-sellers will start threading more carefully in order not to hurt the prices of their stock.

SashaGray - Heavens Tear

Darkette - Sanctuary wrote: »

Wow! Read much?

I don't do NW. I have no need for NW tokens.

Can I parse those two sentences in a way that makes it easier for you to understand?

seems like a silly topic to be posting in then, doesn't it

Baby_pho - Heavens Tear

raps in ht are 550k ea, i still sold my raps for 720k last week. o.o it seems bad everywhere else maybe.

Darkette - Sanctuary

Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »

Then why are you even posting on this thread if you have no interest in NW?

Well, my truculent friend, this thread isn't about NW, it's about a desire for availability of tokens outside NW - something I oppose.

Since I'm tempted to return your cattiness in kind, I will bow out as you suggest.

Do have a most pleasant day.