Nation Wars: New Time Slots?

Angel_Spawn - Sanctuary

Silok - Lost City wrote: »

*facepalm* For a student, I'm ashamed to have to explain to you that international does not mean the same thing as global. It is called international because this version of the game in based in the US and was made with all nations in North and South America in mind. The GMs and other older players have explained this over and over again until the horse has been beaten into nothing but a pile of dust.

And somehow they don`t mind when Euro player cash rolls in do they?

Silok - Lost City

Angel_Spawn - Sanctuary wrote: »

And somehow they don`t mind when Euro player cash rolls in do they?

They sure don't, but anyone with IP addresses outside of those two continents are lucky our version only IP blocks those in regions that have other versions of PW from playing instead of being the type of game that only allows you to play if you have an IP assigned to countries for which the version was intended. That being said, if you sign up for servers whose primary audience is the Americas then complain when the events are set at a time of day to benefit the player base of those countries, well there's not much I can say for you. Would it be fair to our players who live on the other side of Atlantic and Pacific to not have it set to 8PM sever time? Sure. But until the vast majority of the players aren't in the US, don't count on it happening soon. Granted, they tried to use the Euro servers to solve the times issues for players over there, but as people have said throughout the forums, that doesn't make things easier for all those Euro players who don't speak German or French nor does it help our established Euro players who are 100+, R8 or higher geared when there's no way to likely ever be able to transfer characters between servers without overwriting other characters due to having the same name or because many of the servers do not share the same character database.

MANray_ - Sanctuary

I would agree on adding ONE more time slot a week to accomodate European players, TWO TOPS. The problem with more is, as has been pointed out earlier, that in order to keep it fun you need a good number of players, having it twice a day would destroy this aspect.

Also, it would overwhelmingly benefit the no lifers and those apparently somehow able to play 24/7 which would restablish status quo (heavy CSers and no lifers getting all the advantages, everyone else just "happy" to log in) especially as there are now new upgrade options available only through NW which would otherwise require months to obtain.

Finally, having this is as a rare no more than 2-3 times a week event gives you something to look forward to and work for (much like TW for the small minority that could participate in it). Most of us will likely get to do it no more than once a week since, as convenient as friday nights may be from a school/work schedule perspective, they are pretty much prime time for those of us with active social lives. The schedule, as it is right now, its pretty much reasonable for those of us living in the Western hemisphere. The service, for practical reasons, is meant to accomodate US residents, however much some may insist on the "international" tag, and while I certainly agree that PW shoulkd accomodate all of its players, to expect events to be available at all time zones is unreasonable. I live in Mexico, that's North America, and yet I don't get the chance to win any promotion of physical items despite the fact that shipping should be just as expensive (if not cheaper) than within the continental US. I have to go through a third party to make payments also, despite being resident in the same economic bloc. But you don't see me complaining because I realize that global SERVICE providers do not currently exist, even if it may sometimes seem like they do. Let's keep it reasonable. come on.

Tawarwaith - Sanctuary

IVampireI - Sanctuary wrote: »

I wrote Val bout this matter this weekend.And got an answer on the same day.
He is aware of this problem and said that he will try to find a solution so all the players can participate in NW.



Reply i got:

Thanks for sharing your concerns.

That's definitely something I was also concerned with, given how many of our players don't play during "standard" hours.

I don't know when or if we'll be able to change the number of times Nation Wars is run, but I'll talk it over with the Team to see if we can come up with a good solution to this problem.

The last thing we want is to isolate or leave out any players, so we'll do our best to make sure everyone can get involved.

I apologize that I don't have a quick solution, but I'll do my best! Thanks for your patience ^_^;

- Val

b:avoid
So lets be patient and lets see what will happen.

(Hopefully no1 will bite my head off for posting this here )

I wish there was some official feedback from him. Atm, there's Nation Wars on the forums : The old continent vs the new center of the world. Would be nice to have a clear official word on what they do and do not reconsider about this expension.

@Silok : you should light another one b:laugh

@MANray_ : I've never had issues with no-lifers having obvious advantages in a game.

MANray_ - Sanctuary

Tawarwaith - Sanctuary wrote: »

@MANray_ : I've never had issues with no-lifers having obvious advantages in a game.

Neither do I. But there's a difference in between someone putting 3 times more hours than me getting stuff in 1/3 the days I do (that's only fair) and being excluded from everything because the standard minimum apparently has become 6 hours a day. That's a freaking part time job... I do MODERATELY CS (as I've often posted I keep to the US$15 a month minimum standard) and put in somewhere in between 8-12 hours a week. That should be enough to do ok, I'm not talking top flight here, but just ok.

The point to NW is its one of the few things that could balance things out (if its kept in check) as I could make an effort and somewhat keep up with it. But the people nerdraging over it are those who realize it really is a game changer and want to keep things as they are now, with weapon linking and charging lowbies to do runs, etc.

When discussing a possible expansion of NW time slots is therefore fair for me to voice my opinion on the matter and provide what I believe to be a reasonable argument; that disproportionately increasing available time slots will only serve to both ruin the event and keep the game in a state in which only the established elite gets to fully access PvE content. If GMs are reading this, I would love for them to consider the arguments AGAINST the proposal this thread is debating before taking things back to the devs.

Tawarwaith - Sanctuary

MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

The point to NW is its one of the few things that could balance things out (if its kept in check) as I could make an effort and somewhat keep up with it. But the people nerdraging over it are those who realize it really is a game changer and want to keep things as they are now, with weapon linking and charging lowbies to do runs, etc.

I agree that the idea of a pvp "catch the flag" event giving acces to a large scale of rewards was really smart. This is the type of event where all classes have their own advantages. They also randomized the groups, avoiding a +10~12 or "gtfo our group" like TW. And I haven't seen ANYONE stating that the event itself isn't a great idea.

I don't agree that players rage because it's a game changer. Poeple rage because it's a game changer only accessible to a tiny part of the server. They just changed the imbalance over classes and gear, to an imbalance over geographic location. The big problem for me is not the timezone or the excessive rewards, but the combination. Till now, all events gave only minor rewards and in a way always dominated by a few r9 +12 or were purely for amusement. This time it's a game changer as you say. And many just see all their possible farming collapse, their gear become obsolete (morai) and drop drastically in value.

The whole point of canny/raps prices collapsing is more then "QQ my 80mil gear now only cost 20mil". Like we seen with r8 sales, the ones happy about it are just euphoric for a few days then will find out they are running around with "minimal gear" (for squad's liking) just like before. But those who can't attend to NW just find a couple of dead instances. Any of the those OP geared players that are accused of QQ because their gear lost value knows that the shard+refine cost represents the biggest part. The ones that rage are the ones who can't attend, no gear involved there.

In short, a game changing feature on 2x2h in the week on specific timezone is just plain stupid and should be raged over.

Lucy_a - Sanctuary

Desdi - Sanctuary wrote: »

This is exactly what I had in mind. Other option would be to make Friday's NW at 8pm server time and Sunday's NW at 8am server time.

I think this is the best idea.And it would keep everyone happy.Or noon would also be good instead of 8am.

Sheswes - Heavens Tear

Chigenkaiona - Dreamweaver wrote: »

That would be great and all, but they know better. People would use ALT's to re-do it. and a IP block wouldn't work...people know how to change IP addresses easily nowadays anytime. Only way this was possible was block the player via MAC address. That never changes...unless you got $$ to buy another.

pay me 100$ and i will change ur MAC addres within 15 sec b:chuckle

Lucy_a - Sanctuary

*pokes thread*
Still no news about this matter b:surrender b:avoid

BlackCalla - Lothranis

I moved from Lost City to Lothranis server about half a year ago. In teh beginning i was freaked too about all the French, but i understand French a bit so i decided not to let that scare me off. After a while i noticed that even tho system announcements and whatever mobs say is in French, there are many players that don't speak French... at all. The GMs, which actually appear regularly, announce things in English and French. Special events also are announced in both languages. If you find a good international guild, like i did, being an English speaker on for example a French server isn't problematic.

On the NW times: 8 pm is better than 5 am for sure, but ALL events are at 8-9pm server time... and almost every evening there is something... it forces the players to play always at the same time, which isn t possible for me either. Since NW is 2x in the week, why not make it at 2 different times? One at 8 pm (Friday) and one at noon (Sunday) or so would be awesome. And not only for players from a different timezone.

Desdi - Sanctuary

The thing about Nations Wars is that it has become the new major farming instance and it was probably intended to be a sort of farming instance anyway.

This is not about Europeans complaining that "it's unfair". This is about the very fact that a game shouldn't limit a farming instance to a certain timezone. Like I said Friday 8pm and Sunday noon or 8am would please the majority of the players. Both Americans and Europeans/Asians.

You didn't see Europeans going around the forums complaining for a TW time change, did you? That's because TW is optional and has nothing to offer besides pure entertainment. The same applies to other events like the Celestial Tiger which it may have some rewards and some profit but not to the scale of NW.

People who can't participate in NW will just fall behind those who can. People were excluded from Nirvana too, yes. However, good friends and factions that cared would still give you the opportunity to go along. There's nothing you can do if timezone doesn't allow you though.

That was directed towards all the people who complained about Europeans complaining about NW. I would honestly not care if NW was just another event but as the new farming instance it's simply unfair to everyone the way it is right now.

SpiritDivine - Sanctuary

Looking forward to see all you european players to come join the german server. We all speak english and could use some more players. Thank you and good luck from Momaganon server.

Chigenkaiona - Dreamweaver

Silgod - Dreamweaver wrote: »

They could move nv at least for Sunday morning, 10 am for example. It's not so early for US (and they will have Friday) and better for others. b:surrender

People are sleeping during 10am in USA depending on you time zone. We actually like to sleep in during sunday mornings then wake up and do events throughout the day in PWI during sensible times. I'm 3 hours behind from PWI's official timezone but I don't complain. Rather I make time for it.

Accalica - Heavens Tear

You made a very good input Desdi, which I fully agree on.

v4liance

Hey everyone,

Just wanted to make an "official" announcement here that we are currently evaluating what it would take to expand the NW time slots w/out harming the balance of the game.

We definitely do not want to leave players out, particularly given how important Nation Wars is now, but we also have to be careful to make sure the rewards aren't messed up by increasing the access.

We're doing our best right now to come up with a good solution, but unfortunately, it won't happen soon. This is one of my top priorities, however, and I'm going to fight hard to make sure more players have access to Nation Wars.

- Val

BungaSakura - Raging Tide

v4liance wrote: »

Hey everyone,

Just wanted to make an "official" announcement here that we are currently evaluating what it would take to expand the NW time slots w/out harming the balance of the game.

We definitely do not want to leave players out, particularly given how important Nation Wars is now, but we also have to be careful to make sure the rewards aren't messed up by increasing the access.

We're doing our best right now to come up with a good solution, but unfortunately, it won't happen soon. This is one of my top priorities, however, and I'm going to fight hard to make sure more players have access to Nation Wars.

- Val

NW already harming the balance of the game and kill 1 instance lol

Xainou - Sanctuary

Thanks for the update, Hey You. b:thanks

And I think Desdi worded my point very nicely too. It's just very very frustrating to be left behind behind in such a way. Atm I can only hope can/rap prices drop way more to be able to keep up with the others suddenly having second cast nirvana gears...

Desdi - Sanctuary

Thanks for the update Hey,you! It's good to know that the higher ups have been informed.


*grabs furball and runs with it* b:avoid

Annalyse - Heavens Tear

v4liance wrote: »

Hey everyone,

Just wanted to make an "official" announcement here that we are currently evaluating what it would take to expand the NW time slots w/out harming the balance of the game.

We definitely do not want to leave players out, particularly given how important Nation Wars is now, but we also have to be careful to make sure the rewards aren't messed up by increasing the access.

We're doing our best right now to come up with a good solution, but unfortunately, it won't happen soon. This is one of my top priorities, however, and I'm going to fight hard to make sure more players have access to Nation Wars.

- Val

To be honest, it isn't that hard to work out. There is absolutely no need to add another time slot for this instance, just change one of the ones that already exist. You run it two times a week, so what is the harm in having one at 8PM and one at noon? Then everyone gets at least one shot at it. I would much rather see this done than adding another run.

FatherTed - Dreamweaver

Annalyse - Heavens Tear wrote: »

To be honest, it isn't that hard to work out. There is absolutely no need to add another time slot for this instance, just change one of the ones that already exist. You run it two times a week, so what is the harm in having one at 8PM and one at noon? Then everyone gets at least one shot at it. I would much rather see this done than adding another run.

This, pretty much.

I'm fairly certain they have some quota of players online they are actively trying to hit at 8pm-10pm server time though - so I'm not holding my breath.

Alex_Gantz - Dreamweaver

Any official update on this? The request will basically remain the same, pls pls pls make the NW event earlier at least one of the 2 days or a 3rd day earlier, you are killing the people that can`t assist to the event, the ways to make money are almost all dead now with the remove of what is maybe the main coin maker of the game (nirvy), I don t want to hear that that there are other ways of making coin because you know that they are not reliable as nirvy used to be... I know PWI pretty much does not care about players but pls at least one time try to give a **** about the people that does not live on the US b:sad

FayHumming - Dreamweaver

b:chuckle our gm are useless anyway

Knownase - Heavens Tear

I support more NW.

ovenusarmanio

moved to existing thread bout this issue.

Riverwalker - Sanctuary

BungaSakura - Raging Tide wrote: »

NW already harming the balance of the game and kill 1 instance lol

Please make the time change for Sundays to allow more people to participate at more player friendly times! b:tired


No matter what they do in game, there will be those that are never happy.
I don't agree that NW is "harming the balance of the game". I have been participating in NW and have not sold even one item I have earned. All of it goes to improving my own characters, as it was intended. I never supported the catshops in Raging Tides either because I wouldn't buy their over priced items. The only ones buying the over priced "stock" were those that could not farm it or those impatient souls that couldn't wait to earn it themselves.

As far as I am concerned, this needed to be done. It would take months of endless, mind numbing vana runs to try and earn a better gear or weapon for their chars.... unless they had deep pockets. Those that were capable of farming Nirvana (and being snobs about who they would take with them with cries of "Link your weapon!" "must be 5 APS!") were the ones driving that part of the economy... NOT the game. In their simple greed for more coin (though I'm sure they will argue that they were providing a "service") they were keeping casual players and those without access to coin/gold, under geared.

Kudos PW for coming up with a way to help balance the players and lvl the playing field! Viva the weekend warriors!!!

They don't add instances with the idea of lining players pockets with coin. They gave us a fantastic instance that lets each player use it to improve their gear and weapons.

Don't QQ that you can't figure out a way to exploit it to make coin for yourselves. b:shutup

OverSlept - Harshlands

v4liance wrote: »

Hey everyone,

Just wanted to make an "official" announcement here that we are currently evaluating what it would take to expand the NW time slots w/out harming the balance of the game.

We definitely do not want to leave players out, particularly given how important Nation Wars is now, but we also have to be careful to make sure the rewards aren't messed up by increasing the access.

We're doing our best right now to come up with a good solution, but unfortunately, it won't happen soon. This is one of my top priorities, however, and I'm going to fight hard to make sure more players have access to Nation Wars.

- Val

Dear, GM v4liance!

Thank you for for answer but if can i add it`s not only about NW but all event times are really bad for EU players. I hardly can participate any because it`s at 3 am for me. I really love PVP oriented events, mostly thats the reason why im playing on PVP server. We EU players would be so graceful if all events like Celestial Tiger, Tournament, TW, NW would be in better time for us to participate. b:thanks

Alex_Gantz - Dreamweaver

Any news or offcial updates on this?? ty

Manostra - Harshlands

OverSlept - Harshlands wrote: »

Dear, GM v4liance!

Thank you for for answer but if can i add it`s not only about NW but all event times are really bad for EU players. I hardly can participate any because it`s at 3 am for me. I really love PVP oriented events, mostly thats the reason why im playing on PVP server. We EU players would be so graceful if all events like Celestial Tiger, Tournament, TW, NW would be in better time for us to participate. b:thanks

That Post is so good and true, i wanna cry.

Just one example, i could expand this easily:

I've never done City of Abominations and i play pwi for like 3 years now because its on a really horrible time slot for EU Players.

It seem the TW on Saturday isnt hurting the US players that much because i havn't read much wine about it. This time +/- 1 Hour is kinda perfect for EU aswell. It would be great to move at least one NW on this Slot.

It would be very great if other Events could be hold twice or move to a more comfortable time slot , that topic always concerned me and i think its the right time to bring that up the table.

As an alternative, a Charakter transfer (with stuff included) to another Server would be the worst option but at least it would be an option available. Because right now we just left out in dark, sourrounded by evil and out of gas. b:sad

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands

There's more than 1 000 persons attending Nation wars at the actual time and people actually have trouble to get in cause there's too many people.

1 000 persons that attend at actual time vs. what? 10-15 EU persons?

If EU people have issue with the tinme they should just go on the EU servers made just for them. It's not the end of the world to change server or play on 2 servers, I do it, so everyone can do it.

Accalica - Heavens Tear

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands wrote: »

1 000 persons that attend at actual time vs. what? 10-15 EU persons?

If EU people have issue with the tinme they should just go on the EU servers made just for them. It's not the end of the world to change server or play on 2 servers, I do it, so everyone can do it.

Eh?
Do you know how many of these ~1000 are EUs or other non fitting timezones getting up early? Obviously u don't. I run what has become a part EU fac, why? Because recruiting has been alot easier in that timezone than any other we have officers in. What does that tell you? It should be telling you that there's no such thing as only '10-15' people left out on this system, it is HEAPS.

Also regarding moving to EU servers...If you've ever farmed your r9, gotten to know a fair few people or simply have no overflow in time to spend on the computer to re-lvl and re-establish a toon..you should know better than to assume anyone can be like you or have your time to do so.

It's NOT ok that PWI is closing out a big part of the community in regards to economy/endgame gear access. NW is and will probably remain, the biggest and fastest income source, nothing can compare to it in coin value vs time spent to get it, which is absurd. I have friends that are less fortunate than me who can get up 5:20 if I so wish. They cant attend NW due to IRL things such as jobs, timezones, or heck even parents who wont let them sit those times demanded by the computers.
It is purely wrong in my opinion to offer a such a critical instance in regards to players personal economy/gear progress, in only one timezone. Atleast as long as they do not offer any alternative and limited economy instance that can be compared to value/per time spent. b:angry