Is there any point being a veno?
Comments
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Here, in order to preserve the sanity of whoever reads this i'll boil all the quoting down to punctual responses. Janus is just making stuff up so there is no point to quoting anyway.
1. On introductions, you seem to be having some identity issues. You do realize you're not actually gender bending when you play a veno, don't you?
2. Yeah, you were answering the wrong post idiot.
3. No self proclaimed wisdom here, you've just been noobing it up all the way to high levels. Lemme guess, oracles?
4. So the one that got to you was valley girl huh?
5. Yeah, go back and read what you wrote. It's almost like an excited kid talking to his mom. And it made no sense...
6. And no, you can't just lie and hope people let it go.
7. I'm pretty sure there are easier ways to test nerfed drops. Like going on solo runs and getting genie food instead of mirages...
8. Lamest comeback you've managed so far, l2read noob.
9. I take it many men have lied to you before. Don't worry, i won't hurt you... much...
10. You got touchy about the not having a life thing too? LOL, i only need one run to prove i can steal aggro dear.
11. Look i may not be a computer expert, but you don't have to get defensive about not being able to play vids on your rig. And no i had seen that vid before, took me less than half a minute to find it.
12. Yeah, you do know you can do other stuff on the comp while checking forums don't you? And yeah, some of us can write a wall of text in a few minutes, not a whole afternoon like apparently you would need. But hey, your point is herc is good at aggro, not dps. This one you really seem to have a problem with. A scorp has better dps than an herc. Fact. A wanderer has better dps than an herc. Fact. An herc is not necessary, nor required as a dps pet and in fact many herc'ed venos, including your precious Tweakz, keep a separate dps pet for DD they can skill with elemental bashes or useful debuffs like Howl. Even herc'ed venos don't use hercs for dps, all this time what you've been defending is herc as a tank, which i would call subpar. According to you a full squad should not have to gimp its dps with herc tanking a (?) boss unless they have people with -int gear. According to you a robe class will never steal aggro form a same level herc under these circumstances. Why is that? According to you because factoring in the damage reduction a herc gets a better dps output than a DD class would get. I mean, isn't this your argument? So everyone can go full out and care not one bit about aggro with a herc tanking a (?) boss if they're not using -int. This is what you're saying right? I mean, 8x Barbs don't get the benefit of making that claim but hercs do? And you have never seen any robe class ever steal aggro away from herc. Never.
I'm pretty certain i'm right but unlike you i'm not arrogant enough to simply be content making a claim without proving it. I wasn't promising you anything, i merely stated i would test it, at my convenience. As for TT drops not being nerfed then i guess you really are oblivious to what's going on in the game...0 -
MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »1. On introductions, you seem to be having some identity issues. You do realize you're not actually gender bending when you play a veno, don't you?
well, depends on what you mean by "genderbending", and just how real you think the game is --- on how much you identify with your characters, i suppose. but yeah, i can see your point, so i guess i'm just being pedantic.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Heaven's Tear alts: KenLubin, Sou_Hon, JudyCaraco --- level 5x chars.0 -
LOL, going over skill descriptions i just realized i don't have to actually go get myself killed to prove a veno can steal aggro away from herc on a (?) boss. Now this comes down to making a simple estimate. From what i know, the damage for all classes is reduced in half on this scenario. I've read some posters claiming it goes down to one quarter (25%) so let's use that figure. Double sparking increses a caster veno's damage output by 400% extra weapon, so this should sort of cancel it out if we account for the fact the majority of a caster veno's dps output comes from skill use and not pet damage. Let's take it further, triple sparking makes the figures go up to 900% for Sage and 700% for Demon. Now remember Ironwood is 300% weapon damage. This should actually make it easier for a triple sparked veno to steal damage from a herc on a (?) boss than it would be against a regular mob using no sparks. On double spark i would say the chance is about even.
Of course some may argue it is unfair not to account for herc having had a chance to build aggro but this would defeat the main point of this argument since giving a herc the oportunity means gimping your dps. And this is without accounting for crit rate or Jones' Blessing. BTW, other casting classes get the 400% figure for double spark, 700% for Demon. So, i think i'm entitled to say using simple logic that my conclussion was in fact correct and that the burden of proof now lies in Janus. It is you who has to prove me wrong buddy. b:laugh
Later on through the day i may be looking through some old threads for some data on TT drop reductions, although i know consider the aggro part of the discussion settled until Janus presents a reasonable argument that contradicts mine or he otherwise offers proof for his claims. b:kiss0 -
I steal aggro from my Herc regularly on elites w/o sparking. It's intentional and timed so the mob dies before it lands a hit on me or 1 hit at most. The Herc allows me to Soul Degen -> Amp -> Nuke w/o wasting time healing. Keep on going on with your drivel.b:laughBe kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.0
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I steal aggro from my Herc regularly on elites w/o sparking. It's intentional and timed so the mob dies before it lands a hit on me or 1 hit at most. The Herc allows me to Soul Degen -> Amp -> Nuke w/o wasting time healing. Keep on going on with your drivel.b:laugh
LOL, hey we've missed you. You have absolutely no clue what the discussion is currently about but still felt the need to drop in and post something random huh? Actually, that under normal circumstances stealing aggro from a herc is easy does support my point so thanks for your contribution to arguing why hercs aren't really necessary. b:victory0 -
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Man, you're not even making sense.
You argue about things that aren't even in this thread along with things that are. Then you admit that I know what I'm talking about and you're basically just in this thread to harass. Enjoy your pathetic life. b:byeBe kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.0 -
Man, you're not even making sense.
You argue about things that aren't even in this thread along with things that are. Then you admit that I know what I'm talking about and you're basically just in this thread to harass. Enjoy your pathetic life. b:bye
LOL, come on Tweakz, i have done nothing but answer posts in the same tone that they were written. On the other hand you only just recently showed up after being absent through most of the convo you got started yourself, not even caring to argue the point anymore but just to try and mess with me. And i admitted that you have knowledge of the game, not that you know how to use it. Want to take things out of context some more? In fact i seem to be the only one left on this thread with any intention of actually addressing the arguments that have come up. Why don't you just go back to your cave for a couple of more months? I'll be busy in FW and you'll have more room to try and sell your tripe to gullible lowbies. b:chuckle
And seriously, with a reputation such as yours i would be more careful about trying to characterize others as pathetic, which is exactly what you have proven yourself to be over and over.0 -
You're one of those people we refer to as being only "half there". You may have heard people talking about your kind before. b:chuckleBe kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.0
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"Is there any point being a veno?"
Not if you end up arguing the toss over a couple of pets like a moron.
Want a Herc? Get it. Don't want a Herc? Don't get it. I hope this thread gets locked soon, lest someone has an aneyurism from the unbearably stressful fact of life that people have different opinions.0 -
Belial +1b:chuckle0
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Kittens are being killed all over the place in this thread.0
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1. Evidently the game seems like real life to you, which is why you set out on fake internet crusades to prove little other than you have less of a life than you claim to others you have. b:bye
2. I'm obviously in a conversation with Pee Wee Herman -- I know you are but what am I!
3. Oh so close. Nope. Used hyper on my veno from 95 to 100, this level I stayed at on my veno for well over half a year. And unlike you, I can back something up. b:pleased
4, 5, 6. Usual pointless banter.
7. Yeah, being lazy is a great way to test what you claim. Yawn.
8+. More usual pointless banter.
Well, when you get a scorpion that can tank Illusion Nemen 3-3 or a Dark Wanderer that can tank Fataliqua 2-3 might as well not show me your video to back up the claim of DPS and tank.MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »But hey, your point is herc is good at aggro, not dps. This one you really seem to have a problem with. A scorp has better dps than an herc. Fact. A wanderer has better dps than an herc. Fact. An herc is not necessary, nor required as a dps pet and in fact many herc'ed venos, including your precious Tweakz, keep a separate dps pet for DD they can skill with elemental bashes or useful debuffs like Howl. Even herc'ed venos don't use hercs for dps, all this time what you've been defending is herc as a tank, which i would call subpar.
I mean, have you been reading what you've been responding to? Oh right, Kindergarten reading comprehension. I'll tell you what, rather than repeating everything I've said to you for the 5th, 6th, 7th time, go back through all of my posts, or go through my last post where I reiterate the point of my original post, which you seem to have forgotten that's what you replied to originally.According to you a full squad should not have to gimp its dps with herc tanking a (?) boss unless they have people with -int gear. According to you a robe class will never steal aggro form a same level herc under these circumstances. Why is that? According to you because factoring in the damage reduction a herc gets a better dps output than a DD class would get. I mean, isn't this your argument? So everyone can go full out and care not one bit about aggro with a herc tanking a (?) boss if they're not using -int. This is what you're saying right? I mean, 8x Barbs don't get the benefit of making that claim but hercs do? And you have never seen any robe class ever steal aggro away from herc. Never.
I'm pretty certain i'm right but unlike you i'm not arrogant enough to simply be content making a claim without proving it. I wasn't promising you anything, i merely stated i would test it, at my convenience. As for TT drops not being nerfed then i guess you really are oblivious to what's going on in the game...
Whew, wasted a lot less time than you did. b:laugh
Now please, waste more of your "life" responding with another wall of text. b:chuckle0 -
JanusZeal - Heavens Tear wrote: »Nonsense
Go **** yourself Janus, i don't care to be the only one trying to have a legitimate discussion and you have already proven to be a liar in any case. You have failed to address my argument on aggro and seem to think aping what i've said counts as thinking. It's you who's got the six year old mentality and i called you on it. It's you who's got the mentality of a no lifer. I do have better things to do.
So get lost sweetheart. b:kiss0 -
LenieClarke - Heavens Tear wrote: »obvious troll would be less obvious if you didn't obviously leave steps out.
which steps would they be?TheEmpire
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Translation: I can't back up anything I say, and all my arguments have been disintegrated, so I resort to personal attacks.MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »Go **** yourself Janus, i don't care to be the only one trying to have a legitimate discussion and you have already proven to be a liar in any case. You have failed to address my argument on aggro and seem to think aping what i've said counts as thinking. It's you who's got the six year old mentality and i called you on it. It's you who's got the mentality of a no lifer. I do have better things to do.
So get lost sweetheart. b:kiss
And no, you don't have better things to do. Pot calling kettle black again? Those who have to so forcefully proclaim they have a life are, as everyone knows, those with, indeed, no life. Typical hypocrite, and boring. You wasted more time on insults on the forum than you did proving something which you claimed you could do right from the start, and the conditions were set forth numerous times which you conveniently ignored and then pretended you didn't need to prove anything. Hypocrite yet again. Now please, try and make another post to save face in a similar failing manner.0 -
If you do not buy a herc, someone will kill a kitten.Silest - Sanctuary wrote: »Kittens are being killed all over the place in this thread.
If you do buy a herc, someone else will also kill a kitten.
So regardless, a kitten will die. But it'll be your fault either way. b:surrender0 -
JanusZeal - Heavens Tear wrote: »Translation: I can't back up anything I say, and all my arguments have been disintegrated, so I resort to personal attacks.
And no, you don't have better things to do. Pot calling kettle black again? Those who have to so forcefully proclaim they have a life are, as everyone knows, those with, indeed, no life. Typical hypocrite, and boring. You wasted more time on insults on the forum than you did proving something which you claimed you could do right from the start, and the conditions were set forth numerous times which you conveniently ignored and then pretended you didn't need to prove anything. Hypocrite yet again. Now please, try and make another post to save face in a similar failing manner.
I actually backed what i had to say and you didn't challenge my last argument. And the personal attacks you got started yourself. What's the matter? Is the kitchen too hot?
And i don't have to explain my life to you sweetie, it just comes down to my advocating playstyles that don't require you to hand over your life to the game while you do the oposite. Hmm... I wonder who's the one that's got no life? And what conditions were set forth mind you? I was the only one actually trying to boil things down to claims that could be proven, the only one actually reasoning how to find things out, and the only one who came down with a solution, which you can't honestly dismiss without challenging looser. The only hypocrite here is you darling, trying to pass off as a reasonable poster when you're nothing but a filthy rat. Man up and at least walk out gracefully, would you?
Or does it get you off me calling you names. The argument is closed, i backed what i said you didn't. No one cares, this is just a flame thread for the rest of the veno forum. All you can do is come back and try to muster whatever it is that passes as inteligence for you and try to weasel and lie your way into having someone believe you weren't owned and let on the side of the road a discarded piece of garbage.
And you'll do that only to have me put in your place yet again. So go on darling, keep lying to yourself and to the rest of us.0 -
Solandri - Heavens Tear wrote: »If you do not buy a herc, someone will kill a kitten.
If you do buy a herc, someone else will also kill a kitten.
So regardless, a kitten will die. But it'll be your fault either way. b:surrender
i killed a kitten by accident when i was 4x, i fisted it too much when i was trying to tame it.TheEmpire
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
So that's why you retired. Damn kittens._Surreal_ - Heavens Tear wrote: »i killed a kitten by accident when i was 4x, i fisted it too much when i was trying to tame it.0 -
_Surreal_ - Heavens Tear wrote: »which steps would they be?
the ones between soul degen and amp, to keep the latter from overwriting the former, is what i was thinking of at the time. but really, i might also take the position that the more posts tweakz leaves unwritten, the better.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Heaven's Tear alts: KenLubin, Sou_Hon, JudyCaraco --- level 5x chars.0 -
i am also a non herc veno and i really enjoy my class..actually a good veno doesnt need herc to prove she s good. b:cuteb:flower SEIZE THE DAY b:flower0
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Hahaha, you backed up nothing. Absolutely nothing. Where's your video of you holding aggro off a herc on a "[?]" boss throwing scarabs? Where's your tests of TT drops being nerfed? Yeah, just as I thought. Lots of blah blah bull ****, and continuous, baseless "i r backed up", uhh.. whatever it is you backed up. Maybe someone backed up over you and you lost part of the brain that cognitively can discern what backing something up means. Alternatively, the "hypocrite" part of the brain is still obviously functioning. b:laughMANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »I actually backed what i had to say and you didn't challenge my last argument. And the personal attacks you got started yourself. What's the matter? Is the kitchen too hot?
And i don't have to explain my life to you sweetie, it just comes down to my advocating playstyles that don't require you to hand over your life to the game while you do the oposite. Hmm... I wonder who's the one that's got no life? And what conditions were set forth mind you? I was the only one actually trying to boil things down to claims that could be proven, the only one actually reasoning how to find things out, and the only one who came down with a solution, which you can't honestly dismiss without challenging looser. The only hypocrite here is you darling, trying to pass off as a reasonable poster when you're nothing but a filthy rat. Man up and at least walk out gracefully, would you?
Or does it get you off me calling you names. The argument is closed, i backed what i said you didn't. No one cares, this is just a flame thread for the rest of the veno forum. All you can do is come back and try to muster whatever it is that passes as inteligence for you and try to weasel and lie your way into having someone believe you weren't owned and let on the side of the road a discarded piece of garbage.
And you'll do that only to have me put in your place yet again. So go on darling, keep lying to yourself and to the rest of us.0 -
JanusZeal - Heavens Tear wrote: »Well, when you get a scorpion that can tank Illusion Nemen 3-3 or a Dark Wanderer that can tank Fataliqua 2-3 might as well not show me your video to back up the claim of DPS and tank.
Where in the world did you get that response? No one is arguing that a scorpion or a dark wanderer (or a seamonster guardian, another pet that can out-DPS a herc) can tank high-end TT bosses; however, they can out-DPS a herc when someone else is tanking.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Weekly Japanese/English bilingual webcomic
thejapanesepage.com/ebooks/yuki_no_monogatari_manga0 -
I got kicked out of an fb29 because I had no hercs.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
tt is nerfed, but not totally. some days its normal, some days its nerfed. as we in guild call it as TT period now. when tt is on period then drummer in act 1 and wurlord in act 2 is nerfed on droprates, other bosses doesn't seem to be affected much. in 2-1 in normal day i get 1 forshuras armor per run on average, on nerf i get only 1-2 armor out of 10 runs. i have nothing better to do while tting than making spreadsheets of drops. i made a thread a year ago about tt being nerfed when out of 21 run i only got 1 armor, then every1 said its just a bad luck till after few days later i saw more ppl making threads about tt being nerfed and giving less drops. i have never done act 3 so i dunno how nerf effected it and i guess i wont be able to check it now cuz they made it harder. now i just check tt daily, do 3 runs and see forshuras droprate, if i dont get 3 armors i leave tt for the day, if i get 3 armors i do tt solo/squad runs whole day.
and a lvl 100 veno from guild the other said he stole agro from herc on [?], dunno what happened after did he died or herc got it bk. i doubt its possible to hold agro from [?] nonstop, but its definately possible to steal agro.0 -
JanusZeal - Heavens Tear wrote: »Hahaha, you backed up nothing. Absolutely nothing. Where's your video of you holding aggro off a herc on a "[?]" boss throwing scarabs? Where's your tests of TT drops being nerfed? Yeah, just as I thought. Lots of blah blah bull ****, and continuous, baseless "i r backed up", uhh.. whatever it is you backed up. Maybe someone backed up over you and you lost part of the brain that cognitively can discern what backing something up means. Alternatively, the "hypocrite" part of the brain is still obviously functioning. b:laugh
Your word is worthless. Nothing you say matters.0 -
So how's that life coming? Clearly people who farm for a herc have no life, but someone who posts all day on a forum does. That crow must be delicious, especially concerning the bold -->"I can back up my claims all day", "why would I bother proving anything to you". Thanks for playing. Next time, include more insults in your essays. You're still not making up for the stupidity encountered in your posts. b:byeMANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »Go back and read up you dumb dog. I came up with a better method of proving it and you didn't even bother disputing it. Once again you've shown a complete inability to do something as basic as reading. Really, why would i bother proving anything to you if you're so stupid? I don't have the time to school you, and i wouldn't even if i did. You're calling me a hypocrite? I've called you a liar several times and you don't even bother disputing it because you know you can't. On the other hand i'll repeat once again, i don't have to. Your word is worthless. You are worthless. The only hypocrisy here is your lame attempt at trying to come up as anything other but a piece of trash. Yeah, here's your fix, you like me insulting you? Are you a naughty little girl? Go **** yourself. Go buy a razor, do it now, and slit your useless looser life out of your wrists. I freaking mean it, an inflatable doll has more of a spine than you do. And much more of dignity and common sense, i don't care about what you have to say you useless waste of space.
Care to have another go? Make my day. b:sin0 -
JanusZeal - Heavens Tear wrote: »So how's that life coming? Clearly people who farm for a herc have no life, but someone who posts all day on a forum does. That crow must be delicious, especially concerning the bold -->"I can back up my claims all day", "why would I bother proving anything to you". Thanks for playing. Next time, include more insults in your essays. You're still not making up for the stupidity encountered in your posts. b:bye
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62j8n2_T1-c&feature=related
Oh, and BTW, look at when i posted, i work on my comp and still didn't spend more than a couple of hours on forums today. Unlike you...0
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