Barb Issues

lordmakyo

Well i dont know if the rest is agree on this but, i think that we barbs should have our skill Roar with a better effect like make it last for 1-2 minutes with out beeing able to loose aggro during that time or so.

The reason of this is simple, many ppl complains that some barbs dont hold aggro because -we- cant tank, or that we are nothing but nabs, and as you all know, any barbarian looses aggro in less that 10-15 secs after using Roar if someone has a weapon with a really high damage or if someone makes 3 times the damage that we can make on the mobs. Most of this happens at FC, ppl complains about that, even knowing that Roar its like "Get attention" of the mobs, but doesnt makes you hold aggro for ever; and yea i know there is some othe alternatives like Alpha Male ansd such but its almost thesame with that skill, so Im just asking if theres something you could do for our Barb's Roar skill.

buttercupcruella

Hmmm... I remember when I first got Roar to lvl 1. I saw the description not saying much. The added 'more powerful effect at higer lvl' made me wanna lvl it more. At around lvl 7 I decided to check on forums. Supposedly all it does is it resets aggro and gives the barb a slight advantage. I, too, feel the skill is kinda meh. Long cooldown, long casting, not much of an effect...

Sabatier - Raging Tide

this is why you use all your skills in tiger form to try and keep agro. barbs were tanking happily without genies before - alpha male is just an extra tool.

sometimes you aren't gonna manage to keep agro cos you have spark happy DDs who don't even wait for you to cast any skills before they attack. let them die a few times they will learn the lesson.

HexOmega - Dreamweaver

that skill is only good when there is noone using aoes
to prevent heal aggro or sth -.-

indeed barbs need more powerful aggro skills
single target or aoe...




roar doesnt help much when mobs move back to me after 1 tick of dragons breath >.>

and sunder(?) isnt spamable
surfthingie is pretty weak




a aggro +adjustment for barb skills anyone?
make tanks tanks again :P

many quit already ;(




EDIT Sabatier, yeah lets do all runs SLOW, DDs shouldnt spark and deal more damage... ofc ... .


i only see barbs tanking when TANKING DDs die, they simply cant hold aggression

Sabatier - Raging Tide

i'm not saying they shouldn't spark - im saying they shouldnt expect the tank to save their **** if they spark before he is even at a boss etc

you can do a run fast AND safe... as i would expect you to know Hex

we keep telling folks it's up to everyone in the squad to manage their own agro. this still holds.

HexOmega - Dreamweaver

what i mean is (most) barbs cant tank at all in the first place (single target)

every lvl100 sin/archer/bm aims for 5 aps or already has it >.>

flash realm spam ends in pendling, makes clerics go mad :P





...but this is OT - >.> roar (aoe) .. was it meant only to prevent heal aggro? or does it simply suck ..lol

buttercupcruella

Sabatier - Raging Tide wrote: »

i'm not saying they shouldn't spark - im saying they shouldnt expect the tank to save their **** if they spark before he is even at a boss etc

you can do a run fast AND safe... as i would expect you to know Hex

we keep telling folks it's up to everyone in the squad to manage their own agro. this still holds.

+ 1, just 'cause I can.

It can be done fast AND safe if all know what to ddo instead of trying to 'show off(???)' all of their skills at once...

And yea, roar sucks for me.

Flesh ream, ofc, spam, spam, spam, BUT in some situations, when flesh ream is spammed and not many normal attacks are used, chi disappears quickly. Or if you invoke (turtle) [uses 2 sparks] and then try to chi up for flesh ream, but the archer and the wizzie decides to double spark and spam all skills atm..b:surrender

It drives me insane if a person tells me a barb has to keep aggro by all means, while others dd as much as they can, and if something goes wrong it is the barb's fault. This is team work, not a 'who's better at ...' contest.

Roar should have a better effect.b:thanks

Danikovich - Heavens Tear

Roar resets aggro so no matter how much damage has been done to the boss if you Roar then Flesh Ream the boss is yours.

Pressa - Heavens Tear

Danikovich - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Roar resets aggro so no matter how much damage has been done to the boss if you Roar then Flesh Ream the boss is yours.

This :P b:surrender barbs not holding aggro is based on player skill alone any barb over 90 will have no problems ever holding aggro or shouldn't unless its a archer with +12 and you only have +3 b:sad Barbs past 50 should have a small difficulty but not really too much trouble under that and you don't really tank a lot of things.

b:chuckle But alas if chi is your issue recruit a veno thats their jobs after all and brambled barbs shouldn't lose aggro really at all. Or get a keyword when your chi is low tell them to hold back for a bit and get your chi up once chi is back to a acceptable level resume killing. Simple yes?

Rawrgh - Raging Tide

Very useful for stealing bosses in CoA so you can bring em to your squad that's zhenning b:sin

BarbLord - Raging Tide

Roar is much of a useless skil i will admit long casting, cooldown and a small agro

and while i can stil keep agro from any DD under lvl 70 or i have yet to have one steal my agro anyway(thats on bosses)

but i agree our agro skils need to be improved i mean flesh ream our primary single target agro skil reaches its highest level until lvl 89(sage or demon) at lvl 54(the point where its lvl 10) so its builded to keep agro from 5x DDs,yeah thats really effective at 8x *sarcasm*
as for devour its a decent agro skil and one of the few barb agro skils that doesnt reset agro all together just increases yours but its agro effect is way to weak but it cant be maxed until lvl 74 and ofc its chi requirement is just to high to spam it

so i do agree our agro skils should have an increased effect but chances are bigger they will get reduced so theres reason barbs refine their wep to +12b:surrender

Pressa - Heavens Tear

Roar is not useless your DDs just need to learn to control themselves and hit what your hitting thats what the assist attack button is for after all. Or you need to get better with the tab key you can circle and flesh ream targets all around you easier then ever Yoda says: "Weak you are but stronger you will become"

Shazaaam - Lost City

Alpha male And/Or Sunder lv 10 is enough to hold agro even on GV b:victory any lv of sunder below 10 is useless.

honkblarg

If a dd aggros it's their own fault not the barb. Once you pass 90 an archer could easily steal aggro without spark but they are supposed to know how to prevent themselves from doing this (damage over time skills and wait for the monster to lose hp for one...) but most don't understand the concept and in that case it's the dd that's the noob not the barb. Your job as a dd is to figure out how to do the most damage possible without gaining aggro since if you aggro you cause problems and potentially use more time fixing them than you would avoiding them.

Danikovich - Heavens Tear

I do not disagree with the topic tho, there's no need for a Barb in high level playing if you have a high refinement Fist BM unless to give them buffs, pull cata(sage), rule TW field (demon) and tank WB.

Rawrgh - Raging Tide

This :P barbs not holding aggro is based on player skill alone any barb over 90 will have no problems ever holding aggro or shouldn't unless its a archer with +12 and you only have +3 Barbs past 50 should have a small difficulty but not really too much trouble under that and you don't really tank a lot of things.

But alas if chi is your issue recruit a veno thats their jobs after all and brambled barbs shouldn't lose aggro really at all. Or get a keyword when your chi is low tell them to hold back for a bit and get your chi up once chi is back to a acceptable level resume killing. Simple yes?

You're joking right?

Try holding aggro from a BM or archer or sin with stacked interval gears, try holding aggro from a +11 nirvana.

Juggernaut - Harshlands

In this day and age, there is almost no need for a Barb to tank anything.

BM's and Archers with high refined weapons as well as stacking interval, not to mention hercs, just are much better at tanking then Barbs. Most of the time its dumb to even try to have the Barb tank because its not efficient.

Roar is a good skill to reset aggro and take it back. But I see a lot of Barbs spaming Flesh Ream, Roar, and Devour trying to hold aggro from Fist BMs and high refined archers. It's just not going to happen no matter how much you try.

I sometimes prefer it when I don't have to tank. I can spam Devour, and DD in human form. It makes the boss die a lot faster cause the BM can trip spark, and none of the DDs have to worry about taking aggro. It's just easier for everyone.

Yulk - Heavens Tear

After you get surf impact, you can AOE with squads. Roar, then surf impact, switch to human and use swell, slam, firestorm then back in tiger form and use surf impact. Use some MP and your problem solved.


Try using beastial rage while in AOEs while you spark. You'll get to use sunder too.

You can't just use one skill and just leave them alone for 60 seconds, use your AOE attack skills

Partypooper - Harshlands

lordmakyo wrote: »

Well i dont know if the rest is agree on this but, i think that we barbs should have our skill Roar with a better effect like make it last for 1-2 minutes with out beeing able to loose aggro during that time or so.

The reason of this is simple, many ppl complains that some barbs dont hold aggro because -we- cant tank, or that we are nothing but nabs, and as you all know, any barbarian looses aggro in less that 10-15 secs after using Roar if someone has a weapon with a really high damage or if someone makes 3 times the damage that we can make on the mobs. Most of this happens at FC, ppl complains about that, even knowing that Roar its like "Get attention" of the mobs, but doesnt makes you hold aggro for ever; and yea i know there is some othe alternatives like Alpha Male ansd such but its almost thesame with that skill, so Im just asking if theres something you could do for our Barb's Roar skill.

You still live in 2008? Grab some fist already and faceroll

Sirsmokealot - Raging Tide

As a 74 barb I very rarley loose agro I can only think of one instance when I have lost agro and thats only because the silly physic decided to spam his skills and use his genie skills.

I have never really liked roar and only use it for those "Oh **** moments" when you see a team of mobs heading towards the cleric or your squad when I use it and they all come charging to me I use flash realm at least once on each mob to keep the agro but you will always get some silly person that decides he wants to fight a mob on his own and thats generaly where the trouble starts as I have to find the mob in the pack he is attacking and steal agro back while maintaning the agro on the rest of the mobs.

And the cool down on it is kind of long compared to the effect it actualy has on the mobs Alpha male is probaly one of my wisest investments so far (at the loss of earthflame b:cry)

I generaly just use flash realm and AOB for chi when tanking havent done lunar and fc yet but have seen videos I guess thats where agro managment starts to become alot harder just kinda confuzles me that with all the added items to the game making people stronger as well as the new uber class (TB) being added that no adjusting has been made to barbs but I am presuming it has not been done in other versions either and im pretty sure if China said there was a problem with barbs tanking then they would be working at improving it. Untill then ill keep trying diffrent methods and seing what works best.

Rule #1 Work with what you have and make it work for you untill something else better comes along.

Partypooper - Harshlands

Sirsmokealot - Raging Tide wrote: »

As a 74 barb I very rarley loose agro

No wonder

Sirsmokealot - Raging Tide

Juggernaut - Harshlands wrote: »

In this day and age, there is almost no need for a Barb to tank anything.

Sorry for the double post but these kind of comments kind of annoy me as the barb is not here to be a damage dealer it is here to be tank and this should not be the case I understand a class being able to tank something 15 levels lower than it but anyone able to tank anything at its = level boss wise is fail on the devs side.

Let each class do its job as its meant to I hate seing other classes tank call me patritoic but it would be like seing a BM healing while the cleric deals damage just is not meant to be like that.

Of course like I said above though just seems like that no one cares and eventualy barbs loose intrests till the day when people stop making barbs as there is no use for them im pretty sure PW would not like this to happen so they need to pull there finger out and see whats going wrong and make the tank the tank again

If you think there is not enough barbs around and this would slow your party down then ask your self if barbs could actualy hold agro better would more people choose to bring back there "dead barbs"?

Partypooper - Harshlands wrote: »

No wonder

Never lost it before 74 either dont wanna blow my own trumpet but have been told various times by various diffrent people that I am a good barbarian.

Partypooper - Harshlands

Sirsmokealot - Raging Tide wrote: »

the barb is not here to be a damage dealer it is here to be tank

U MAD?
http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=553941

Sirsmokealot - Raging Tide

Partypooper - Harshlands wrote: »

U MAD?
http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=553941

I will repeat it once more as you dont seem to understand

The barbarians role is to tank just because someone has proven that they can also be effective damage dealers with uber equipments and level does not mean this is how we are all destined to be if I wanted to be a damage dealer I would of chose a blademaster and saved my self alot of expense on equipment... Make sence now?

ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver

i think that the point was that a barb is no longer the best choice for tanking but for certain bosses...

RoidAbuse - Sanctuary

Sirsmokealot - Raging Tide wrote: »

I will repeat it once more as you dont seem to understand

The barbarians role is to tank just because someone has proven that they can also be effective damage dealers with uber equipments and level does not mean this is how we are all destined to be if I wanted to be a damage dealer I would of chose a blademaster and saved my self alot of expense on equipment... Make sence now?

There is no need for barb tanks anymore at high levels. Get a +12 nirvana axe and it might help you keep argo against every other class except 5aps fisters. Or you can join the crazy and become a fister yourself. Either way, barb tanks are dead at high levels.

Partypooper - Harshlands

Sirsmokealot - Raging Tide wrote: »

I will repeat it once more as you dont seem to understand

The barbarians role is to tank just because someone has proven that they can also be effective damage dealers with uber equipments and level does not mean this is how we are all destined to be if I wanted to be a damage dealer I would of chose a blademaster and saved my self alot of expense on equipment... Make sence now?

ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver wrote: »

i think that the point was that a barb is no longer the best choice for tanking but for certain bosses...

nor can they keep aggro once your buddies get rank 8/nirvan/+8 gears

Make sence now?

Juggernaut - Harshlands

Sirsmokealot - Raging Tide wrote: »

Sorry for the double post but these kind of comments kind of annoy me as the barb is not here to be a damage dealer it is here to be tank and this should not be the case I understand a class being able to tank something 15 levels lower than it but anyone able to tank anything at its = level boss wise is fail on the devs side.

When I am in a group with a Blademaster that has 5.0 attack speed and +12 hh100 fists, I am not going to tank. If I tanked a boss, the BM would have to hold back on his dps, and the boss would take a long time to kill. If he went all out, and got aggro, the cleric has to struggle with healing two people as the aggro goes back and forth. If I accept the fact that the BM can tank just fine, I can Devour and DD in human form and the boss goes down much faster then if I was tanking it.

When I am in a group with a high level Veno that has a Herc, I am not going to tank bosses that the Herc can tank just fine. The Herc can reflect a lot of the damage back to the boss, and it also allows me to DD in human form, dealing more damage. The boss goes down faster, and the cleric doesn't even have to heal anyone unless the boss aoes.

I'm sorry you were annoyed with that comment, but the fact remains that Barbs are not the most efficient way of tanking bosses at endgame.

Sirsmokealot - Raging Tide

You know while I like your smileys they do not communicate for you try stringing a few words together to make a sentance and stop expecting me to find the hidden messages in your replies.

Kupuntu - Sanctuary

Sirsmokealot - Raging Tide wrote: »

I will repeat it once more as you dont seem to understand

The barbarians role is to tank just because someone has proven that they can also be effective damage dealers with uber equipments and level does not mean this is how we are all destined to be if I wanted to be a damage dealer I would of chose a blademaster and saved my self alot of expense on equipment... Make sence now?

A barb can tank just fine till high-aps classes reach lvl 85 or 90. After you get like -0.25 or -0.3 int (-0.05 from weapon, cape, tome and then -0.10 from wrists), it starts to be hard.

Partypooper - Harshlands

Sirsmokealot - Raging Tide wrote: »

You know while I like your smileys they do not communicate for you try stringing a few words together to make a sentance and stop expecting me to find the hidden messages in your replies.

Read between the lines