Psys, useless?

Hypnos - Raging Tide

soon I can use soul of vengance to go around harass peeps, just you wait >:}

10min effect un-removable even upon death/dc'd muahahaha

MagicHamsta - Lost City

Hypnos - Raging Tide wrote: »

soon I can use soul of vengance to go around harass peeps, just you wait >:}

10min effect un-removable even upon death/dc'd muahahaha

whew.....
good thing me am a wizard...
since we don't really get hit and since we have a huge mp pool.
b:chuckle

although lol that will be pretty annoying.
xD
b:surrender

Hypnos - Raging Tide

@Glodia: the thing about psychic agro is the fault from game developer, in future patch their agro meter will be lowered which mean it's not entirely the newb fault to draw agro when dding

Kimbley - Harshlands

Why do psy's claim their heal is better than wiz's just because it is aoe? I prefer our morning dew =p

And as for the rest of this discussion... Everything has been said before =p Psy's aren't useless, just not necessary. And atm there are too many people giving them a bad name XD

Daose - Harshlands

Kimbley - Harshlands wrote: »

Why do psy's claim their heal is better than wiz's just because it is aoe? I prefer our morning dew =p

I actually think the wiz heal is better mainly because of the cooldown and it's instant, but AoE can be more useful in some situations.

soon I can use soul of vengance to go around harass peeps, just you wait >:}

10min effect un-removable even upon death/dc'd muahahaha

Lolz b:laugh

About the mana burn of soul of vengeance, it's an incredibly small amount. Or is the formula different for other classes? b:shocked

Giodia - Heavens Tear

Daose - Harshlands wrote: »

Replies in color...b:victory
And this still doesn't apply to EVERYONE, stop going off of this lame generalization. It really isn't helping your argument.

Yes, but it also lasts 90 seconds (going off ecatomb here, feel free to correct me). That extra healing can probably be the difference in whether or not someone can tank a boss. Obviously it won't be needed in all situations, but still handy nonetheless.

If a tank requires 2 healers to heal him, your 90 secs cooldown will not help much. Let me assure you that. One moment that you slipped, it may be the end of something.

Daose - Harshlands wrote: »

I think Reico has a point. Wizards are just pure DD's. While they may be stronger than psychics, I feel that the only thing they really bring to the table is...damage. Psy's can't exactly do the same damage, but they have considerably quicker casts which can somewhat make up for the gap in power. And on top of that, they still have more buffs to bring along, like that AoE heal, empowered vigor, soul of vengeance to stack on reflect. While it's not much, it's still something to consider when choosing who you want on the team. I actually think having a wiz and a psy would be cool.

Even archers watch their aggros and do not auto-dps all the way throughout a boss fight. So what if you can cast fast?

But you cannot chain-cast, your mana doesn't allows it unless charmed, but then again, aggro-snatching problems.

So one would not hesitate to ask: "why would we need a psy then?"

When Mages elemental affinity doesn't fit with the boss, there's always an archer doing pattk. If the mage doesn't have the right affinity for it, what good will a psy do?

Daose - Harshlands wrote: »

No one is arguing that things won't work without psy's, we're arguing your claim that psy's just make all squads fail. And to be honest, the only thing you NEED in most instances is a tank and a cleric. The rest of the team can consist of whoever for the most part.

You think you are so pro to post on a alt with colors. b:chuckle You are the worst thing since WW2.

If we need only a tank and a cleric, the instance run would be so slow, that will make you yawn. Oh, I hope you can pull the mobs one by one on the gluttonix path, with only a tank and cleric.

Clearing Gluttonix will take 45 minutes at least.

Let's face it, with failz psys claiming this and that, it's getting old. Try getting on you main and show me you do have some experience in the game (not an oracle noob), then we will debate further.

Right now, failz psys are still everywhere. it's up to you non-failz to figure out a way to convince people on your claims.

If we can arrange a run, I would love to see if you are controlling your aggro.

Giodia - Heavens Tear

Hypnos - Raging Tide wrote: »

@Glodia: the thing about psychic agro is the fault from game developer, in future patch their agro meter will be lowered which mean it's not entirely the newb fault to draw agro when dding

I know about that patch, but it still will not help if psys chain-cast till oblivion, right?

Kimbley - Harshlands

Even though a run would take forever that doesn't make dd's necessary... they are still optional, just more liked...

And there are fails of every class... not just psy's...

And to judge an entire class based on it's weaker representatives is a bit messed up =P

Giodia - Heavens Tear

Daose - Harshlands wrote: »

I actually think the wiz heal is better mainly because of the cooldown and it's instant, but AoE can be more useful in some situations.



Lolz b:laugh

About the mana burn of soul of vengeance, it's an incredibly small amount. Or is the formula different for other classes? b:shocked

This shows how much you know about the game. b:chuckle

Morning dew is not instant unless sutra. But it has next to none cooldown, so it's spammeable within sutra duration.

That makes it mightily useful on heals. AOE heals? With long duration? Why would we need that?

Your heals are one off (last ditched efforts) skills. But it probably will not save anyone much if we need aoe heals and frankly speaking, if we know how to play our class, we can survive without your aoe heals.

Really. Your heals are lukewarm at best.

Giodia - Heavens Tear

Kimbley - Harshlands wrote: »

Even though a run would take forever that doesn't make dd's necessary... they are still optional, just more liked...

And there are fails of every class... not just psy's...

And to judge an entire class based on it's weaker representatives is a bit messed up =P

Right now as we are speaking, more intellectual-challenged psys are running about.

If the majority of the psys are bad, we automatically assume they are bad as a majority and smart ones (those who do not wish to lose exp) will steer clear of them.

grava2

Well, as a first time player I think I've done very well as a psy, I've only ever been in one boss battle, (with the tusker lol) but I managed to space my casting well enough. learned to avoid soul of Vengence. the burn doesn't help much for grinding. but I do manage to die a lot. seeing as how I hardly ever party I have to yet again wonder if a psy is a class for me. b:worried

It seems like every one is mainly hating on the psy because they don't fit into the tried and true formula of parties. this is just something that fixes itself over time as long as their are players willing to experiment with other players. at any rate. sorry this thread turned (somehow) into a borederline race war.

Hypnos - Raging Tide

maybe the fact that it only take 1.5 sec to chann has aoe effect Heal over time make it better? well the chann can be negated by Sutra and its quick cast come quite handy when you need to recover a quick portion of hp so ea have their own strength

not necessary eh, in TT wizard and archer are not necessary in the presence of the almighty veno, in fb BM is not necessary in the presence of...I dunno, any other classes? In the other hand, a veno have trouble getting zhen squad, a BM, archer, wiz have no trouble getting a rb squad, if come down to usefulness and necessity only cleric and Barb are the most wanted, the other classes can be substituted by alternative choice. Psy is not an exception, it is a magic DD class, its strength is quick channel in compensation for its lower damage per skill, in term of DPS psy is by far a decent magic dps, if not the best, from 1->79. Game developers are well aware of the fact that Psy damage per skill is low, that's why most of the psy weap have +crit to somehow give them some spike damage from time to time. I only limited down from 1-79 because: at 79 wiz have undine strike, I'm well aware of that, with 60% less elemental resistance, wiz no doubt deal massive damage especially with sutra on. At 89, demon veno with ironwood have 20% chance to put an end to any barb or bm. So further comment gotta wait til after the 79, demon and sage skills released. Debuff wise, no class can compared to veno in this matter, Psy's AOE skills bring along with it some nice secondary effect however, lower accuracy, stun, paralyze, slow and bleeding, some are pretty much left untouch in day-p-day grinding and questing but in PvP, especially TW is a great asset no matter how you see it.

Psy concept is focused for pvp but still need lots of fix and tweak, some skill description are wrong too so we'll have to wait till later patch but as I playing psy, it's potentially be a decent class to play, but not overpower because game developer wouldn't want all wiz to reroll psy now do they =/

Daose - Harshlands

Giodia - Heavens Tear wrote: »

If a tank requires 2 healers to heal him, your 90 secs cooldown will not help much. Let me assure you that. One moment that you slipped, it may be the end of something.

Or I won't slip, and it won't be the end of something. Speculation is fun, isn't it?

Even archers watch their aggros and do not auto-dps all the way throughout a boss fight. So what if you can cast fast? But you cannot chain-cast, your mana doesn't allows it unless charmed, but then again, aggro-snatching problems.


Waiting for the aggro-reducing patch...

So one would not hesitate to ask: "why would we need a psy then?"
When Mages elemental affinity doesn't fit with the boss, there's always an archer doing pattk. If the mage doesn't have the right affinity for it, what good will a psy do?

And once again, you're talking as if I said psy's are needed for parties. In situations where a mage CAN be useful, a psy can also shine. Besides, bosses can only resist one element, correct? Wizzes have 3 trees of elements, and psy's have 2. Should be enough to get around resistances if you ask me.

You think you are so pro to post on a alt with colors. b:chuckle You are the worst thing since WW2.


Hmm, don't remember saying I'm "so pro to post on a alt with colors." Rather irrelevant to the discussion at hand.

If we need only a tank and a cleric, the instance run would be so slow, that will make you yawn. Oh, I hope you can pull the mobs one by one on the gluttonix path, with only a tank and cleric. Clearing Gluttonix will take 45 minutes at least.


When I said the only thing you need is a tank and a cleric, I meant that those are the only two things that are required to have a successful run. Venos (on a slightly smaller scale), Sins, Archers, Wizzes, and Psy's all have DD capabilities, so it's usually a matter of who wants to come along. And while anyone with a brain would prefer to have a couple of DD's to make things go faster, they aren't ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY in quite a few scenarios.


Let's face it, with failz psys claiming this and that, it's getting old. Try getting on you main and show me you do have some experience in the game (not an oracle noob), then we will debate further.

I could direct that back at you. Besides, I don't need an avatar to prove my experience of this game. If my words aren't enough for you, kiss it.

Right now, failz psys are still everywhere. it's up to you non-failz to figure out a way to convince people on your claims.

With the class just coming out it's to be expected things won't be 100% smooth. It's just a matter of time.

Ninjetics...

Daose - Harshlands

Giodia - Heavens Tear wrote: »

This shows how much you know about the game. b:chuckle

Morning dew is not instant unless sutra.

By instant, the HEALING is instant as opposed to an HoT. I never said anything about the cast.

But it has next to none cooldown, so it's spammeable within sutra duration.
That makes it mightily useful on heals. AOE heals? With long duration? Why would we need that?

Um...less work for the cleric? The heal can be used to sustain the party. It's obviously not main heal material, but still a good backup heal.

EDIT: You're not gonna be sutra'd 24/7...ijs. And when you aren't, that long channel for dew just isn't going to do. Though that is a good strat.

Giodia - Heavens Tear

Daose - Harshlands wrote: »

Ninjetics...

psys are not needed anywhere. There's no situation where you will shine.

At the end of the day, you are just another DD which the patch will not help much if you keep chain casting.

Actually with the patch, it will just encourage psys to chain-cast even more, which results in aggro-snatching.

The problem is: You need a wiz to shine, when a wiz or other classes do not need any psy buff, heal DD, reflect skills to shine.

Veno is a one man army, which I have soloed my FBs myself.

psy is not a essential piece of the puzzle. You do not have STA, or sutra, no undine.

We do not need a jack around.

Hypnos - Raging Tide

...why all your argument always based one sole assumption that all psy do is chain casting, it's not like psy don't have an esc button on their keyboard o.,O

True, everything work out fine even w/o TB appearance, that's why when expansion coming, game developer say this race is solely focus on pvp. That doesn't mean they are useless when it come down to DD + some support compare to an archer do none other than auto atk.

Sutra we have something similar, tide spirit, with a bonus of damage, also disturb soul negate sutra effect.
undine is a lvl79 skills, let us wait till later

back at the wiz, do they have a skill allow them to remove debuff? do they have a skill to stun enemy? why would the game developer would give psy wiz skills and vica versa?

Giodia - Heavens Tear

Daose - Harshlands wrote: »

By instant, the HEALING is instant as opposed to an HoT. I never said anything about the cast.

Um...less work for the cleric? The heal can be used to sustain the party. It's obviously not main heal material, but still a good backup heal.

EDIT: You're not gonna be sutra'd 24/7...ijs. And when you aren't, that long channel for dew just isn't going to do. Though that is a good strat.

Cast time is essential. By spamming Dew..you can gain back chi fast.

Read how mages managed to safe full wipes with their sutra+ heal combo.

Each heals can reach at least 3k, so it's much much more better than your bubble of life. And that's why mages are preferred.

Giodia - Heavens Tear

Hypnos - Raging Tide wrote: »

...why all your argument always based one sole assumption that all psy do is chain casting, it's not like psy don't have an esc button on their keyboard o.,O

True, everything work out fine even w/o TB appearance, that's why when expansion coming, game developer say this race is solely focus on pvp. That doesn't mean they are useless when it come down to DD + some support compare to an archer do none other than auto atk.

Sutra we have something similar, tide spirit, with a bonus of damage, also disturb soul negate sutra effect.
undine is a lvl79 skills, let us wait till later

back at the wiz, do they have a skill allow them to remove debuff? do they have a skill to stun enemy? why would the game developer would give psy wiz skills and vica versa?

Apparently, the failz psys did not know they have an esc button. And your tide spirit doesn't allow spells to cast fast to the point of spamming it.

Disturb soul is not useful for most bosses.

Archers dps comes from auto-shots. But that doesn't mean we can afk. We need to monitor our crits. If we crit 3-5 times in a row, which can happen, we will need to stop dpsing.

Keeping the boss on debuffs (vicious and serrated) is also another way to lower the HP faster.

It's pretty funny to see psys trying to argue that they do have some place in a squad.

RB rainbow squads doesn't include fishborns. kkthxbai.

Hypnos - Raging Tide

1 sutra = ~4 spell cast, 1 tide spirit = 3 spell cast + 100% increased magic weapon damage, both take 2 sparks

my point was not disturb soul on boss, it's disturb soul vs wizard, did you see any mob have sutra?

oh,more assumption, are you implied that psychic goes afk when dding eh /:)

does Rainbow squad even work now? and I see more squad willing to take on another BM, Archer or cleric on their rb squad rather than veno.

and it's funny how a psy hater trying to prove psy doesn't have a place in the game. If you hate it so much, quit the game, easier for you and for us

you next point is?

Risingson - Lost City

Giodia, you pretend you only blame the players behind Psychics, but you really don't xD.

You're also arguing a lot about Psychics' skills, their utility and you are CONSTANTLY comparing them to Wizards. They are not the same, drop it. Besides, Psychics are useful in squad runs. I can tank magical bosses, Qingzi, Trioc and all, no problem. I can deal a lot of damage, actually I deal more damage than Wizards right now, or at least the same, if there is any in my squad. The only point you have is about the heal, I don't use it a lot in instance runs. Although it's very very useful in Public Quest. I myself see Bubble of Life as a caster-dedicated heal, since you're really not gonna run close to your tank and cast the heal so he can benefit from it.

You say we won't be useful when a mob has some elemental resistance, but that's kind of the reason why we have Soulburn I think, and other skills that rely on our Soulforce. Those are basically neutral skills thats damage won't get reduced by any kind of elemental barrier. For example, Red Tide's damage may get reduced against a water mob, but the bleeding, if triggered, won't. And believe me the bleeding hurts. So does Soulburn. Those two are enough to kill, in addition of our other elemental tree we will use against a water/earth resistant mob.

About rainbow squad anyway, like I said I never struggled to find a squad, and I do my 3 BHs EVERYDAY. Nobody ever told me "no, no Tideborn sorry!", and that has nothing to do with "luck on Lost City", most people are just not stubborn haters like you. Take a break.

Reico_M - Dreamweaver

Giodia - Do yourself a favor and quit playing PWI. Complaining about how tideborn aren't needed, and how we were all better off without them isn't going to change anything. The developers aren't going to read you and say "Hrm, maybe we made a mistake." and undo the Rising Tide expansion. Psychics aren't going anywhere, Assassins aren't going anywhere. Complaining about how the rainbow squad is all messed up now isn't going to help anything. Do yourself and everyone else a favor and STFU.

Schwarzen - Sanctuary

Anyone besides me notice that Gioda's icon looks alot like that of a Psychic?

Im detecting some major self loathing issues

Konariraiden - Heavens Tear

Schwarzen - Sanctuary wrote: »

Anyone besides me notice that Gioda's icon looks alot like that of a Psychic?

Im detecting some major self loathing issues

It's basic psychology, really. Gio just has multiple personality disorder. I prescribe 250 milligrams of SHUT THE HELL UP.

EvilVisage - Heavens Tear

I'm not going to get back into the fighting argument.

But with my personal experience as a psy, I'm going to have to disprove everything Giodia says.

We have a place in squads. I'd choose a psy over an archer, and even a wiz sometimes, anyday.

Our heal isn't all that effective, but it does help at times. The range could use w/ an increase.

The overall class is balanced, and is great for pvp.

I can kill about anyone from any class around my level, except for occasionally barbs (Due to the raw hp).

Its just a ploy. If your so unhappy about the new classes, go play MY-PW. They generally don't get new stuff very quickly.

PequetteV - Lost City

stop saying bubble of life is bad only the range is


i healed wizard in fb59

Daose - Harshlands

Schwarzen - Sanctuary wrote: »

Anyone besides me notice that Gioda's icon looks alot like that of a Psychic?

Im detecting some major self loathing issues

LMAO

About Bubble of life, if it gets that 15 meter range patch that the chinese server supposedly got/is getting, it will be a much more useful skill.

BTW, I'm done arguing with you giodia. Waste of time really...actions speak louder than words.

EvilVisage - Heavens Tear

PequetteV - Lost City wrote: »

stop saying bubble of life is bad only the range is


i healed wizard in fb59

No need to be an ****. But bubble of like is terrible. The range makes it almost useless, except for personal heals. So... since the RANGE of the skill in this case makes the skill, then yes... Its bad. You "healed" a wiz in fb59. Maybe if hes taking pyro lmao.

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver

Risingson - Lost City wrote: »

Giodia, you pretend you only blame the players behind Psychics, but you really don't xD.

You're also arguing a lot about Psychics' skills, their utility and you are CONSTANTLY comparing them to Wizards. They are not the same, drop it. Besides, Psychics are useful in squad runs. I can tank magical bosses, Qingzi, Trioc and all, no problem. I can deal a lot of damage, actually I deal more damage than Wizards right now, or at least the same, if there is any in my squad. The only point you have is about the heal, I don't use it a lot in instance runs. Although it's very very useful in Public Quest. I myself see Bubble of Life as a caster-dedicated heal, since you're really not gonna run close to your tank and cast the heal so he can benefit from it.

You say we won't be useful when a mob has some elemental resistance, but that's kind of the reason why we have Soulburn I think, and other skills that rely on our Soulforce. Those are basically neutral skills thats damage won't get reduced by any kind of elemental barrier. For example, Red Tide's damage may get reduced against a water mob, but the bleeding, if triggered, won't. And believe me the bleeding hurts. So does Soulburn. Those two are enough to kill, in addition of our other elemental tree we will use against a water/earth resistant mob.

About rainbow squad anyway, like I said I never struggled to find a squad, and I do my 3 BHs EVERYDAY. Nobody ever told me "no, no Tideborn sorry!", and that has nothing to do with "luck on Lost City", most people are just not stubborn haters like you. Take a break.

pffft magic bosses was sooooo 8 months ago. I know wizzies who can tank tt runs and hardcore phys bosses.

Risingson - Lost City

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »

pffft magic bosses was sooooo 8 months ago. I know wizzies who can tank tt runs and hardcore phys bosses.

pffffffffffffffffft sorry if I started the game in December and wasn't playing 8 months ago. I don't know everything yet. Good for the wizards you know.

kenlee

Saherra - Harshlands wrote: »

umm dude are u freaking insane... 40% were that come from.. and plus hge said 5 classes (BM, Acher, Cleric, Veno, Wiz) leaving one stop open... why would some1 fill that stop with an other tank, when a FATSER dder can go there... a veno is only good for purify and debuffs.

curious about what purify are you talking about? anyway veno is debuffing but i have strong debuffs. amplify, myriad rainbow for chance to 100% pdef/mdef reduction, iron wood and genie skills like extreme poison and tagling mire. with this debuffs counted, my guild mate ( r8 archer) tank and drop fb89 bosses in like 1 min. im wondering if similar psy can do that too.