Sword or Fist? Which is the better at PvP?

Azianjimster - Sanctuary

imho fist bms are just wanna be archers b:chuckle

Sinense - Sanctuary

I should really play this character... but... fist and claw users have some other weaknesses but ... if you build yourself for fists and claws:

o If you have an archer in your party, they can buff you.

o We get 100 evasion from 10 dex where archers get 60 evasion from 10 dex.

o We get ridiculous benefits from weapon refines and from -interval gear. Also because of our evasion, we get good benefits against melee classes from armor refines. (But refine benefits are mostly late game only unless you are rich).,

o Light armor with alter marrow magical (along with even 20 or 30 vitality) can help with wizards (and so can shadowless kick and our high attack rate). We must manage our cooldowns or must duck out of combat if we have to switch back to magical after we switched to physical but this can really help. Also, party buffs can help deal with our pdef penalty, so even level 10 can be viable.

Granrey - Sanctuary

Azianjimster - Sanctuary wrote: »

imho fist bms are just wanna be archers b:chuckle

Silly post.

If somebody wants to be an archer, then that person makes an archer toon.

Its not like we are born BMs and we want to be archers.

Saying that I have seen some Archers using claws and fists as you guys can have it too due to the low str requirement.

A bm using a bow + fists is way more deadlier than archer using a bow + fists. At least with melee mobs.

Sylvae - Sanctuary

Granrey - Sanctuary wrote: »

Silly post.

If somebody wants to be an archer, then that person makes an archer toon.

Its not like we are born BMs and we want to be archers.

Saying that I have seen some Archers using claws and fists as you guys can have it too due to the low str requirement.

A bm using a bow + fists is way more deadlier than archer using a bow + fists. At least with melee mobs.

I dunno, if I could get the rank 8 chest for archers and mix that with all the -interval equips, the insane attack rate could make up for not having fist mastery pretty easily. Would kill the build for being anything but a fist user however.

King_Solomon - Heavens Tear

Sylvae - Sanctuary wrote: »

I dunno, if I could get the rank 8 chest for archers and mix that with all the -interval equips, the insane attack rate could make up for not having fist mastery pretty easily. Would kill the build for being anything but a fist user however.

golden TT99 LA mixed with HA + TT100 fists = 2.50 hits/sec.

Granrey - Sanctuary

Sylvae - Sanctuary wrote: »

I dunno, if I could get the rank 8 chest for archers and mix that with all the -interval equips, the insane attack rate could make up for not having fist mastery pretty easily. Would kill the build for being anything but a fist user however.

I think the logic is simple.

When a melee mob is attacked with a bow, the mob moves toward the attacker.

Which is the BM zone. The mob is falling into a trap as BM has short range physical attack and great physical defence. In other words the bow will do some damage but its use for pulling.

The archer should keep range at all cost. Pulling the mob to use fists after is not a good move. by doing that, the archer is playing the mob game due low phy defence (LA) and low attack with fists due to lack of masteries.

Sylvae - Sanctuary

Granrey - Sanctuary wrote: »

I think the logic is simple.

When a melee mob is attacked with a bow, the mob moves toward the attacker.

Which is the BM zone. The mob is falling into a trap as BM has short range physical attack and great physical defence. In other words the bow will do some damage but its use for pulling.

The archer should keep range at all cost. Pulling the mob to use fists after is not a good move. by doing that, the archer is playing the mob game due low phy defence (LA) and low attack with fists due to lack of masteries.

You missed me saying it would ruin the build for anything else.

It would be a HA build, not an LA one, during early grinding. For areas of grinding where buffs aren't available, it would make use of Winged Shell to alleviate damage. Later on Demon Wingspan might help out as well, for constant stream of dmg prevention. Or play as normal and restat later on if feeling lazy.

Thinking 3str/2dex build or so, which would mean at around 100 lvl

(1+2.01) 3.01 as multiplier, compared to

(1+2.01+.6) 3.61 multiplier with lvl 10 mastery and a 3str/2dex fist build

So 83% dmg compared to a BM using the exact same build.

The whole points is the rank 8 chest piece, which allows an extra -.1 interval that is unavailable to any other class. Because of that, no one else can have as high an attack rate. And remember, the higher interval stacks, the more effect it has.

So you could have -.1 chest, -.1 TT 99 wrists, -.5 LA TT99 set bonus, -.5 HA TT99 set bonus, -.1 fists. So base of .3 interval. Then there is a lvl 8 tome that gives -.05, and a cape that does the same. So 5 attacks a second, and this is before speed boosts. Wouldn't even dream of trying this without getting the rare stuff first however. But as can be seen, that extra -.1 can have a major effect in damage. It's all a matter of how many pieces you can scrounge together.

The difference between -.6 and -.65 is double the number of attacks. So depending on where the BM tops out, an archer doing only 83% dmg can still easily outdamage them by quite a large margin. Just depends on time frame and coins available.

Granrey - Sanctuary

Sylvae - Sanctuary wrote: »

You missed me saying it would ruin the build for anything else.

.

It does not ruin the built at all as the trick for the BM works with the lowest level bow available. Which means even a Barb can pull with the bow and do minor damage along the way.

As I said the BM pulls with the bow to bring the mob to BM specialty area which is close combat.

The archer regardles whatever he does with his built, close combat is the wrong way to go for him.

Sylvae - Sanctuary

The ruining of the build is talking about the archer. I've only really posted on the archer, as only they can get that specific rank gear. Only time BM was mentioned was to compare damage. And I think everyone would agree, having an archer stat for heavy armor fist would pretty much ruin it for its normal intended function

KevinK - Sanctuary

Fists BMS rock.
With the natural accuracy, there is no need for dex/accuracy equipment. There is no need for the 50% rings, therefore you can use higher dmg rights w/ + str on them. With demon spark & increased speed, you can quickly switch to a weapon like dark flash that heals you while you hit.

Against light armors, one single dex ring is enough to handle them.

Against mages that kite, it's easy to switch to a +str weapon with garnet shards, no need for accuracy shards. etc, etc.

Tkd - Lost City

In LVL 40..

What is the best weapon for PVP?
or PVP and PVE ..balanced..

Filet - Heavens Tear

KevinK - Sanctuary wrote: »

Fists BMS rock.
With the natural accuracy, there is no need for dex/accuracy equipment. There is no need for the 50% rings, therefore you can use higher dmg rights w/ + str on them. With demon spark & increased speed, you can quickly switch to a weapon like dark flash that heals you while you hit.

Against light armors, one single dex ring is enough to handle them.

Against mages that kite, it's easy to switch to a +str weapon with garnet shards, no need for accuracy shards. etc, etc.

Dex build axe bms, or sword bms, etc. can just use 2 ring of mastadon's strength instead of 2 mistys. With a fist bm's already low max hp, the 5% hp recovery from dark flash would barely account for anything. And any bm against a mage has no need for acc shards... mages have practically no evade

Aiden_Legend - Heavens Tear

I may only be a lvl 60 fists but i am able to own other bms several lvls above me, they hit quick and with the genie skill wind shield hit even quicker, not to mention with magic users we have a stop spell casting skill so def fists

Kniraven - Lost City

Necro Alert.

Anyways, use both.
Sword + Fist are amazing together.
Please someone close this and nobody respond.

Sucubus - Lost City

non will EVER we mooore ruined then me EVER fist/claw barb lv66 and 6k hp selfbuffedb:laugh yeah i love playing as a noob b:dirty

Kniraven - Lost City

Sucubus - Lost City wrote: »

non will EVER we mooore ruined then me EVER fist/claw barb lv66 and 6k hp selfbuffedb:laugh yeah i love playing as a noob b:dirty

http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/5082/gtfo.gif

DruGbUsEr - Lost City

b:shocked Fists Are Very good nowadays because of those Sacrificial Strike Fists

Kaste - Sanctuary

moymoy wrote: »

Fist will rock at the end... you know why?? higher dex=higher acc= higher critical= higher evasion... meaning you will never hit us and we will kill your defence with our critical... got it??

seriosly, fists may have high dex, but what if they meet a high dex axe wielder with double mistys (or sign of frost: chaos / some other rings like that)? They wont be able to do a damn **** about getting their **** kicked. Fister is going to get stunlocked, especially if he is wearing LA as most fist BMs

Divine_Death - Dreamweaver

Kaste - Sanctuary wrote: »

seriosly, fists may have high dex, but what if they meet a high dex axe wielder with double mistys (or sign of frost: chaos / some other rings like that)? They wont be able to do a damn **** about getting their **** kicked. Fister is going to get stunlocked, especially if he is wearing LA as most fist BMs

Double, no triple necro.
And fyi, most fists BM use HA. There's only one way axes can kill a BM and that's HF+Bramble. Anything else's just charm tick.

TerminatorX - Lost City

Popular opinion is that 3/2 is pretty much the best move for any non-tanker BM with the cash to support it so and fists > * so...

/convo?

Im_Grumpy - Dreamweaver

Nayiro - Sanctuary wrote: »

Fists. Everyone will argue against me, but fists late game own in PvP vs. any other CC class. Our accuracy and dodge is substantial. We hit fast, us pots less often due to spark gathering so quickly. We also beat casters because of our one skill that cancels their spell.

But honestly, everyone will tell you swords because everyone on PWI is to young (in game) to realize fists rock PvP.

But that's just me.

I have a level 65 Fist/Axe BM and he can take down lv 70 BMs and Barbs and you are soooo right, people are like, WTF HAPPENED? when i beat them, sword BMs are easy...

Pro_untamed - Lost City

Claws rock at pvp why because fist and claw bms will pwnd any class in a matter off seconds its all about intervals u stun de enemy if u have enough intervals u will kill them before they say oh....****..... note u need high refining lvl on fists/claws ......u don't need vit ..... that's wat stones are for and refine ure end gear equipment to the most u can..... use will of budhista to put ure ivasion high ....wen being hit u will see ...mismissmissmismis sometimes resist against meele target not against mages (sucks) but that's why u have stun skills ...... always have ure marows ready ...... by the way dragon bane is awsome if u get to use it with demon spark .... if u are planing to go fist/claw. There is no point on going sage go demon why ..cuz more crits .... at end game u should have 300 strenght and 200 dex. U can use all skills tree all heavy armor and all axes till nirvana 1xx. To get all interval gear work ure **** off farming wat ever mats if ure poor... if ure rich jst buy it ..... don't believe wat they say about fistl/claw bms those are jst fail bms who are noobs at this game bo matter wat servers .... by the way its also about how well u understand the bm that counts well I am out

Okeano - Harshlands

Stop necroing sht.

EndlessDark - Harshlands

ugh..to end this, im a lvl 66 bm, with interval lvl 60 bloodmoon bracers and my lvl 60 gold fists. so far ive yet to lose to anyone near my level, and ive won against lvl 80 clerics, 70 sins, (not to good on barbs though...). other bms cause me no problem, i end up cutting trough their hp with a well timed spark and bodhivista. i beleive fist bms win over axe and sword if you cant stop their hits (bodhivista comes back into play). but i guess this may be unfair seeing as i can get interval items.
sooo...aps=win? i mean i can also use axes my level so if i come across a kiting demon, stun till they submit...

BaddgirlxD - Dreamweaver

Cash shop interval gear to -3.33 base and then tell me whos better x)

Monofailmuch - Heavens Tear

I've been a sword bm all my life because the first weapon u get in the game is a wooden sword and it looks cool.

Yet, i was getting pwned deep hard by other bms.
Axes hit harder with skills and can stunlock.
Fists have better dps/chi building with normal attacks.
Poles have a strong ranged attack and a purge weapon.

I was using mage bane and atmos strike and ..i was losing all the time.
I never firgured out how to beat other classes either. b:cry

So I cashshopped like a *****, I charged thousands of bucks each month to make up for it. b:pleased
I bought a lunar sword and refined it a lot.
But I was still losing so I decided to use other weapons.
Now i'm the leader of drakon, the strongest tw faction of my server and I'm feared by pretty much all the TWers. b:cool

So don't use swords except for myriad in pve. b:bye

Kupuntu - Sanctuary

Monofailmuch - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I've been a sword bm all my life because the first weapon u get in the game is a wooden sword and it looks cool.

Yet, i was getting pwned deep hard by other bms.
Axes hit harder with skills and can stunlock.
Fists have better dps/chi building with normal attacks.
Poles have a strong ranged attack and a purge weapon.

I was using mage bane and atmos strike and ..i was losing all the time.
I never firgured out how to beat other classes either. b:cry

So I cashshopped like a *****, I charged thousands of bucks each month to make up for it. b:pleased
I bought a lunar sword and refined it a lot.
But I was still losing so I decided to use other weapons.
Now i'm the leader of drakon, the strongest tw faction of my server and I'm feared by pretty much all the TWers. b:cool

So don't use swords except for myriad in pve. b:bye

That post says enough; you are a hater of that guy but definitely not him.

Pro_untamed - Lost City

Axe/fist build is best jst go with that

eraldus

Just do whatever you want and don't let biased ppl "build" your char for you.

Pro_untamed - Lost City

eraldus wrote: »

Just do whatever you want and don't let biased ppl "build" your char for you.

Lol yup jst go and try wat ever you want its all about experience you will find out wats best for you wen you try it :)b:victory