Imo we should wait for mod 6 to be finally released as they delayed the launch by a few weeks. That COULD mean nice changes for the SW incoming. I really hope so.
If the launch is delayed I really think it is to avoid a mad exodus of NWO players to ESO. Launching a fail product the same day a win product is being launched would have just been stupid.
The thing the devs seems to have trouble with, is over nerfing and over buffing. theres never a medium.
The one time they attempted to nerf CW's. It was too much. (and it was pretty much the only time they have tried to nerf CW's) and instead they completely negated all nerfs they were going to do and buff them instead.
this time around, their buffing them even more.
Then TR's, they got over buffed with the flawed way they made Shadow of Demise work, and the auto proccing dazes from scoudrel that can be delivered in such a way that it can be endless. After so long where TR's were not in a great state.
GWF's have been messed up ever since they decided to remove thier prones and decrease thier unstoppable DR. All that needs to be recalled now.
GF's after so long finally got buff to decency.
DC's have been changed so drastically that they're all over the place now. You either cant kill them worth <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> or they kill you effortlessly.
And Paladin's are coming out soon and they're just a mess. They're in the most messiest state out of any class released yet.
SW was in a nicely balanced state, but continued to get nerfed and nerfed. Not a single adjustment has been made other than nerfing to SW's. To top it all off, general changes like the whole change to life steal and regeneration affect the class the hardest. Thats why its in the state its in now.
SW no longer has nothing going for it at all. the sole reason they were brought into the game, had progressively been taken away by the class everyone was worried about doing in the first place that it shouldnt really be doing in the first place primarily, Control Wizards.
The thing the devs seems to have trouble with, is over nerfing and over buffing. theres never a medium.
The one time they attempted to nerf CW's. It was too much. (and it was pretty much the only time they have tried to nerf CW's) and instead they completely negated all nerfs they were going to do and buff them instead.
this time around, their buffing them even more.
Then TR's, they got over buffed with the flawed way they made Shadow of Demise work, and the auto proccing dazes from scoudrel that can be delivered in such a way that it can be endless. After so long where TR's were not in a great state.
GWF's have been messed up ever since they decided to remove thier prones and decrease thier unstoppable DR. All that needs to be recalled now.
GF's after so long finally got buff to decency.
DC's have been changed so drastically that they're all over the place now. You either cant kill them worth <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> or they kill you effortlessly.
And Paladin's are coming out soon and they're just a mess. They're in the most messiest state out of any class released yet.
SW was in a nicely balanced state, but continued to get nerfed and nerfed. Not a single adjustment has been made other than nerfing to SW's. To top it all off, general changes like the whole change to life steal and regeneration affect the class the hardest. Thats why its in the state its in now.
SW no longer has nothing going for it at all. the sole reason they were brought into the game, had progressively been taken away by the class everyone was worried about doing in the first place that it shouldnt really be doing in the first place primarily, Control Wizards.
I have been saying for awhile (since before iwd was released) that classes they were going to nerf (gwf and hr) should just be left a lone, the others will catch up. They nerfed gwf, changed hr without really nerfing it, and the other classes all caught up anyways. The IV Sent GWF nightmare of mod3 would not be so scary in a mix of mod6 TR's, DC's and CW's. It would be just about right. The same with the Stalwart Bulwark Guardian Fighters prior to the nerfing of the set and the conqueror capstone.
I agree. I wasnt too worried at the time in Mod 3 with the prone chaining GWF's were doing in Mod 3. Mod 2 is when GWF's were the most balanced in my opinion. Every single thing GWF's had going for them has been crushed into the ground. Unstoppable, Determination generation, DR, Roar, prones via Takedown and Frontline Surge, Slam, Spinning Strike (reducing the duration and making the attacks hit faster actually made this worse in my opinion)
GWF's shouldnt never have been touched, and they wouldnt have been in the sorry state they are now. The only thing to fix its state is to pull back ALL those changes. Roar needs to return like it was before except not go through CC immunity, and at the very least Takedown needs its prone back (I can settle for Frontline Surge remaining a stun on players). Thier stamina gain needs increasing as well as strength attribute just not deliver as it should.
As for SW's, thier "adjustments" need to be pulled back. They need to do something with all thier lifesteal. Many of thier miniscule class features need serious buffing. And I feel curse synergies need to refund back some stamina when they are done, globally though all curses when curse synergies are made successfully.
I cant even begin to comment on everything thats messed up on paladins right now. Its just a mess.
Tr's need a toning down. AND NOT OVER NERFED like they so readily do everytime they adjust something. Just fix Shadow of Demise so it deals its piercing damage similar to how HR's do. And the dazes from scoundrel need a slight tone down in thier duration. The original timing of the dazes were bad, but they over compensated when they lengthened them in mod 5 preview.
The only classes that seem to stay in relatively good shape always is CW (of course) and HR's
Denvald , gived you a nice advice, by stoping playing that class and if every warlock are doing it , then maybe they will change the class instead of having a class unplayed.
Dev's looks at curves and statistics , if something show like no one is playing sw , then they will buff it for sure
Denvald , gived you a nice advice, by stoping playing that class and if every warlock are doing it , then maybe they will change the class instead of having a class unplayed.
Dev's looks at curves and statistics , if something show like no one is playing sw , then they will buff it for sure
but atm there are nearly no warlocks doing PVP looking at the leaderboard, hoards of TR´s running Holtenow or GG, what do the devs need more? Every day there are tons of obvious absurdly imbalanced situation as proof for imbalance of the hole game
normally i do not have problems with GWF as warlock, if the warlock just tries to facetank the GWF he will sure fail, but thats not the way to deal him
since i tried hellbringer in pvp i can say: its <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> for PVP vs SB imo, not more not less
I usually have problems fighting GWFs like Steamroller/Eomer/Saber. And some other GWFs with 8k+power. Probably the only chance for me to win them is to kite around a pillar, otherwise they will just roll me into the ground with ease.
I just played a few matches with my newly level 60 SW Temp (+2 feats from Fury) ... and i must say that the class is not THAT bad thanks to Cursedbite, Harrowstorm and Infernal spheres as encounters + Eldrich blast and Dark Aura on at wills + "free" 20% ApR... or, improving what i just said/typed, the class is not as bad as GWF-class .
Curse bite? For temptation??? That's already enough for me to judge what PvP warlock you're. Got carried a "few" matches and thinks PvP SW is good now. Ok...
Problems about not to being kicked??? XDDDD (sorry, could not resist. XD)
Yes. Yet, he does not curse at his partymates before he kicks them. As well as he does not care abusing GM help. After all, there is waaay more annoying **** that every single "competitive" PvPers abuses, DC/CW/TR is just shining trio for that. And if you ask me it's more annoying when I am fighting an equally geared PvP CW renegade with a shield up and then he deals 28k icy rays through Shadow slip on on me and when I go look at the log I realize that the icyrays itself did only 8k, the rest is just some ****ty broken class feature Or when some terribad GWF steamroller clone can't kill me and slots perfect bloodtheft/ferocious reaction just to kill me. Yes I actually had SUCH experience and it was even more poisonous than being kicked by somebody.
Well, obviously, i were carried due, as i said, its my first time on PvP with a level 60 SW class char. But trust me, i did more that 1 kill vs players on my own on even/equal conditions (full HP and with Dailies up [Brood]) contesting a node. (EDIT) If you still think that HB SW on any tree is the worst class on PvP, then, I invite you to go SM Destroyer or Instigator to PvP Arena and check it/them out by yourself.
Instigator is an utter trash like Damnation path for SWs which I can't say about destroyers. Those guys may halve you if you yawn too much.
lets say GWF has one build (as known for month) with maxed stats that is deadly indeed and can handle lots of classes GS 24k up
lets say GWF in lower and midrange (as known for month) is a bad trip in most cases
lets say warlock is bad all in all, has some advantage against GWF by dots and slip mechanics, but most classes have this and even do better with real dodges and big burst damage
lets say Warlock under performs in higher spheres compared to other classes getting near godmode if maxed
warlock is fine atm, its just that other classes need a tonedown
regards
I agree in case of tone down, but i think warlock needs a littel defence-buff since all classes like TR, DC, CW, Hunter, even GWF and GF have much better mechnics as known for month
@clonkyo1 and ofnieslaf
if you say all is fine you really should play the class in PVP more then 10 times before writnig any comments , i have a lev 32 GWF and went some pug PVP matches low level, he is ok, a bit underperforming, can I give e real feedback to the community in case of knowing nothing about it?
But then, the SW can use Lifedrinker with Dreadtheft and make a show
i tried lifedrinker , it doesn´t perform very well in my case, to much damage loss against plague fire and to less heal in my case (but uesed a smal version)
and damnation isn´t a choice for PVP in mod 5, and will not in mod 6 I predict
Not sure if you're being sarcastic, the more DoT ticks they have from you, the higher chance FR/bloodtheft will proc multiple times.
Maybe the guy doesn't actually PvP
I am the monk, martial skill transcends the battlefield
It is my my life style, my doctrine and my state of mind,
You fight well, but without focus and discipline, you will fall.
As a warlock player since mod 4 on release I think the main problem is warlock lacking and actual defence mechanism. All the other classes have them but warlocks, a buff to shadow slip or rework would be great as our main defence stat life steal is being reworked to only a % chance to proc. that is not very good because unlike warlocks other classes aren't dependent on life steal, they got decent defence on their gear and for example wizards get a shield. If warlock stays in the state it is in now before mod 6 we will still take the big hits and our shift will be pretty much useless since piercing damage will cut through it. I understand the life steal nerf so that clerics and tanks will be needed but think about the warlock, we are squishy and true we have high damage but our rotations take ridiculously long to cast and we will be interrupted a lot. We are supposed to be tanky casters and robe wearing wizards can last longer than us. Warlocks need higher defence on armor and a better shift or defence mechanism so that we're no longer the easy kill. I would have suggested invisibility on shift but I can see the problems that could cause with temptation.
i tried lifedrinker , it doesn´t perform very well in my case, to much damage loss against plague fire and to less heal in my case (but uesed a smal version)
and damnation isn´t a choice for PVP in mod 5, and will not in mod 6 I predict
I use Lifedrinker for PvE and it performs decently well.
Granted, I'm not willing to transfer a GVorp to my SW, I can't see how much of a difference it would make for pugging or clearing dailies. For scenarios below CN/PvP, it's not a bad option for total self sufficiency. I'm playing a SB Damnation build and it seem to work as expected.
As for why Devs can't fix SW, the answer is obvious - They're waiting for the appropriate mod to make SW ridiculously imbalanced. We've seen it with nearly every class so far. One mod, SW will rise to the levels of DC/TR/GWF.
Broken mechanics, broken class designs, lack of actual content, and over zealous, bronze-age moderation?
As for why Devs can't fix SW, the answer is obvious - They're waiting for the appropriate mod to make SW ridiculously imbalanced. We've seen it with nearly every class so far. One mod, SW will rise to the levels of DC/TR/GWF.
Well, I'll surely not wait 5 more modules to play again like I did on my TR. Will that module even exist? More and more players will be lured by our class to soon realize they should have invested their time/money into something else but SW because apparently, some other caster class is more praised by the devs. I already got sick enough by how our class is treated to get over my principles and transfered all my enchantments to TR I used to play before m5. Just to troll oneshotting GWFs/fellow SWs and kick those that kicked me when I played my PvP SW since my char is rather old (the older your char is the more likely you'll get a lead) and already in the first 20 pages and you know it feels quite good, just trying not to fall asleep doing it though.
thefabricantMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 5,248Arc User
edited March 2015
I have all 3 of the main classes discussed here, CW, SW and TR. I can honestly say, the most broken of them is TR, which will become evident mod 6. True, CW has been historically strong, but which class can solo anything in mod 5 AND mod 6 with the absolute most garbage gear?....TR. It doesn't matter how well I can play my CW, my CW will never be able to perform the same level of bs that my TR can, simply because my tr has the the invincibility shield of stealth+ITC. SW....that is a horribly weak class in comparison to either CW or TR though and I completely understand the perspective of them needing a buff. Whilst SW can output more damage, it comes at the cost of having absolutely no CC, which is just not a worthwhile trade off.
Comments
If the launch is delayed I really think it is to avoid a mad exodus of NWO players to ESO. Launching a fail product the same day a win product is being launched would have just been stupid.
The one time they attempted to nerf CW's. It was too much. (and it was pretty much the only time they have tried to nerf CW's) and instead they completely negated all nerfs they were going to do and buff them instead.
this time around, their buffing them even more.
Then TR's, they got over buffed with the flawed way they made Shadow of Demise work, and the auto proccing dazes from scoudrel that can be delivered in such a way that it can be endless. After so long where TR's were not in a great state.
GWF's have been messed up ever since they decided to remove thier prones and decrease thier unstoppable DR. All that needs to be recalled now.
GF's after so long finally got buff to decency.
DC's have been changed so drastically that they're all over the place now. You either cant kill them worth <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> or they kill you effortlessly.
And Paladin's are coming out soon and they're just a mess. They're in the most messiest state out of any class released yet.
SW was in a nicely balanced state, but continued to get nerfed and nerfed. Not a single adjustment has been made other than nerfing to SW's. To top it all off, general changes like the whole change to life steal and regeneration affect the class the hardest. Thats why its in the state its in now.
SW no longer has nothing going for it at all. the sole reason they were brought into the game, had progressively been taken away by the class everyone was worried about doing in the first place that it shouldnt really be doing in the first place primarily, Control Wizards.
I have been saying for awhile (since before iwd was released) that classes they were going to nerf (gwf and hr) should just be left a lone, the others will catch up. They nerfed gwf, changed hr without really nerfing it, and the other classes all caught up anyways. The IV Sent GWF nightmare of mod3 would not be so scary in a mix of mod6 TR's, DC's and CW's. It would be just about right. The same with the Stalwart Bulwark Guardian Fighters prior to the nerfing of the set and the conqueror capstone.
GWF's shouldnt never have been touched, and they wouldnt have been in the sorry state they are now. The only thing to fix its state is to pull back ALL those changes. Roar needs to return like it was before except not go through CC immunity, and at the very least Takedown needs its prone back (I can settle for Frontline Surge remaining a stun on players). Thier stamina gain needs increasing as well as strength attribute just not deliver as it should.
As for SW's, thier "adjustments" need to be pulled back. They need to do something with all thier lifesteal. Many of thier miniscule class features need serious buffing. And I feel curse synergies need to refund back some stamina when they are done, globally though all curses when curse synergies are made successfully.
I cant even begin to comment on everything thats messed up on paladins right now. Its just a mess.
Tr's need a toning down. AND NOT OVER NERFED like they so readily do everytime they adjust something. Just fix Shadow of Demise so it deals its piercing damage similar to how HR's do. And the dazes from scoundrel need a slight tone down in thier duration. The original timing of the dazes were bad, but they over compensated when they lengthened them in mod 5 preview.
The only classes that seem to stay in relatively good shape always is CW (of course) and HR's
Dev's looks at curves and statistics , if something show like no one is playing sw , then they will buff it for sure
but atm there are nearly no warlocks doing PVP looking at the leaderboard, hoards of TR´s running Holtenow or GG, what do the devs need more? Every day there are tons of obvious absurdly imbalanced situation as proof for imbalance of the hole game
since i tried hellbringer in pvp i can say: its <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> for PVP vs SB imo, not more not less
Curse bite? For temptation??? That's already enough for me to judge what PvP warlock you're. Got carried a "few" matches and thinks PvP SW is good now. Ok... A burden, I'd rather say.
WTB Class Reroll please
Instigator is an utter trash like Damnation path for SWs which I can't say about destroyers. Those guys may halve you if you yawn too much.
WTB Class Reroll please
lets say GWF has one build (as known for month) with maxed stats that is deadly indeed and can handle lots of classes GS 24k up
lets say GWF in lower and midrange (as known for month) is a bad trip in most cases
lets say warlock is bad all in all, has some advantage against GWF by dots and slip mechanics, but most classes have this and even do better with real dodges and big burst damage
lets say Warlock under performs in higher spheres compared to other classes getting near godmode if maxed
regards
@clonkyo1 and ofnieslaf
if you say all is fine you really should play the class in PVP more then 10 times before writnig any comments , i have a lev 32 GWF and went some pug PVP matches low level, he is ok, a bit underperforming, can I give e real feedback to the community in case of knowing nothing about it?
i tried lifedrinker , it doesn´t perform very well in my case, to much damage loss against plague fire and to less heal in my case (but uesed a smal version)
and damnation isn´t a choice for PVP in mod 5, and will not in mod 6 I predict
WTB Class Reroll please
Maybe the guy doesn't actually PvP
It is my my life style, my doctrine and my state of mind,
You fight well, but without focus and discipline, you will fall.
More threads by me / Click on it
My Support Warlock/Temptation Thread
I use Lifedrinker for PvE and it performs decently well.
Granted, I'm not willing to transfer a GVorp to my SW, I can't see how much of a difference it would make for pugging or clearing dailies. For scenarios below CN/PvP, it's not a bad option for total self sufficiency. I'm playing a SB Damnation build and it seem to work as expected.
As for why Devs can't fix SW, the answer is obvious - They're waiting for the appropriate mod to make SW ridiculously imbalanced. We've seen it with nearly every class so far. One mod, SW will rise to the levels of DC/TR/GWF.
Go Cryptic!
PS - I quit.
WTB Class Reroll please