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Lets talk RP and AD
hfgtfsdfs
Member Posts: 688 Arc User
So this game has changed alot since Mod3. They introduced artifacts and artifactgear. Also recently they made RP bound from the enchants that drops them and nerfed the droprate. How does these changes affect the players?
Lets say a normal player wants to play 3 chars so they don't get bored of the game. I want to be good at a game and play at the highest level (PvP), otherwise it feels kinda "meh". I also want to make progress in the game by playing it both PvP and PvE and have a chance to get to the top level within a reasonable timeframe.
That means we need/want:
3x artifact belts
3x artifact necks
3x artifact mainhand
3x artifact offhand
9x artifacts
Total RP needed for legendary:
Belts: 4,645,200 x3
Necks: 4,645,200 x3
Mainhand: 4,645,200 x3
Offhand: 4,645,200 x3
Artifacts: 3,847,635 x 9
Total: 90371115 RP needed
Thats like what, 2000 stacks of peridots (give or take)? A stack of peridots cost 90000 AD so 2000x90000 AD = 1800000000 AD is needed.
Did I do the math correctly? That seems like insane numbers to me. How is anyone supposed to be able to get that kind of RP/AD? A new player has no chance at all to ever play at the higher levels and If I were a new player that realized this, I would never come back again. Why play a game I cant win or have a chance to compete against the other top players? Even if a new player wanted to pay2win it seems very much impossible unless you won the lottery IRL.
Even if a player sticks to one char only the amount of AD/RP is insanely high. Not to talk about all the other items you need in the game like companions, weapon/armor enchants, normal enchants etc.
Also about the refining system. Draging 2000 stacks of peridots into the artifacts takes more time then most people have to spend on actually playing the game. 2000 stacks of peridots is 198000 single peridots and u drag them 5 by 5 so that's almost 40000 times you have to drag the RP into the artifacts. How is this a good refining system? Care to explain? At least let us put full stacks into the artifacts to save us time.
My Conclusion:
For a Free2Play game, this game sure is expensive.
Suggestion:
Every single chest in all the dungeons in this game should drop at least a few black opals every single time you win. Also every win in PvP/GG/Tiamat/Dragons should also give a few black opals. You could give out RP for every completed dailies. This would motivate the players to actually play the game and feel that they are doing more progress every single day. Makes it more fun and motivates me to keep playing and attract new players etc.
Lets say a normal player wants to play 3 chars so they don't get bored of the game. I want to be good at a game and play at the highest level (PvP), otherwise it feels kinda "meh". I also want to make progress in the game by playing it both PvP and PvE and have a chance to get to the top level within a reasonable timeframe.
That means we need/want:
3x artifact belts
3x artifact necks
3x artifact mainhand
3x artifact offhand
9x artifacts
Total RP needed for legendary:
Belts: 4,645,200 x3
Necks: 4,645,200 x3
Mainhand: 4,645,200 x3
Offhand: 4,645,200 x3
Artifacts: 3,847,635 x 9
Total: 90371115 RP needed
Thats like what, 2000 stacks of peridots (give or take)? A stack of peridots cost 90000 AD so 2000x90000 AD = 1800000000 AD is needed.
Did I do the math correctly? That seems like insane numbers to me. How is anyone supposed to be able to get that kind of RP/AD? A new player has no chance at all to ever play at the higher levels and If I were a new player that realized this, I would never come back again. Why play a game I cant win or have a chance to compete against the other top players? Even if a new player wanted to pay2win it seems very much impossible unless you won the lottery IRL.
Even if a player sticks to one char only the amount of AD/RP is insanely high. Not to talk about all the other items you need in the game like companions, weapon/armor enchants, normal enchants etc.
Also about the refining system. Draging 2000 stacks of peridots into the artifacts takes more time then most people have to spend on actually playing the game. 2000 stacks of peridots is 198000 single peridots and u drag them 5 by 5 so that's almost 40000 times you have to drag the RP into the artifacts. How is this a good refining system? Care to explain? At least let us put full stacks into the artifacts to save us time.
My Conclusion:
For a Free2Play game, this game sure is expensive.
Suggestion:
Every single chest in all the dungeons in this game should drop at least a few black opals every single time you win. Also every win in PvP/GG/Tiamat/Dragons should also give a few black opals. You could give out RP for every completed dailies. This would motivate the players to actually play the game and feel that they are doing more progress every single day. Makes it more fun and motivates me to keep playing and attract new players etc.
ZengiaH@ejziponken
Post edited by hfgtfsdfs on
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Comments
x2 RP is very much needed but even then 1800000000/2 is insanely high. And to manage to get the RP you need for that double weekend is also very hard, if not impossible. And waiting for another event is also not very fun, that means I'm stuck with low level items and have to save all the RP for that event = no daily progress = boring game.
. Make artifacts BOA
. Provide methods which players can get RP at a decent rate
. Remove the artifact pay wall ( ~4,000,000-6,000,000 AD : 8000-12000 zen : $80-$120 per Legendary artifact)
The only way to get refining stuff seems to be dragon hoard enchantments and refining blue/green gear. However once you get it purple the grind takes a whole new level.
If they are going to keep refining they either need to 1) lower the refining requirements or 2) increase a player's ability to obtain RP
I have seen players come and go but there is a very high perception right now that the insane RP requirement for end game gear is driving people away. Not to mention that if you manage to buy stack of 99, you want to jump off a bridge rather than refine them 5 at a time.
2000 stacks x 200000 AD = 400000000 AD. Thats like 800000 ZEN (1ZEN = 500 AD).
I've run Tiamat around 50 times now and I got like 15 RP stones with 3x less dragon hoard enchantments. They seem to need a 1000% buff if that's the only legit way to get RP.
1) Resonance(rare) and greater stone of resonance(epic) should be added to dragon hoard drop table.
2) Now that its all bound you can also increase the cooldown to per enchant instead of being common to all enchant. Therefore 3 enchants = 2 more additional drops per cooldown. 5 enchants =4 more drops per cooldown .
I think the solution is to put the RP in the end of each dungeon etc so that people play the content. This is very much needed now when Tiamat basically killed ALL the other dungeons. There is no longer possible to farm dungeons for AD and Tiamat is dropping T1/T2 to everyone so all the gear is almost free now. But it leaves us with no AD to get the RP with and no dungeons to play.
1. You shouldnt have been able to reach the legendary status in 1 day. Due to many bugs, exploits or poor thinking we got this kind of situation. Have you ever played vanilla wow?! Do you know what it took to get a legendary object? Lets say a whole guild had to work for 1 player!
2. You play 1 char for free and pay for the rest.
3. One can play solo pvp with much less than legendary. At epic lvl a character is already overgeared for all pve content and can hold its ground in pvp as well.
4. Maybe you want a competitive scene like a special arena where you can have access to all gear?!(i would really like to watch it) But then again they should be able to make money from that and i dont see any step in that direction.
If you did it with Pearls you'd need about 9130 stacks at 4000 each = 36,520.000 AD. Still spendy, but almost doable.
It requires not very much at all to get all artifact gear to epic status. And at that level you are geared enough for all of PVE.
If they want to make money they need to make the players want to keep playing the game. I've been playing ONE char since BETA and its getting boring. But its way to much grinding and way to expensive to start a new char now. Even if they cut the cost and playtime for a new char in half its still way to much.
I played all the content once with my CW, I have no interest in getting all the boons once more. The content isn't that fun to play so that I would want to do it twice. Once you unlocked boons on one char, they should be unlocked on all your chars. And not for 30k+ zen that nobody has.
Yeah I rounded up to 2000 stacks. The price now is 90k, a few weeks ago it was 15k, so the price is going up and my number isn't that far off if you think about it. It could go even higher in time. And like I mention in another post, if you remove the bots that shouldnt be there in the first place - the prices would skyrocket. 2000 stacks x 200000 AD = 400000000 AD. Thats like 800000 ZEN (1ZEN = 500 AD).
As a player i understand and resonate with this, but in the end is about their business plan and that is a wall. In every moment i can decide i;ve had enough and walk away, as i did with many other games before, if that happens they;ve failed.
SO NOW I understand the issues that people are talking about when it comes to refining. I like the fact that its in the game because it makes almost everything you pick up usable, but yeh, it's a very slow process. For me, maybe it's not such a terrible thing since I am retired, but I can understand other peoples frustration with it.
Doubling the Refining Points on a permanent basis would be a dream, but I am not sure,, that might create a rush for the devs to come out with new content even quicker. ??
OT side note: What's with this new END GAME gear(Draconic Templar)? My old Devoted Cleric gear had better stats to it in some areas. The big advantage I have seen in the new gear appears to be these Overload Slots, which are kinda cool.
I think the "Artifact" is taking over the game.
No one really believes BtA RPs so much as slowed bots down. 3rd party AD prices are an excellent barometer of AH trends. Based on mountains of in-game spam, AD prices haven't risen at all....
The obvious reason for all this is to incentivize people to BUY RP with real money, ie. buy zen and buy blood opals or transfer the zen to AD, both of which makes cryptic money. Do not get me wrong, I am not raging at them for trying to be profitable, just pointing out why these suggestions will Most likely not be enacted. You have to remember that while the game is Free To Play, the company still has to be profitable or the servers get turned off and nobody gets to play. If you can earn all your AD in game and do not need to spend Zen, then that is exactly what will happen, and everyone loses. I personally think there should be a happy medium here, the solution is to stop the Botters making RP cheap by farming Sharandar instance nodes with hundreds of toons at the same time and then flooding the market with unbound RP, not stopping the real players from earning a marginal return in the trade house. Sadly, just as quickly as the Devs find a bot farming method and shut it down, the bots find a new one and move on. The real players get stuck loosing that method as well with no compensation.
My solution: make all RP drops bound, but make them drop frequently. Make all gear drops bind on equip. Note that I said drops, if you buy RP from a vendor or the zen store then it should be trade-able and if you buy gear from a vendor then it should bind on pickup. That would allow some trade and shut the bots down, at least until then find some other exploit, while also allowing the companies to make a few bucks as well.
That said, it would be nice if Tiamat, dropped more RP.
But people... Get 4-5 lesser Dragon's enchantments and start looting RP items. Sure it's not a click-and-win solution, but you would make a bit progress each day, wich imo is great!
Free to Play Player here... 2 artis at legendary, working on my third. Not a single bit of RP bought from AH or Zstore. It's doable, now quit your whining and just play the effin' game.
That's pretty much my position as well. So much of the game I can't stand due to the influence of the business model yet the core gameplay and combat is enough to keep me playing. My attitude based on experience remains that any game under constant development is one change away from me going to play something else. If you've got even slightly broad gaming tastes there's a wealth of other games to play.
perhaps if you treated the game as a game and not a job and just have fun with what you have (because in 3 months it'll all be different anyways) maybe you would enjoy this more? I mean i know i won't get my belt / neck legendary but hey it's not like it'll be bis for a year. something new will come out next mod to make it obsolete - you want to use your 50 leadership alts and buy more rp to make the new trendy artifacts legendary on day 1 go ahead each to their own enjoyment.
that being said, their has been a fair amount of alternative solutions to RP, we'll see if any are released for mod 6, doubtful but that's the only time we'll know if they listen.
Everybody needs RP. They should just make all sources bound (except zen store) and give us a reasonable way to get it by playing the game and a way to let players buy it too if they want to fast-track a bit. And by reasonable I don't mean one single peridot after running Tiamat.
this
/10char
Yes, should be hard, but also should be doable, let say this mod will last 4 month, so u have been given 4 month to make offhand to legend, cloak to legend, and lets say on normal arti ( we get couple more after all, why not to pick up new one in place of old waters) Now remember, u dont have lesser resonances stones for 80k like it was in botgazm times, neither u have peridots fo 15k per stack. Now tell me, how a new player should make they artis to legendary if he has at least mainhand and belt to refine, and 2 other normal artis. Ohh lets forget about that. U just need to do cloak, off hand and 1 new arti, how much is it? 13mln rp to get? Hm blood rubies gives u 50k each, so 260 blood rubies? How much is one? i dont want to even think about final price whales r willing to pay (considering they r not using 3rd hand sellers ofc, which i dont belive they dont) Next thing, i can pay for game in enjoy, but in my country 100$ per month is 1/4 of my payment, which muricans keep to forget. hell... i wont spend this manies on game, even if i would it would not bring me 260 blood rubies in 4 month. And we r trying to be legit here, right? Mister, u r hypocrite which has evrything in this game, coz bought it in times when it was cheap, and how has problem with ppl who want to keep up with him, or just dont see diffrence between "hard to get" and "impossible". Lets say i spend 3-4 hours in this game ( which im not, im playing much longer, but nvm) How can i afort 13mln rp in 480h + 400$. U need to consider that, i like also play pvp a bit ( not on top lvl, but still) run some dungs for pure joy, and kill tiamat at least 2-3 (which i did of course much more, mostly leading legit raids to succes, and i got already what i needed) times per day, to keep up with others. Now, if u will show me how RP is fine in this popular case, i will admit ur right, but right now u r a troll and hypocrite to me.
(Sin)cerely
Kain
Now considering they have killed all reasonable sources of player income the game is now "pay to refine"
If you aren't hoarding RP or already in-game rich, you're just plain screwed.
Everything you need to know about CW:
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?780981-Chem-s-CW-Compendium-Everything-you-need-to-know
Don't forget making artifact equipment so accessible its worth peanuts so that the maximum number of players will have them.