test content
Logo
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
Forums > Home› Class Forums›
Amber's Guardian Fighters tanking Guide
epclipseingmoon
Member, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 0 Arc User
Hey all,
Before I start this guide I would like to say a Guardian Fighter can handle a lot of mobs and thus can tank really well despite what a lot of other people say. This guide is based on how to be effective as a punching bag for all mobs in the area and this takes a lot of practice because the GF is probably the hardest class to learn to fill your team role.
For anyone who does not understand the true role of a tank please read this:
A tank is a style of character in gaming, often associated with a character class. A common convention in real-time strategy games, role-playing games, Fighting Games and MUDs, tanks redirect enemy attacks or attention toward themselves in order to protect other characters or units. Since this role often requires them to suffer large amounts of damage, they rely on large amounts of vitality or armor, evasiveness and misdirection, or self regeneration.
Got that paragraph from Wikipedia but that sums up our role, I have noticed many people seem to not realize our purpose.
Amber's Guardian Fighter Tanking Guide
Note this style of tanking takes lots of practice and also you do have to change your timing with different gear if it changes your guard meter especially. Also A GF will never be a dps monster like all other classes.
The reason why no one takes us GF’s to the dungeon is because of the end dps tree all current guides will get you on the bottom of the pain giver board. Seeing a super low dps GF over and over turns people off even if they’re using gear like the knight captain to buff everyone. Even if you buff everyone 5 – 15% that most of the time will only count as a 4 man run because you are not doing much damage. I would only gear to help the team if I played the support class aka the devoted cleric.
First I would like to talk about spec. The only tanking path is Iron Vanguard and Conqueror is a must!
Powers and Feats can be found here: http://nwcalc.com/gf?b=mwv:27siq4:1ye3ls,19i3n0k:1u5551:150000:1u0000&h=1&p=ivn
If your human put the rest into Ubiquitous Shield.
Abilities spec along these lines in pic: note try to reach that defence and deflect first before other skills.
Boons
Sharandar: Dark Fey Hunter - Fey Precision - Elven Haste - Elven Ferosity - Elven Resolve
Dread Ring: Conjurer's Gambit - Evoker's Thirst - Forbidden Pierceing - Shadowtouch - Rampageing Madness
Icewind Dale: Weathering the Storm - Refreshing Chill - Rapid Thaw - Cool Resolve - Winter's Bounty
Powers best for tanking:
Daily’s: Indomitable Strength – Fighters Recovery
Encounters: Lunging Strike – Enforced Threat – Frontline Surge
At-Will: Cleave – Threatening Rush
Class Feature: Combat Superiority – Enhanced Mark
My tanking style:
As a guardian fighter you are the person who should lead rather than follow your party, as soon as you get close to mobs lunge at them and use enforced threat and cleave them a couple of times then jump to the next group probably with threatening rush cause lunging strike would probably still be on cool down and strike that group. That’s the basic part rinse and repeat but also watch your party if something attacks them, lunge or threatening rush to them and cleave to collect agro.
Never just stand and block keep moving back when you have a lot of mobs on you.
So now you will have a lot of mobs after you don’t run to much rather block run back to avoid aoes when shield breaks. Once your shield breaks be careful and use frontline, lunging and threatening rush but keep jumping away to build action points for fighters recovery. As soon as fighter’s recovery is ready cast it and go all in no need to block for a few seconds. If you get surrounded, use frontline to create an opening to escape. But try to keep the mob in one area unless you’re kiting adds for a boss like in the frozen heart for example.
You will die many times while you learn and prefect this style. You will need to be able to judge when to move back from the mobs before your shield breaks so just don’t give up. When you start to master this style you won’t need to use many potions either.
Only time I change skills is for MC and VT final boss, I swap Enforced threat for Knights challenge even though it is a bugged skill.
The reason to take all agro is because your aoe classes can do tones more damage if the mobs are all together. I have seen many guides that recommend knight’s Valor but that does not work if you are being a real tank. The others wont get hurt as much anyway using my style but they will have to watch the aoes.
Well that’s the basic guide I will revise and add to it eventually though as something’s probably don’t make sense.
Before I start this guide I would like to say a Guardian Fighter can handle a lot of mobs and thus can tank really well despite what a lot of other people say. This guide is based on how to be effective as a punching bag for all mobs in the area and this takes a lot of practice because the GF is probably the hardest class to learn to fill your team role.
For anyone who does not understand the true role of a tank please read this:
A tank is a style of character in gaming, often associated with a character class. A common convention in real-time strategy games, role-playing games, Fighting Games and MUDs, tanks redirect enemy attacks or attention toward themselves in order to protect other characters or units. Since this role often requires them to suffer large amounts of damage, they rely on large amounts of vitality or armor, evasiveness and misdirection, or self regeneration.
Got that paragraph from Wikipedia but that sums up our role, I have noticed many people seem to not realize our purpose.
Amber's Guardian Fighter Tanking Guide
Note this style of tanking takes lots of practice and also you do have to change your timing with different gear if it changes your guard meter especially. Also A GF will never be a dps monster like all other classes.
The reason why no one takes us GF’s to the dungeon is because of the end dps tree all current guides will get you on the bottom of the pain giver board. Seeing a super low dps GF over and over turns people off even if they’re using gear like the knight captain to buff everyone. Even if you buff everyone 5 – 15% that most of the time will only count as a 4 man run because you are not doing much damage. I would only gear to help the team if I played the support class aka the devoted cleric.
First I would like to talk about spec. The only tanking path is Iron Vanguard and Conqueror is a must!
Powers and Feats can be found here: http://nwcalc.com/gf?b=mwv:27siq4:1ye3ls,19i3n0k:1u5551:150000:1u0000&h=1&p=ivn
If your human put the rest into Ubiquitous Shield.
Abilities spec along these lines in pic: note try to reach that defence and deflect first before other skills.
Boons
Sharandar: Dark Fey Hunter - Fey Precision - Elven Haste - Elven Ferosity - Elven Resolve
Dread Ring: Conjurer's Gambit - Evoker's Thirst - Forbidden Pierceing - Shadowtouch - Rampageing Madness
Icewind Dale: Weathering the Storm - Refreshing Chill - Rapid Thaw - Cool Resolve - Winter's Bounty
Powers best for tanking:
Daily’s: Indomitable Strength – Fighters Recovery
Encounters: Lunging Strike – Enforced Threat – Frontline Surge
At-Will: Cleave – Threatening Rush
Class Feature: Combat Superiority – Enhanced Mark
My tanking style:
As a guardian fighter you are the person who should lead rather than follow your party, as soon as you get close to mobs lunge at them and use enforced threat and cleave them a couple of times then jump to the next group probably with threatening rush cause lunging strike would probably still be on cool down and strike that group. That’s the basic part rinse and repeat but also watch your party if something attacks them, lunge or threatening rush to them and cleave to collect agro.
Never just stand and block keep moving back when you have a lot of mobs on you.
So now you will have a lot of mobs after you don’t run to much rather block run back to avoid aoes when shield breaks. Once your shield breaks be careful and use frontline, lunging and threatening rush but keep jumping away to build action points for fighters recovery. As soon as fighter’s recovery is ready cast it and go all in no need to block for a few seconds. If you get surrounded, use frontline to create an opening to escape. But try to keep the mob in one area unless you’re kiting adds for a boss like in the frozen heart for example.
You will die many times while you learn and prefect this style. You will need to be able to judge when to move back from the mobs before your shield breaks so just don’t give up. When you start to master this style you won’t need to use many potions either.
Only time I change skills is for MC and VT final boss, I swap Enforced threat for Knights challenge even though it is a bugged skill.
The reason to take all agro is because your aoe classes can do tones more damage if the mobs are all together. I have seen many guides that recommend knight’s Valor but that does not work if you are being a real tank. The others wont get hurt as much anyway using my style but they will have to watch the aoes.
Well that’s the basic guide I will revise and add to it eventually though as something’s probably don’t make sense.
@dimensionallight
Princess Amber - DC
Shieldmaiden Amber - GF
Valkyrie Amber - GWF
Huntress Amber - HR
Princess Amber - DC
Shieldmaiden Amber - GF
Valkyrie Amber - GWF
Huntress Amber - HR
Post edited by epclipseingmoon on
0
Comments
Overpowered 60 CW ~ Thaumaturge 14.5k
==========================================
~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!
Princess Amber - DC
Shieldmaiden Amber - GF
Valkyrie Amber - GWF
Huntress Amber - HR
Yea look up Black Ice Ioun of Stone it also is an augment but gives 93 stats to ALL stats. Not just Recovery and Crit
http://neverwinter.gamepedia.com/Black_Ice_Ioun_Stone
93 at 30 in all stats!
Black Ice Ioun Stone
Augment, Rank 1
Binding icon.png Binds on Equip
Hit Points:
10
Power:
5
Critical Strike:
5
Recovery:
5
Armor Penetration:
5
Defense:
5
Deflection:
5
Regeneration:
5
Life Steal:
5
Overpowered 60 CW ~ Thaumaturge 14.5k
==========================================
~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!
You have to visibly watch, you mark the targets with Enforced Threat, or Threatening Rush, then you have a Hard Taunt tab feature which is kinda meh.
So basically unlike FFX1 or WoW you need to actually watch whats going on.
Overpowered 60 CW ~ Thaumaturge 14.5k
==========================================
~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!
The assumption would be that threat is the damage you do to a monster multiplied by a threat modifier. That modifier is 1 for classes other than GF. That modifier is manipulated with threat reducing feats, etc. The GF has threat multipliers for that modifier. If the GF's damage is so low that with these threat modifiers they still do not do more threat than the other party members' damage, then they cannot take threat away. My understanding is enforced threat makes monster's attack you, but if you do not do enough damage to them to get to the top of their threat meter, they will go to whoever is on the top of their threat list when enforced threat expires.
Healing also causes threat based on the amount of healing done. When a mob first spawns in a fight and the only thing registering on their threat meter is the DC heals, then they go for the DC.
Threat deteriorates over time. It is probably weighted such that more recent damage has higher threat than damage done 6 seconds prior.
That is what I meant by...does anyone know how threat works in this game. I am looking for validation, as until you understand that game mechanic, you cannot manipulate it appropriately. A tank's function is soaking damage and manipulating threat.
You are correct that sometimes because the GF has to move around all the time from a broken guard or avoiding bid RED attacks he lacks the ability to maintain threat, especially on large groups of adds as his abilities are capped I believe at 5. So 15-25 adds only 5 can be taunted at a time also Tabbed Mark for Boss, add to that as you said GF damage output is so low the bosss/ adds don't even notice while being hit for massive damage from GWF / CW.
That is why Tanks are not used or needed.
Overpowered 60 CW ~ Thaumaturge 14.5k
==========================================
~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!
I use swordmaster protector and tank just fine so IV conq is not 100% necessary only real difference is FLS.
Other than that you are spot on with the reason to tank or have a tank.
A GF has to be observant like a dc of all the team members and rather than heal intercept and steal agro off your ally. I would say being a GF requires you to be more observant than even a dc btw.
So ono when are you going to make a GF?
Princess Amber - DC
Shieldmaiden Amber - GF
Valkyrie Amber - GWF
Huntress Amber - HR
yeah even my guide will not help speedrunners because a gf and dc is not needed at 15k+ cws and gwfs are the real classes to play... then again we may get a super buff mod 4 like what they did to the gwf ages ago. theres hope atleast...
Princess Amber - DC
Shieldmaiden Amber - GF
Valkyrie Amber - GWF
Huntress Amber - HR
With swordmaster spec you also lose threatening rush and thats a huge loss. swordmaster is nicer dpswise but more glassy guess thats why you went protector
Princess Amber - DC
Shieldmaiden Amber - GF
Valkyrie Amber - GWF
Huntress Amber - HR
it also uses alotta powers that most GF wouldnt dare use in the same situations.
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?566921-The-Iron-Maiden-A-Reflect-Based-Protector-Build-for-Swordmaster-GF-s
Though i suppose without this build i dont really know how far SM could go but it works for me.
But yeah, wms is a great skill.
Good job on the thread btw because it outlines several misconceptions regarding the GF which is something people need.
Don't get me wrong as i don't mean to offend someone. But in D&D something like a "Tank" does not exist. We are a "Fighter"-class just like the GWF. So everything we are capable of a GWF should be and is currently (probably better) able to too...
Valmacha Gelkrâch - 14k PVE-Renegade CW (MoF)
Hrogard Hammerfall - 16k PVE-Destroyer GWF (IV)
Yrianda Willowborn - 15k PVP-Conquerer GF (IV)
Lunging-Strike-Jill - Becoming PVP-Protector GF (SM)
Rit'lek Ku'tar - PVE-Scoundrel TR (WK) - disabled/Invoker
Ilrith Wildfire - HR - disabled/Invoker
Aron Hammerfell - PVE-Protector GF - disabled/Invoker
Galwyn Fenrirdottír - DC - disabled/Invoker
And GWF are only stronger because theres a huge difference in weapon damage ~ 300+ which scales depending on the power even thier lowest epic sword is 100 wep damage higher than our best. GWF also do not have aggro generators or skills to protect others thier "protection" is to knock enemies down.
Play wise they are completely different.
and again under the misconception that GWF's tank when thier damage taken is much higher doesnt mean they are tanks it means they have personal survival while GF is meant for party survival. there is a certain point where GFs are "not needed" but that point is only because we havent gotten further in the dungeon side if there were a 15k dungeon chances are people would need a tank.
eclipse sorry for over posting.
But you are a Guardian too lol fact is a GWF cannot out tank a good GF in regards to threat gen. GWFS are the preferred tank because of their high end dps.
Princess Amber - DC
Shieldmaiden Amber - GF
Valkyrie Amber - GWF
Huntress Amber - HR
It's ok constructive feedback is helpfull for everyone reading this, the hope of this guide is to revive the GF class. mod 4 rework should be intresting indeed though
Princess Amber - DC
Shieldmaiden Amber - GF
Valkyrie Amber - GWF
Huntress Amber - HR
That's what i thought it was about, I am excited about the reworking as well i hope they get it right. I didn't want to get in the way of this thats why i apologized.
and it sounds like you know your stuff as well and I hope people take it into account later on.
I added the build i use as a modifier to your build thread so others can see another spectrum of tank which is useful.
This is an interpretation of yours.
That's still no verification. Moreover common sense is apparently not always "the way to go". But also just a classification of a logic of multiple Individuals. Whereever that idea/logic/thought might came from. In other words: Many minds can still be wrong (and i don't exclude me from that!).
I think a sentinelgwf with the right features will be capable of the same. Their skills are indeed not the same(, tho they got several to generate aggro). But the ways how to play them can be...
I should mention this again: I really think this guide is a good guide exspecially for new GF's and no overpowered Partys. And i'm looking forward to a rework on the GF too!
Valmacha Gelkrâch - 14k PVE-Renegade CW (MoF)
Hrogard Hammerfall - 16k PVE-Destroyer GWF (IV)
Yrianda Willowborn - 15k PVP-Conquerer GF (IV)
Lunging-Strike-Jill - Becoming PVP-Protector GF (SM)
Rit'lek Ku'tar - PVE-Scoundrel TR (WK) - disabled/Invoker
Ilrith Wildfire - HR - disabled/Invoker
Aron Hammerfell - PVE-Protector GF - disabled/Invoker
Galwyn Fenrirdottír - DC - disabled/Invoker
If raw damage, then you do not need Armor Penetration to be an effective GF. If modified damage, then you need to stack Armor Penetration to 24% so you can keep agro on boss mobs.
so enhanced mark allows a higher percentage of your damage and hits as threat.
Iron warrior also can increase threat for all powers within its duration i believe by 150%.
several others can too.
My arpen is 0 and i have little trouble in threat so i dont really know about that.
That would account for not being able to hold agro on the boss mobs in dungeons.
Also GF gets ArPen from Dex. So every point over 10 in Dex is equal to 1% ArPen. So subtract that number from 24% to see how much ArPen you might need...provided it is our modified damage that impacts threat.
And I thank you for your responses. I am not meaning anything in a negative way, just wanting to move the conversation forward. That there is not a clear understanding of how threat works in this game is a reason people are frustrated with the class. The little nuances of how things work are very important to functioning properly. Whether threat is based on raw damage or actual damage is an important consideration.
Would be nice to actually be told these mechanics by the devs or we could be guessing all day...
Princess Amber - DC
Shieldmaiden Amber - GF
Valkyrie Amber - GWF
Huntress Amber - HR
It would be nice to get clarification from a dev, as this is not something you can test and it is something paramount to a class functioning properly.
You will most likely have either a GWF or CW in your party, or both. meaning you dont need to use your enforced threat when they are proned/sucked up/stunned. I have no
VS bosses in single target, just whack on knights challenge and hope it doesnt bug out, its viable to use it on most of them.
I only slot in enhanced mark, if i need to do kiting.
and also the featured satirical comedic adventure "A Call for Heroes".
Here are two links on how threat (aggro) and taunt (hard taunt, used by tanks) worked, including Class (AT) modifiers and damage/debuffs.
http://cityofheroes.wikia.com/wiki/Taunt
http://cityofheroes.wikia.com/wiki/Threat
I'm not saying you can't make it work somehow but I've seen this style and it can get ugly.
Also don't recommend using KV? Really? It's hands down one of the best skills a GF has when used properly. You do know it generates threat based off of damage soaked right?
Gloom level 60 Control Wizard
Dusk level 60 Trickster Rogue
Dawn level 60 Devoted Cleric
Eclipse level 60 Hunter Ranger
Wrath level 60 Great Weapon Fighter
Jinx level 60 Scourge Warlock