test content
Logo
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
PvP: Do not fight on the towers!
fgreyspear
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 472 Bounty Hunter
Gotcha. I bet some of you will say that this is the dumbest thing one can do in PvP, and everyone has to fight on the tower platforms, or else nuub.
Well, you are right as much as you are wrong. Because many of you keep crying about their teams and shouting to fight on towers, do you keep forgetting about one thing: When the opponent stands on your tower does it stop counting.
Of course, you need to stand on a tower to capture it and you need to be one more player than the other team to do so. But once you have captured it do you need to get rid of your opponents and get the fight away from the tower or all your efforts may have been for nothing.
Therefore once you have taken a tower do you need to fight off the tower, intercept the other team before they can get to it and try to "pull" the fight to one of their towers. This means you will be fighting off the towers and this is good. A worthy opponent will know this and try to get past you and onto your tower, so you have to do all you can to stop them, but the worst you can do is to remain on your own tower and wait for them to come.
Please keep this in mind, do not just always go mad and sit at the fire when you see someone not fighting "on tower".
Nuff said.
Well, you are right as much as you are wrong. Because many of you keep crying about their teams and shouting to fight on towers, do you keep forgetting about one thing: When the opponent stands on your tower does it stop counting.
Of course, you need to stand on a tower to capture it and you need to be one more player than the other team to do so. But once you have captured it do you need to get rid of your opponents and get the fight away from the tower or all your efforts may have been for nothing.
Therefore once you have taken a tower do you need to fight off the tower, intercept the other team before they can get to it and try to "pull" the fight to one of their towers. This means you will be fighting off the towers and this is good. A worthy opponent will know this and try to get past you and onto your tower, so you have to do all you can to stop them, but the worst you can do is to remain on your own tower and wait for them to come.
Please keep this in mind, do not just always go mad and sit at the fire when you see someone not fighting "on tower".
Nuff said.
Stay frosty.
Post edited by fgreyspear on
0
Comments
^this guy knows what's up
Hence my thread. I want to make players aware that there is just as many good reasons to be on a tower as there are to be off a tower. Even if this only means "travelling from tower to tower" and to you is not much worth talking about.
Well there are rovers and there are point holders. Rovers should be moving toward a contested node, but every point needs a point holder. when i play my gf, unless my team is clueless it's my job to hold/contest #2. There is no reason for me to leave, as it's too close to home, and can be taken quite easily if i move away. sometimes i stay for a while with no action on a rofl stomp game, but it is my job. If i leave to make a few points on another node, i leave it vulnerable for takeover. only the rovers (cw/gwf hr) should be moving between points.
This in my opinion.
Stupid point. If you take the fight to their base you leave your base and middle base unprotected. They have no reason to fight whole team at their base. Also good luck with stopping Sent GWF or Perma TR from getting past you to the tower. And if they do get past, they capture the tower because you're not fighting at the node. So no, there's no real reason to fight outside of tower/node.
And face it, you're not pushing them, you're being pushed and you run away to your base, letting them cap mid, that's why people shout "FIGHT ON THE TOWER" when you're playing. And now you're trying to justify being a sissy writing this thread. Maybe just write "I HAD A REASON TO RUN AWAY FROM OUR TOWER!".
Not to mention your "pushing them to their base" would work ONLY on complete IDIOT. One click is all it takes to get behind you, stand on the node, ane take the fight to the tower, making your "tactic" useless, pointless and so on.
The game is all about time. The longer you are standing on a contested node, the better, and to me it is far better to already be standing on a node that is going to be contested, than to not be. Unless there is some major tactical advantage to not standing on the node briefly. If there is a fight, the fight should be on the node.
You notice how a team can dominate a node without capping it? Either red or blue is the top color, the top color shows who is dominating that node. If no one from the non-dominating team is on a contested node, the node immediately turns the color of the team dominating it. If no one from the team dominating the node is on a contested node, the node slowly turns the color of the team not dominating it. To me the order of priority is: 1. Every node blue. 2. Every node dominated. 3. Every node contested. These weigh against each other with common sense of course; you are not going to risk allowing 2 blue nodes to be capped red or even dominated red in order to just dominate the third node which is currently contested but red-dominant. If it makes sense in a given situation, you want that node to turn blue immediately after you have won the fight/kited the enemy off of it.
It is SO MUCH easier to continue to contest a node for ever when you are dominating it. All you have to do is fight on it about 50% of the battle and you will double the time it takes the same amount of players from their team to cap it. If the node is red dominated, you HAVE to fight ON the node to contest it at all.
I think there is a bit more to point holding, point taking, so on, that is based on dominating/not dominating a node, that most people dont even take int consideration. Best of all worlds you are setting up the battle-field to be standing on the node fighting enemies who are not standing on the node at all. Like a ranged class kiting enemies off a node and then using cc to keep them off of it as long as possible. Throw in some team work and your golden. Ranged dps/cc and a tank are an awesome combo in that regard because the ranged toon can hammer/cc the off node enemy player(s) while standing on the node while the tank can rotate on and off the node pushing the enemy team away/occupying them off node. The best combos I have seen are a dc/ranged dps/cc class on node with a tank on node and they are acting in conjunction more to keep you off node than to just kill you- though character death is the likely result. By the time the enemy player even gets barely on the node, the tank is ragdoll-tossing them off of it and grinding them into the ground.
IF an entire team can do this from node 2 from the very start, a win is the most likely result. Its why you dont all run to home node at start. You are giving the enemy 2/3 of the battlefield from the start and immediately putting yourself in a really disadvantageous position. IMO of course, im no pro, just saying what I have seen consistently work.
Jugger Conq GF
....
Say you were standing on a captured tower and you see an opponent coming towards you. What do you do?
A) Stay on the tower and wait for the opponent to come
Also assume for
Any second you can manage to stop an opponent from getting onto your tower means a few more ticks on the counter for your team.
Of course if you fail then you will have to get back onto your tower, but just for this scenario assume that you will not fail. You still think it is bad to be off tower?
If the score is 700-250, guess what, your team is not going to make a miraculous comeback. So if you want to continue fighting (pointlessly, IMO) then fight off a node so that the game can get over with quicker.
and then guy #2 comes and gets on the node, and you are off of it, and may get stunlocked so as not to be able to get back to it. And then the team that was counting on you to hold the node, has to come off thiers to get it back. Best to just fight on the node, no matter if you own it or not. fighting on the node covers all contingencies, whareas your suggestion has the possibility of your team losing a node.
you don't pvp much, i can tell.
Edit: I think I may be mistaking what ya'll are talking about?
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
i believe what the OP is trying to offer here is one example.
there is no need to jump in this thread and try to prove him wrong by attacking his post or by trolling him. if you have other pvp tactics to share or if you can describe why there are better tactics or varied scenarios, please offer them in a respectful manner. if you have nothing constructive to add to the discussion, by all means, move on.
You have got to be kidding me. No reason to even discuss anything on these forums with you guys around.
You have zeb here who joins the discussion, then you have you, who tries to stifle it.
A), obviously. Even if he gets on the tower he doesn't start to capture it. Also I don't have to worry about guys coming from above to cap it, as I'll see them when they jump down, they won't be behind me. I I won't be 2v1'd or 3v1'd, as by "intercepting" I get closer to their spawn/backup coming back from their base's node. You're simply forgetting this pvp is 5v5, not 1v1. In 1v1 of course I'd CC him and force him to fight outside, but it's 5v5. Meaning I still have 4 more guys to worry about. Not to mention 4 other guys in my team would rather defend the node than help me in some far away place.
And If I have stun, freeze, root, prone, push. Freeze, root and push are CC coming from ranged attacks. If I could slow him down by stunning/dazing/rooting/freezing/pushing him, I'd do it.
So my enemy goes for a tower, I get off that tower and he's like "Okay, I'm not gonna go for a tower anymore. I'll play with him just like he wants, because I'm an <censored> and this guy thinks he's a <censored>!"
Yeah, I do. It's not only bad, it's <censored> and based on false assumption and would work only with [convenient] <censored> of your opponents.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
However not every class and build is the same. CC is not only for ranged attacks. GWFs and GFs frequently use prone and stun. Even HRs, while being a ranged class, can very well root a player and kill them with melee attacks.
Even if you have not skilled any CC and only play with a pure damage build will this still drive some players back simply because they know they will die in a 1v1 against you. They will then not get onto the tower, but either hit you with ranged attacks or AoE attacks. Do you then remain on tower and wait to be killed? Do you perhaps hope someone else will come and rescue you?
Or do you move off the tower and force a response? The other player will have to do something once you go after him. If this means he will get onto the tower then this might just be what you want, right?
You do get killed, too, in PvP. It happens. And of course (using your logic) were you killed by a decent player, because only a decent player knows how to kill you, right? ...
So (again using your logic) the decent player will not just roll right on by, but he will also kill you and always win, because he is the "decent player" and not an "idiot".
It is a good general rule to fight on node. If you know what you are doing, have excellent situational awareness and a mastery of all of the factors involved in pvp, fighting off node sometimes has its advantages. Is that fair to say?
Jugger Conq GF
....
a whole lot of this. ^
Yeah, exactly. Unless he's an... [word that will be censored by zebular] and plays right in the palm of your hand. But I don't assume people are [word that will be censored by zebular]. One shift/dodge/roll and he's behind you. People have 2-3, HR has 5-6 dodges at their disposal, letting them close that gap in no time. Yeah, I wouldn't be able to stop anyone who's not an [word that will be censored by zebular].
That's why I wrote about ranged classes. If I were a GWF or GF I wouldn't be able to hold the guy anyway. He'd have to be a sitting duck to get hit with the first attack, and get pronelock'd. Again, I don't assume people are [word that will be censored by zebular].
If they run away from me, I won't chase them, leaving mid node for the runner to capture. If I can scare the guy to walk away, I don't think he'll come back without some kind of a plan. And I'm sure as hell if I scared him he wouldn't have more than 30-40% health points. He wouldn't be scared otherwise Whatever his plan is, I'd proceed accordingly. But none of those plans would require me to leave the node, unless I'm positive there's NOONE around and I can be SURE I can leave without leaving it vulnerable. PLUS I'm a GWF. GF can just block and wait for ranged teammates to handle it. If I were GWF I'd have it tough, but I'd probably hide behind the pillar, forcing opponent to come to the node to attack me, thus getting close to me and getting owned, assuming I could scare him with my "pure dps build" you spoke off. If it's Hotenow I'll see him, if it's Rivenscar he'll need to get on the node to get to me, so I'll see when he is close, just to run out and bam.
Are you serious? I don't want him to get onto the tower, I don't want to leave the tower. Is it too hard for you to understand? When I chase him I'm sure to get ambushed by his teammates from the respawn or from base node. Chasing him would be the most [word that will be censored by zebular] thing to do. And seriously, stop trying to force your flawed logic here. "Force a response". Guy is running away from me, if he tries to attack me he's dead. But he can stall, leaving 2 vulnerable.
I don't know what kind of a player are you (30 level with green gear getting shouted on by guys with Mulhorands?), but get 60 level, get into some pvp guild and play at least one serious pvp.
PS.
Zebular: I don't mean to offend you or anything, but looking for appropriate words is a pain in the ***, and words I wanted to use would be censored anyway, so I did it for you.
However, some of us do like to take the initiative in a fight and to force a fight and thereby to dominate (or to "own") a situation. It is possible to do this. You may have never tried it, but it will have happened to you in a situation where you were trying to get on a tower. You will have been pushed into a situation where you wanted to turn around and to hit back, or else risk certain death for example. Or even when death is certain do you want to get your opponent as deep into health as you can instead of dying a completely meaningless death.
I also do not believe you are the type of player who just stands forever on a tower and who never moves at all.
Well, your topic is not "Why fighting off the node is not as stupid as people make it out to be", it's "Don't fight on the nodes!". You try to justify your opinion with false assumptions and flawed logic. It's not a matter of opinion, where one can agree to disagree.
And why would I move? Unless I play against highly unskilled and undergeared guys I don't have a spare second at 2. And even if I do it's because all the fights are either on our base because opponents have some strange tactic and prefer running above me instead of into me or we're pushing them and it's all on their base. Either way, I move without risking losing 2.
if the tactics are wrong, it's not attacking to say so. it's not what you say, it's how you say it. saying they are idiotic is a derogatory term and can be taken as an insult. a lot of threads that get moderated are moderated for this reason.
do not reply to this post. if you want to address it, please do so via PM only.