Funny is the point of the deep gash. I think it's very reasonable that the bleeding caused by ibs is larger than the sure strike as much as I think a stab hurts me more than a scratch. measured this feat is perfect.
The aesthetic problem (and mechanically balanced) is that the damage of the next bleed always cancel the previous damage, it being higher or lower.
in this sense the deep gash is a critical multiplier whose own inherent dynamics gwf cancels ... then I find that wearing battle fury / powers long time and high damage - reaping strike - compensate. the gwf now has a rotation and a challenge "keep always bleed with high sticks".
but as the pattern of damage in the game is VERY high, the best that you do is beat all without thinking too much, otherwise the enemies will be dead before you "finish its rotation."
Maybe, maybe not, I don't really care. To be honest you should thank your lucky stars Deep Gash does anything at all because not that long ago it didn't do diddly.
My guess is that the 'other damage bonuses' are most likely all of them and the variance comes from the various temporary power buff's and mitigation debuff's available to the GWF. (Not to mention the buffs/debuffs from the rest of the team.)
This overwrite feature does explain why everyone uses WMS/SS these days, as long as WMS is still capped at ten targets instead of five like most At-Will's. You crit with WMS, switch to SS until your crit is finished banging.
Sadly, my interest in the GWF is near zero given that they removed the only thing I liked about them. That being the Executioners Style feat that almost everyone else hated. 25% extra damage from Reaping Strike to a single target was boss, just feels like a wet noodle now. If I'm going to make things bleed, I'll play my TR thank you very much.
MoF/Thaum CWSS/Thaum CWIV/Protector GFSW/Combat HRSM/Destroyer GWFWK/Executioner TRDO/Faithful DC
Yeah GWF are finally in a good place. I changed mine over to IV tree Destroyer spec and can do great damage in dungeons as well as tank. Sadly too many people want them back at the bottom of the barrel and are calling for nerfs (you know if a TR can't destroy them in pvp and can only stalemate....) The deep gash buff was huge but what really put is into a great spot was how we scale, The new artifacts are beyond a noticeable difference especially with GWF and with them you can make yourself high dps with alot of survivability. (Raven skull + Eye + your choice other one) so if something gets through your Unstoppable + temp hp + life steal from everything + active companions (btw these are AWSOME if you choose right) + boons then you can always activate your skull and get 90% of your missing HP + 10 % of max hp as temp hp giving you time to life steal back up. The best enchant for us it seems at the moment is Pvorp to help increase all the damage (which means all the Life steal) add it all in with easier to obtain R10 and we can rock it out now.
Yeah GWF are finally in a good place. I changed mine over to IV tree Destroyer spec and can do great damage in dungeons as well as tank. Sadly too many people want them back at the bottom of the barrel and are calling for nerfs (you know if a TR can't destroy them in pvp and can only stalemate....) The deep gash buff was huge but what really put is into a great spot was how we scale, The new artifacts are beyond a noticeable difference especially with GWF and with them you can make yourself high dps with alot of survivability. (Raven skull + Eye + your choice other one) so if something gets through your Unstoppable + temp hp + life steal from everything + active companions (btw these are AWSOME if you choose right) + boons then you can always activate your skull and get 90% of your missing HP + 10 % of max hp as temp hp giving you time to life steal back up. The best enchant for us it seems at the moment is Pvorp to help increase all the damage (which means all the Life steal) add it all in with easier to obtain R10 and we can rock it out now.
Makes a lot of sense. I miss Executioners Style but I'm probably the only one who does. Regardless, changing Deep Gash is definitely a big deal. Was completely skippable before. Replacing ES with an AP gain on kill seems underwhelming given that I doubt anyone uses Reaping Strike. Heck, the only reason I used it at all before was the 25% bonus to single-target.
With HR's being in the game, I doubt RS will kill enough targets to gain significant AP. CW's and HR's will annihilate the trash, leaving little to pick up in AP from RS kills. Might still be worth it for Determination gains, but as I've said I haven't even rebuilt my GWF yet. Good to know it's in a better place when I finally get tired of the HR.
MoF/Thaum CWSS/Thaum CWIV/Protector GFSW/Combat HRSM/Destroyer GWFWK/Executioner TRDO/Faithful DC
Actually i gain AP fairly fast now, my main skills are Frontline surge and IBS, i swap out my other one depending on what im doing you can cancel threatening rush so its damage stacks really fast and if you want to really smack around yard trash go with trample the fallen +that is disgusting, for aoe i use wicked just because its all we really have (reaping is worthless imo) add in some of the companions and you just dont die
Actually i gain AP fairly fast now, my main skills are Frontline surge and IBS, i swap out my other one depending on what im doing you can cancel threatening rush so its damage stacks really fast and if you want to really smack around yard trash go with trample the fallen +that is disgusting, for aoe i use wicked just because its all we really have (reaping is worthless imo) add in some of the companions and you just dont die
No that's what I was saying, that reaping is probably useless now. Shame really, because I really liked it as it was.
MoF/Thaum CWSS/Thaum CWIV/Protector GFSW/Combat HRSM/Destroyer GWFWK/Executioner TRDO/Faithful DC
WMS also have a limit of 5 targets , but whatever.
I use executioner style ( old and new) .
crucial points :
1 - the "modern gwf " has less recovery he possessed before ( I cut mine in half ) .
2 - you do not need to kill anyone with reaping strike . You can kill them with a daily that generates the 2 ap ( reaping strike is a precondition ) .
3 - Despite the odds, even if you are going very badly , you kill 300 enemies , resulting in an extra 6 Dailys . to the current standard game, that is not bad ( no one else produces ap per target ) .
4 - you get 10 % damage with ibs . is VERY little, but oddly enough , it works. is not unusual for me to mend a slam on the other (I could already use 2 crescendo in sequence ) .
Summary : I like the class, but she does not say things we can not do. the big problem here is: gwf currently has a powerful daily for aoe . he has a good single (daily final) and " utility aoe " . ie , executioner style is a feat with utilitarian purposes given the present scenario .
the spinning strike gained some " improvements " but does not work with the bleed besides having a short range. A wasted potential.
1 - is still the second (third with iv ) major source of damage aoe vs 5 enemies . (counting Dailys ) .
2 - high bleed.
3 - generation ap = encounter . This means that you hit unstoppable up to 3 times . = 3 encounters. ( problem mentioned above) .
4 - Logistics : suppose we have 4 enemies to face: the gwf with another Atwill will attack them frontally , receiving the attack of the four . A User's reaping strike , can attack the flank so that will hit all enemies and only receive 1 damage thanks to the range of the attack .
5 - threat by damage.
6 - while you cast , you get 8 % damage resistance .
7 - Construction of determination.
I'm not saying that the reaping is better than the wicked today. I could talk , knowingly , other 500 reasons not to use Atwill . But not anticipate his judgment before playing . I say this because my reaction at the time of the preview , it was exactly this , they had just with Atwill ( even went bearish on post feedback , bad attitude ) .
ps:there is no more things like "single damages" for pve.
everything is killed VERY quickly and collectively, is at gwf / ranger and especially the cw.
in a few bosses you need a single damage (3 comes me in the head, the dragon of valindra, valindra and Idris). That's for sure strike is more than enough. everything else is solved with nuke / control.
I still can't really understand the majority of what you're saying Zacazu.
I won't argue for or against something I haven't tried, but it seems to me that the perk that add's AP on-kill for Reaping is probably less useful now that there is a legitimate ranged nuking class. Unless Deep Gash that is proc'ed off Reaping Strike also gives 2% AP on-kill. Which I doubt. If it does, slightly more useful.
MoF/Thaum CWSS/Thaum CWIV/Protector GFSW/Combat HRSM/Destroyer GWFWK/Executioner TRDO/Faithful DC
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inthefade462Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I still can't really understand the majority of what you're saying Zacazu.
I won't argue for or against something I haven't tried, but it seems to me that the perk that add's AP on-kill for Reaping is probably less useful now that there is a legitimate ranged nuking class. Unless Deep Gash that is proc'ed off Reaping Strike also gives 2% AP on-kill. Which I doubt. If it does, slightly more useful.
Not sure what you mean by legitimate ranged nuking class. there's always been one called CW. It is the only class that can out damage a GWF at equivalent gear/skill, and only if doing massive pulls where the GWFs 5 target cap limitation comes into play.
For the most part HR's are hanging with TRs and GFs in the "not desired' camp. Not sure if they got overnerfed in preview before they were released or what but they're just not really doing anything.
everything I kill gives me 2 ap . if I kill 20 with a slam / avalanch , I gain 40 ap . the reaping strike is the prerequisite ( must be "equipped.") .
If you are a nostalgic beta , and likes to have a high production of ap , stay with the feat. but in the present scenario it is not necessary .
ranger :
ranger is a new class and everyone has one . when the novelty wears off and get only those most dedicated , then we have a real idea of what the ranger can do . I've found 2 very good ( amidst thousand ) .
but there is a basic difference here ( terms of damage ) .
the ranger is good for cleaning the garbage very quickly .
gwf is good for nuke against heavier enemies / cc immunity.
Ie the aoe of the two classes are complementary. but as an "ideal " team has 2 cw , is the dilemma : which of the two has better synergy with the cw ? Response : gwf in 80% of cases.
but this does not mean that the gwf is better than the ranger . a hypothetical balanced team both classes have their respective advantages .
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inthefade462Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited January 2014
I kinda understand what you are saying. About rangers, i dont see them competing with gwf for group spots. A lot of people are trying to figure out where hr fits. Aoe dmg but no cc, so they can't replace cw. Unlike gwf their aoe dmg fails if they are forced to tank and can't be an anchor point for cws to focus their aoe on, tanking the mobs so don't replace gwf.
Actually i find they are good replacement for the cleric in that scenario. This assumes they have some nature feats, they buff dr as well as a cleric, mitigate alot of dmg with fox, and their aoe clears out low hp trash so our 5 target aoe isnt wasnt on <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> mobs so clear times are faster.
In low-avg gs group hr adds dmg while providing same group survivability as a dc. Can run t2s with either cleric or nature hr and not use pots. In higher gs party cleric adds dmg buffs in addition to dr buffs because healing isn't needed, but hrs is also doing more dmg due to better gear so they equal out.
I kinda understand what you are saying. About rangers, i dont see them competing with gwf for group spots. A lot of people are trying to figure out where hr fits. Aoe dmg but no cc, so they can't replace cw. Unlike gwf their aoe dmg fails if they are forced to tank and can't be an anchor point for cws to focus their aoe on, tanking the mobs so don't replace gwf.
Actually i find they are good replacement for the cleric in that scenario. This assumes they have some nature feats, they buff dr as well as a cleric, mitigate alot of dmg with fox, and their aoe clears out low hp trash so our 5 target aoe isnt wasnt on <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> mobs so clear times are faster.
In low-avg gs group hr adds dmg while providing same group survivability as a dc. Can run t2s with either cleric or nature hr and not use pots. In higher gs party cleric adds dmg buffs in addition to dr buffs because healing isn't needed, but hrs is also doing more dmg due to better gear so they equal out.
Plus NHR can make GWF's unstoppable even more powerful because they can stack 12% of your hp in t.hp from it with stag heart and then beyond that they can increase mitigation by almost 50% just by buffing and for sentinels just by being in the party they give 10% defense and regenerate healing which is almost always on with oakskin.
Thats 16% t.hp from full determination then 12% more from stag heart numbers don't lie.
You might not feel like you need it; but it doesn't hurt.
Comments
Maybe, maybe not, I don't really care. To be honest you should thank your lucky stars Deep Gash does anything at all because not that long ago it didn't do diddly.
My guess is that the 'other damage bonuses' are most likely all of them and the variance comes from the various temporary power buff's and mitigation debuff's available to the GWF. (Not to mention the buffs/debuffs from the rest of the team.)
This overwrite feature does explain why everyone uses WMS/SS these days, as long as WMS is still capped at ten targets instead of five like most At-Will's. You crit with WMS, switch to SS until your crit is finished banging.
Sadly, my interest in the GWF is near zero given that they removed the only thing I liked about them. That being the Executioners Style feat that almost everyone else hated. 25% extra damage from Reaping Strike to a single target was boss, just feels like a wet noodle now. If I'm going to make things bleed, I'll play my TR thank you very much.
Yeah GWF are finally in a good place. I changed mine over to IV tree Destroyer spec and can do great damage in dungeons as well as tank. Sadly too many people want them back at the bottom of the barrel and are calling for nerfs (you know if a TR can't destroy them in pvp and can only stalemate....) The deep gash buff was huge but what really put is into a great spot was how we scale, The new artifacts are beyond a noticeable difference especially with GWF and with them you can make yourself high dps with alot of survivability. (Raven skull + Eye + your choice other one) so if something gets through your Unstoppable + temp hp + life steal from everything + active companions (btw these are AWSOME if you choose right) + boons then you can always activate your skull and get 90% of your missing HP + 10 % of max hp as temp hp giving you time to life steal back up. The best enchant for us it seems at the moment is Pvorp to help increase all the damage (which means all the Life steal) add it all in with easier to obtain R10 and we can rock it out now.
Makes a lot of sense. I miss Executioners Style but I'm probably the only one who does. Regardless, changing Deep Gash is definitely a big deal. Was completely skippable before. Replacing ES with an AP gain on kill seems underwhelming given that I doubt anyone uses Reaping Strike. Heck, the only reason I used it at all before was the 25% bonus to single-target.
With HR's being in the game, I doubt RS will kill enough targets to gain significant AP. CW's and HR's will annihilate the trash, leaving little to pick up in AP from RS kills. Might still be worth it for Determination gains, but as I've said I haven't even rebuilt my GWF yet. Good to know it's in a better place when I finally get tired of the HR.
No that's what I was saying, that reaping is probably useless now. Shame really, because I really liked it as it was.
I use executioner style ( old and new) .
crucial points :
1 - the "modern gwf " has less recovery he possessed before ( I cut mine in half ) .
2 - you do not need to kill anyone with reaping strike . You can kill them with a daily that generates the 2 ap ( reaping strike is a precondition ) .
3 - Despite the odds, even if you are going very badly , you kill 300 enemies , resulting in an extra 6 Dailys . to the current standard game, that is not bad ( no one else produces ap per target ) .
4 - you get 10 % damage with ibs . is VERY little, but oddly enough , it works. is not unusual for me to mend a slam on the other (I could already use 2 crescendo in sequence ) .
Summary : I like the class, but she does not say things we can not do. the big problem here is: gwf currently has a powerful daily for aoe . he has a good single (daily final) and " utility aoe " . ie , executioner style is a feat with utilitarian purposes given the present scenario .
the spinning strike gained some " improvements " but does not work with the bleed besides having a short range. A wasted potential.
1 - is still the second (third with iv ) major source of damage aoe vs 5 enemies . (counting Dailys ) .
2 - high bleed.
3 - generation ap = encounter . This means that you hit unstoppable up to 3 times . = 3 encounters. ( problem mentioned above) .
4 - Logistics : suppose we have 4 enemies to face: the gwf with another Atwill will attack them frontally , receiving the attack of the four . A User's reaping strike , can attack the flank so that will hit all enemies and only receive 1 damage thanks to the range of the attack .
5 - threat by damage.
6 - while you cast , you get 8 % damage resistance .
7 - Construction of determination.
I'm not saying that the reaping is better than the wicked today. I could talk , knowingly , other 500 reasons not to use Atwill . But not anticipate his judgment before playing . I say this because my reaction at the time of the preview , it was exactly this , they had just with Atwill ( even went bearish on post feedback , bad attitude ) .
ps:there is no more things like "single damages" for pve.
everything is killed VERY quickly and collectively, is at gwf / ranger and especially the cw.
in a few bosses you need a single damage (3 comes me in the head, the dragon of valindra, valindra and Idris). That's for sure strike is more than enough. everything else is solved with nuke / control.
I still can't really understand the majority of what you're saying Zacazu.
I won't argue for or against something I haven't tried, but it seems to me that the perk that add's AP on-kill for Reaping is probably less useful now that there is a legitimate ranged nuking class. Unless Deep Gash that is proc'ed off Reaping Strike also gives 2% AP on-kill. Which I doubt. If it does, slightly more useful.
Not sure what you mean by legitimate ranged nuking class. there's always been one called CW. It is the only class that can out damage a GWF at equivalent gear/skill, and only if doing massive pulls where the GWFs 5 target cap limitation comes into play.
For the most part HR's are hanging with TRs and GFs in the "not desired' camp. Not sure if they got overnerfed in preview before they were released or what but they're just not really doing anything.
everything I kill gives me 2 ap . if I kill 20 with a slam / avalanch , I gain 40 ap . the reaping strike is the prerequisite ( must be "equipped.") .
If you are a nostalgic beta , and likes to have a high production of ap , stay with the feat. but in the present scenario it is not necessary .
ranger :
ranger is a new class and everyone has one . when the novelty wears off and get only those most dedicated , then we have a real idea of what the ranger can do . I've found 2 very good ( amidst thousand ) .
but there is a basic difference here ( terms of damage ) .
the ranger is good for cleaning the garbage very quickly .
gwf is good for nuke against heavier enemies / cc immunity.
Ie the aoe of the two classes are complementary. but as an "ideal " team has 2 cw , is the dilemma : which of the two has better synergy with the cw ? Response : gwf in 80% of cases.
but this does not mean that the gwf is better than the ranger . a hypothetical balanced team both classes have their respective advantages .
Actually i find they are good replacement for the cleric in that scenario. This assumes they have some nature feats, they buff dr as well as a cleric, mitigate alot of dmg with fox, and their aoe clears out low hp trash so our 5 target aoe isnt wasnt on <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> mobs so clear times are faster.
In low-avg gs group hr adds dmg while providing same group survivability as a dc. Can run t2s with either cleric or nature hr and not use pots. In higher gs party cleric adds dmg buffs in addition to dr buffs because healing isn't needed, but hrs is also doing more dmg due to better gear so they equal out.
Plus NHR can make GWF's unstoppable even more powerful because they can stack 12% of your hp in t.hp from it with stag heart and then beyond that they can increase mitigation by almost 50% just by buffing and for sentinels just by being in the party they give 10% defense and regenerate healing which is almost always on with oakskin.
Thats 16% t.hp from full determination then 12% more from stag heart numbers don't lie.
You might not feel like you need it; but it doesn't hurt.