Suggestion: Foundry Doubloons - non-encounter XP/rewards

eldarth · August 2013

Currently foundry authors are incentivized to pack their quests/stories with encounters since that is the only way someone playing their quest can get any kind of reward - xp or loot.

Foundry Doubloons could be given out by foundry author on an Objective Completed event. Cryptic could allow authors to divide up, say 1000 doubloons into chosen objectives. Completing an objective, the player might then see that they obtained 150 doubloons. Since the foundry already has "budgets" this should be easy to accomplish. Cryptic could even declare that an encounter "costs" an author 200 doubloons - that would force diminishing returns preventing an author from simply putting in every encounter possible and every doubloon possible.

At the "final chest" Cryptic could calculate an XP (and/or loot) based upon number of doubloons gained, scaled by PC level, time spent, maybe a maximum doubloons/minute, interactions, phase of the moon - whatever/however they wanted to scale it. And doubloons would be exchanged for the xp/loot calculated - so no new "coinage" would leave the foundry quest.

This would grant authors a way of providing rewards for story driven, non-killing, puzzle solving, encounter avoidance, etc. This would be a huge benefit to the diversity and quality of foundry quests.

cribstaxxx · August 2013

Lol well it seems your onto something as 100% have voted 1 so far

klixan · August 2013

I absolutely support this idea! Love it!

At the moment it just feels so flat and unrewarding to complete a task in a foundry mission and receive nothing for it. It also discourages people from playing long missions.

It would be wonderful to get rewards for completing non combat tasks too! Because sometimes killing stuff 'ad infinitum' can get a bit tiresome.

All in all, I support this idea!

littlegoofball1 · August 2013

Good idea...

beeblebrox69 · August 2013

I posted an almost identical solution a few times in the Foundry forum, although more focused on allowing an author to give loot drops throughout the adventure (in hidden areas, chests, whatever), that would be calculated up to a budgeted reward at the final chest (find half the widgets, get half the level-appropriate bonus award).

So yes, I'm ALL for this.

Right now, I'm stuck "rewarding" my players for exploring and figuring out non-essential puzzles with some kind of joke or some additional story flavor. *shrug* I'd much prefer the option of giving real, non-exploitable loot.

klixan · August 2013

Someone in the General forum suggested some type of currency that can only be earned in foundry missions and then exchanged for vanity items at a special vendor. I like that idea too and it ties in nicely with the idea of Doubloons.

Heck, anything that make foundry quests more appealing and rewarding gets my vote!

carkorak · October 2013

If I was just going off what you had as the headliner of your post I would have said no, but after reading the meat of what you wanted, I totally agree, I would love to be able to see quests that reward you for more then monster mashing, it would possibly increase the length of farms, it would also introduce a new type of farm, the dubloon farm, but since it would hopefully be coded to be non exploitable, even if someone built 50 linked maps with maxed out asset allocation it still wouldn't be to big of a problem

Im still a fan of them letting us put 1 or 2 skill based crating interactebles per map, but I don't think that would be happening any time soon.

derpdedo · October 2013

klixan wrote: »

Someone in the General forum suggested some type of currency that can only be earned in foundry missions and then exchanged for vanity items at a special vendor. I like that idea too and it ties in nicely with the idea of Doubloons.

Heck, anything that make foundry quests more appealing and rewarding gets my vote!

I love the idea of vanity items. There may be a max limit you can earn in a day, or quest.
Someone is bound to try to take advantage of it making a run here, pull lever to get max aloud, next quest…

rezlez · October 2013

So, in other words, when you get to the end of a quest, you can choose between Item, Money, Exp, OR Seals of Venture. How large or OP the rewards are would be based on Dubloons. Seals of Venture would be what's needed for vanity items...or even combat items, or pots, etc - basically, an all-around store for Foundry addicts.

I'd like that idea, since one of my chars ONLY does foundries. This means I still have one bag, I generally have to buy pots 24/7, and my equipment is low pro due to normally only getting one item at the end per foundry. If a shop existed for Seals of Venture, which had pot bundles, one-time-only bag (you can't get the story bag if you get this, and vice versa), equipment options, etc., I'd be so grateful.

Oh, and if we choose item, let us roll 2 times in case we don't need the item we first see.

tannakaobi2 · October 2013

I agree and voted yes. But maybe not in the hands of Authors.

ephiroll · November 2013

Good idea. I don't see how it can be exploited more than the systems already in place. Maybe add in a minimum number of objectives to such a quest to prevent the 'pull lever win' deals.

angrysprite · November 2013

I've been screaming this to Robobo (BadBotLimit) since waaaay back when.

And waaaay back when he DID mention it's on their minds, but he was (rightly at the time) non-committal. I know the Devs have a lot on their plates and this is something will will sit near the bottom of the priority barrel, but since it's ANOTHER opportunity to beg, scream, shout that this is wanted, here I am.

stratiar · November 2013

Great idea, add me to the FOR list.

orangefiree · November 2013

I voted yes as well, this shouldn't be too exploitable, and would also provide an opportunity for optional objectives.

zebular · November 2013

I voted, "Yes!" Thanks for this poll, much appreciated!

antonkyle · November 2013

Can Cryptic ignore such a one sided poll?

angrysprite · November 2013

antonkyle wrote: »

Can Cryptic ignore such a one sided poll?

They do it every day.

In short: they (Robobo) have said they are looking at ideas, hoping to eventually make Foundry quests "more rewarding" to play. He/they did not specifically say they would come-up with non-combat booty, but the idea was mentioned. Unfortunately I don't recall the answer if there was one (this was back in April, '13) and those forums were locked away next to the Crown of Neverwinter in the Hall of Justice Vaults that no one is ever allowed access to, until they're stolen.

Let's just say: I would't advise holding your breath. if it comes, it won't be any time soon enough, (not to be confused with: Soon™.)

buffsmad · November 2013

Yes from me too. I'd specifically like to see the capability to make Achievement Awards.

Points scoring ones could be for prominent foundries (trying to stay on topic

) although I am more interested in non-point awards which can be 'checkable' in dialogue to allow more diversity in quest/dialogue design. Eg if someone takes a romantic dialogue route they can be awarded Friend of X and persistant mushy pcs can gain Suitor of...., Lover of... to unlock different dialogues. There would be more continuity to Campaigns with quest completion awards if the PC is known to npcs. (Rather than 'Please remind me....' or 'What did I do...' dialogue options.)

adran07 · December 2013

Do it Cryptic! Do it!

nehemiah217 · December 2013

klixan wrote: »

Someone in the General forum suggested some type of currency that can only be earned in foundry missions and then exchanged for vanity items at a special vendor. I like that idea too and it ties in nicely with the idea of Doubloons.

Heck, anything that make foundry quests more appealing and rewarding gets my vote!

Yes, a Foundry-only currency *IS* a great idea, alongside unique items that can only be purchased with Foundry currency.

I also like Eldarth's idea, and think that a merging of both concepts would be akin to eating a steak *while* you're having sex... "Hey wait a minute, those two don't.... oh yeah, this works...."

:cool:

Of course, it can be argued, why add additional currencies? Why not just make gold worth something? Hey, I'm not saying, just playing devil's advocate here... but you have to admit, it's a good point. But I think we can all agree, the Foundry needs some incentive; and I vote for Eldarth to be the contracted project lead!

kellnaforian · December 2013

Yes. Players do need more of a reason to try A VARIETY of the foundry quests.

ashawkins · December 2013

I don't see why this is questionable. To the authors in Foundry who spend hours a week putting together a story, I know that they are bummed that they can't add kits and rewards throughout their story line. Even if the chest has minor assets like health or money. It would add a bit of spark to exploration.

I push exploration in the story I'm putting together for the Foundry. The thing is, I really have to make a twist to make it worth the walking around-like vanishing figures, traps, wild animals.

I just wish upon the shiniest star in the sky, (besides a healthy human race or money in my pocket) for the ability to reward players through their travels.

reiwulf · December 2013

Yeah, this would be great for more story oriented and/or exploration/puzzle quests too.

wolfsong84 · December 2013

I also agree with this.

thylbanus · December 2013

I like many of your ideas and posts eldarth, but I'm not so sure about this. I'm the kind who likes to find potential for exploit and this sounds rife with exploit potential. Could you elaborate on your primary post more about this idea? It has a LOT of potential, both good and bad. I'm most interested in the diminished return theory.

charononus · December 2013

Video games are about combat, non - combat levels don't work in video games and such things are either going to be an exploit click fest at best, and that is the best thing that could happen. Or a boring case of someone writing d grade versions of war and peace in video game form.

reiwulf · December 2013

There's much more than combat in videogames, have you ever played Myst? Day of the tentacle? There are many other options for a videogame than just combat. Exploration and puzzles foundry quests would really have more support with this idea.

charononus · December 2013

reiwulf wrote: »

There's much more than combat in videogames, have you ever played Myst? Day of the tentacle? There are many other options for a videogame than just combat. Exploration and puzzles foundry quests would really have more support with this idea.

No idea what Day of the tentacle is.

That said Myst is it's own beast. It had a very good writers behind it, and contrary to their own opinion most people. Myself included in this, are not good writers. There is a reason why fan-fiction isn't published work, and the foundry is similar to fan-fiction. Myst and it's sequels are also mostly alone in their own genre. No other game similar to them has gotten as popular as they did, and even their popularity seems to have been niche.

Now I'm not trying to say the foundry is bad. I've played a few good ones that have given a light story that then plunged us into a bunch of mobs to kill. This (disregarding how buggy the new/featured lists are) is what most people not just me seem to like in a foundry.

reiwulf · December 2013

So? if you happen to enjoy battle centered quests, this idea would not impact you, it merely helps other kind of quests to also get more rewards.

eldarth · December 2013

thylbanus wrote: »

I like many of your ideas and posts eldarth, but I'm not so sure about this. I'm the kind who likes to find potential for exploit and this sounds rife with exploit potential. Could you elaborate on your primary post more about this idea? It has a LOT of potential, both good and bad. I'm most interested in the diminished return theory.

From initial post:
"Foundry Doubloons could be given out by foundry author on an Objective Completed event. Cryptic could allow authors to divide up, say 1000 doubloons into chosen objectives. Completing an objective, the player might then see that they obtained 150 doubloons. Since the foundry already has "budgets" this should be easy to accomplish. Cryptic could even declare that an encounter "costs" an author 200 doubloons - that would force diminishing returns preventing an author from simply putting in every encounter possible and every doubloon possible."

This part definitely would need some "balancing" in order to co-exist with the existing encounter budget of 50 encounters per map.
200 is way to high given 1000 doubloon budget. Perhaps 10 doubloons per encounter? So, if an author placed ALL 50 encounters, that would cost 500 doubloons leaving 500 doubloons that could be awarded to the player. So, by using every single encounter, you've reduced the available XP/loot reward that the player receives at the end by 50%. Kind of discourages "pit of X" loot/XP farm type quests. But, if the author placed 10 encounters, that'd cost 100 doubloons, leaving 900 awardable so, 90% of maximum loot/XP calculated at end.

This kind of encourages non-encounter based quests, but conversely, this would turn all "Pit of X" quests into "Talk to X" and receive 1000 doubloons quests. D'oh! See, needs work. Perhaps something similar but only allowing a maximum of 5% of doubloons awarded per objective? No easy answers.

casmelak · January 2014

This part definitely would need some "balancing" in order to co-exist with the existing encounter budget of 50 encounters per map.
200 is way to high given 1000 doubloon budget. Perhaps 10 doubloons per encounter? So, if an author placed ALL 50 encounters, that would cost 500 doubloons leaving 500 doubloons that could be awarded to the player. So, by using every single encounter, you've reduced the available XP/loot reward that the player receives at the end by 50%. Kind of discourages "pit of X" loot/XP farm type quests. But, if the author placed 10 encounters, that'd cost 100 doubloons, leaving 900 awardable so, 90% of maximum loot/XP calculated at end.

This kind of encourages non-encounter based quests, but conversely, this would turn all "Pit of X" quests into "Talk to X" and receive 1000 doubloons quests. D'oh! See, needs work. Perhaps something similar but only allowing a maximum of 5% of doubloons awarded per objective? No easy answers.

I like the general idea. I think something like this, coupled with the ability to add skill nodes, would offer authors quite a bit to work with.

My thoughts on it are as follows:

1. Base the currency accumulation on completion of objectives, and make it so that 'kill stuff' objectives are not eligible.
2. Rather than make it a base/set amount to start with, increment the amount of currency to say 25-50% of the objectives, with a limit to the quantity you can earn per map based on size. (Say, the largest map you can make can earn 1000, you have 40 objectives on that map /4 = 10 of those objectives earn the player currency at a max of 50 a piece. Makes longer quests still have value, while making short quests still earn something, and doesn't mess with the other budgets. Encourages multiple maps and rewards story building without necessarily penalizing balance.)
3. Require completing the whole quest to actually earn the currency.

Perhaps with some testing and tweaks it would work out pretty well.

Sign me up.

Suggestion: Foundry Doubloons - non-encounter XP/rewards

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