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So yeah this game is still garbage.
h0p3i
Member Posts: 66
Came back after a couple of months.
Started a skirmish.
My priest healing spells still heals for almost nothing.
When I died on the boss, I had to revive at the very beginning, the entrance in the skirmish area.
Party died, and all bailed because of this, no one will run back to the boss from the beginning.
Wasted 30mins of my life on this skirmish (again).
Hey great work fixing the priest class to actually be a healer and great work for fixing the dungeons with simple logic like when your party is fighting you have to run 3mins to actualy get to the party?
Amaaaazing!
Started a skirmish.
My priest healing spells still heals for almost nothing.
When I died on the boss, I had to revive at the very beginning, the entrance in the skirmish area.
Party died, and all bailed because of this, no one will run back to the boss from the beginning.
Wasted 30mins of my life on this skirmish (again).
Hey great work fixing the priest class to actually be a healer and great work for fixing the dungeons with simple logic like when your party is fighting you have to run 3mins to actualy get to the party?
Amaaaazing!
Post edited by h0p3i on
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Comments
If you cannot spend 3 minutes to regroup after a wipe (btw it is about the time it takes for "revive sickness" to wear off anyway, look it up if you don't know what that is), you shouldn't bother with games of this style. MMOs are time consuming by nature, 3 minutes is nothing.
You have to realize if you could re-join the fight immediately after you died, you could zerg any boss down with no effort required at all.
Sorry your party left. Happens sometimes, try to find some people that are willing to put the extra time and effort and not quit after a wipe, usually that's all it takes to get the job done.
We cannot thank you enough for your selfless service to the community.
Short answer: You aren't doing it right, and your party was awful.
Contagion - Cleric
Testament - Wizard
Pestilence - Ranger
Dominion - Paladin
NIGHTSWATCH
The rules:
Disregard gear, disregard cc, disregard everything, just pure numbers:
-My cleric got 22k hp
Some basic healing spells I use (disregard modifiers, passives, dailies, just the numbers):
Healing Word: Heals for 3000-3432 (overtime healing, first second like 700, second 1.2, and so on, in a total of 3-4seconds.
Sun Burst: Healing for 1063-1216. 10seconds cooldown.
Bastion of Health: 1543-1765, 13.6second cooldown.
I use these 3 spells one after another, lets consider the highest numbers lets say I'm lucky: 3432+1216+1765=6213HPin rougly 5seconds I healed on one target.
Now I can try spam my astral seal (472-540healing), and Sacred Flame (511-585 healing), but most of the time, in pvp that is really erratic (since I get cc'ed most of the time I'm trying to move away from enemy, etc.
You can tell me that there are other aspects of the game, like reducing incoming damage, and regen, and crit and better gear and l2p (the last 2 "constructive" comment I love the most).
But when this comes down to healing, the above amount I can pull out thats it no more.
Now consider other aspects:
-Enemy CC me (no move no heal for seconds).
-Enemy hit me (or my target) for 10-15k dmg in mere 2-3seconds.
-Enemy got a help and the cc and dmg doubles.
I'm asking politely, where is the healing as a cleric I should heal a good amount of incoming dmg, or that's it, the party is dead (pvp or dungeon, doesn't matter).
If as a cleric I _should_ heal... what the above says about my class as a healer?
Astral Shield is not a healing spell Gives regeneration, the ticks are like 1-2k healing per hit.
Forgemaster's Flame? That is also only heals when you use divine power on it and only a really passive heal when you or party is near the enemy you put it on.
Compare the 1-2k healing per second to enemy damage sources. When a one white damage doing 2-5k dmg, and an at will the same, and then you got the encounter powers doing 10-20k damage.
The difference is non-comparable.
Since you ask politely, you get polite answers.
You can't really disregard gear. It's where most of your numbers come from. At 60, your Healing Word can easily dole out over 6k healing over time without a crit and without using Divinity. Also without using Healer's Lore or any other heal-boosting effects. If you start factoring in enchants, crits, and Divinity use, the numbers jump considerably. Bastion can hit 10k+ heals. Also don't forget your Dailies; they come up frequently and can be game-changing. Divine Armor is a fantastic clutch with its defense boost and huge temp HP heal, and Hallowed Ground grants extra damage along with mitigation.
That being said, you have few options for clutch healing. It's not playing whack-a-mole with red health bars like in most MMOs. Those games use mana or a similar resource to limit how long you can sit there spamming Greater Battle Heal or what-have-you. I think these are some important points to keep in mind about playing as a DC in NW:
1. Your party members have a responsibility to take care of themselves. They need to use their own skills to CC enemies, kill them outright, evade red areas, go immune, or whatever else it is that they can do. You're there to bolster their defenses and help them stay healthy so that they can do what they need to do, and you have some capacity to save them from huge hits, but not indefinitely.
2. Your gear matters quite a bit as a DC. True of all classes, but DCs in particular suffer horribly if their gear is subpar or not matched well to the individual player's style. In PvP you are all but forced to spec for high survivability and generally can't get away with hanging back and tossing heals, because you'll get focused. In that particular case, even the "healiest" DC needs some defensive stats, or it won't be living long enough to heal anyone.
3. Astral Shield is your friend in group play. It's the most elegant, if boring solution in your toolbox.
4. Feat selection is very, very important. There aren't that many good ones, and some of the awful ones look good if you don't know better already. Repurpose Soul adds AoE healing based on your criticals, Holy Resolve grants you an occasional temp HP buffer, Healing Step grants temp HP frequently, etc.
5. You have to stay mobile and dodge both preemptively and on reaction as needed. The aforementioned Healing Step feat in the Righteous tree is a huge help for PvP and any other situation where frequent dodges are required.
I hope some of that helps. I know DC can be discouraging, but when you've got it moderately geared up and figured out, it can be very rewarding. I think the class still needs some tweaking, but it's far from hopeless or useless. A good cleric is far more useful than any potion :P
Contagion - Cleric
Testament - Wizard
Pestilence - Ranger
Dominion - Paladin
NIGHTSWATCH
sorry if anyone didnt understood what i wrote, but english is not my first language so yeah i can brutalize it as i want
You have dodges to avoid that damage or to give you time to heal or for an ally to intercept. Since it's an action game, you also have line of sight mechanics to work to your advantage.
Also, those 10-20k damage numbers can't keep going indefinitely unless they are similar damage from multiple sources, in which case it's not just clerics who are in trouble. No, healing can't go toe-to-toe with burst damage, but it's not really meant to. It has to be used in conjunction with other tactics to shine, and it does work.
Contagion - Cleric
Testament - Wizard
Pestilence - Ranger
Dominion - Paladin
NIGHTSWATCH
You disregard the two most powerful healing abilities in the game. Simply put them on your bar along with Sun Burst. Use Sun Burst in traffic (i.e. hitting both allies and enemies) on cooldown to build divinity. Do not waste it on the jesus laser, but use it to cast Astral Shield. Place the blue circle where your allies are fighting. It will give them damage resistance and a powerful HoT.
When Astral Shield is about to disappear, resume Divinity mode and put Forgemaster's Flame on the biggest, toughest monster that's in or near melee range with your party. If they need a hint that it's proccing HoT, just step next to the monster and the green numbers will put them wise.
Using just this simple rubric, appropriate gear and mediocre to moderate player skill, you can solo heal zero-death runs of practically every dungeon and skirmish in this game.
Overall all anyone can say is find a method for getting better gear/enchants and hopefully get a better party next time. Gear and stats are everything in mmorpgs.
If it's a super emergency: skip some steps, make sure they have a healing word on them, and soothing light for all you're worth. You should be able to keep them up till they can use a pot and get out of harms way. If they don't use a pot - let them die repeatedly. It's not your job to provide every single hit point lost.
Don't forget astral seal on targets of your team to build your divinity - and heal them while they attack.
All this works in skirmishes with absolute <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> gear, and even a very sub-optimal feat selection. That said - if you are still in green gear at lvl 60, and it's not part of some stat stacking strategy, then you're gearing wrong. There's so much cheap blue stuff on the AH, or dropping out of the sky in Sharandar that getting acceptable gear as a DC for skirimishes and even most of the elite dungeons is almost too easy.
Master of the Hunt is particularly easy for skirmishes. Aberrant Assault is more tricky with all the Thoon Hulk shenanigans and overseer cc. You'll need some careful stamina management to ensure your dodges are there for when you need them. As will your team.
I'm hoping I can give it a good go this time, and people might understand that clerics will get pwned with healing aggro and need help :P
The comments I've read here seem encouraging ^^
Astral Shield and Sun Burst should be your mainstays in group play. Add in Astral Shield and the 3rd strike bonus of Sacred Flame and you should see little green ''+'' signs & green numbers flying off of your party members.
The third encounter is usually party and dungeon specific and will likely change throughout the course of a run. For a Skirmish you should be able to get away with something like Daunting Light. It is our best ''kill'' encounter and you shouldn't need to be a healbot in a skirmish. For dungeons you should replace Daunting Light with Forgemasters Flame or the underrated Divine Glow (small area of coverage but debuffs the defense of enemies caught in it and boosts the damage of party members caught in it. A DPS party member caught in Divine Astral Shield and Divine Glow is a thing of beauty.). If your party is taking extreme damage and struggling to stay healthy then you can run with Astral Shield, Sun Burst & Healing Word (full healbot).
Only the toughest of boss and mini-boss fights should make your life difficult as a healer.
Your party must also be doing their own bit to stay healthy and alive by avoiding unnecessary damage and topping themselves up with health potions if they take spike damage (we Clerics are not very good at bringing people back from near death).
To a degree, they have a point. By using Sun Burst, Astral Seal and bursts of Sacred Flame I am almost always (90% of the time) able to cast Divine Astral Shield when it comes off of cool down, so there is no need for me to be going all DPS.
Usually in parties with fresh 60s we have a problem with people ignoring us to fend for ourselves against mobs and thinking we should be replacing their heal potions. Truth is, we cannot compete with healing potions in healing spike damage and we are torn to shreds by adds because few, if any, of our powers are serious damage dealers. Daunting Light and Chains can easily dispose of lesser adds but in a dungeon you will not be able to use these as you'll be using a heal/buff/damage mitigation rotation.
Experienced 60s however know that if they want to minimise health potion usage and would like to see that blue circle as often as possible they need to keep an eye on us and help clear the adds.
I think clerics can do a lot of healing with the right build. I see astral shield more as dmg mitigation, and healing word as the main healing spell. On a critical hit, healing word can heal for 4k-10k instantly, taking in account of repurpose soul and seeker's beacon if you use MH. Then it gives a regen effect of 2kish, I think that's far better than a health pot. Being a cleric is not just about healing when they are low but keeping an eye for when they will misstep/stand in red/are about to get pummeled by adds. By anticipating the dmg they may take, they are unlikely to take those spikes.
If they do take a critical hit, then use soothing light. It is such a strong heal. Sometimes when I am with a comfortable party I tell them to not use pots and to trust me. You'd be surprised how much you can heal with hw.
Honestly, I interpret the Cleric as a mitigator and slow healer as it is, so I am okay with the fact that our best power - Astral Shield - is more of a damage mitigator than an all out healing power and that our at-wills and encounters provide a steady stream of top-ups. For all but the most geared players I think it is best if you come to accept that you are going to find it very difficult to rapidly take someone from near-death to fighting-fit in a single cast and that you should rather focus on stopping damage in the first place.
True - i use it - everybody is using it.
But
The fact, that there is not that much variety at that point is a bit sad....
You put and AS down and if they aint in it, they're stupid.. If they Chase shiny red stuff, They're stupid.. If they dont dodge they're stupid.. Bottom line you cant help stupidity.
Saying DC sucks because of stupidity is.... STOOOPID
Have a look at MITIGATION feats, passives and encounters, synergize your strongest ones.
Class passives
Foresight with Benefit of foresight
Healers lore or Divine fortune
Encounters
Astral shield
Healing word or forgemasters flame - only used in divinity as AS is about to end ( depending on ranged or melee allies )
Sunburst
Daily
Hallowed Ground with moontouched feat
Divine armor
At-Wills
Astral seal everything
Sacred flame or brand of the sun (depending on mobility)
Equipment
Miracle healers set for trash runs
High Prophet set for boss debuff (if needed)
Radiant Enchants all over except utility slot
Ancient or Fomorian weapon and Off hand
* Join a guild that knows where their shift key is *
Second mistake: You assume that you are only there for healing, which is again false. While you might throw seals out it is up tot he team to utilize their placement of the seals. Teams that cause mobs to fly everywhere with knock back are the bane of clerics, as well as any decent team looking to take mobs down quickly. At most you should be using divine anvil, and regular sunburst tossing seals on targets and hitting the target to spread the healing love with sacred flame. Past that if you are relying on your divine healing you are just expecting too much.
Third mistake: Assuming that as a cleric you should make people live through red circles or any other alpha strike attack. This is not a game of face tanking like previous MMOs of yesteryear. If your team refuses to use their defensives to avoid attacks or doesn't do their job to help keep aggro off you then that isn't your fault in the end. Albeit even though you need to learn to kite and heal aggressively at times, especially for some major boss fights, in no way should you be expected to be tanking tons of aggro while the rest of the team herpaderps the boss and tunnel visions it. Only extremely geared clerics can pull that off, and even then it's pressing their luck in some circumstances.
Stop trying to be a WoW priest in other words and play a cleric.
Players coming from other games need to understand to that the main focus of Clerics in this game is to not PROVIDE large amounts of healing but large amounts of Mitigation. POTIONS are a must for every class for O'**** situations.
"Does this look infected to you?"
Totally misunterstanding of the class itself.
Cleric is designed as a supportive attacking class - with mitigation, damage buffs and also little heals, while heals have more a regeneration-like meaning.
While the party got some brain, stay in range and may in AS too, they will be up and well - mostly.
If they are brainless, and fame addicted (get the jump: "red carpet"), they get a high chance to die.
As said, clerics may heal 1/3 of total health within a period of 4-6 seconds...
By taking the look to it's basic design, not being a direct healer, thats quite a good amount.
Sometimes its annoying, but the healed one can still take a pot, so in that period most characters get enough HP to stay alive.
Just a Healing Word + Pot heals for about 10-11k on average + ~5-7k as HoT -- so we are at ~15-20k, let them attack seal-marked mobs and/or stay in AS, there we got the 90-100% heal in 4-6 seconds.
To bring my post to an end:
Astral Shield and Seal are way enough on ~85% of the (end)game.
Some parts can be played also without Astral Shield, on some other parts a bit more heal is needed.
Never needed more than AS in CTAs - during last CTA we had a guildrun with 2 clerics, dual sunbursts and Aseals made it fine.
To me this game works fine without a direct-uber-heal0r.
If we get one of that kind, complete game balance will be blown up I think.
-I showed what are the heal spells and how much they heal.
Made a new post in general too, and this time I got videos to prove what I'm experiencing is a joke as healing cleric:
I'm going to try and record more cleric videos to show how garbage the mechanic is as actual healing.
http://www.twitch.tv/40p3
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?548811-Is-this-how-I-supposed-to-do-with-Cleric-in-pvp
The gist of what I wrote:
- You MUST attack at all times that you are not actively dodging or using support skills. Divinity and Action Point gain are absolutely essential to a cleric's function, and your At-Wills generally provide additional benefit to your team.
- Bastion is typically not a great choice for PvP since it takes so long to cast, your allies can't see the splat to know where to stand, and it's too much of a drain on your Divinity to spam it in Divine mode every single time.
- You're trying to play DC like a healer from some other MMO. Those of us who are trying to tell you that the class DOES essentially work are not crazy; the mechanics are effective, but they are very different from what you're used to.
Contagion - Cleric
Testament - Wizard
Pestilence - Ranger
Dominion - Paladin
NIGHTSWATCH