There are exceptions in every dungeon but all loot which came from chests is also boss drops. The boss drops follow the information provided when you first enter the dungeon and as such every dungeon has a reason for every class to do the dungeon. There are excpetions, such as the Dragon Symbol which drops in Karrundax (I have gotten this drop at least four times off the dragon as a cleric) but the Tier items which set effects are unique and only "drop" in the dungeons which they are stated to in the dungeon descriptions.
Yes, but i know that as a cleric i have more chance to be able to need more loots if i play frozen heart or pirate king instead of karrundax, that was my point. As a CW i can need more loots if i play karrundax or spellplague. That's basic maths and since most bosses only have 3 different loots (not including the set items), there is no way everyone can profit as much as some classes do in specific dungeons.
That's why i think being able to need everything should help fixing this issue.
That's why i think being able to need everything should help fixing this issue.
This made my day. Want know why, I tell you why it because few week ago we could need on everything now we can't thanks to the same kind of people who like this BOP <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> .
This made my day. Want know why, I tell you why it because few week ago we could need on everything now we can't thanks to the same kind of people who like this BOP <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> .
funny, in my experience, rolling need on everything was a sign of a ninja looter that deservedly would get kicked from dang near any group, raid, and guild I've ever been in. if you're getting that stuff to sell, that is, by definition, a greed roll. you roll need on that, then I either kick or tell the group you need a new healer, because I'm leaving. Granted, that last argument is not as effective in this game as it is in a lot of other games, but it's still my history and stance.
That being said, what I think personally is a great idea (which has met with some success in some games) would be that if everyone can roll need on everything, then rolling need and winning automatically bound the item to the character. reduces ninjaing and makes need and greed rolls more often truly reflect needs and greeds.
I agree that AD was more farmable prior to the patch, but it's actually easier to obtain now. As long as you have more than 1 60 (and if you don't it only takes a few days) it is much easier for you to make more "new" AD each day. By new I mean refined, new to the system AD.
I used to make ~10-12k AD per day per character at 60, I have 4 60's almost 5. I can now easily hit the refine cap with all 60's just from prayer/leadership pvp daily and nevermember daily. So with less work (and way less grind) I can get good AD without having to do things I don't want to do. Ie run 3 dungeons during DD time, which is different everyday so I have to be willing to sacrifice a random 1.5-2 hours straight.
Now I make ~100k AD a day by just doing what I enjoy, PvP.
Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
funny, in my experience, rolling need on everything was a sign of a ninja looter that deservedly would get kicked from dang near any group, raid, and guild I've ever been in. if you're getting that stuff to sell, that is, by definition, a greed roll. you roll need on that, then I either kick or tell the group you need a new healer, because I'm leaving. Granted, that last argument is not as effective in this game as it is in a lot of other games, but it's still my history and stance.
That being said, what I think personally is a great idea (which has met with some success in some games) would be that if everyone can roll need on everything, then rolling need and winning automatically bound the item to the character. reduces ninjaing and makes need and greed rolls more often truly reflect needs and greeds.
Some people will still roll need, then they sit there with a purple they can salvage for 6-10k. it's not much, but it's all they can get with BoP. I think fallen's suggestion was better tbh, as people running t2's do it for profit, and when everyone can need, that's just fair.
I agree that AD was more farmable prior to the patch, but it's actually easier to obtain now. As long as you have more than 1 60 (and if you don't it only takes a few days) it is much easier for you to make more "new" AD each day. By new I mean refined, new to the system AD.
I used to make ~10-12k AD per day per character at 60, I have 4 60's almost 5. I can now easily hit the refine cap with all 60's just from prayer/leadership pvp daily and nevermember daily. So with less work (and way less grind) I can get good AD without having to do things I don't want to do. Ie run 3 dungeons during DD time, which is different everyday so I have to be willing to sacrifice a random 1.5-2 hours straight.
Now I make ~100k AD a day by just doing what I enjoy, PvP.
Gaunt pvp was so fun prior to BoP patch, now it feels totally unrewarding and people afk there just to get the daily. Save up 45-75 grym coins for 6k salvage? Meh.
Some people will still roll need, then they sit there with a purple they can salvage for 6-10k. it's not much, but it's all they can get with BoP. I think fallen's suggestion was better tbh, as people running t2's do it for profit, and when everyone can need, that's just fair.
see, what makes that unfair to me is that not everybody runs for profit, some people are running to actually get that gear for that character. Those people, imo, are genuinely entitled to roll need for it. everyone else's profit concerns are, at best, secondary. hence the very reason the greed roll option exists in the first darn place.
why is profit really that big a deal, though? that's what I don't get. this is a game. play it to play it. if the only reason you play is to hoard money/ad/whatever, then you must not be enjoying the game for what it is and would probably be better off doing something else then coming back when you desire new, upgraded gear whenever that comes along.
Gaunt pvp was so fun prior to BoP patch, now it feels totally unrewarding and people afk there just to get the daily. Save up 45-75 grym coins for 6k salvage? Meh.
I do agree with this, they effectively killed gaunt. I'm saving up neverember daily's until I have the pve pvp and dungeon, that's the only way participating is worthwhile =P
At least the GG items should have remained BoE, they completely killed their first content release lol.
Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
see, what makes that unfair to me is that not everybody runs for profit, some people are running to actually get that gear for that character. Those people, imo, are genuinely entitled to roll need for it. everyone else's profit concerns are, at best, secondary. hence the very reason the greed roll option exists in the first darn place.
why is profit really that big a deal, though? that's what I don't get. this is a game. play it to play it. if the only reason you play is to hoard money/ad/whatever, then you must not be enjoying the game for what it is and would probably be better off doing something else then coming back when you desire new, upgraded gear whenever that comes along.
Sigh, I'm not even gonna try.
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ranncoreMember, Moderators, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 2,508
edited August 2013
I think there should still be a good way to get gear for my alts (a shared account bank for seal items like PvP, GG and seal vendor gear at the very least), and I think the Salvager should award refined diamonds.
I didn't think it was possible, but PvP and GG just became even less appealing.
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bpskibbenheimsMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 210Bounty Hunter
edited August 2013
Seems like someone restarts this poll every day. I have voted on this exact topic with differently worded voting options several times before.
greed. pure and simple. if someone is running content that they neither "need" nor properly enjoy, because they can make money that is tied to a game, then they aren't here to play a game. The motivation for such might be different for different individuals. maybe it's just to see a really big number of AD/Zen. maybe it's because they want to acquire everything they possibly can at the expense of making it harder for some people to play (people that want to play the dungeons as designed and/or want to gear the old fashioned way). maybe it's just because they don't know what they want and greed feels like some kind of goal.
Don't get me wrong. Greed is not always a bad thing, and it's certainly not an insult. There are times where it works and is even necessary. It can sometimes be a motivator for good things. What bothers me is that it gets in the way of actually playing the game. Playing only for profit is not playing. it's working. If working is your goal, then there are more productive ways to do it, and those ways will probably even put more money in PWE's wallet.
So tell me, is there a good reason to keep playing/working this way? the answer to that is going to be different for different people.
There are exceptions in every dungeon but all loot which came from chests is also boss drops. The boss drops follow the information provided when you first enter the dungeon and as such every dungeon has a reason for every class to do the dungeon. There are excpetions, such as the Dragon Symbol which drops in Karrundax (I have gotten this drop at least four times off the dragon as a cleric) but the Tier items which set effects are unique and only "drop" in the dungeons which they are stated to in the dungeon descriptions.
The Tier 2 set pieces drop so infrequently it's understandable that people think they don't drop off the boss at all.
greed. pure and simple. if someone is running content that they neither "need" nor properly enjoy, because they can make money that is tied to a game, then they aren't here to play a game. The motivation for such might be different for different individuals. maybe it's just to see a really big number of AD/Zen. maybe it's because they want to acquire everything they possibly can at the expense of making it harder for some people to play (people that want to play the dungeons as designed and/or want to gear the old fashioned way). maybe it's just because they don't know what they want and greed feels like some kind of goal.
Don't get me wrong. Greed is not always a bad thing, and it's certainly not an insult. There are times where it works and is even necessary. It can sometimes be a motivator for good things. What bothers me is that it gets in the way of actually playing the game. Playing only for profit is not playing. it's working. If working is your goal, then there are more productive ways to do it, and those ways will probably even put more money in PWE's wallet.
So tell me, is there a good reason to keep playing/working this way? the answer to that is going to be different for different people.
You have your opinions, i have mine. Many people share my opinion and think it's ruining the game experience, and gives zero motivation for players. Gear has never been particularly hard to get, but enchantments are a pain in the *** to get. People who previously ran dungeons and worked their way towards enchantments, can't do it any more.
Just because you're OK with rank 5 enchants and no weapon/armor chants dosen't mean everyone else wanna give up on their goals without paying real money... And i think PWE's wallet is quite full already.
I don't see a problem with the DD chests. I just wish it was that way sooner, so I didn't have to be lucky and get the pieces I actually needed for a set. However, having said that, I'm also glad it wasn't like that or I would have never been able to get the AD I have now just to increase my stats through enchants and such... So I'm kinda stuck in the middle. I have what I want now, but making an ALT will be easier to obtain my gear that I actually need. Problem, is, with 5 players of different classes in a DD, how often will one get the loot, assuming it's good loot, from a boss drop, also assuming it isn't bound since some tend to be. So the AD is a rare thing now. Very rare. I've ran 10 dungeons and not got a loot drop yet from a boss. That makes me sit here playin DD's over and over for loot that I can make AD with. The Salvager I believe is great also, however, 24K in one day...??? I actually get more and more rough AD just from the salvager and will never hit 0 until at least a year or even at all. Increasing the rough AD refinment to a higher number may just be the only thing that is needed in my opinion. Try 50K. It doubles the normal value and we can actually do something useful. Half of 100K is not bad at all. It would also keep us busy for sure. 24K though... I will never get below what I have now. Ever. If rough AD is sooo much easier to get, and it is, then why keep the refinment at such a low rate? I'm willing to bet that increaing this rate would increase the urge to continue to do GG for gear to salvage and DD's as well. Salvage about 3-5 pieces of gear and you hit your cap for the day... Then what? I play PvP to pass the time of boredom, but I also get glory for gear. I can salvage that too, but now your talking I'm at double my salvage cap in one day, so whats the point? Only reason I got is that it's entertaing, but not rewarding. Increase the salvage per day quota. Bet you will see a difference...
I don't see a problem with the DD chests. I just wish it was that way sooner, so I didn't have to be lucky and get the pieces I actually needed for a set. However, having said that, I'm also glad it wasn't like that or I would have never been able to get the AD I have now just to increase my stats through enchants and such... So I'm kinda stuck in the middle. I have what I want now, but making an ALT will be easier to obtain my gear that I actually need. Problem, is, with 5 players of different classes in a DD, how often will one get the loot, assuming it's good loot, from a boss drop, also assuming it isn't bound since some tend to be. So the AD is a rare thing now. Very rare. I've ran 10 dungeons and not got a loot drop yet from a boss. That makes me sit here playin DD's over and over for loot that I can make AD with. The Salvager I believe is great also, however, 24K in one day...??? I actually get more and more rough AD just from the salvager and will never hit 0 until at least a year or even at all. Increasing the rough AD refinment to a higher number may just be the only thing that is needed in my opinion. Try 50K. It doubles the normal value and we can actually do something useful. Half of 100K is not bad at all. It would also keep us busy for sure. 24K though... I will never get below what I have now. Ever. If rough AD is sooo much easier to get, and it is, then why keep the refinment at such a low rate? I'm willing to bet that increaing this rate would increase the urge to continue to do GG for gear to salvage and DD's as well. Salvage about 3-5 pieces of gear and you hit your cap for the day... Then what? I play PvP to pass the time of boredom, but I also get glory for gear. I can salvage that too, but now your talking I'm at double my salvage cap in one day, so whats the point? Only reason I got is that it's entertaing, but not rewarding. Increase the salvage per day quota. Bet you will see a difference...
Don't even hope for a refinement cap raise. STO players have been harassing cryptic for this for more than a year, with threads about this every week, and nothing has changed so far. It's not even worth trying.
I'm not a huge fan of this idea anyway, printing more money doesn't make stuff cheaper, except some minor fees like transmutation, which is already very cheap.
I am disappointed to see the auction house empty of epic sets (at least any I was interested in) and the few that are there are several times more expensive.
This is not a surprise of course. I fully expected that when I saw the latest changes announced. I will only play this game for fun, I am not going to start grinding to improve my gear. So I will will run through the latest content, but I am not seeing much to keep me around at the moment. It seems to me that Neverwinter is turning into the type of game you have to play an awful lot if you want access to all areas of the game.
Comments
Yes, but i know that as a cleric i have more chance to be able to need more loots if i play frozen heart or pirate king instead of karrundax, that was my point. As a CW i can need more loots if i play karrundax or spellplague. That's basic maths and since most bosses only have 3 different loots (not including the set items), there is no way everyone can profit as much as some classes do in specific dungeons.
That's why i think being able to need everything should help fixing this issue.
I can still move.
I can still fight.
I will never give up!
funny, in my experience, rolling need on everything was a sign of a ninja looter that deservedly would get kicked from dang near any group, raid, and guild I've ever been in. if you're getting that stuff to sell, that is, by definition, a greed roll. you roll need on that, then I either kick or tell the group you need a new healer, because I'm leaving. Granted, that last argument is not as effective in this game as it is in a lot of other games, but it's still my history and stance.
That being said, what I think personally is a great idea (which has met with some success in some games) would be that if everyone can roll need on everything, then rolling need and winning automatically bound the item to the character. reduces ninjaing and makes need and greed rolls more often truly reflect needs and greeds.
I used to make ~10-12k AD per day per character at 60, I have 4 60's almost 5. I can now easily hit the refine cap with all 60's just from prayer/leadership pvp daily and nevermember daily. So with less work (and way less grind) I can get good AD without having to do things I don't want to do. Ie run 3 dungeons during DD time, which is different everyday so I have to be willing to sacrifice a random 1.5-2 hours straight.
Now I make ~100k AD a day by just doing what I enjoy, PvP.
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
Some people will still roll need, then they sit there with a purple they can salvage for 6-10k. it's not much, but it's all they can get with BoP. I think fallen's suggestion was better tbh, as people running t2's do it for profit, and when everyone can need, that's just fair.
Gaunt pvp was so fun prior to BoP patch, now it feels totally unrewarding and people afk there just to get the daily. Save up 45-75 grym coins for 6k salvage? Meh.
see, what makes that unfair to me is that not everybody runs for profit, some people are running to actually get that gear for that character. Those people, imo, are genuinely entitled to roll need for it. everyone else's profit concerns are, at best, secondary. hence the very reason the greed roll option exists in the first darn place.
why is profit really that big a deal, though? that's what I don't get. this is a game. play it to play it. if the only reason you play is to hoard money/ad/whatever, then you must not be enjoying the game for what it is and would probably be better off doing something else then coming back when you desire new, upgraded gear whenever that comes along.
I do agree with this, they effectively killed gaunt. I'm saving up neverember daily's until I have the pve pvp and dungeon, that's the only way participating is worthwhile =P
At least the GG items should have remained BoE, they completely killed their first content release lol.
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
Sigh, I'm not even gonna try.
I didn't think it was possible, but PvP and GG just became even less appealing.
Then allow me...
greed. pure and simple. if someone is running content that they neither "need" nor properly enjoy, because they can make money that is tied to a game, then they aren't here to play a game. The motivation for such might be different for different individuals. maybe it's just to see a really big number of AD/Zen. maybe it's because they want to acquire everything they possibly can at the expense of making it harder for some people to play (people that want to play the dungeons as designed and/or want to gear the old fashioned way). maybe it's just because they don't know what they want and greed feels like some kind of goal.
Don't get me wrong. Greed is not always a bad thing, and it's certainly not an insult. There are times where it works and is even necessary. It can sometimes be a motivator for good things. What bothers me is that it gets in the way of actually playing the game. Playing only for profit is not playing. it's working. If working is your goal, then there are more productive ways to do it, and those ways will probably even put more money in PWE's wallet.
So tell me, is there a good reason to keep playing/working this way? the answer to that is going to be different for different people.
The Tier 2 set pieces drop so infrequently it's understandable that people think they don't drop off the boss at all.
Perfect, and True.
You have your opinions, i have mine. Many people share my opinion and think it's ruining the game experience, and gives zero motivation for players. Gear has never been particularly hard to get, but enchantments are a pain in the *** to get. People who previously ran dungeons and worked their way towards enchantments, can't do it any more.
Just because you're OK with rank 5 enchants and no weapon/armor chants dosen't mean everyone else wanna give up on their goals without paying real money... And i think PWE's wallet is quite full already.
Up the cap on refining AD per day.
I'm not a huge fan of this idea anyway, printing more money doesn't make stuff cheaper, except some minor fees like transmutation, which is already very cheap.
This is not a surprise of course. I fully expected that when I saw the latest changes announced. I will only play this game for fun, I am not going to start grinding to improve my gear. So I will will run through the latest content, but I am not seeing much to keep me around at the moment. It seems to me that Neverwinter is turning into the type of game you have to play an awful lot if you want access to all areas of the game.
Yeah, that was the overwhelming majority vote, but they went the cash grab/AD limiting route instead.