Vote for BoP/BoE items!

zalcs

Do you like the recent BoP update, or do you hate it? Are you ok with the salvage option?

zalcs

Basically it's 1 and 2 vs 3 and 4

tharsoniusvb

I voted for "fine as it is" although it's a bit early to say. All i konow is, it was bad as it was before. Much to much loot, people got geared up way to fast and of course they got bored with no or hardly any goal to work for.
Since the patch i made plenty of ad from dungeon runs. 3 drops each time with a 20% chance is not so bad. And a T2 set piece sells now for a really nice price (sure, it's **** rare as it should be but when it drops it's awesome), also the epic items that sold for 1 or 2k before the patch are worth much more. So i have nothing to complain atm. I think many people just can't get over the fact that instead of making 5 million a week, they might only make 1 million. It's a bad world, i know. Stiff upper lip, folks.

zalcs

tharsoniusvb wrote: »

I voted for "fine as it is" although it's a bit early to say. All i konow is, it was bad as it was before. Much to much loot, people got geared up way to fast and of course they got bored with no or hardly any goal to work for.
Since the patch i made plenty of ad from dungeon runs. 3 drops each time with a 20% chance is not so bad. And a T2 set piece sells now for a really nice price (sure, it's **** rare as it should be but when it drops it's awesome), also the epic items that sold for 1 or 2k before the patch are worth much more. So i have nothing to complain atm. I think many people just can't get over the fact that instead of making 5 million a week, they might only make 1 million. It's a bad world, i know. Stiff upper lip, folks.

Perfect vorpal and soulforged is quite a goal that will keep you playing for like 5 years with the current system. A little on the long side imo, for being able to gear one character with BiS gear. But yeah, keep the discussion going!

goddessunique

I do like how these changes made every gear in ah almost quadruple in price but this will be hard for new players to buy. And I would like a new way to make ad and I like the idea of raids.

tharsoniusvb

Is there a reason you should get these perfect enchantments for free in just a short time? I think not. This is something you should work long and hard for (or pay). I mean, it's f2p but not f2p and be done in 2 weeks. And again, there are still good ways to make a nice amount of ad. If you have lots and lots of time and run many, many dungeons you will get the perfect wonder gear you dreamed of since you were little.
When it comes to armor and weapons, t2 (or cn) is endgame and it was a joke that i could by a full t2 set for my twink with the ad i made just from leveling to 60. Well maybe not quite, but you get my point.

zalcs

tharsoniusvb wrote: »

Is there a reason you should get these perfect enchantments for free in just a short time? I think not. This is something you should work long and hard for (or pay). I mean, it's f2p but not f2p and be done in 2 weeks. And again, there are still good ways to make a nice amount of ad. If you have lots and lots of time and run many, many dungeons you will get the perfect wonder gear you dreamed of since you were little.
When it comes to armor and weapons, t2 (or cn) is endgame and it was a joke that i could by a full t2 set for my twink with the ad i made just from leveling to 60. Well maybe not quite, but you get my point.

I agree t2 sets were too easy to get, i think they should put coal wards/possibly lesser enchantments in the dd chests (not BoP.) It would make them worth running again and again and make enchantments a lot easier to get, also they could lower the drop rate of t2 sets drastically, making it a small chance to get some delicous (BoE) t2's! This would make the set prices relatively high and everybody will be happy... i think

Also lower the cost for removing enchantments, making progression a lot more fun, and wouldn't force you to wait till you get enough for a greater one, to get the higher tiered one as fast as possible.

faeriestorm

I don't like BoP, I don't mind it for the DD chests though as long as need rolling is not restrictive to class. As it is not I see most players need if it is for their class even when they clearly do not need the item. They do it because they know (particularly if they are the only one of that class) that they have a better chance at loot (or guaranteed if only one of that class). I also do not like that the new dungeon has all it's loot as BoP. BoP from DD chest sure, provided those same items can drop off a boss as BoE and need rolling is not lock out if it is not your class.

trollgre

BoP (problem here is its hard to gear your other characters you need to start again from scratch making AD useless)
Prices from AH becomes higher = more profit? ( no, who will buy overpriced item ex 20kAD before now 200kAD+?)

BoP
gaunt now is like a ghost town noone go there anymore unless they havent tried gaunt set yet or doing quest

most $ spenders buy zen so they can buy their set at AH but with BoP supply is limited AH prices are all OP so they will think twice before buying zen for item

we dont need to vote they will see how it affects AH game and players

korgullte

The DD chest is not really a issue at all to me. The Malobog boss drops being BOP and the end boss dropping blues does suck I am fine with all the leadup bosses in every dungeon having a much higher chance to give a blue but the end boss should give epics. That is my only real gripe atm.

faeriestorm

korgullte wrote: »

The DD chest is not really a issue at all to me. The Malobog boss drops being BOP and the end boss dropping blues does suck I am fine with all the leadup bosses in every dungeon having a much higher chance to give a blue but the end boss should give epics. That is my only real gripe atm.

Mainly that and when an epic does drop for a class that there is only one of in a party that person need roles it even when they do not need it just because they know no one else can.

azlanfox

This is a difficult topic. There are so many facets to each camp with a lot of issues bouncing around among them.

It's hard to narrow down and categorize, but I can guarantee that the following are present:

1. There are those that feel 'entitled' to all things in the game be made easy for them to reach at whatever effort level they can put into it. Things need to be easier and not like real life.

2. There are those that truly feel a need to struggle for every little gain. You must give varying levels of work to gain anything, nothing worth while should ever come without effort.

3. There are those that believe only they are 'entitled' to the bling and the profits due to all the work they have put into it. They are special, a cut above the rest, not common like the rest of the people, and they must show that.

4. There are those that already have everything they could want and don't care about this. They just want some way to put it all to use.

5. There are those that already have everything they could want and want to make sure that everyone else has a hard time getting to where they are at so they can feel more special. It's a privilege not a right.

6. There are those that already have everything they could want and want to make sure that everyone else can have it too.

7. There are those that already have everything they could want and want to make sure that everyone else can have it too, but it has to COST.

8. There are those that are rich and bought everything they could ever want. They can fall into any other category as well, within reason.

9. There are those that are not wealthy, but choose to spend a lot on entertainment. They can fall into any other category as well, within reason.

10. There are those that are on tight budgets and try to limit their spending. They can fall into any other category as well, within reason.

11. There are those that are effectively poor and do not spend on this kind of thing. They can fall into any other category as well, within reason.

12. There are those that are personally poor, but others spend their money for them. They have more then their means should dictate. They can fall into any other category as well, within reason.

13. There are those that are rich, poor, high entertainment spenders, have everything they want bought for them, but won't spend a dime on this kind of thing. They can fall into any other category as well, within reason.

14. Among these categories there are those that covet what others have.

15. Among these categories there are those that are hypocrites.

16. Among these categories there are those that are truly genuine.

17. Among these categories there are those that falsely represent who they are or what they do. They aren't necessarily hypocrites, but they can be.

18. There are those that have done something, or violated something and not been caught.

19. There are those among these that are entirely selfish.

20. There are those among these that are entirely selfless.

21. There are those among these that are truly none of these.

So I ask you, how do you reconcile all of this? How do you make right something and please all of this?

Tough isn't it?

beckylunatic

I like how your signature answers the question of whether it's tough to resolve all those different desires.

azlanfox

beckylunatic wrote: »

I like how your signature answers the question of whether it's tough to resolve all those different desires.

Except my Wizo can only use ice... or else this would be rather simple.

rabbinicus

Let's add another option, do away with bound items entirely. Let people trade their items back and forth or use them them equip new characters on their account.

unksam

Guys use that head a bit,BOP is a s....,since queing for a dungeon takes like 30-40 min,the loot from the bosses is junk,except for the last boss that on many dungeons is an exageration in challenge because of the unlimited adds.At least in the old game u had the chance of gearing up at a decent level,now even if u dungeon like a madman u have low chances of geting some items good for ur class,even the last chest will reward u with a junkie ring or belt.Another major problem of this update is the game economy,it's simple ruined since this BOP,in the last weeks before this patch the game's economy was at a normal level,now it's imp not to see overprices for everything.

faeriestorm

rabbinicus wrote: »

Let's add another option, do away with bound items entirely. Let people trade their items back and forth or use them them equip new characters on their account.

This would be the best option, Bound loot is immensely annoying to begin with.

bootyjoos

azlanfox, really good post.

One good thing about bop that I haven't seen many people talk about is that it makes gear score more relevant. When you inspect a player, you can see by their gear that they have at least run X, Y, and/or Z dungeons successfully. When players can buy gear, you have no idea if any given player has even played endgame. However, it's a bit late for bop. Since we haven't had it for so long, we feel entitled to what we had.

Full disclosure: my friends with too much glory and too many drake seals gave me a full set of epics the moment I hit 60. However, they also carried me through dungeons until I stopped being terrible. Also I'm a cleric in this game where it's easy to blame other people for dying so long as I've been laying down my blue circles.

azlanfox

My current opinion in favor of BoP is based on a misplaced hope that those that took advantage of the cheap purples and those that exploited their way to level 7+ enchants will continue to be disappointed by the end game and eventually leave.

I originally, and vehemently, advocated an end of beta/pre-launch wipe of all accounts. Reseting the purchased packs back to the default 1mil and 600K AD levels with everyone else zeroed out. All the spend zen returned. All that exploited stuff gone, everyone starting roughly equal. The only advantage anyone should have coming out of beta over new players, except that which they spent real money on, is experience in the game. Just like every other MMO out there. The occasional thank you pack, title, or achievement is nice.

This did not happen and it exacerbates this rather hotly debated topic. It is only in my continued arrogant, self-righteous mind set that reminds me that everyone would be so much better off in the long run if they just listen to me and do what I say. :P

spellwarden

yea Azlanfox. I was right there with you after caturday. However, it seems that there has not been any positive changes to the game. Which is sad, but then again. I stopped playing a few months back, being disillusioned with the money-system, the exploits, and the general need for GRINDING.

It is at it's core, a fun and engaging game. Everything is really well done. True, some more boss mechanics, and less of a cake-walk towards the bosses, would have been nice. Perhaps some special dungeons that where more than just a different setting. But as far as that goes, the red-circle-dodge, and the team play required at end-game WAS fun.

Still, since they cannot get the F2P and Loot drop corrected. I think I will stay out for the time being.

Will check in again in 4 months.

diogene0

I wish we could need any non bound item, since there are dungeons with no specific loot for some classes. No CW loot in frozen heart for instance, so no incentive to do this dungeon, very rare cleric drops in karrundax (and only one, on the dragon), but a very common CW main hand, so all CWs want to do karrundax for the weapon and all DCs want to do frozen heart for the icon. That makes sense, of course, since most classes have a specific dungeon they should do with their class and it's never the same one. Making groups is a hell everyone wants to run the dungeon where they can need most of the stuff, and if you say no to exploits it's even harder now since everyone wants to do a different dungeon.

ambisinisterr

diogene0 wrote: »

No CW loot in frozen heart for instance, so no incentive to do this dungeon, very rare cleric drops in karrundax (and only one, on the dragon)

You're incorrect on this.

Frozen Heart Drops Tier 2 Boots (every class) and Karrundax Drops Tier 2 Gauntlets (every class).

There are exceptions in every dungeon but all loot which came from chests is also boss drops. The boss drops follow the information provided when you first enter the dungeon and as such every dungeon has a reason for every class to do the dungeon. There are excpetions, such as the Dragon Symbol which drops in Karrundax (I have gotten this drop at least four times off the dragon as a cleric) but the Tier items which set effects are unique and only "drop" in the dungeons which they are stated to in the dungeon descriptions.

spudvicious

Out of curiosity, how would people like it if, instead of being BoE or BoP, these items were bound to account. Cryptic uses account bound items commonly in other games, why not here?

I know this would not please the people that only want to make ridiculous amounts of AD from sales like they used to, but it would allow people to farm the items for alts. Might be an interesting compromise... for some people, anyway.

fallenhawk

rabbinicus wrote: »

Let's add another option, do away with bound items entirely. Let people trade their items back and forth or use them them equip new characters on their account.

Whoa dude that be the best and people could sell there epic trick out gear when batter gear comes out.It keep prices low on most gear and let people make back some if not all the AD they put in to their gear.

bubba1966

goddessunique wrote: »

I do like how these changes made every gear in ah almost quadruple in price but this will be hard for new players to buy.

And the irony is that those who can afford it, don't need it. I see a lot of it just sitting there on the AH not selling.

bubba1966

ambisinisterr wrote: »

You're incorrect on this.

Frozen Heart Drops Tier 2 Boots (every class) and Karrundax Drops Tier 2 Gauntlets (every class).

Afraid the post is, in fact, correct.

The post isn't talking about T2 set pieces. It's about the minor and final boss drops and how some dungeons are better for a specific class because that class can need on those drops while the other classes cannot. It's about how that is inherently unfair.

See, BoP, which you so ardently defend, has forced this kind of behaviour; players not running certain dungeons because they can't cant roll need on a majority of drops. Was never this way before, because a DD chest with a chance of salable Tiered item was sufficient reward.

vrtesseract

I think the salvage system makes it much harder for someone who has scrimped and saved to buy their first set of epics.

I think a better solution would be a general money changer npc who will exchange all currencies (except zen) into ad including event coins, lion tokens, if you want the price to seem more dynamic fluctuate it based on the zen exchange median

OR

for a more dynamic market add a few tabs or a drop down menu to the zen exchange for people to buy AND sell currencies

melodywhr

with BoP, this encourages players to grind for end-game gear but what happens when you get to end game? level 60s that still want to play and grind for better gear for alts or friends must depend on the single boss drop that you've got a 20% chance to get as long as no one slips in that "need" at the last minute. granted, with the addition of the new content, lord neverwinter's daily and the salvager, we all have more opportunity to make rough AD but the cap to refine stayed the same. if i'm doing leadership gigs and grinding all of the dailies, i will always hit that magical 24k limit. even though the reset time is 3AM PST every day, it's still a 24 hour cycle. i mean, if the limit was raised or if the cycle was shortened to maybe 6 hour increments it would at least compensate for the inability to auction off valuable epic gear. which, because of the now-less-frequent BoE drops, that gear has already gone up on the AH.

it would be nice if cryptic/pwe would address this.

zalcs

bubba1966 wrote: »

Afraid the post is, in fact, correct.

The post isn't talking about T2 set pieces. It's about the minor and final boss drops and how some dungeons are better for a specific class because that class can need on those drops while the other classes cannot. It's about how that is inherently unfair.

See, BoP, which you so ardently defend, has forced this kind of behaviour; players not running certain dungeons because they can't cant roll need on a majority of drops. Was never this way before, because a DD chest with a chance of salable Tiered item was sufficient reward.

Very true!

zalcs

vrtesseract wrote: »

I think the salvage system makes it much harder for someone who has scrimped and saved to buy their first set of epics.

I think a better solution would be a general money changer npc who will exchange all currencies (except zen) into ad including event coins, lion tokens, if you want the price to seem more dynamic fluctuate it based on the zen exchange median

OR

for a more dynamic market add a few tabs or a drop down menu to the zen exchange for people to buy AND sell currencies

Great idea, this game has wayyy too many currencies

diogene0

ambisinisterr wrote: »

You're incorrect on this.

Frozen Heart Drops Tier 2 Boots (every class) and Karrundax Drops Tier 2 Gauntlets (every class).

There are exceptions in every dungeon but all loot which came from chests is also boss drops. The boss drops follow the information provided when you first enter the dungeon and as such every dungeon has a reason for every class to do the dungeon. There are excpetions, such as the Dragon Symbol which drops in Karrundax (I have gotten this drop at least four times off the dragon as a cleric) but the Tier items which set effects are unique and only "drop" in the dungeons which they are stated to in the dungeon descriptions.

Yes, but i know that as a cleric i have more chance to be able to need more loots if i play frozen heart or pirate king instead of karrundax, that was my point. As a CW i can need more loots if i play karrundax or spellplague. That's basic maths and since most bosses only have 3 different loots (not including the set items), there is no way everyone can profit as much as some classes do in specific dungeons.

That's why i think being able to need everything should help fixing this issue.