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GWF is a dead class.
booyquake
Member Posts: 56 Arc User
Unstoppable was nerfed, and is now bugged. I am lucky if unstoppable lasts for more than 1.5 seconds. I am dying so fast in dungeons now.
We can't tank.
Our damage was terrible, it was nerfed further. I do even less damage now. Our AOE is capped at 5 units and our single target is abysmal.
We can't do damage.
Dracolich requires 3 CW's now in order to do the classic exploit pushing - no way a GWF is worth bringing (not that they were before).
We are useless.
P.S. I can't speak to the sentinel PVP changes - but I can say that I play with many high skill / maxed out gear friends who love to point out how easy it is to deal with those 'unkillable' GWF's that destroy pugs.
So I guess I'm giving it up. I see a lot of other GWF's leaving the game too.
Oh well.
We can't tank.
Our damage was terrible, it was nerfed further. I do even less damage now. Our AOE is capped at 5 units and our single target is abysmal.
We can't do damage.
Dracolich requires 3 CW's now in order to do the classic exploit pushing - no way a GWF is worth bringing (not that they were before).
We are useless.
P.S. I can't speak to the sentinel PVP changes - but I can say that I play with many high skill / maxed out gear friends who love to point out how easy it is to deal with those 'unkillable' GWF's that destroy pugs.
So I guess I'm giving it up. I see a lot of other GWF's leaving the game too.
Oh well.
Post edited by booyquake on
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Time to look for another game
its supposde to be the other way around, we are supposed to lose HP when unstoppable ends, not losing Unstoppable when Temp HP ends, even if i still have half bar of Determination left on it..
Fixing it will hardly help anyways. We are a dead class.
......
P.S. I can't speak to the sentinel PVP changes - but I can say that I play with many high skill / maxed out gear friends who love to point out how easy it is to deal with those 'unkillable' GWF's that destroy pugs.
.....
Basically that setup is a joke and just for destroying brainless pugs. You won't see that **** being in effective in real premade games. Its unbelievably easy to just ignore a GWF, and you can still be one shot by TRs and CWs.
GWF is dead.
1. Sent/Regens are still beasts. Took 3 of us in our premade to take one down last night.
2. Just ran MC with a DPS Destroyer GWF. He ranked top in damage.
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
PVE DPS - There is a really really high gap in skill between players in Neverwinter. When comparing damage and talking numbers, I am speaking about players at the high end of that skill gap. Those who have done their research, optimized their gear and feats and such.
That being said, grab a parser like ACT and compare GWF single target dps to that of a rogue, it generally shoud be around half (I've looked at this myself and discussed it with GWFs in some of the top guilds around the shards). Also compare GWF AOE to CW AOE, we are really hindered by the 5 unit cap, and a skilled CW can devastate the AOE dps.
PVP - I find it strange that any premade would struggle against post-patch GWFs considering Unstoppable is near useless due to the bug. However I did say that I can't really speak to those regen/teneb/hp stacking sent GWFs in PVP aside from what some of my top level pvp friends have told me (see the first post). I really believe the nerfs hurt PVE far more than PVP for us GWFs, because the real PVP issue seems to be how strong teneb/hp/regen stacking is, and the sent feats perhaps too. These issues weren't really addressed - probably because tenebs are a great money maker - or maybe for other reasons.
Btw u got to try fighting 2 good geared equipment opponent such as TR & CW b4 u shoot. U will eat your own words, trust me. Give you about 15secs, and bye. If is 3v1, you wouldnt last more than 10secs lol!
35 k hp 7 Greater Teneb's ..are you daft in real life or just trying to be funny.
With that kind of gear you would be op playing any class under almost any conditions.
Those that dont want to buy 10s of millions astrals to gear up but playing this game by gathering in an ordinary pace suffer from the last patchs nerfing/buggs to the gwf class.
Its rather amazing how some peeps say to all that dont like a broken class to adapt when they have gear that compensate it all.
Comments like -Oh you broke you legg, get a car- dont really help those with "normal" gear that are already struggles to get t2 groups in this situation.....
As it stands if you as a gwf have the same dps as rogues cw:s and gf:s in a dungeon run you either have better gear or they dont know how to play their classes period..
If they dont fix what was broken for gwfs in this patch the class is more or less dead as 99% of all comments here says.
(fyi i dont suffer myself that much as i mostly play the class for other reasons and are deacent enough geared but it dont meen i cant see facts for what they are.)
All in all i still love the GWF class i still do t2s and contribute to the group and have a blast. if you think this class is dead then either figure out how to fix in current state or if that is too hard for you then move along.
I used to have a guild like that but it fell aprt. And I was one of the top GWF in the guild. Moving from that I'm now in an uber elite guild that barely accepted me even though I out gear half of there CW's and TR's. I am one of 3 GWF's in the guild next to 20 CW's, 12 TR's 10 DC, and 8 GF's. Needless to say I rarely get to go to CN. This is a guild that runs 4 man CN and the only reason I'm in is I've proved I can be that 4th man. Now that my defenses have been nerfed I failed a Draco run wearing full Titan set and all my overkill tank gear. Guild considered removing me from guild. The only reason that has not yet happened is the uber 15k GS GWF is also having trouble with the draco run now.
My point is yes guilds can make GWF fun, but guilds dont last, players you used to play with quit and move on guilds fall apart it happens. And When that is gone, the entire weight of GWF hate lands on you and we all stumble and wonder if it's really worth it to keep playing. To try to build that good rep in a new guild... It took a long time just for the last one.
Talk about being cluess!!!
This thread has never been about what you are able to do in the right group with the right people.
I have no problem what so ever to play t1 or t2 and survive in the right group but after this patch i do it less good.
Since patch i lost about 20-30 % of my dps and tons of survivability and if gwf was the only class in this game it would matter less.
Maby you are willingly ignorant or just plain blind to the fact that alot of players get groups by LFG in open channels. You know the new lfg channel where lfg stands for LOOKING FOR GROUP.
That means that you compeate with the space of 5 players with other classes and guess what happens when your average performance is less then taking in some other class. YES BINGO you get less groups -DOH...
IF this is to understand i suggest YOU are the one to move along instead of post that is so obviously full of ignorance..
What kind of piece of <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> guild is that.
Removing there players because the are not of any use anymore especially because of a patch that basically ruined the gwf class.
They sound nothing more then a bunch of f*k*ing tools.
Tissue for you. I never know someone like you would care to be their tool for that long... Pm me their guild name, so i can avoid being 'used'..
If I am you, I will leave this guild immediately. This is not a job, it is a game. Your guildies are just cruel and cold and heartless; I wonder why you want to be in this 'ELITE' grp to prove yourself. The GWF class has some issue, both before and after the nerf. Due to the contents being what they are, we dont get to show off our skills in many grps. However, if you rely on slam for your main dps gain, too bad; however slam is about 15-20% of my total dmg in any dungeon run, the nerf amounts to about 10% less dps (60% of 15-20%), while it provides 15% lower dmg so that you can face tank and dps the adds for longer AND safer; it should make up for the 10% lost in dps in my opinion. For me, i have never finished any grp having lower than 2nd place in dmg, unless the cw / dc / gf insisted on we push all adds off ledge, and I just stand there watching. IF that is what you want to play, pushing ALL adds off ledge, your original slam dmg wont contribute much as well, so I really dont see the how it affects you. If the rest of the party even stand their ground and start fighting just a little bit, my dps will pull ahead, unless there is a uber geared TR around. BUT in that case, I will switch my role into more of an offtank and grabing aggro as much as I can and just face tank them (given that unstoppable is not freaking BUGGED).
On the other hand, the current BIGGEST problem with GWF is with the bug of unstoppable; when your temp hp is consumed, your unstoppable is gone. I wonder how if you are such a uber geared GWF player not having an issue with this bug and raise your voice to the devs. This bug has completely destroyed the GWF as even if you have full determination bar, and you tab it, you get knock back and out of unstoppable since the adds cc'ed you and dmg you for more than your temp hp. THIS IS THE ISSUE, NOT THE NERF TO SLAM.
p.s., Did I mention I would suggest you to leave your 'elite' guild, just to enjoy this game a bit more? Those 'elite' players are so good, i think they should keep to themselve and create their own game.
We pvp with my friend GWF after the update - i really own him.
So yea i guess class is dead for now. Atleast in pvp.
The sentinels die 50% faster then before.
But i guess its a matter of skill becouse its obvious the used encounter combos are for sure not working now.
Maybe they need to respec and re-adapt
Just coz your fotm solo spec got nerfed doesn't mean the class is dead. Sure there is the bug of Unstoppeble, but that will be fixed eventually. Try to make a more team oriented build that actually brings something to the team instead of just rushing to the far node and camp it. For PVE i havn't really noticed that much of a difference. But then again i havn't been Sentinel specced since the game came out of Beta. I used Sentiel build simply coz i didn't had the gear and survival to AoE groups of enemies without taking way to much dmg. When i did get the gear i respecced to Destroyer.
Not So Fast = 5.5% Regardless of targets hit: 0% on miss
Indomitable Battle Strike = 6.5% Regardless of targets hit: Bonus on a kill
Roar= 6.5% Regardless of targets hit: 0% on miss
Wicked Strike=1.5% per target: 0% on miss
Weapon master strike 1.5% per target: 0% on miss
So I can do a full encounter rotation and have less than 20% AP. Lowest cool down is Not So Fast at 9.9s with current recovery. The other two are over 10 seconds. For the following example I round all to 10s.
Using just encounters in the first rotation nets 20%. 10 seconds until next rotation.
Five full rotations to reach 100% for a daily. So in a perfect world and chaining encounters it would take the following time.
20% at 3 seconds
40% at 13 seconds
60% at 23 seconds
80% at 33 seconds
100% at 43 seconds for full AP.
Using just at-wills with ~1.5 second animation time and hitting 5 mobs would generate roughly 7.5%.
5 mobs hit: 100% / 7.5 =13.3
4 mobs hit: 100% /6% =16.6
3 mobs hit: 100% /4.5% =22.2
2 mobs hit: 100% /3% =33.3
1 mob hit :100% /1.5% = 66.6
So in a perfect world with mobs not moving and me not dodging red ground or mob hits nor missing the hits is as follows:
13.3 X 1.5 seconds = Hitting 5 mobs for 20 seconds for a daily.
16.6 X 1.5 seconds = Hitting 4 mobs for 24.9 seconds for a daily
22.2 X 1.5 seconds = Hitting 3 mobs for 33.3 seconds for a daily.
33.3X 1.5 seconds = Hitting 2 mobs for 49.9 seconds for a daily.
66.6X 1.5 seconds = Hitting 1 mobs for 99.9 seconds for a daily.
GWF is an AOE class. The less mobs on the board the less AP we regen. When there is more than 5 mobs on the board then we should be generating massive amounts of AP to deal with the large number of mobs. That was working as designed before the patch using our encounters. Now that they have removed AP generation regardless of mobs hit our AP generation has tanked which means less dailies meaning less DPS.
When there is only one mob it takes us longer generate full AP, after all we are an AOE class . Now we are stuck with the same constraint regardless of mob count.
I talked with other class members in the guild and they did tests to see how long it would take to generate AP.
The best was 9 seconds. Yes 9 seconds. From empty to full using encounters.
The worst was GWF as shown above.
GWF job is to take out the trash. Given the current state. You are better off taking ANY class that is NOT a GWF.
Nothing much to say here other than my PVE enjoyment was trying to keep #1 DPS against my guild which always depended on the dungeon. I normally finished in top 2 and lowest was 3. Now I am lucky to get 3rd and usually end up just above the DC.
Recap. AOE class no longer generates AP to handle large groups of mobs. Stuck generating AP against SINGLE target.
1. The age-old, known-since-beta, "toggle" that makes it unusable until map change. They said they fixed it in patch notes... but, as I found out from a PvP match earlier today, they HAVEN'T.
2. Duration ending when Temp. Hit points get consumed. But you already know that.
3. Duration is also lowered when you use skills that generate Determination (like Roar) during Unstoppable. Like 2), this was spotted during test realms. Unlike 2), this one was addressed on the forums and allegedly 'fixed'. Well, it hasn't been, either. Just try it on dummies and you'll see yourself de-hulked either BEFORE the bar runs out, orBOTH the upper and lower halves of the bar emptying out at the SAME time, as it happened to me multiple times while bashing away on dummies.
+ - + - +
On the other hand:
- Punishing Charge seems unaffected by the changes that plague other skills, 3.3% per mob hit.
- With Unstoppable so crippled atm, Daring Shout appears like a good thing to have. With Foresight, Astral Shield and/or Hallowed Grounds, mitigation hard cap can be easily reached.
Woah, woah, woah.. this was spotted before the patch went live and the developers still did nothing? Are they lazy as hell or simply just dont care if their game fails?
Yep!
Was reported and a developer came back about 3 days before the patch, saying it was confirmed and they were looking into getting it fixed.
You can tell you saying absurdly untrue statements are you not, and then that that therefore may just severely warp ones judgment towards agreeing with you on any one point of topic that you've purported to be true.
~~~~> I usually solo pvp Queue for Domination. By almost always i mean I solo join Hotenow just under 100% of the time...
Up until a day or so ago I was spec'd SM/Destroyer. And though I did notice I had gotten nerfed, I could still decimate enemies often, in a mere 2-3 seconds. Perhaps each time they were low GS and or low skill. I don't know. But what I do know, from my personal experience is that even though I was not dropping as many opponents as I had been, and that I had lost a seemingly immense amount of survivability, I was still succeeding often in pvp/cap situations. Even the other day winning a 1v2 fight that a third enemy jumped into as I was finishing off the 2nd one as they ran from me - and had a third enemy attack me at home point having res-ed. And I, while having low hp, killed them with (if i am not mistaken) 2 Encounters. One which took them to under 1/2 hp, and easily killing them with the second/and or the At-Wills i started to throw. My point being. I felt/feel like we HAD to be nerfed. I literally would stop and tell people I just destroyed super fast "sorry", because I felt GWF was so OP and imbalanced. (or at least was able to be). Now I feel way more challenged. And I do not feel bad when I drop someone. I feel like I earned it. But tbh I am not sure Ill ever finish my last 3 i need for the PVP Objective of 40/40, currently 37/40 Triple Kills...lol...think I only went from 36/40 to 37/40 in over 2 weeks time. :P
Maybe they went to far. Reduced damage too much. But for you to say we can not tank or do damage is completely ridiculous.
I just changed my build back to IV and Sent. instead of the Destroyer Tree. And as far as the PVE goes I noticed right away that I do much lower damage, but its steady damage, BUT I am way more resilient and able to stay in the fights longer (against Mobs as well as 2 or 3 Player opponents.)
Hope you do not retort with negativity saying that I basically should have understood you were generalizing. That I shouldnt take you so literal. Because well, if our language is so capable descriptively speaking, should not we realize that if we forget it's worth and value we may, just sadly enough if we abuse or lose respect for it and the words we use to communicate with to others - may just be lost to us down the road hampering the effectiveness when others are speaking to us. Like you, and now, as far as your foot and standing on it next to your points...
...LLLoooLLL... I just seen you also stated "We are useless." o0 Bit dramatic much? =D
Good Day.