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Why did you nerf me?

bardstale001bardstale001 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 18
edited June 2013 in The Temple
I'm sure there is 1000's of these threads lately and I hate reading them too. But damnn it I really had to communicate my distaste and frustration with this horrible new batch of changes; I am/was a paying customer after all.

At least for us Clerics, I can't speak for the other classes this was big stab in the back.
First you drop like 5 seconds from our best skill (for us healer spec anyhow), then this new reduced respawn timer
thing probably sucks even worst.

Look most will agree we are mainly a support class and most of us spend more time what is like a job trying to keep everyone alive in dungeon raids and PVP; often a "thankless" job.
Furthermore, lets face it a lot of PUG groups have no clue; don't think/know to control aggro, etc.
I have to spam pots a lot to just stay alive, and overall we are probably going to die more often then
most. The level 60 pots and kits are not cheap and have to work at making enough gold to keep ahead.
Now with this nerf you (the developer, designer, et al) make the chances of dying at least twice or more over.
Before this patch (happened 6-13-2013) there was much better chance you'ed be just go unconscious.
I understand you (the developer) need to make money and apparently this is some sort of push to get people to buy res scrolls but now it's beyond reason.

Unlike a lot of people that haven't exchanged yet, I did!
I paid a fair amount and probably would have more. Why would you do this to me?

This patch was a big F'you to us Clerics in particular and as a paying customer.
You are no doubt going to see a lot less of us Clerics in the game as it just got a lot less funner.
It's as if you want us to all roll TRs which seem to be somewhere around 3 out of 5 already.
I'd rather not play at all then be forced to make a class change just because of nerfs and rash design changes.

Finally insult to injury, these changes really question our builds. You should have been given us a free respec in consideration.

Here, right back at you with a big F'you too by not supporting/buying anymore, at least not for the foreseeable future.
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • jaymadiv#8056 jaymadiv Member Posts: 423 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    just to nitpick...everyone DID get a free respec.
    image
  • oxiactionoxiaction Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 55
    edited June 2013
    I have to agree. Just buff the other heal abillities!!!

    Bastion of Health: reduce CD by ~5 seconds
    Healing Word: More recovery -> faster recharges
    Self Heal reduce: Down from 40% to 30%

    And here you go. With this 3 changes, most of the clerics would be happy
  • cuteschmooplescuteschmooples Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 20 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Or better, stop/reduce the the ultimate dungeon Boss skill: Infinite MOB Spam. I don't think clerics will have much trouble after that. Heck, anyone for that matter.
  • spani4rdspani4rd Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 297 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    oxiaction wrote: »
    I have to agree. Just buff the other heal abillities!!!

    Bastion of Health: reduce CD by ~5 seconds
    Healing Word: More recovery -> faster recharges
    Self Heal reduce: Down from 40% to 30%

    And here you go. With this 3 changes, most of the clerics would be happy

    Healing Word is not affected by recovery, even post patch
  • oxiactionoxiaction Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 55
    edited June 2013
    spani4rd wrote: »
    Healing Word is not affected by recovery, even post patch
    but thats what I want to happen.
    U didnt unterstand what I meant ;)

    I mean that Healing Word SHOULD be affected by Recovery
  • kevinf08kevinf08 Member Posts: 432 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    The fact that some are viewing the cleric changes as a nerf just goes to show how broken astral shield was.

    Astral Seal: The healing from this power no longer tapers off more quickly than expected.
    Divine Armor: This power will now consistently affect all party members and the caster's own summoned Companion.
    Divine Glow: Now has separate target limits for allies and enemies, rather than a shared total.
    Guardian of Faith: This power now properly heals players when the target is killed.
    Prophectic Action: Now correctly reduces its cooldown by 10 seconds per rank.
    Hammer of Fate: The control immunity aspect of this power now lasts a consistent length of time.
    Prophecy of Doom: Adding ranks to this power no longer causes the Divine version to increase the target’s defense rather than reduce it.
    Punishing Light: The damage from this power now scales based on player level.
    Soothing Light: The healing from this power now scales based on player level.
    Feat: Focused Poise: The damage increase from this power has been improved.
    Feat: Focused Poise: This feat now also increases Divine Power generated by Lance of Faith.
    Feat: Second Sight: This power now correctly heals party members for 5% of the damage dealt per rank, up from 2%.

    Yeah cleanse was kind of nerfed too, but really cleansing rez sickness had to go, either that or just remove rez sickness entirely because it really did not impact the game aside from people saying "cleanse plz" at the campfire.
  • morsitansmorsitans Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 1,284 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    I like how you've deleted all the other nerfs and stuff from that list, like all the non-stacking spells, ethereal boon being halved, etc. Nice balanced reporting.

    Even then, that list is pretty terrible. I mean, soothing and punishing light have been buffed and yet are STILL TERRIBLE, whereas astral shield has been ruinously nerfed and yet is STILL THE BEST SKILL WE HAVE.

    The DC has serious issues, but making AS worse simply highlights them more.
  • ausdoerrtausdoerrt Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Or better, stop/reduce the the ultimate dungeon Boss skill: Infinite MOB Spam. I don't think clerics will have much trouble after that. Heck, anyone for that matter.

    Well, they HAVE significantly nerfed the amount of mobs at bosses - not sure if all, but those that were excessive for sure.
  • gtxinsanegtxinsane Member Posts: 116 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    kevinf08 wrote: »
    The fact that some are viewing the cleric changes as a nerf just goes to show how broken astral shield was.

    Astral Seal: The healing from this power no longer tapers off more quickly than expected. --- FIX
    Divine Armor: This power will now consistently affect all party members and the caster's own summoned Companion. --- FIX
    Divine Glow: Now has separate target limits for allies and enemies, rather than a shared total. --- FIX
    Guardian of Faith: This power now properly heals players when the target is killed. --- FIX
    Prophectic Action: Now correctly reduces its cooldown by 10 seconds per rank. --- FIX
    Hammer of Fate: The control immunity aspect of this power now lasts a consistent length of time. --- BUFF, for PvP, where we suck more now.
    Prophecy of Doom: Adding ranks to this power no longer causes the Divine version to increase the target --- FIX
    Punishing Light: The damage from this power now scales based on player level. --- BUFF, by a paltry 10%, still a waste of divinity
    Soothing Light: The healing from this power now scales based on player level. --- Refer to Punishing Light
    Feat: Focused Poise: The damage increase from this power has been improved. --- BUFF, +1% per level (2/4/6/8/10), still very deep in the virtuous line (which sucks)
    Feat: Focused Poise: This feat now also increases Divine Power generated by Lance of Faith. --- BUFF, but Sacred Flame produces more DP/time unfeated
    Feat: Second Sight: This power now correctly heals party members for 5% of the damage dealt per rank, up from 2%.
    --- FIX

    Yeah cleanse was kind of nerfed too, but really cleansing rez sickness had to go, either that or just remove rez sickness entirely because it really did not impact the game aside from people saying "cleanse plz" at the campfire.


    Try again.
    Gabriel Angelfire - Devoted Cleric // Karguk the Impaler - Great Weapon Fighter // Zephalyne - Control Wizard
    PVP: How to make your life less miserable as a Devoted Clerics -- Still in it's Unfinished Glory
    Dragon
  • piixiivpiixiiv Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Haa I like these threads. I have no isseus in PvE and PvP. L2p and adapt lol. Healing is boring now with this patch.
  • ausdoerrtausdoerrt Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    gtxinsane wrote: »
    Try again.

    What gives? Both AS so-called "nerfs" are actually fixes too. In fact, it's mostly fixes. Kthxbye.
  • morsitansmorsitans Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 1,284 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    I don't get that mindset at all. Whether it's listed as a "balance change" or a "fix" or whatever, it's still a change, in a negative direction.

    If you were suddenly told by your employer that you were now going to earn $200 less a month, but they explained

    "it's not a pay cut, it turns out you actually shouldn't've been getting that much money anyway! So we're actually fixing your wages! You should be thanking us, really."

    you would probably still feel pretty aggrieved, because 'fix' or not, that's still 200 fewer dollars every month.
  • kevinf08kevinf08 Member Posts: 432 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    morsitans wrote: »
    I like how you've deleted all the other nerfs and stuff from that list, like all the non-stacking spells, ethereal boon being halved, etc. Nice balanced reporting.

    Even then, that list is pretty terrible. I mean, soothing and punishing light have been buffed and yet are STILL TERRIBLE, whereas astral shield has been ruinously nerfed and yet is STILL THE BEST SKILL WE HAVE.

    The DC has serious issues, but making AS worse simply highlights them more.

    I didn't include the nerfs because i was pointing out that some skills were buffed, as opposed to waht the title claims.

    Soothing light is awesome, you people need to l2p tbh.
  • kevinf08kevinf08 Member Posts: 432 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    gtxinsane wrote: »
    Try again.

    You list some of my quotes as being fixes, yet the reason astral shield is much weaker now is because it was fixed lol. WEll unless you wheelchaired around with double AS.

    try again.
  • sefarisonsefarison Member Posts: 8 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    kevinf08 wrote: »
    Soothing light is awesome, you people need to l2p tbh.

    0/10 please put some effort in



    So they fixed a bunch of skills to work as intended, but now you are forced to use the same 3 or 4 encounters (AS, Sun Burst and either FF or HW), so those fancy new skills and feats are pointless.

    Instead of a support class that can heal and buff/debuff, we are now relegated to healbot, and not a very good one at that.
  • datemperdatemper Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 210 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    I'm sure there is 1000's of these threads lately and I hate reading them too. But damnn it I really had to communicate my distaste and frustration with this horrible new batch of changes; I am/was a paying customer after all.

    At least for us Clerics, I can't speak for the other classes this was big stab in the back.
    First you drop like 5 seconds from our best skill (for us healer spec anyhow), then this new reduced respawn timer
    thing probably sucks even worst.

    Look most will agree we are mainly a support class and most of us spend more time what is like a job trying to keep everyone alive in dungeon raids and PVP; often a "thankless" job.
    Furthermore, lets face it a lot of PUG groups have no clue; don't think/know to control aggro, etc.
    I have to spam pots a lot to just stay alive, and overall we are probably going to die more often then
    most. The level 60 pots and kits are not cheap and have to work at making enough gold to keep ahead.
    Now with this nerf you (the developer, designer, et al) make the chances of dying at least twice or more over.
    Before this patch (happened 6-13-2013) there was much better chance you'ed be just go unconscious.
    I understand you (the developer) need to make money and apparently this is some sort of push to get people to buy res scrolls but now it's beyond reason.

    Unlike a lot of people that haven't exchanged yet, I did!
    I paid a fair amount and probably would have more. Why would you do this to me?

    This patch was a big F'you to us Clerics in particular and as a paying customer.
    You are no doubt going to see a lot less of us Clerics in the game as it just got a lot less funner.
    It's as if you want us to all roll TRs which seem to be somewhere around 3 out of 5 already.
    I'd rather not play at all then be forced to make a class change just because of nerfs and rash design changes.

    Finally insult to injury, these changes really question our builds. You should have been given us a free respec in consideration.

    Here, right back at you with a big F'you too by not supporting/buying anymore, at least not for the foreseeable future.

    You can't speak for other classes ..... you also don't speak for other clerics,beside the ones that hold your viewpoint and visibly support you on the forum.

    I'm still playing,still supporting and still buying.

    Thanks for YOUR input tho.
  • mumnochmumnoch Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 51
    edited June 2013
    The only people are those few (like 3 people right?) who enjoy playing a 1 dimensional healbot. This patch made it easier for them, now they don't have to think about what 3 encounters to have on their bar as the decision has been made for them.

    Dev's you can get rid of all the rest of the cleric's powers, they will never see the light of day again on a solo-healing cleric.
  • gtxinsanegtxinsane Member Posts: 116 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    L
    ausdoerrt wrote: »
    What gives? Both AS so-called "nerfs" are actually fixes too. In fact, it's mostly fixes. Kthxbye.

    I worked with the list he gave me. Kthxbye.
    kevinf08 wrote: »
    You list some of my quotes as being fixes, yet the reason astral shield is much weaker now is because it was fixed lol. WEll unless you wheelchaired around with double AS.

    try again.

    I quoted you directly and pointed out what your so called "buffs" were. It wasn't about Ashield to begin with. I was nit picking.

    Learn2context.
    Gabriel Angelfire - Devoted Cleric // Karguk the Impaler - Great Weapon Fighter // Zephalyne - Control Wizard
    PVP: How to make your life less miserable as a Devoted Clerics -- Still in it's Unfinished Glory
    Dragon
  • khatzhaskhatzhas Member Posts: 268 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    gtxinsane wrote: »
    Try again.
    Have soothing/punishing light really only improved by 10%?
  • akula69akula69 Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    kevinf08 wrote: »
    Soothing light is awesome, you people need to l2p tbh.

    Oh man. Now I know your just full of sheet. LOL.
  • datemperdatemper Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 210 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    mumnoch wrote: »
    The only people are those few (like 3 people right?) who enjoy playing a 1 dimensional healbot. This patch made it easier for them, now they don't have to think about what 3 encounters to have on their bar as the decision has been made for them.

    Dev's you can get rid of all the rest of the cleric's powers, they will never see the light of day again on a solo-healing cleric.


    Interested where you crunched that 3 people number from.

    Like high end gameplay required thinking of what went on your encounters pre patch ?

    I'm not gonna advocate pre patch was better than post patch or vice versa.What I am hopefull of is that these changes are leading to something better all round for everyone.
  • vmlinuxvmlinux Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    The only mindless play pre-patch was the double stacking, which everyone and I mean EVERYONE agreed was bugged. But instead of just fixing the bug, they decided to make the cleric into a worthless piece of trash healbot. Some people love that though, those are the same people in everquest that didn't load up stuns, roots, and whatnot, and just loaded heals from top to bottom of their spell list. There has never in any game that I can think been a cleric that heals so <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> poorly that they can't load up any skill that deviates from healing.

    I don't know why those people even bother playing unless they just like a chat system with glittery spells attached.
  • troodeetroodee Member Posts: 38
    edited June 2013
    oxiaction wrote: »
    I have to agree. Just buff the other heal abillities!!!

    Bastion of Health: reduce CD by ~5 seconds
    Healing Word: More recovery -> faster recharges
    Self Heal reduce: Down from 40% to 30%

    And here you go. With this 3 changes, most of the clerics would be happy

    Completely second this. And maybe some useful divine power at wills :)
    We are not designed to outheal stupidity!
  • munkey81munkey81 Member Posts: 1,322 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    morsitans wrote: »
    I like how you've deleted all the other nerfs and stuff from that list, like all the non-stacking spells, ethereal boon being halved, etc. Nice balanced reporting.

    Even then, that list is pretty terrible. I mean, soothing and punishing light have been buffed and yet are STILL TERRIBLE, whereas astral shield has been ruinously nerfed and yet is STILL THE BEST SKILL WE HAVE.

    The DC has serious issues, but making AS worse simply highlights them more.

    I never had to run 2 DC's to clear CN before the patch, and I don't have to now. In fact, I changed my build after the patch, now I heal for more then I ever did before.

    The DC class is excellent in pve, and pvp. If they ever remove rightouesness, I will be utterly unstoppable in pvp. As it stands right now, most people end up running away from me anyway cuz they cant take me down.

    You guys need to try some new builds, I love my cleric more then I did before =)
  • nallifnallif Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Wait, you play a healer in an MMO and you *aren't* a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>?

    p.s. You forgot "slap in the face."
  • sh4dowrunn3rsh4dowrunn3r Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    If they ever remove rightouesness, I will be utterly unstoppable in pvp. As it stands right now, most people end up running away from me anyway cuz they cant take me down.
    ofc you outheal incoming damage and break all chain perma stuns and no one can stop you , true story :D
    if you do it with premade in all t2 vs green geared pugs then congrats :D
    even if righteouness gave +40 % bonus instead of penalty incoming damage would still allow 1-3 shots while in standing in AS... cause we dont' have any burst heal so there is no way to mitigate burst damage incoming at you for 20k - 40k in zero time while your heals tick for a few hundred HP... hell even with burst heals you can't burst heal anything if you are stuned and dead in 2 secs.

    I also do good in PvP sometimes depends on enemy team. Ocasionally I come even first place... and get lots of kills. But when you are facing any decent enemy that is running teneb stacking and stuns you're just dead.
  • munkey81munkey81 Member Posts: 1,322 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    ofc you outheal incoming damage and break all chain perma stuns and no one can stop you , true story :D
    if you do it with premade in all t2 vs green geared pugs then congrats :D
    even if righteouness gave +40 % bonus instead of penalty incoming damage would still allow 1-3 shots while in standing in AS... cause we dont' have any burst heal so there is no way to mitigate burst damage incoming at you for 20k - 40k in zero time while your heals tick for a few hundred HP... hell even with burst heals you can't burst heal anything if you are stuned and dead in 2 secs.

    I also do good in PvP sometimes depends on enemy team. Ocasionally I come even first place... and get lots of kills. But when you are facing any decent enemy that is running teneb stacking and stuns you're just dead.

    I pug all my PvP, never do any premades. No one can stop, being owned in PvP. It happens, to some more then others. Not sure what build you have, but I absolutely can heal "burst" dmg you call, 40k? lol of course not, being chain stunned? Nope, not much you can do there until/if they ever introduce DR in PvP. As a cleric its obvious you are going to be focused if you are facing any decent team. I am having a lot of success with the build I'm using, I use it for PvE and PvP, veeeeerry hard to kill, and huuuuuge burst heals, love this build. I posted a link to my build on the cleric forums, you should check it out if you looking for something "else".

    I am generally always fighting in the middle of the pack, and on the pillar. Soothing light >DV-Healing Word > Norm Sunburst . Is a ridiculous burst in heals, I've healed over 30k to "myself" with that rotation, in a packed crowd, depending on how long I use SL. That, coupled with Seals on enemies, even stunned, I can heal through tons of dmg and cc's. I'll put a normal AS down in a big fight, it helps, but it isn't this builds crutch.

    Love the build, check it out
  • vampiregoatvampiregoat Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    I notice ALLOT of bosses can mass summon mobs fast and spam their abilities so fast that NONE of my characters have it easy.
  • wholyhandgrenadewholyhandgrenade Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    all the cleric received were nerfs, but the biggest insult of all was the idea that since the cleric was to be nerfed into uselessness that all the tanking type classes get bolstered so they don't need the clerics
  • wholyhandgrenadewholyhandgrenade Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    kevinf08 wrote: »
    You list some of my quotes as being fixes, yet the reason astral shield is much weaker now is because it was fixed lol. WEll unless you wheelchaired around with double AS.

    try again.

    AS was never broken until they nerfed it, now one of my clerics doesn't even use it.
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