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Team work > The Nerf.
silence1k1ll
Member Posts: 148 Bounty Hunter
I am red, the rogue. My friend is blue, the Cleric. He followed the team and kept us up, as is his job. I used my big bad daily twice both matches, his twice as well... if you honestly think that the patch on the 20th is going to be game changing, I suggest you do the mathematics of your skill tree a bit better ( Except you poor tanks and GW fighters... guys, I really hope you get the love you so deserve ).
The point of this post is not really about the nerf though... my friend worked his *** off to keep us up, and with the coming patch not only will good Clerics like him get completed back of the bussed in PvP, but honestly the drop in willing Clerics is going to be so drastic there will be no point in playing anything but PvE. Which I suppose is fine, I've nothing against PvE, but my staying reason is PvP.
If you don't give your healers points for doing their jobs... they'll quit. A simple bachelors in business could teach you that.
( This is in regards to assist points given to damagers instead of healers. )
The point of this post is not really about the nerf though... my friend worked his *** off to keep us up, and with the coming patch not only will good Clerics like him get completed back of the bussed in PvP, but honestly the drop in willing Clerics is going to be so drastic there will be no point in playing anything but PvE. Which I suppose is fine, I've nothing against PvE, but my staying reason is PvP.
If you don't give your healers points for doing their jobs... they'll quit. A simple bachelors in business could teach you that.
( This is in regards to assist points given to damagers instead of healers. )
I ENJOY PLAYING NWO
Post edited by silence1k1ll on
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I have a 60 DC, and personally I don't see what the problem is.
The ONLY heals a DC has that don't actually do any damage are...
Astral Shield (Encounter) - Great Spell, can't argue against it in any way.
Healing Word (Encounter) - Complete HAMSTER Heal, and with 3 charges it's worthless in an extended fight.
Bastion of Health (Encounter) - Long cool down makes it worthless in pvp for the amount it heals in my opinion.
Hallowed Ground (Daily) - It only heals if you feat for it, but it also reduces damage to your allies and increases damage they deal. Great daily in any scenario.
Of those 4, only 2 of them are worth anything in pvp.
Forgemaster's Flame (Encounter)- Great ability for PvP. It snares, does damage, and if you Divinity it...it heals for quite a bit.
Sun Burst (Encounter) - AoE Damage, AoE heal, and if you Divinity it...it heals for more and knocks enemies back.
Astral Seal (At Will) - It's an At Will that does damage when you use it and grants healing to anyone who attack that target. Should be cast on every enemy near you in my opinion.
The ONLY difference in the two scenarios (pre patch, post patch) is that the easiest way to avoid dieing which is running in a circle jumping up and down so that you are always going out of reach of the melee classes is no longer viable because you actually need to stop and cast something other then astral shield.
In all reality, a DC that isn't using abilities that deal some sort of damage isn't doing their job because they aren't applying Astral Seal, Forgemaster's Flame, or Sun Burst. A DC that doesn't deal damage is one who is not applying Astral Seal, using the worst heals in the game (aside from Astral Shield), and not applying the damage buffs/debuffs or CC that the class is capable of.
Less winning a blue item and more the psychology of "winning". But yes, bingo.
Clerics keep me alive, they need to be visually rewarded for what they do.
( At least give a "Healing" column. )
What discrepancies?
If I deal damage, but don't get the killing blow on my GWF...I get assist points, not kill points. 50 points per kill 25 per assist.
If my tank spec'd GF (no, he's not the 15k power dps GF) spends the entire game CC'ing TR's and CW's off our squishies, but don't actually land a killing blow I get assist points, not kill points.
The DC is at no disadvantage anyone else doesn't share. If you don't get the killing blow, it's 25 points...the only difference is, you actually have to participate in the fight now, you can't drop an astral shield or throw out a healing word then run to another point or hide behind a corner and passively gain credit for assists.
And yup, just tested it myself, currently if you don't land the killing blow as a DC...you don't get points for a kill, only points for the assist.
So, my argument still stands. For a DC actively participating in the fight and not just simply dropping an Astral Shield...nothing will change.
I figured you were a moron when I had to point out what the OP was actually referring to, but your reply only confirms it. I would like to see you as a heal spec'd DC participate in the fight while healing and keeping your party alive and get more points then a competent CW or TR that are travelling point to point with you.
Besides the fact that the point system is HAMSTER anyways and the people worried about it much the same. It's f#$king random blue trash for #1. But it doesn't change the fact that xippin your argument has no relevance towards the OP, since a actual decent healing DC will be wasting ability slots, daily's, cast times, and cool downs on healing/survival abilities that lower his chances of getting death blows. (Which also give bonus points for point defense..etc) Therefore lowering his overall points score by only receiving assists points.
By xippin's logic DC's need to all go DPS and "participate in the fight". Hold on let me check... yup still think you're a moron.
that`s what you`re saying, because that scorelist is just about getting a green or blue, nothing else.
let`s quit the game for an occasionally 10/30 silver reward ;p
Maybe you're not getting it. There are only FOUR...yes, you saw it right...FOUR heals that the DC has that do not inherently deal damage. Of those FOUR heals, only TWO are worth slotting at all at 60. One being a daily, one being an encounter. That means that any decent DC still has 2 Encounter, 1 Daily and 2 At Wills that will deal damage putting them in the exact same position post patch, that they were in pre patch.
If you had even a basic understanding of the DC's abilities you would understand what i'm telling you. I kept it very civil, but since you want to refer to me as a moron without actually having the slightest inkling of what you are talking about, civility is no longer necessary.
A Healing spec'd DC's Healing word...sucks...period. It's absolutely useless in pvp as it heals for less then half of the damage of 1 hit over a 10 SECOND period of time. Not only that, it only has 3 charges and the charges refresh every 15 seconds.
A Healing spec'd DC's Bastion of Health...sucks...period. It will heal for less then half of the damage of 1 hit and it's on a 19 second cooldown.
Astral Shield and Hallowed Ground are the ONLY two not damage dealing heals a DC has that are worth slotting in pvp. Hallowed Ground being a daily, and Astral shield being 1 encounter ability, leaving 2 encounters free for him to use. Maybe you missed the memo, but DC's are not just healers in an Action based game, they are mitigation/cc support characters that happen to have heals.
Get with the program nub.
And -I- have a near BiS cleric (only missing ancient offhand).
Yes, I fully understand that DC's deal horrible damage. That is not the issue in question. The Nerf that everyone seems to think is going to make people not play DC's is that they don't receive assist credit for only healing, which they shouldn't. Their role is not to heal, their role is a support (Healing, CC, Buffing, Debuffing, and Damage). The game is lightly based on DnD, in which clerics are front line fighters that happen to have heals, not healers that happen to have damage. NWO follows the same concept, DC's are not just healers, they are support characters that happen to have heals.
My tank spec'd guardian doesn't getting killing blows, neither does my DC. But I still contribute to the win which ultimately gives me more glory then having a lot of killing blows and losing. The only difference is the blue or green item that you get for a high score, which is trivial since purple items are in excessive abundance at level 60.
And just as a side note, I do agree that the point system should be removed as it discredits anyone not built to dps. I am not supporting the point system, I'm simply advocating that getting credit for assists without actually fighting is not the correct approach either. Getting credit for healing instead of dealing damage means I can run over and throw a Bastion of Health onto a fight then run and hide but I would still get credit for every kill their even though I marginally participated, when I could have been CC'ing/Debuffing the enemy or buffing my allies damage etc.
As opposed to tagging any target with an at will once and then running and hiding then receiving credit? The issue of whether you believe some of the healing abilities provide horrible healing, is not the issue. Much the same as the dmg dealing of DC's is horrible and not the issue. Deal horrible dmg or deal horrible healing. You keep saying the role of the cleric is not to heal but yet you include it in the description of support. I understand your point of view and we disagree on whether healing is considered "participating in a fight" but agree that the point system is HAMSTER. gg
And in theory, this could make DC's get more points that the killers. 4 teammates are hitting one opponent each, getting 50 points per kill. Should the DC have a seal on every one of those 4, that's a total of 100 points assist. Right?
you wake up too, it`s a rogue with personal healer ;p
all depends on spec/gear.
they can do just as many dmg as any other class.
too bad a lot of people don`t get this and go spam everywhere what`s op or not.
blue belt - offensive slot
Nothing more to add here .
Not exactly true.. Look my screenshot.
DC's can actually win blue items, no problem with that. It's the bs that I do 90% dmg to someone's HP and than a TR kills him. He get's the kill while I spended a Daily etc. -.- CW also does such tricks also.
But healing + killing is very possible with a DC.
(this is lvl 60 btw)
I found out that teamwork is the key, at least 1 DC for the AS and than you can beat everyone without having good gear. I losed from ppl big time while I "HAMSTER" them the round before, stay together so you have that combat advantage (and not against you) and to help each other.
in the case of them being together all the time which you say is it their weakness, just take the other 2 spots.
and if they run off together take the other 2 which they re not going, simple ;p
So where's my full plate, my kite shield, my hammer of utter pwnage, and my stacking self buffs?