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Here's some feedback on the last boss on Wolf Den.
diggot
Member Posts: 40 Arc User
You devs can take all those adds and constant spamm of AoE's and shove them
where the sun never shines. We had a team running the entire dungeon without
much problem, and then STONEWALLED on the final boss.
Adds adds adds AoE AoE adds adds AoE adds...
Is this the only way you can create hard-to-kill bosses?, by making an army of
adds coming out of nowhere, and also making the event spamm AoEs everywhere...
where the sun never shines. We had a team running the entire dungeon without
much problem, and then STONEWALLED on the final boss.
Adds adds adds AoE AoE adds adds AoE adds...
Is this the only way you can create hard-to-kill bosses?, by making an army of
adds coming out of nowhere, and also making the event spamm AoEs everywhere...
Post edited by diggot on
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As fun as I think this game is, their boss designs blow.
If my DM kept spawning creatures instead of making a boss that could present a challenge without the need to keep fighting minions, I'd end up punching him in the mouth.
I am in a holding pattern, logging in to evoke and doing my trade skills until the fix cleric/ GF threat or learn how to tune an encounter without using the spawn_random_enemy button.
Liberated Borg -Captain USS Solstice
Member of Starfleet Borg Task Force - Tactical Unit
Then I decided to do some research.
Seems the adds only spawn when the bosses melee attack hits someone, at which point two wolves spawn per person hit. I guess the strategy is to have a GF who is quick on his toes tank the boss and for everyone else to be pretty much constantly moving about to avoid his aoe attacks.
I haven't actually gone back to try this out, but it might be worth a shot if you've got an organized group you can run with.
"Hah! You are doomed! You're only armed with that pathetic excuse for a musical instrument!!!" *the Savage Beast moments before Lonnehart the Bard used music to soothe him... then beat him to death with his Fat Lute*
And now people are whining about the one boss that doesn't spawn a ridiculous amount of adds and requires good reactions, smart movement, and knowledge of her mechanics to beat.
Is there no pleasing you people? What's your ideal boss fight, a boss from Super Mario?
^^^ This ^^^.
I actually respected their design a lot more when I learned this. Just wish there was a better indicator in the game so people realized.
That would actually be awesome if done right. Add some mystical stones that you have to attune to or you get one shotted, keep people on their toes.
Make them elemental. The boss begins to summon a water attack, you have to attune to fire to counteract it.
Liberated Borg -Captain USS Solstice
Member of Starfleet Borg Task Force - Tactical Unit
Pretty much this.
Boss encounters should be more boss focused.
Hah, first time I did the boss for Dread Vault, when the whole floor turned red I thought that's exactly what they were doing.
And how on earth is a PuG group supposed to work this out at the time? Does the boss offer any clues? Do the wolves burst out of people's chests as they are hit?
It's not even as though the mechanic makes much sense, unless perhaps the boss gets an emote like:
"ahhhh... my magic sword draws the lifeforce from you so that I may summon more wolves!!!! Each time I hit you I get stronger!!!! MUwahahahah!!!"
I have to admit, I agree with this. As a result of the abysmal encounter in the Wolf's Den, I'm pretty much just holding those quests until I out level and can solo them. Or they fix them. Or, eventually, probably just toss them and forget about them all together.
Sorry to say it (since I know it is a common theme today), but when I think of a heroic boss encounter, I just don't think of "so you think you can dance" as what it should be like.
Recurring waves of adds make sense for a mage boss or even a necromantic one, but even here, there should be limits. Recurrent adds plus massive AoE plus the need to dodge every 2-3 seconds is just.... well, ludicrous, frankly.
I'd much prefer seeing boss encounters that require team work rather than forcing players to essentially forgo teamwork in the name of dance or die. This is especially overt in relation to the issue with effective hate table management.
In fairness, it makes a certain sense for melee to need to pay attention to positioning (i.e., combat advantage, etc) and for ranged to do the same... AT RANGE... but the idea that a boss can toss an AoE that covers so much of an area that you can't possibly dodge OR that any melee hit spawns adds on top of everything else is... well, see above.
For the person trolling about whiners... my idea of a good boss fight is one where you can actually deduce what is being required without dying 20+ times; specifically, a fight in which mechanics are introduced and then, accelerated over duration (as opposed to being dropped on you in such a manner that the only way you can figure it out is to die repeatedly to it).
If I wanted to spend hours at a go trying to get a single instance completed or a single boss defeated, I'd still be running 90+ man EQ 1 raids. The notion that a balanced group with tank, healer, and dps at level consistently cannot defeat this encounter tells its own story and no, it's not that silly, elitist "lrn2play" <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>, either.
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Its all the boss fights are....Its much harder to manage the adds then anything else....Cryptics always been rather clueless. Oh, wait, the boss is down to 75...here come the adds.....50, adds, 25, adds...5 is the last add rush.
****ing yawn..
Long story short: Fix fighters. -.-
When the advice is that everyone keeps moving, it really means everyone. Also, not 100% on this, but I think he gets wolves if he smacks your companion, so it is easier to just dismiss them. The only mobs that should hit anyone repeatedly is the archers and they have <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> for life, so it's not much of an issue.
Boss is easy. Like above stay away from his swing. And yes Melee adds do create wolves all should have out is heal or wiz pets
Then you get to boss mob and you get a few adds...ok, ok. We're fine. They die, back to boss, dodge an AoE. Ok, ok, we're fine. Kill adds, dodge a few more AoE's. Ok, we're.....HOLY FYACKING SHARTBALLS ON A SHISH-KA-BOB SKEWER BATMAN!!!!!!!! It goes from challenge to way out of the park difficult when you have 2 stormcallers, enforcers and shadow wolves in addition to trying to dodge AE's that you can barely see because the two stormcallers have crossed streams while the adds are playing the cleric like a pair of Japanese kettle drums. And you have 0.00000000000025 secs to respond if you DO see the Boss' AE as even the slightest amount of lag, which has been prevalent in the game since the last two recent patches have rendered lag and reaction times to a fraction of what they were.....
...And you have the most insane encounter of all time.
At lease with the Mad Dragon, each and every boss is hard and overloaded with adds and is difficult from beginning to end, but not so with Grey Wolf Den.
I'm sorry you DEVs think this is fun, but you are out of your flipping minds.
Why don't you simply get better gear and improve your tactics? It isn't that hard, you know.
Well here is clearly a problem... NEVER cross the streams.
Ah no, I have nothing really super relevant to post here excepting that yes, we need more creative mechanics.
Don't get hit by the hands that come up from the ground and you wont spawn shadow wolves. Those shadow wolves are the ones that will kill you.
And don't miss your dodge/dash.
Easy.
Actually its not the hands that spawn the adds, its his sword attack. It's two adds per person hit by his frontal AOE sword attack. This includes companions, so use a ranged one or dismiss them.
The boss is simply too hard for randoms, the boss requires a few wipes for everyone to get the hang of it, but after a couple of wipes, everyone gets bored/tired/etc and leaves. This is a boss designed for a group of people who know each other, speak on mic, and are prepared to practice the hell out of it until they get it right.
I have never run this dungeon with anyone I knew. Only pugs via the dungeon queue. Never wiped on the boss. I didn't even know how his add spawn mechanic worked until this thread. So knowledge of it obviously isn't that important.
this
I had problems with wolf den mostly because elite adds showed up and went berserk at cleric and it seems like GF don't have any skills to take aggro on himself (DC goes down and after him GF also CW would most probably fail if we had one). Only 3 of TR were left and after 3 tries we managed to kill boss/adds with tactical approach (bait & swith, stealth and another skill name I don't remember helped a lot).
GF just needs skills that would prevent team (and mostly DC) from being pwned by adds
PS Wolf Den boss itself is pretty easy but thoose adds...
Actually the hands only do damage, it the melee hits that spawn shadow wolfs (2 per player hit), since u get prone long enough for boss to melee u , people assume its the hands.
That boss is super easy, u need to just kite, a direct approach will end in wipe like 90%, if u have a CW it needs to get near the boss pull him back then if u have rogues or another DC/CW use max range to hit, while at the same time having reflexes to avoid its pounce/hands since it will pounce back and forth, after a while the kiter will need help to get the adds of him, kill adds, win.
Not a quick fight since u cant exploit like bugging the mobs or standing on the edge of a ship.
Also the kiter needs to use quick cast spell like weaken ray or ice chill, any other spell will most likely end up on getting hit by melee.
I dont understand what the fuzz is about '-.- (normal GWD btw not epic if that exist's not lvl 60 yet
My advice for dungeons is always , make ure own group, check everybody is social, and everybody wants boss dead 100%...
.then roll on
It might be tied to their level meaning they've not done higher places or the fact that the adds hit for a good deal more than the boss himself.
Got my PVP set, all is well for normal PVE content now.
Lol I love this encounter, one of my favorite bosses so far. Maybe you should try different builds and strategies before you slam the game. Funny enough, this boss is a bit different than the ones before it, so naturally that'd cause some difficulty on the first try.
A little secret: groups wipe when they are inflexible and unable to cooperate properly. Run this with a good group and feel the difference. Just because you successfully zerged the rest of the dungeon, doesn't mean your group was any good.