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Guardian fighters need a look at in pvp (toned down)

ryzzhanryzzhan Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 5 Arc User
edited May 2013 in PvE Discussion
i really do feel they are way overpowerd for pvp as things are now. they can block damage from EVERYONE for a long time. charge attack you (so you cant really escape). they still manage to do a lot of dmg in pvp while not taking a lot. and more fragile classes like the wizard and the rogues cant really do much about it. any attempt to cc them is just blocked. which is royal bs. and this is not just one match that i am complainng about it's been the last 4 days i've been pvp'ing that this annoyance has been getting a bit much.

someone REALLY needs to look at this.
Post edited by ryzzhan on
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Comments

  • grzmot33kgrzmot33k Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    and more fragile classes like the wizard and the rogues cant really do much about it.

    dude, rogue jump behind GF and crit him with his daily for...100k...done to me few times.

    rogue got op cloud / cw op with his grips+daily dmg, if he caught you you are done for.

    GF dont have a dmg to do so...he can only live longer, no 1 shooting anyone.

    No dodge, no range multi-shot skill to throw some1 out of mount
  • renokyozumirenokyozumi Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    grzmot33k wrote: »
    dude, rogue jump behind GF and crit him with his daily for...100k...done to me few times.

    rogue got op cloud / cw op with his grips+daily dmg, if he caught you you are done for.

    GF dont have a dmg to do so...he can only live longer, no 1 shooting anyone.

    No dodge, no range multi-shot skill to throw some1 out of mount

    I dont think you have ever fought against a well specced GF ever. GFs are capable of one shotting anything other then a DC / another GF.

    Their weakness lies in fighting against packs. 1v1 they are pretty much beasts.

    (I play GF)
  • orangerascalorangerascal Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    grzmot33k wrote: »
    dude, rogue jump behind GF and crit him with his daily for...100k...done to me few times.

    rogue got op cloud / cw op with his grips+daily dmg, if he caught you you are done for.

    GF dont have a dmg to do so...he can only live longer, no 1 shooting anyone.

    No dodge, no range multi-shot skill to throw some1 out of mount

    Rogues daily deals damage based on the amount of HP the target has. So getting 1 shotted by daily is impossible. Care to add more misinformation to prove you really don't know what you're talking about?
  • tenkurotenkuro Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    grzmot33k wrote: »
    dude, rogue jump behind GF and crit him with his daily for...100k...done to me few times.

    rogue got op cloud / cw op with his grips+daily dmg, if he caught you you are done for.

    GF dont have a dmg to do so...he can only live longer, no 1 shooting anyone.

    No dodge, no range multi-shot skill to throw some1 out of mount

    Yeah, you're dumb, so dumb. You had less than 5% HP left and the rogue comes behind you and uses the daily to kill steal and you see 100k damage and you automatically assume he would do that amount of damage to you when you're at full HP. Why don't you go play a rogue and get it to 60 and try to solo a GF. I guarantee you won't win any of them if you're both starting at full hp.
  • yasha00yasha00 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 479 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    GF are beasts in pvp that's for sure, but please don't nerf because I want to roll one next. I like the idea of being a nigh unstoppable, super-mobile, hard hitting juggernaut of death.
  • opm49602opm49602 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    yasha00 wrote: »
    GF are beasts in pvp that's for sure, but please don't nerf because I want to roll one next. I like the idea of being a nigh unstoppable, super-mobile, hard hitting juggernaut of death.

    Don't nerf me I want to be OP!!!
  • vaichanavaichana Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 91
    edited May 2013
    You can't block a CW strangle-lift-Sith thing. Block meter goes away awfully fast vs any decently specced rogue with the ranged daggers alone. GF can't oneshot anyone, they can 2-shot you if they use Knight's Challenge (which means they will deal AND take double damage against you. So you can 2 shot them too if you are anyway competent in your class), rogues are actually better tanks than DPS-y GF with Impossible to Catch alone. I have been oneshotted by Lightning Execution at 75% hps plenty of times by geared rogues. A good CW can lift a GF in the air and kill it before it even expire, and the GF can't do **** about it. If you are a good CW, TR, or GWF you can outplay and beat a GF. If you just stand around spamming your at wills you obviously will die against any decently played GF, but I am pretty sure your problem stands behind the monitor and the chair.
    Stop saying that GF are OP, they aren't any more OP than wizards, rogues, GWF or clerics. I find PvP rather balanced, the only things that need addressing are mounts and some kind of reduction on CC duration.
  • opm49602opm49602 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    vaichana wrote: »
    You can't block a CW strangle-lift-Sith thing.

    Mine gets blocked all the time. :(
    vaichana wrote: »
    Block meter goes away awfully fast vs any decently specced rogue with the ranged daggers alone.

    Don't waste your block on stupid things like at-wills. Save it for things that need blocking like CC.

    Good gf are amazing in pvp. 90% of gf are pretty HAMSTER poor at their class.
  • yasha00yasha00 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 479 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    vaichana wrote: »
    You can't block a CW strangle-lift-Sith thing. Block meter goes away awfully fast vs any decently specced rogue with the ranged daggers alone. GF can't oneshot anyone, they can 2-shot you if they use Knight's Challenge (which means they will deal AND take double damage against you. So you can 2 shot them too if you are anyway competent in your class), rogues are actually better tanks than DPS-y GF with Impossible to Catch alone. I have been oneshotted by Lightning Execution at 75% hps plenty of times by geared rogues. A good CW can lift a GF in the air and kill it before it even expire, and the GF can't do **** about it. If you are a good CW, TR, or GWF you can outplay and beat a GF. If you just stand around spamming your at wills you obviously will die against any decently played GF, but I am pretty sure your problem stands behind the monitor and the chair.
    Stop saying that GF are OP, they aren't any more OP than wizards, rogues, GWF or clerics. I find PvP rather balanced, the only things that need addressing are mounts and some kind of reduction on CC duration.

    I think I need to work on my sith powers because GFs block my CW's entangling force. If I do manage to get around their blocks and dodge the torrent of knockdowns I certainly don't do enough damage to kill one in the space of one entangling force.

    I would agree that the classes are mostly balanced though.
  • vaichanavaichana Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 91
    edited May 2013
    Good -insert random class- are amazing in pvp. Not just GF.
    As for the blocking, I am pretty sure you can't block that CW cc, unless you need to be in a really weird position to do so. I never managed to.
  • sdneversdnever Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 116 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    I'm a rogue and have a heck of a hard time trying to kill a GF, even with my team there. But I don't think they should be nerfed at all. The PvP arena is capturing points, where the guys with the most defense are going to be Overpowered.

    So yes if enemy has more GFs they will probably win. That is as it should be.

    The only counter I've found is to ignore GFs and get the other nodes. Just hope the GF doesn't follow you around.
    Or another counter would be to queue up with a GF yourself.


    Just because they are overpowered in domination does not mean they will be overpowered in every type of PvP.
  • kevlairkevlair Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 12 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    As a GF I can tell you that the class seems pretty close to being balanced against the others. In most cases, I find that people just do dumb things that get themselves killed and have little or no concept of basic strategy. A good rogue will take me down quick once my my guard meter is down. However, if I get a good Griffon's Wrath on them...they are freaking done for. I can basically go toe to toe with just about anyone, which quite honestly is as it should be for all classes.

    If I come across another GF, more often than not I will avoid the time consuming fight...since after all the point is to capture the points and win. The few attacks that I have that cause players to go prone or even momentarily dazed are absolute must haves. Too many freaking roges rolling away from me...COME FIGHT!
    Caslav Macenvanje
    Guardian Fighter
  • kevlairkevlair Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 12 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    sdnever wrote: »
    The only counter I've found is to ignore GFs and get the other nodes. Just hope the GF doesn't follow you around.
    Or another counter would be to queue up with a GF yourself.


    Just because they are overpowered in domination does not mean they will be overpowered in every type of PvP.

    Amen brother. I can't tell you how much of a pain in the *** I can be to the oppossing team. More often than not it takes 3 or 4 enemies to bring me down once I turtle up. Which if my teammates are smart....they should be capturing the other points! FFS I can't tell you how often I sit there getting beat upon and wondering wtf the rest of the team is up to when the entire opposing group is on me.
    Caslav Macenvanje
    Guardian Fighter
  • infraynorrinfraynorr Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    There's so many ways to counter GF's it's just about learning the classes.
  • majtrollxmajtrollx Member Posts: 76
    edited May 2013
    I bet people here complaining about rouges are pretty bad in PvP. If you can't see a rouge near you, you shouldn't PvP at all. This being said, GFs shouldn't get nerfed, that's stupid. If you're blowing everything on a GF guarding head on expecting to kill them, then you're really stupid and shouldn't PvP.
  • zingarbagezingarbage Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    By far the two most populous classes in PvP are CW and TR. The GF in 1v1s are fairly good against them. These nerf threads are to be expected..
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • infraynorrinfraynorr Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    majtrollx wrote: »
    I bet people here complaining about rouges are pretty bad in PvP. If you can't see a rouge near you, you shouldn't PvP at all. This being said, GFs shouldn't get nerfed, that's stupid. If you're blowing everything on a GF guarding head on expecting to kill them, then you're really stupid and shouldn't PvP.
    The **** is a rouge?
  • soanvalckesoanvalcke Member Posts: 30 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Two GFs can hold a point indefinitely if they work together to systematically take down one target at a time. Balanced is balanced.
  • skarrotskarrot Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 11 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Here we go!! Childy **** plaiers never die! GF is op! OP what? I'm lvl 42 with over 9k glory and i never see a decent GF! I just see ppl take a lot of dmg in a point. I sacrifice def and deflect for power and crit to made me "offensive" just to do 1.8 2k crit when class like rogue made crit for 3.4 3.8k cleric make daily crit for 5k CW made dot crit for 2.5k with ****load of skill during choke per 2+k crit so what the **** in op? GF make crit like every other class but is really hard to kill for the "guard meter" but it end! shield gonna broke and GF can't dodge or stealth when shield is down. I think some child cry for Anwill of Doom instakill but anyway u have to take the target at 15-10% hp to make 4-5k crit with it (ofc i'm talking about dmg of my lvl 30-39 pvp map atm i never do pvp 40-49) so OP of what? Stop cry and think about this.....
  • tarlockentarlocken Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    soanvalcke wrote: »
    Two GFs can hold a point indefinitely if they work together to systematically take down one target at a time. Balanced is balanced.
    You say that as if there is an epidemic of two man guardian teams watching each others back, focusing down single targets and coordinating their knockbacks to keep the node in their favor. What you describe is called teamwork.
  • snapybsnapyb Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 32
    edited May 2013
    lol gfs can be op when played by people who know how to use their class but this goes for every player and class so will you post and say trourges r op wen they manage to one shot u ? or wen a gwf manages to beat you in a 1v1 ? no pvp yes does have certain problems with skills one shottbut majority of is its balanced when things get blocked your not timing things right if you see a gf blocking why go for him? switch targets when you realize he inst pay attention strangle him its simple pvp tactics like ive played rouges who blow all their cds wen i have my block up and after i just unload and their either dead or run i have played smart rouges who are patient who wait for my block to go down or by using certain skills kiting and what not to get rid of my block meter then they unleash their dps its all simple stuff just needa practice
  • dominemesisdominemesis Member Posts: 269 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Hmm classes may be pretty well balanced, I've now seen posts asking for nerfs to every class in the game. Just wait when they release Ranger, Barbarian, Warlock, Druid, Sorcerer, Paladin, Bard, and/or Warlord...they'll melt people's faces off for weeks before anyone figures out how to counter them, and the cries for nerfs will rock the boards once again lol.
    The Inn of the Lucky Dragonfly - NW-DFIM545CN
  • parvuslacertusparvuslacertus Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    The only thing that may seem OP is that with my 60 GF I can keep a single target on the ground for a few seconds, although unless I'm really lucky I can't usually finish off someone in that period, nevermind actually getting in the needed position versus ranged classes. Also, GF is pretty useless without support, so great teamwork is needed. The fact that someone doesn't know how to handle other classes doesn't mean they're OP.
  • mutelunaticmutelunatic Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    skarrot wrote: »
    Here we go!! Childy **** plaiers never die! GF is op! OP what? I'm lvl 42 with over 9k glory and i never see a decent GF! I just see ppl take a lot of dmg in a point. I sacrifice def and deflect for power and crit to made me "offensive" just to do 1.8 2k crit when class like rogue made crit for 3.4 3.8k cleric make daily crit for 5k CW made dot crit for 2.5k with ****load of skill during choke per 2+k crit so what the **** in op? GF make crit like every other class but is really hard to kill for the "guard meter" but it end! shield gonna broke and GF can't dodge or stealth when shield is down. I think some child cry for Anwill of Doom instakill but anyway u have to take the target at 15-10% hp to make 4-5k crit with it (ofc i'm talking about dmg of my lvl 30-39 pvp map atm i never do pvp 40-49) so OP of what? Stop cry and think about this.....

    Lol try again this time typing with your elbows we might then be able to make some sense of what you are actually trying to get across.
  • cronis10000cronis10000 Member Posts: 79 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    GF is definitely bad a s s and I do think my GF is a tough pvp class. Like the other post said. Groups destroy me with little problem. 2 cw's and im hooped. I use my powers just like a rogue and try to be situational and catch a target off guard when possible.
  • dr3adz0rdr3adz0r Member Posts: 6 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    "Scissors are fine, plz nerf Paper" -Rock
  • klixanklixan Member Posts: 447 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    I don't have a problem with balancing classes for PvP. But please, keep PvP skills and PvE skills separate!

    If they start nerfing classes for PvP balance, this will seriously mess up PvE players. I can't tell you the number of games I've quit, all because a so-called 'balance' nerf for PvP ruined a class for PvE.
  • joukuoj32joukuoj32 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    PVP balance is funny thing.

    With my GF(1vs1) i killed some CW, TR really fast(was suprise how fast they died), but some TR, CW killed me in few secs too.
    GF, DC is mostly waste of time 1vs1(its about who team m8 come first).
    Didnt have many 1vs1 with GWF so dont know about them.

    Are GFs too strong 1vs1 in PVP? Against CW and TR which know they classes NO.
  • faine4444faine4444 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Cry for me, Argentina.
    ryzzhan wrote: »
    i really do feel they are way overpowerd for pvp as things are now. they can block damage from EVERYONE for a long time. charge attack you (so you cant really escape). they still manage to do a lot of dmg in pvp while not taking a lot. and more fragile classes like the wizard and the rogues cant really do much about it. any attempt to cc them is just blocked. which is royal bs. and this is not just one match that i am complainng about it's been the last 4 days i've been pvp'ing that this annoyance has been getting a bit much.

    someone REALLY needs to look at this.
  • eros1986eros1986 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    mutelunatic wrote: »
    Lol try again this time typing with your elbows we might then be able to make some sense of what you are actually trying to get across.

    buahahahaha man n1
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