It's unfortunate that they are so obviously trying to gouge the player for everything. I'd have happily spent what I would normally spend on a sub game - 60 up front and 15 a month - in the cash shop if I was getting value for the money. As it stands, I feel like everything is just trying to rip me off, so the amount I'm willing to spend immediately drops to 0.
^ This exactly.
Its like every time I take my nephews and Mom to Sea World. We hydrate early and eat a big breakfast because we know we won't be spending a dime inside the park after paying a couple hundred on tickets and parking. Yes I could pay $35 for a disposable camera that sells for $5 at every gas station we passed on the way but I CHOOSE not too.
You do realise that it is a fail microtransaction model right?
Its better to gain 1euro from 90% of the playerbase with a lot of respecialisations (what mmorpg players do a lot in normal conditions), than get 10 euro per respecialisation from 0.1% once in a while...
Just think of what you are doing... Its like giving unpolished, 2nd grade mmorpg with most of its features disabled unless you pay 10 times more than for 1st grade subscription based game.
Fail.
who said they were doing micro-transactions?
that being said they shoould give a free respec every 15 levels for you to use, and then charge afterwards
It's unfortunate that they are so obviously trying to gouge the player for everything. I'd have happily spent what I would normally spend on a sub game - 60 up front and 15 a month - in the cash shop if I was getting value for the money. As it stands, I feel like everything is just trying to rip me off, so the amount I'm willing to spend immediately drops to 0.
This. I feel like the point of microtransactions is a bit here and there. Like you throw down $5 for a skin in league of legends or whatever. It's practically a donation at that point. Just a little something.
So you can spend $10-$20 a month and feel like it's "your subscription" for an MMO. But the cash shop isn't vanity stuff or whatever, it's a lot of other stuff that's overpriced and you can buy currency.. I don't like that at all.
Seems like it's ok to convert "AD" to "Zen" but the other way around lets you buy power. And they're selling it anyway. Nothing you can buy with CASH should affect your character beyond aesthetics- period. It shouldn't save you grind time, or give you stats or respeccs or anything. Riot does it right, Valve does it right. It's an established system so I'm surprised to see it so poorly managed here.
it's beta so maybe they'll fix it? (hah..) but people are already spending money so unless there's a wipe (and a zen refund for all the stuff people already bought) it's too late.
Honestly the threads are pointless.. Let them continue on thinking this revenue model will work. At 90 days when this game is a ghost town and they've lost that initial population surge (which most won't ever be recoverable) maybe they will wake up.
For now there is plenty other stuff to play while you wait to see the fate of this game. Try GW2. For $60 you can level to 80, have plenty of inventory space, 5 characters, have no trouble making money for gear/repsecs and essentially play for free for real. (minus the $60 for the game)
Honestly I'm not a big PVPer which is why I never tried GW2 until 2 weeks ago but I must say I'm hooked. I have more than enough to do and I haven't even been in a single PVP battle yet. I'm only 40% map complete right now, level 80, already have all rare gear and still loads and loads to do.
0
bzzzdMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
surprise, if you actually spend that amount you indeed get sth for it.
if you pay nothing, well... then you have to earn it ingame. just like you farm for something in another game.
we'll see you back here or in another game once you find out your options at 80 with 100% map completion. have fun getting that precursor.
Nah... have 3 other classes I wanna try... and 3 starting areas I haven't even touched yet. Several dungeons I haven't run. Plus its actual fun farming again in an MMO. I'm honestly having more fun now than I've had in the last several years and trying every fail game that's been released... and I haven't even cracked WVW which is the meat and potato's of the game.
Very high return on investment in that game.
Only way I'll do anything in this game again besides my daily login for 30 seconds and pray is if they fix the multitude of issues plaguing level 60 play right now.
Cryptic already has $250 of my money.. That is 1.5 years of uninhibited gameplay for a typical $15/mo MMO. This game technically isn't even released yet and already my play is inhibited by charges for re-specs or a companion that doesn't die in 20 seconds at level 60.
0
jubalehrleeMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 1Arc User
edited May 2013
from many of these replies i can see that the most people just don't get it. it's a fact that tinkering with your character is a huge facet of enjoyment and sustained patronage to online games. yes, it's an area where unscrupulous companies can financially exploit (for a time), but the point is how to exploit/capitalize on it without turning off the majority of your player base. if you follow GW2's model they genuinely never make you feel like you're being exploited. the things they charge for/and how much they charge seem reasonable to the majority of players. they even have people willing to throw money at them for MORE stuff to buy in the cash shop. this is an example of how to get the players to feel good about giving up their cash over the long haul. if GW2 had a Foundry system i'd venture i'd still be spending most of my time in that game.
What bothers me is that some of the feats don't actually work, as well as some of the passives aren't effecting all abilities they should and are generally buggy. That means that a build I had previously was not working for end-game dungeons. I had to do a full respec so that I could get some of the abilities I passed on. GG
from many of these replies i can see that the most people just don't get it. it's a fact that tinkering with your character is a huge facet of enjoyment and sustained patronage to online games. yes, it's an area where unscrupulous companies can financially exploit (for a time), but the point is how to exploit/capitalize on it without turning off the majority of your player base. if you follow GW2's model they genuinely never make you feel like you're being exploited. the things they charge for/and how much they charge seem reasonable to the majority of players. they even have people willing to throw money at them for MORE stuff to buy in the cash shop. this is an example of how to get the players to feel good about giving up their cash over the long haul. if GW2 had a Foundry system i'd venture i'd still be spending most of my time in that game.
This, somewhere in the middle of this game and GW2 is the sweet spot where an AMAZING MMO exists. This is amazing technically in it's gameplay but horrible in terms of monetization, GW2 is terrible in gameplay, but great in monetization and value.
Oh well, back to League of Legends/Path of Exile for most folks
0
terradraconisMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 17Arc User
What bothers me is that some of the feats don't actually work, as well as some of the passives aren't effecting all abilities they should and are generally buggy. That means that a build I had previously was not working for end-game dungeons. I had to do a full respec so that I could get some of the abilities I passed on. GG
So click the respec button on the Feat Tab and pay the Astral Diamond charge to respec your feats.
Several dungeons I haven't run. Plus its actual fun farming again in an MMO. I'm honestly having more fun now than I've had in the last several years and trying every fail game that's been released...
Only way I'll do anything in this game again besides my daily login for 30 seconds and pray is if they fix the multitude of issues plaguing level 60 play right now.
Cryptic already has $250 of my money.. That is 1.5 years of uninhibited gameplay for a typical $15/mo MMO. This game technically isn't even released yet and already my play is inhibited by charges for re-specs or a companion that doesn't die in 20 seconds at level 60.
I already did that in gw2, and I even was in the same state as you before I hit 80 - but leveling and levelcap are often 2 kinds of games (even if arena tries to tells you otherwise with their manifesto).
it's funny that you say you like farming in gw2 again, since I found it MUCH worse in gw2 than getting my AD here. heck, do they still have the anti-farm code in place?
but if you're still having fun in a few weeks, I'm happy for you.
from many of these replies i can see that the most people just don't get it. it's a fact that tinkering with your character is a huge facet of enjoyment and sustained patronage to online games. yes, it's an area where unscrupulous companies can financially exploit (for a time), but the point is how to exploit/capitalize on it without turning off the majority of your player base. if you follow GW2's model they genuinely never make you feel like you're being exploited. the things they charge for/and how much they charge seem reasonable to the majority of players. they even have people willing to throw money at them for MORE stuff to buy in the cash shop. this is an example of how to get the players to feel good about giving up their cash over the long haul. if GW2 had a Foundry system i'd venture i'd still be spending most of my time in that game.
what people don't get is that you can respec your feats for AD. everybody is up in arms about the FULL respec, ignoring that you hardly have to respec powers/ability score. and no game has free respecs.
gw2's system is just better hidden and/or people are just more easily satisfied. don't forget reality tv has a high number of viewers as well. and I'd be very cautious about the "majority" claim. plenty of people have already left gw2 behind (inb4 IT'S DYING!!1 - didn't say that), so there are plenty of people who didn't like either the game, it's shop or both. but as I said, if people are having fun in game X, good for them.
0
bzzzdMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
So click the respec button on the Feat Tab and pay the Astral Diamond charge to respec your feats.
Actually respect feats doesn't change the fact that I don't have the abilities that are implemented by my new feat tree. If you read what you just quoted you would noticed I said I didn't have the abilities, I put points into other abilities that worked for my build. This requires a full respec.
My personal feedback is that the current system that is used for respecing is one of the main reasons I was turned off by the game. At this time and age it is absolutely pathetic as a business practise, but since they can find people to support them then nobody can really blame them.
I mean this game is officially in Beta so people are supposed to try things out and the devs are expected that they will be changing things a lot, plus there will be bugs that won't be fixed until their number comes of the devs schedule. Even past the Beat stage, as a game that is both an MMO and an RPG, people will be trying different things out and the devs will be changing things a lot. Furthermore, no one spec can be good enough for PvE (solo and group) and PvP (solo and group) at the same time, in fact builds that can be amazing for one are terrible for the other and vice versa. So limiting this major aspect of gameplay with such a ridiculous system is unacceptable imo.
The game is supposed to be a Beta, if the game is a beta we are beta-testers, if we are beta-testers we are helping PW to correct and improve the product they are coding before it launchs, if we want to test to help PW to make a better product so they can get more money we must test especs meaning we need to change them, to change especs we must pay real money.
Yeah, no, does not compute.
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bzzzdMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
If something in Neverwinter game is not working correctly, it is a mistake from the employees that work to code Neverwinter game.
Duh!
I'm pretty sure you are not THAT dense.
ehrm, if "something" is not working, where are you forced to pay for it? we're talking about the respecs here. "duh". nice generalization tho.
so either suck it up and wait till the MINOR issue is fixed, use a workaround or farm/pay for a respec if you can't endure to play your completely broken character (because it must be broken, right? since it's so BAD you can't play anymore and HAVE to respec). everything else is up to the person who decided which point goes where.
cryptic has reworked whole systems in the past and gave out quite a few respecs along with it. pw might be greedy and cryptic a bit stupid considering what goes live, but they're not THAT stupid.
and before you call me a fanboy, there is plenty that pisses me off in the game, to a level I'd punch the person responsible in the d1ck - the respecs are minor in comparison.
ehrm, if "something" is not working, where are you forced to pay for it? we're talking about the respecs here. "duh". nice generalization tho.
so either suck it up and wait till the MINOR issue is fixed, use a workaround or farm/pay for a respec if you can't endure to play your completely broken character (because it must be broken, right? since it's so BAD you can't play anymore and HAVE to respec). everything else is up to the person who decided which point goes where.
cryptic has reworked whole systems in the past and gave out quite a few respecs along with it. pw might be greedy and cryptic a bit stupid considering what goes live, but they're not THAT stupid.
and before you call me a fanboy, there is plenty that pisses me off in the game, to a level I'd punch the person responsible in the d1ck - the respecs are minor in comparison.
I mean, atm - I'd rather watch HGTV with my wife than play. I cannot experiment they way i'd like to with a new game/character as I have been able to do so- within a days time or for no money at all in 5 other games, all of which are still alive in some form or another. The fact that people can so blindly banner themselves that "all's well with the respeccing is ludicrous."
Hmmm, good read though did not read 100% of the comments, it is clear this game is doomed to fail before it starts based on the microcharge system they feel is acceptable. I recently read a Forbes article describing the outdated system that WoW uses compared to current F2P game systems similar to this one, though you get nickle and dimed on wants such as name changes, server transfers and what not on WoW, your $15 a month covers all in game fees and now seems cheap all of a sudden...
In WoW you level your toon from 1 - 90 at the end of all that you realize okay ...that worked for questing but for something a bit more focused such as dungeons, raids or PvP those options are no longer of value. It is common to have 2 specs and in some classes; respec out of one to another almost daily.. for those defending this games policy, you might want to"insert foot in mouth" at this point and remain silent here afterwards. Even $1 per respec could easily be financial **** depending on certain classes.
I have found the inital quests to be engaging and interesting, I have yet to fully explore the game to be fair but the interface feels somewhat restrictive. The idea of spending money on end game content feels sneaky and manipulative...
RE:
PWE User
"their" mistakes? did a cryptic employee come to your house and force you at gunpoint not to put at least one point in a power?
but hey, if pointing that out makes someone a fanboy....
Either a fanboy or a misinformed/uneducated/inexeprienced player... pick one how can you not see that respeccing in this game will likely be common place?
"But it doesn't, that's what I'm saying - you have access to the entire game, all content, as much as you want, for free and you're complaining that you have to pay a small amount of money, to re-spec your character. It's not essential for you to re-spec, as much as you might like to think it is - so if you want to do it, pay.
I imagine most people would only ever need to re-spec once @ 60, if even that - if someone wants to constantly change up their build and don't want to roll alts, who's problem is that?"
is this ur first mmo? cause with what ur saying it seems like it. Not essential to re-spec?? are u for real ? the base to build ur class is to test everything and see what works best, and even then it changes accordingly with the situation, another lame fan boy...
I've played dozens of MMOs and I can't recall a time where it was necessary for me to re-spec, let alone multiple times - maybe you should think about the class you're playing and what role you want to fill, plan better and then you won't have this problem.
What do you do in game/MMO that doesn't allow for respec at all? Maybe Cryptic intended for player choice during character progression to have impact and decided that in NW a respec is a luxury item. I don't know, but I do know that kicking up such a fuss over having to pay a small amount of money for something in a free game that isn't essential is nonsense.
I mean, even if wow lost 1 million customers a year, it would still be around for 8 more years. EA is behind SWtOR has cash shop and sub options had hope - with the new movies in works - of getting new influxes of cash, and customers. The queues killed me on SWtOR, and those are actually better now. (they combined some servers) I played this morning for 2 hours. I also spent $40 on account wide unlocks in the past 2 months.
I've played dozens of MMOs and I can't recall a time where it was necessary for me to re-spec, let alone multiple times
I can't count the number of times I've respecced in both EQ2 & WoW, most of which came because various Talents or Achievements were changed significantly. In many cases, those respecs were provided for free -- in EQ2's case, this was even true after the game went F2P.
It's not always about "plan better."
Fare you well
Let your life proceed by its own designs
Nothing to tell
Let the words be yours, I'm done with mine ...
Comments
^ This exactly.
Its like every time I take my nephews and Mom to Sea World. We hydrate early and eat a big breakfast because we know we won't be spending a dime inside the park after paying a couple hundred on tickets and parking. Yes I could pay $35 for a disposable camera that sells for $5 at every gas station we passed on the way but I CHOOSE not too.
who said they were doing micro-transactions?
that being said they shoould give a free respec every 15 levels for you to use, and then charge afterwards
This. I feel like the point of microtransactions is a bit here and there. Like you throw down $5 for a skin in league of legends or whatever. It's practically a donation at that point. Just a little something.
So you can spend $10-$20 a month and feel like it's "your subscription" for an MMO. But the cash shop isn't vanity stuff or whatever, it's a lot of other stuff that's overpriced and you can buy currency.. I don't like that at all.
Seems like it's ok to convert "AD" to "Zen" but the other way around lets you buy power. And they're selling it anyway. Nothing you can buy with CASH should affect your character beyond aesthetics- period. It shouldn't save you grind time, or give you stats or respeccs or anything. Riot does it right, Valve does it right. It's an established system so I'm surprised to see it so poorly managed here.
it's beta so maybe they'll fix it? (hah..) but people are already spending money so unless there's a wipe (and a zen refund for all the stuff people already bought) it's too late.
Ummmm.... a storefront filled with single-time, small purchase items in an MMO that traditionally offered a subscription model.
That is a micro-transaction... the keyword being MICRO. DERP.
For now there is plenty other stuff to play while you wait to see the fate of this game. Try GW2. For $60 you can level to 80, have plenty of inventory space, 5 characters, have no trouble making money for gear/repsecs and essentially play for free for real. (minus the $60 for the game)
Honestly I'm not a big PVPer which is why I never tried GW2 until 2 weeks ago but I must say I'm hooked. I have more than enough to do and I haven't even been in a single PVP battle yet. I'm only 40% map complete right now, level 80, already have all rare gear and still loads and loads to do.
surprise, if you actually spend that amount you indeed get sth for it.
if you pay nothing, well... then you have to earn it ingame. just like you farm for something in another game.
we'll see you back here or in another game once you find out your options at 80 with 100% map completion. have fun getting that precursor.
Nah... have 3 other classes I wanna try... and 3 starting areas I haven't even touched yet. Several dungeons I haven't run. Plus its actual fun farming again in an MMO. I'm honestly having more fun now than I've had in the last several years and trying every fail game that's been released... and I haven't even cracked WVW which is the meat and potato's of the game.
Very high return on investment in that game.
Only way I'll do anything in this game again besides my daily login for 30 seconds and pray is if they fix the multitude of issues plaguing level 60 play right now.
Cryptic already has $250 of my money.. That is 1.5 years of uninhibited gameplay for a typical $15/mo MMO. This game technically isn't even released yet and already my play is inhibited by charges for re-specs or a companion that doesn't die in 20 seconds at level 60.
This, somewhere in the middle of this game and GW2 is the sweet spot where an AMAZING MMO exists. This is amazing technically in it's gameplay but horrible in terms of monetization, GW2 is terrible in gameplay, but great in monetization and value.
Oh well, back to League of Legends/Path of Exile for most folks
So click the respec button on the Feat Tab and pay the Astral Diamond charge to respec your feats.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Da da da derpage. derp-o-rama. super derp.
Well I'm glad you can describe yourself so well.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I 100% agree, if something is broken by the developer the player should absolutely foot the bill.
I already did that in gw2, and I even was in the same state as you before I hit 80 - but leveling and levelcap are often 2 kinds of games (even if arena tries to tells you otherwise with their manifesto).
it's funny that you say you like farming in gw2 again, since I found it MUCH worse in gw2 than getting my AD here. heck, do they still have the anti-farm code in place?
but if you're still having fun in a few weeks, I'm happy for you.
what people don't get is that you can respec your feats for AD. everybody is up in arms about the FULL respec, ignoring that you hardly have to respec powers/ability score. and no game has free respecs.
gw2's system is just better hidden and/or people are just more easily satisfied. don't forget reality tv has a high number of viewers as well. and I'd be very cautious about the "majority" claim. plenty of people have already left gw2 behind (inb4 IT'S DYING!!1 - didn't say that), so there are plenty of people who didn't like either the game, it's shop or both. but as I said, if people are having fun in game X, good for them.
good thing then they don't have to, since cryptic handed out free respecs in the past.
Actually respect feats doesn't change the fact that I don't have the abilities that are implemented by my new feat tree. If you read what you just quoted you would noticed I said I didn't have the abilities, I put points into other abilities that worked for my build. This requires a full respec.
Of course! let us pay for their mistakes!!!
Fanboys....
"their" mistakes? did a cryptic employee come to your house and force you at gunpoint not to put at least one point in a power?
but hey, if pointing that out makes someone a fanboy....
If something in Neverwinter game is not working correctly, it is a mistake from the employees that work to code Neverwinter game.
Duh!
I'm pretty sure you are not THAT dense.
I mean this game is officially in Beta so people are supposed to try things out and the devs are expected that they will be changing things a lot, plus there will be bugs that won't be fixed until their number comes of the devs schedule. Even past the Beat stage, as a game that is both an MMO and an RPG, people will be trying different things out and the devs will be changing things a lot. Furthermore, no one spec can be good enough for PvE (solo and group) and PvP (solo and group) at the same time, in fact builds that can be amazing for one are terrible for the other and vice versa. So limiting this major aspect of gameplay with such a ridiculous system is unacceptable imo.
comment here if you look for a solution,
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?232422-Donation-rewards-that-are-fair-yet-still-desireable-profitable
GW1 was completely free to respec and WoW is cheap enough that it's not a concern and it has dual specs.
Yeah, no, does not compute.
ehrm, if "something" is not working, where are you forced to pay for it? we're talking about the respecs here. "duh". nice generalization tho.
so either suck it up and wait till the MINOR issue is fixed, use a workaround or farm/pay for a respec if you can't endure to play your completely broken character (because it must be broken, right? since it's so BAD you can't play anymore and HAVE to respec). everything else is up to the person who decided which point goes where.
cryptic has reworked whole systems in the past and gave out quite a few respecs along with it. pw might be greedy and cryptic a bit stupid considering what goes live, but they're not THAT stupid.
and before you call me a fanboy, there is plenty that pisses me off in the game, to a level I'd punch the person responsible in the d1ck - the respecs are minor in comparison.
I mean, atm - I'd rather watch HGTV with my wife than play. I cannot experiment they way i'd like to with a new game/character as I have been able to do so- within a days time or for no money at all in 5 other games, all of which are still alive in some form or another. The fact that people can so blindly banner themselves that "all's well with the respeccing is ludicrous."
In WoW you level your toon from 1 - 90 at the end of all that you realize okay ...that worked for questing but for something a bit more focused such as dungeons, raids or PvP those options are no longer of value. It is common to have 2 specs and in some classes; respec out of one to another almost daily.. for those defending this games policy, you might want to"insert foot in mouth" at this point and remain silent here afterwards. Even $1 per respec could easily be financial **** depending on certain classes.
I have found the inital quests to be engaging and interesting, I have yet to fully explore the game to be fair but the interface feels somewhat restrictive. The idea of spending money on end game content feels sneaky and manipulative...
RE:
PWE User
"their" mistakes? did a cryptic employee come to your house and force you at gunpoint not to put at least one point in a power?
but hey, if pointing that out makes someone a fanboy....
Either a fanboy or a misinformed/uneducated/inexeprienced player... pick one how can you not see that respeccing in this game will likely be common place?
I've played dozens of MMOs and I can't recall a time where it was necessary for me to re-spec, let alone multiple times - maybe you should think about the class you're playing and what role you want to fill, plan better and then you won't have this problem.
What do you do in game/MMO that doesn't allow for respec at all? Maybe Cryptic intended for player choice during character progression to have impact and decided that in NW a respec is a luxury item. I don't know, but I do know that kicking up such a fuss over having to pay a small amount of money for something in a free game that isn't essential is nonsense.
I can't count the number of times I've respecced in both EQ2 & WoW, most of which came because various Talents or Achievements were changed significantly. In many cases, those respecs were provided for free -- in EQ2's case, this was even true after the game went F2P.
It's not always about "plan better."
Let your life proceed by its own designs
Nothing to tell
Let the words be yours, I'm done with mine ...