Well, a half orc would do more damage, while a human would have better defense. The Build suggested by the TE does use the 3 "human feat points" in a defensive talent and humans also get +3% defense.
Thats what I was thinking but plugging in numbers myself (assuming 54 point total with human) just using this build the bonus crit % would be mitigated by feats. The defense added with steely defense (given they are additive) would be effectively 18% defense boost so 3.6% extra damage from defense with the bonus for all damage (give my math is right and it does work addictive).
Half-orcs would just get 2 more dex (2% crit witch talents could mitigate) so 2% AoE resist and 1% deflect. The 5% Crit damage doesn't seem all that much (If additive). Its almost making it seem like human would actually trump out Half-orc in damage (perhaps very high crit rate could change this) while also mitigating more damage.
Of course, it does depend a lot on how well stats like defense scale for GWF and the way stats work, but to me just skimming over, it seems the advantage orc might have to damage would only likely take place at high crit %, otherwise it would be the same if not lower, while also losing a good bit of extra defense.
GWF level 60 (Beholder) - The pains of leveling!
Cleric level 5X (Dragon) - Holy goblin so much easier!
Why do you use roar? I basically have the same build, a few tweeks and roar seems to be horrible. You're far better off with Daring Shout if you took roar for the Determination or Battle Fury for damage. Personally I use Takedown for the prone and single target damage. All you really need is WMS for AoE.
Roar critsfor 2.6 k at 60 and five or more targets gives nearly full unstoppable bar.
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quickness87Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited April 2013
Nice info guide here, I'm starting my GWF despite all the negativity on the forum, I'm glad someone took their time and post their build that actually works.
Stats are better than Heroic Feat points. This will remain true even when the Heroic Feats are working properly. This is partly because for the most part, the GWF Heroic Feats are pretty bad other than a few that any race can get with the first 20 points.
Also, you have to make your optimal build, using a level 60 build, with both the Human and the Half-Orc (for example) and then compare the cold hard "numerical" differences.
You can't say, "oh the Human gets 3 more heroic points and therefore gets the +3 critical strike talent". The Half-Orc can grab this talent as well. Don't just give the Half-Orc crappy selections in order to say the Human is better, lol.
Again, you need to build "your" optimal GWF using both races and then fairly add in those 3 heroic feat points only AFTER the first 20 points are spent doing what you feel is the best job you can do with them. Then compare it to the Half-Orc with the additional +2 to a stat and the other racial abilities of both races.
People are doing disingenuous comparisons on here because they want one race to be better.
I did this exact comparison using my own build and I did not find the Human to be better. It was extremely close, it was a toss up, however my selection was the Half-Orc. I would not do it over either.
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quickness87Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited April 2013
^ that post is indeed true.
But as for my personal preference, I always prefer human when it has the option to pick Race
Kinda why I noted that race is more or less pick whatever in the beginning I stated an opInion as regular gear stats will increase faster then further levels will come. At a point it becomes a game of diminishing returns and percentages.
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akwartz01Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 5Arc User
The tool tips don't update and there are no buff icons to indicate the feat is changing the stats they claim. Its not to say they are broken or not working as intended just there are no value updates to say they are either.
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chym34Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 2Arc User
edited April 2013
And how should I put my GWF Ability scores points once I'm leveling i.e. lvl 10,20 etc.. ? all in STR or mix with DEX and CON , is there a cap ?
What attacks are you using while unstoppable? I am not sure if I should stick to atwills only during it, or encounters aswell(to profit the action point increase more?) ?
Also why you think dex is better then con?
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quickness87Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
What attacks are you using while unstoppable? I am not sure if I should stick to atwills only during it, or encounters aswell(to profit the action point increase more?) ?
Also why you think dex is better then con?
^ I'm curious about this question as well.
Thanks Kartofflen
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forsakenlich1Banned Users, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
My typical flow for unstoppable is. 1X WMS to get debuff than followed by flourish and IBS than again with 1x WMS either spamming WMS depending on targets or swap to sure strike for whats left.
So you basically use like 3-4 at wills during unstopable and 2 encounters... interesting Wouldnt sticking to WMS and sure strike net more dmg?
Also if you could express yourself at the dex vs con, since I did not find it itt.
In the con VS dex debate i side with dex being as there is not a feat to convert any stats into crit. However there is one to convert recovery into arpen by 25%. So best to go that way and the build relies heavily on crits for debuffs and dots. And also probably not as in the short animation for flourish and IBS they can crit for over 20k in less than 1/4th the bar of unstoppable. I highly doubt i could do that with sure strike on the elite targets.
My typical flow for unstoppable is. 1X WMS to get debuff than followed by flourish and IBS than again with 1x WMS either spamming WMS depending on targets or swap to sure strike for whats left.
what is WMS? xD sorry, im a newbie
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xdreeganxMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
What did you spend your points into and at what rank (1,2,3)? I'm only lvl 5 or so atm.. I'm going to try and follow this build and see how things go.. thx for the guide
Comments
Thats what I was thinking but plugging in numbers myself (assuming 54 point total with human) just using this build the bonus crit % would be mitigated by feats. The defense added with steely defense (given they are additive) would be effectively 18% defense boost so 3.6% extra damage from defense with the bonus for all damage (give my math is right and it does work addictive).
Half-orcs would just get 2 more dex (2% crit witch talents could mitigate) so 2% AoE resist and 1% deflect. The 5% Crit damage doesn't seem all that much (If additive). Its almost making it seem like human would actually trump out Half-orc in damage (perhaps very high crit rate could change this) while also mitigating more damage.
Of course, it does depend a lot on how well stats like defense scale for GWF and the way stats work, but to me just skimming over, it seems the advantage orc might have to damage would only likely take place at high crit %, otherwise it would be the same if not lower, while also losing a good bit of extra defense.
Cleric level 5X (Dragon) - Holy goblin so much easier!
Appreciated it, thumbs up
Also, you have to make your optimal build, using a level 60 build, with both the Human and the Half-Orc (for example) and then compare the cold hard "numerical" differences.
You can't say, "oh the Human gets 3 more heroic points and therefore gets the +3 critical strike talent". The Half-Orc can grab this talent as well. Don't just give the Half-Orc crappy selections in order to say the Human is better, lol.
Again, you need to build "your" optimal GWF using both races and then fairly add in those 3 heroic feat points only AFTER the first 20 points are spent doing what you feel is the best job you can do with them. Then compare it to the Half-Orc with the additional +2 to a stat and the other racial abilities of both races.
People are doing disingenuous comparisons on here because they want one race to be better.
I did this exact comparison using my own build and I did not find the Human to be better. It was extremely close, it was a toss up, however my selection was the Half-Orc. I would not do it over either.
But as for my personal preference, I always prefer human when it has the option to pick Race
Which makes Halfling the only logical choice. You know it.
20 str,dex or con ?
I'm asking as I see "feats getting fixed" in several topics now.
I started with 18 str as adrow can't remember the dex(at work cant check). But all stat on level went str dex.
Also why you think dex is better then con?
^ I'm curious about this question as well.
Thanks Kartofflen
personalyl i like to stick to onwill so i dont break the constant flow of DPS while unstoppable.
my 'rotation' is daily (if i have it), encounters, unstoppable, then encounters are back, etc
Also if you could express yourself at the dex vs con, since I did not find it itt.
In the con VS dex debate i side with dex being as there is not a feat to convert any stats into crit. However there is one to convert recovery into arpen by 25%. So best to go that way and the build relies heavily on crits for debuffs and dots. And also probably not as in the short animation for flourish and IBS they can crit for over 20k in less than 1/4th the bar of unstoppable. I highly doubt i could do that with sure strike on the elite targets.
what is WMS? xD sorry, im a newbie
Weapon Master Strike. Your Paragon At-Will
Arrows and Blades do not have names on them.
They are addressed, "To whom it may concern.."
Why didn't you go for 20 Str? I went for 20 str as a Human.. Thinking that was the main stat for GWF