A paid beta test is pretty much proof this game is nothing but suckage.
Then don't pay. Or even better, then don't play. If this is "all but true" then the game is a a failure, so your work is done. We thank you for your warning and appreciate you as you exit never needing to return with your received supernatural reading.
And if you all believe that, I saw similar replies for EVERY F2P game that ever offered head-start yes, head-start. That's all this is. Not a "force to pay for beta" Nobody is mocking anybody because they can't pay and they watch as only they don't get to preview.
Tell ya what, if I find free members who get into the preview and like it, can they point at someone like this and say how these comments were "major suckage?"
Of course not. Nobody wants to be told that, and if for some reason beyond my understanding they "did," they would want specifics where they get such an accusation--to prove it or zip it if you will.
It's an option for swag and priority access. Nobody's FORCING anybody to pay to test. As I mentioned before Pin is ever vigilantly working on a multiple access for many members of ALL tiering (free,paid key, and the Founders) to get access. A fair and diverse cross section of ALL players (free, paid product and Founder paid) will be represented.
But nobody's forcing people to spit wrong info either. If people want to take an incorrect stance after factual information has been linked and posted, that is their right.
Just don't expect the said posters to be credible and may accidently be identified as a beast themselves.
So, please, speak facts folks or some people might mistake you for this.
Path of exiles packages https://www.pathofexile.com/purchase we entered public Open Beta on January 23, 2013 and expect a release late this year. (for comparison to show the market trend ONLY)
GW2 offered same thing for beta ( i got conned, thanks lefty btw)
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liquadiaMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 7Arc User
edited January 2013
I Was going to get Guardian title! But then i realised they are dealing with only 2 currencies. 1 USA Dollars and EUROS.
The UK doesnt deal with both, dollars or euros and the cheapest i can get this for is if i remember
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dequixoticMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Nice Video iamtruthseeker. Unfortunately, "then don't pay" is a bad answer. The reality is the beta is a "paid beta" and the total value of the $200 package is severely overpriced to the point where someone obviously used a random number generator for the value.
No one is forcing anyone to buy it, but they are certainly making people who want to play feb 8th to buy it. No one is forcing me to pay my ISP for the abilty to connect to the internet, but if I want to do, I damn well have to pay. Perfect World needs to stop pretending you are gonna give free access in the same manner that they are now giving paid access, if they were, they would have announced dates for the Free Beta.
That said, I am going to be buying probably both the $ 200.00 and $60.00 pack because I want to support the game and get all the neat stuff, but i will not be able to beta test for most of it because the schedule is such that I am unavailable for feb 8th and march 22nd (who made a beta during paxeast weekend, I hope they are there so I can kick them)
This is nothing but a cash grab...... So here is my cash
$60 to play on Feb. 8th too. Not $200.
Also you can get into the beta without paying, so it's hardly a pay-for beta. If you want to support Cryptic though, this is a way to do it with the added bonus that you are guaranteed to be able to try the game out.
Just to throw a couple of cents in, here. I disagree with the argument that paying for beta access supports the studio. I buy Zen for Champions and STO to support the studio. I am already disheartened by the precedent being set, here. I played CO and STO for a few months before deciding to spend any money on either, and, when I lost all my progress on two characters when forced to switch CO to a PWE user account, I almost didn't spend any money, at all. The fact is, there are things in both games that I decided that I wanted, but I didn't know that until playing the games for a while. Same applies, here. I like the IP, but anyone who has been a fan of D&D since SSI made games for the Commodore 64 will tell you: Making a D&D game that doesn't suck is a tricky thing. DDO still has not overcome some of its initial flaws, and it may never do so. I will continue to play it, but I will likely never spend money on it.
Your not paying for beta. You just want in the beta and this is the only surefire way. Assuming they did not offer a "founders" package, you would have to rely on chance, or some other giveaway. I, for one, am thrilled I have a way to get into the beta if I so desire it. I don't have to wonder if I will get that random invite.
Is that really better? if so, just hope and pray your getting in. It's still the same.
Otherwise, you are supporting a studio for a product you are interested in.
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dequixoticMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Just to throw a couple of cents in, here. I disagree with the argument that paying for beta access supports the studio. I buy Zen for Champions and STO to support the studio. I am already disheartened by the precedent being set, here. I played CO and STO for a few months before deciding to spend any money on either, and, when I lost all my progress on two characters when forced to switch CO to a PWE user account, I almost didn't spend any money, at all. The fact is, there are things in both games that I decided that I wanted, but I didn't know that until playing the games for a while. Same applies, here. I like the IP, but anyone who has been a fan of D&D since SSI made games for the Commodore 64 will tell you: Making a D&D game that doesn't suck is a tricky thing. DDO still has not overcome some of its initial flaws, and it may never do so. I will continue to play it, but I will likely never spend money on it.
Okay, so how does this deal affect you and your decision. Is this any different than buying a game without a demo or paying for a game before it is out. In a way these founder deals are a replacement for pre-ordering. PWE and Cryptic are basically saying: "You don't get to buy the game, but you can get a bunch of cosmetics and novelty items and are guaranteed to be able to try it early. Other people can still get into the closed beta, but because you're making the decision to pay for a free to play game, we'll reward you with a slot." People that don't think it's worth it or don't want to pay can wait until they get a code or until open beta.
PWE isn't forcing anyone to pay for anything though.
Just to throw a couple of cents in, here. I disagree with the argument that paying for beta access supports the studio. I buy Zen for Champions and STO to support the studio.
The fact that one method of giving them money supports the studio in no way refutes the assertion that another method does so as well.
A studio incurs significant extra costs for a game launch that are above and beyond the costs of ongoing maintenance. Most games recoup these costs by selling the game in a box, and many (perhaps most, these days) additionally have "special" boxes that come with more stuff and cost more.
Neverwinter doesn't come in a box. These packs represent the same economic factors, and an industry-standard, long-proven method of dealing with them, slightly modified for a Free 2 Play paradigm.
The great part about this paradigm vs. other MMO monetization plans; this is optional. With most MMORPGs, you have to buy SOMETHING to play. With this one, you don't. Of course, this means 10% of the players are covering the costs, instead of 100%; but the theory is, the total number of players will be higher, so that 10% will be a lot more people than 10% of a P2P launch.
If you don't think the packs provide value, by all means don't buy one; but some of us do, and it IS a necessary thing for PWE to get that initial "bump" of income to make up for the development and launch marketing costs. It's crucial to the success of the venture.
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j0reelMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 14Arc User
edited January 2013
Have the Devs said what the in-game store prices will be yet? I know with Blacklight: Restibution the store prices for ingame items was rediculously high. Looking at the amount of zen crystals that the founders get makes me think that the prices will be the same and if that IS true, then the ingame cash you get won't be going very far. So I was hoping that maybe someone somehere had said something about it...
Have the Devs said what the in-game store prices will be yet? I know with Blacklight: Restibution the store prices for ingame items was rediculously high. Looking at the amount of zen crystals that the founders get makes me think that the prices will be the same and if that IS true, then the ingame cash you get won't be going very far. So I was hoping that maybe someone somehere had said something about it...
Founders don't get any Zen. We get Astral Diamonds. Little information about AD has been released yet, but they seem like they'll be comparable to Questionite in Champions Online and Dilithium in Star Trek Online, so I'll talk about Star Trek Online.
Dilithium is exchangeable to other players for Zen at player-set rates. Those rates have fluctuated between around 95:1 to 150:1. That would make 750k Dilithium be worth about $50-$79 of Zen, and obtainable by a minimum of 93 character/days of grinding (83 for a lifetime subscriber).
It is not known if AD will be sufficiently comparable to Dilithium for these numbers to be useful, but they're all we have using only sources that are not covered by an NDA.
Founders don't get any Zen. We get Astral Diamonds. Little information about AD has been released yet, but they seem like they'll be comparable to Questionite in Champions Online and Dilithium in Star Trek Online, so I'll talk about Star Trek Online.
Dilithium is exchangeable to other players for Zen at player-set rates. Those rates have fluctuated between around 95:1 to 150:1. That would make 750k Dilithium be worth about $50-$79 of Zen, and obtainable by a minimum of 93 character/days of grinding (83 for a lifetime subscriber).
It is not known if AD will be sufficiently comparable to Dilithium for these numbers to be useful, but they're all we have using only sources that are not covered by an NDA.
Actually those rates used to be roughly 250/1 at one point and I've read numbers as high as 350/1 doing random searches of the STO forums. Truth is there is no set convertion and numbers can vary from 50/1 (minimum rate*) to 500/1 (maximum rate*) depending on supply and demand.
I'm glad I can pay to get into beta because I never get selected and/or to late to apply to get selected to attend one. I just don't like the fact that it's expensive just to get the extra <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> items. >.> I wish they would have given a statue of Drizzt or something physical I can hold. A plush toy or something lol
Actually those rates used to be roughly 250/1 at one point and I've read numbers as high as 350/1 doing random searches of the STO forums. Truth is there is no set convertion and numbers can vary from 50/1 (minimum rate*) to 500/1 (maximum rate*) depending on supply and demand.
*at least in CO and STO, last I checked
Min is 25 in STO. FYI.
Yes, they were that high early on, but that was shortly after the conversion, when many of the things intended to use Dil simply didn't exist yet. After a time it settled into the 125-150 range and stayed there, until the new Rep system came along and disrupted things. It dipped to 85:1, but now it's slowly creeping back up as people start to hit Tier 5 in the existing reps. It'll likely dip again every time a new rep is introduced, but there's no reason to think it'll go below 85 again, and if it hits 85 again, the evidence suggests it'll head back up around 95 in short order.
I'm comfortable with the 95-150 range as being where it "usually" is, but you're correct, it could sometimes be wildly different for a time. Long term rates are what I'm concerned with here, because "25-500" just isn't at all useful, and either end is unlikely to occur again, nor to remain for long if it does.
Yes, it could be that 750k Dil is worth $300, or that it's worth $15; but neither extreme is likely to be more than a bump. Over time, it's spent most of its time between 95 and 150. Feel free to pull together every forum post ever mentioning where it is and graph them over time and prove me wrong if you're more dedicated to the statistics than I am.
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j0reelMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 14Arc User
edited January 2013
Sorry your right, Astral Diamonds... I couldn't remember the name for some reason and zen currency was the only other one I could think of. Maybe after the first beta weekend, someone can post some screen shots (if possible) of some on the in-store items and prices...
Comments
Yep... probably is going to suck as much as Guild Wars 2 because it had a paid beta test too.
Then don't pay. Or even better, then don't play. If this is "all but true" then the game is a a failure, so your work is done. We thank you for your warning and appreciate you as you exit never needing to return with your received supernatural reading.
And if you all believe that, I saw similar replies for EVERY F2P game that ever offered head-start yes, head-start. That's all this is. Not a "force to pay for beta" Nobody is mocking anybody because they can't pay and they watch as only they don't get to preview.
Tell ya what, if I find free members who get into the preview and like it, can they point at someone like this and say how these comments were "major suckage?"
Of course not. Nobody wants to be told that, and if for some reason beyond my understanding they "did," they would want specifics where they get such an accusation--to prove it or zip it if you will.
It's an option for swag and priority access. Nobody's FORCING anybody to pay to test. As I mentioned before Pin is ever vigilantly working on a multiple access for many members of ALL tiering (free,paid key, and the Founders) to get access. A fair and diverse cross section of ALL players (free, paid product and Founder paid) will be represented.
But nobody's forcing people to spit wrong info either. If people want to take an incorrect stance after factual information has been linked and posted, that is their right.
Just don't expect the said posters to be credible and may accidently be identified as a beast themselves.
So, please, speak facts folks or some people might mistake you for this.
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GW2 offered same thing for beta ( i got conned, thanks lefty btw)
The UK doesnt deal with both, dollars or euros and the cheapest i can get this for is if i remember
$60 to play on Feb. 8th too. Not $200.
Also you can get into the beta without paying, so it's hardly a pay-for beta. If you want to support Cryptic though, this is a way to do it with the added bonus that you are guaranteed to be able to try the game out.
Part of the problem since December, 2012.
Your not paying for beta. You just want in the beta and this is the only surefire way. Assuming they did not offer a "founders" package, you would have to rely on chance, or some other giveaway. I, for one, am thrilled I have a way to get into the beta if I so desire it. I don't have to wonder if I will get that random invite.
Is that really better? if so, just hope and pray your getting in. It's still the same.
Otherwise, you are supporting a studio for a product you are interested in.
Okay, so how does this deal affect you and your decision. Is this any different than buying a game without a demo or paying for a game before it is out. In a way these founder deals are a replacement for pre-ordering. PWE and Cryptic are basically saying: "You don't get to buy the game, but you can get a bunch of cosmetics and novelty items and are guaranteed to be able to try it early. Other people can still get into the closed beta, but because you're making the decision to pay for a free to play game, we'll reward you with a slot." People that don't think it's worth it or don't want to pay can wait until they get a code or until open beta.
PWE isn't forcing anyone to pay for anything though.
1. If beta access requires payment, then paying gets you into the beta.
2. Paying gets me into the beta.
3. Therefore, beta access requires payment.
You might as well say:
1. If an animal is a Tyrannosaurus rex, then it is a reptile.
2. My iguana is a reptile.
3. Therefore, my iguana is a Tyrannosaurus rex.
Read a book. The beta test will proceed as normal whether or not anyone buys a founder's pack.
The fact that one method of giving them money supports the studio in no way refutes the assertion that another method does so as well.
A studio incurs significant extra costs for a game launch that are above and beyond the costs of ongoing maintenance. Most games recoup these costs by selling the game in a box, and many (perhaps most, these days) additionally have "special" boxes that come with more stuff and cost more.
Neverwinter doesn't come in a box. These packs represent the same economic factors, and an industry-standard, long-proven method of dealing with them, slightly modified for a Free 2 Play paradigm.
The great part about this paradigm vs. other MMO monetization plans; this is optional. With most MMORPGs, you have to buy SOMETHING to play. With this one, you don't. Of course, this means 10% of the players are covering the costs, instead of 100%; but the theory is, the total number of players will be higher, so that 10% will be a lot more people than 10% of a P2P launch.
If you don't think the packs provide value, by all means don't buy one; but some of us do, and it IS a necessary thing for PWE to get that initial "bump" of income to make up for the development and launch marketing costs. It's crucial to the success of the venture.
Founders don't get any Zen. We get Astral Diamonds. Little information about AD has been released yet, but they seem like they'll be comparable to Questionite in Champions Online and Dilithium in Star Trek Online, so I'll talk about Star Trek Online.
Dilithium is exchangeable to other players for Zen at player-set rates. Those rates have fluctuated between around 95:1 to 150:1. That would make 750k Dilithium be worth about $50-$79 of Zen, and obtainable by a minimum of 93 character/days of grinding (83 for a lifetime subscriber).
It is not known if AD will be sufficiently comparable to Dilithium for these numbers to be useful, but they're all we have using only sources that are not covered by an NDA.
Actually those rates used to be roughly 250/1 at one point and I've read numbers as high as 350/1 doing random searches of the STO forums. Truth is there is no set convertion and numbers can vary from 50/1 (minimum rate*) to 500/1 (maximum rate*) depending on supply and demand.
*at least in CO and STO, last I checked
Min is 25 in STO. FYI.
Yes, they were that high early on, but that was shortly after the conversion, when many of the things intended to use Dil simply didn't exist yet. After a time it settled into the 125-150 range and stayed there, until the new Rep system came along and disrupted things. It dipped to 85:1, but now it's slowly creeping back up as people start to hit Tier 5 in the existing reps. It'll likely dip again every time a new rep is introduced, but there's no reason to think it'll go below 85 again, and if it hits 85 again, the evidence suggests it'll head back up around 95 in short order.
I'm comfortable with the 95-150 range as being where it "usually" is, but you're correct, it could sometimes be wildly different for a time. Long term rates are what I'm concerned with here, because "25-500" just isn't at all useful, and either end is unlikely to occur again, nor to remain for long if it does.
Yes, it could be that 750k Dil is worth $300, or that it's worth $15; but neither extreme is likely to be more than a bump. Over time, it's spent most of its time between 95 and 150. Feel free to pull together every forum post ever mentioning where it is and graph them over time and prove me wrong if you're more dedicated to the statistics than I am.
This is what i was looking for i do like the barded horse and wolf pet but i will not buy a founders pack until i have tested/played the game first.
Also prior to PWE taking over it was stated that CO and STO lifetime members would get into the beta at some point is this still true?