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The "SOLO" Question... =)
zellex
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
In every game this seems to come up and since I can't seem to find a post on it....
Is there solo content in the game? Will someone be able to solo to top level?
I know people have mixed emotions on this topic that vary greatly...lets hear what you think about it too.
Is there solo content in the game? Will someone be able to solo to top level?
I know people have mixed emotions on this topic that vary greatly...lets hear what you think about it too.
Post edited by zellex on
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Neverwinter Thieves Guild
I take the "4 WHM challenge" from the start, just to make sure that survivability is possible. I can't speak for Cryptic's in-game content, but a lot of getting to "top level" solo may depend on how good the Foundry authors are; making you want to play, but still giving a good challenge without making it hopeless if you don't have help from other classes.
Ah, thanks haven't had a lot of time to go through all the data on the game scattered about... great news I like the option of being able to solo... taking more time than with a group makes perfect sense to me
Yeah I'm really interested in learning more about the foundry....I know very little about it and what can and can't be done...sounds very interesting. I love soloing too and make an effort to make a character in every game that can do it...or I don't last long in the game.
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?5211-Neverwinter-Online-New-Users-FAQ
Foundry stuff is in section 2 about halfway down (though its along sction )
mind it poitns to this post too which you might want to look at
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?13401-Foundry-Videos-and-some-FAQ-s
Dungeons/delves and foundry dungeons will like startrek online change the difficulty of mobs based on how many in party, what level you are (and also what difficulty you pick). This is automatic, though whether the difficulty will be more than just increase hp and damage output I do not know.
Great info thanks man...I keep seeing people referencing STO which I never played so... get a bit lost when people refer to it's mechanics....but I've seen similar implementations in other games.... thanks again.
In this instance, however, because the game is based on 4e D&D mechanics, I'm praying that there's a significant amount of content that actually FEELS like 4e by requiring tactical coordination between multiple characters in order to succeed. The fun of 4e was that combat was a group experience, and you couldn't necessarily "superman" or 'one man army" it, no matter how optimized your characters were. You had to work to create openings for one another, exploit weaknesses, focus fire, and watch each other's backs to claim victory. If that element isn't included in the game at least to SOME degree, the game will feel very hollow to me - 4e in name, but not practice.
-- Galileo Galilei
I wouldn't worry too much about that. Two things Cyptic has confirmed:
1) There will be group required content put out by them.
2) Players will have access to most tools Cryptic has access to via the Foundry.
Since we know players will be able to set level restrictions on UGC so I would figure that players will, if not at launch then some time after release, set party requirements.
WTF is the "4 WHM challenge?" (looks)
Did you mean this?
As for solo-ability, yes the missions can be done solo, wih the difficulty ramping up based on each person's level joining.
Delves are the "RAID" equivalent and do require 5 people or some level of multiplayer not yet confirmed but more than one player (and a companion.)
[All of this is not confirmed but:
I've also heard (and again, I cannot confirm,) that Delves in their respective zones may or may not have level range caps. Getting into new zones is a no brainer as you need to be x minimum level to travel to which is not possible to progress in Cryptic storylines without finishing a minimum number of official quests which take you to said minimum level (as experienced by STO and CO) or you could do dailies/Foundry and other XP things which mean you're ready as soon as you finish x minimum quests to "introduce you to a new area."
Max-Level caps on the other hand, are tricky. I get certain zones are using fixed-level characters in the persistent areas and this simply might be a byproduct on not having OP players helping other players, Delves being the only gateway they can restrict (you can't exactly stop players from running around open areas and delves are "extra or bonus" quests outside the official storyline.)]
Umm, what Neverwinter level restrictions? All I have seen in the Foundry is easy/regular/hard? I thought the STO range was based on a limitation in placing scaling creatures they now have overcome?
I don't see a huge stretch to make content require minimum or maximum players.
[will edit in the source]
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Neverwinter Thieves Guild
I mean, a party full of pure healers is going to be able to win any encounter based on raw stamina alone, right? You don't drop 4 White Mages without a headache in the process. The caveat is that they don't do much damage, so they're going to have an equally large headache trying to kill you. So....really, it's less of a "this is hard and you should consider yourself accomplished if you pull it off' and more of a "if you're willing to sit through two hours a combat, go for it."
Yes?
-- Galileo Galilei
Just to confirm, players will be able to solo most of the content in Neverwinter. Large dungeons and events will require at least 5 people to team up. We've made teaming up for these more difficult quests extremely easy, so even a shy solo player like myself can easily find a team for these things.
If you're implying we can form parties of more than five (raid parties)... that'd be awesome. And news to me. I'd heard of only 5 man parties so far.
Thanks for your info! I guess that we'll get raids... *rubbing my hands*
St. Augustinus
Yes that would be awesome, Crypticmapolis can you confirm 5 man parties is the biggest it can get or can you make larger ones or is it still up in the air so to speak ?
Neverwinter Thieves Guild
Events though, who knows? I'd bet like STO you'd not be teamed up but all of you are in some big PvE (I'm hoping defeat the hoardes of evil enemies in their army.) Looking over at Events, I also bet we'd be trggered solo to find the most or kill the most things in a timed limit to win contests.
And yes, we know "some user" wants PvP Capture the Flag multiple users. No clue on PvP. Is it solo PvP or group or both?
Anything to add oh mighty wise and Powerful Mapolis? *bows demurly*
While I agree that FFXI set a standard for groupcentric content, even though that changed around the time of Abyssea, other MMOs , specifically WoW, possess non-soloable content. Raids and instances are group only, as is PvP.
However, to answer to your original point, groupcentric content is a great idea.
I miss the days of FFXI where you had to be in a group to level and the party would be adjusted to each members strengths and weaknesses. If you entered a party as a thief and couldn't SATA, you got kicked. And if you didn't know how to properly SC or MB, you'd get kicked, unless you were in a Dunes party in '05ish. I digress.
Truthfully, it's that particular playstyle and content I'm looking for again. I miss being part of a group. I miss getting together to do someone's AF quest or going into Sky. I also played WoW for a long time and I soloed everything except the instances and raids, and it was boring as hell. I like to solo, but I don't want it to be my main source of exp. Being in a party and leveling is, and should be, FUN.
In addition, FFXI's 'team-based' mentality made the game special. It required you, for the most part, to have a linkshell and socialize (seriously, G1). A WoW guild is nothing more than a chat-room that almost never does anything for you, or you for them. A FFXI linkshell is a group that helps you with quests, as there aren't a lot of them in FFXI, leveling (sometimes - level dependent), crafting help, etc... This is what the groups need to be like in Neverwinter. And not a duplicate of a WoW guild.
I would like to see Neverwinter be that type of game; I don't want to see another damn WoW-clone.
If you hadn't noticed, WoW-esque content makes an MMO extremely boring! "I'm gonna level to 90, start my dailies, craft/gather, maybe do an instance and logoff, then do the same thing tomorrow and the day after, ad nauseum!" Is this the type of content players want? Hell no.
I like quests, but I don't like quests to be my main source of leveling. Give me monsters to kill! Give me a reason to group! Give me a reason to be social! Give me a reason to help other people! Instead of solo-leveling to the max level and then start on 'end-game' content. It took me a year (I think more, but I don't remember) to get to 75 in FFXI, and it took me a month or so to get to max level in WoW - two weeks the last time I went from 1-90. It became a grind to even log into WoW - I'd probably still be playing FFXI if it weren't for their less-than-stellar customer service and time requirement. However, I truly had fun in that game. I always looked forward to logging in, and I don't regret playing it. WoW, on the other hand, wasn't very fun. I felt like logging in was a chore/task/grind, and I regret ever playing it.
Neverwinter is in a great position to take leads from all of the other MMOs; their strengths, weaknesses and what/what doesn't work. I'm not saying it should be a FFXI clone (the time requirements were awful
Finally, make the environments (to include music) memorable. I would go to the Sanctuary of Zi'tah and just hang out and listen to the music, and maybe camp an NM or two. I would also enjoy farming silk in Rolanberry Fields because of the ambiance, not because killing crawlers was particularly fun. Even if I had to wait for a party in Jeuno, the music was fabulous.
I would spend most of my time in WoW near an AH after getting to max level because the zones, and their music, drove me up the wall. I didn't really like the music in the towns either.
Overall, WoW sucks. I never want to play that awful game again. I would, however, love to experience a game that amalgamates the best qualities of all MMOS and turns it into a truly enjoyable experience. You could always hire Uematsu to score the game >.>;
Locking real progression behind forced group content or giving solo or small group players second hand progression is probably the only real thing that could kill any enjoyment I could get out of this game.
I really like how grouping worked in Lineage. People grouped for safety and to ensure they didn't die and lose xp or their items. Grouping worked there because people wanted to. High level players could solo if they wanted or could farm faster with others, but anyone could try for the drop. Contrived grouping doesn't promote the desire to group but punishes those who won't jump through the hoop for the shiny. GW2 is the only recent game I've played that has broken out of the contrived cookie cutter build or boot syndrome and I love that. Players desire to help each other to succeed and each are rewarded according to their contribution not how someone with master looter on decides.
tldr: Promoting the desire to group is good. Forcing grouping and putting the control into random players hands is bad.
IMO this is unfortunate because what differentiates and makes MMORPGs unique and special is group-based content. I would love it if people who want to solo stuck with single player games and if devs focused much more on group content than solo ez-mode.
A bunch of soloists yapping in chat and existing in the same world isn't much of a MMORPG, and that's what many MMORPGs feel like the bulk of the time. What's the appeal there vs just playing a high quality single player game like a Skyrim (if you want FPS style RPG) or any of the bazillions of other single player games out there?
Good MMORPGs are rare and the fact that so many are emphasizing solo is ruining community in them and ultimately hurting them because when people do play them like single player games, they tend to do up initial content and then go away. This compared to people who group and who will stick around and play a MMORPG with plenty of good group content for years.
D&D was never much of a single player game. It could be done, but it was more about groups. You didn't just hook up with your buddy the DM and have him run you thru solo missions. You got together with friends and you grouped.
D&D was also never about PvP and PvP absolutely doesn't belong in a game like this - all it does is detract from quality PvE, PvE balance, and just dilutes the whole.
Much like soloists should stick to single player games, PvPers should stick to games that are appropriate for quality PvP, like MMO lite (planetside for ex), MOBA, online FPS, or games like the upcoming forge that are like MMORPG PvP without any of the PvE (which is what many PvPers want anyways).
Imagine how awesome an MMORPG could be that focused on group PvE with minimal solo-ability to fill in the gaps and not wasting time or effort slapping on crappy PvP? I'd love to see it done by a company capable of making a decent game.
I couldn't agree more. I hope the game is not being delayed only by pvp, because it would be a real shame.
St. Augustinus
But as for grouping - I agree that MMOs are about grouping. There's tons of options out there for single player DnD games. I'm hoping that Cryptic focuses on group based content.
MMO stands for Massively Multiplayer Online. It does not stand for Massively Group-play Online. The key word is Massively, which denotes a large number beyond just "multi-player." This then brings into the notion that these Masses, just like in real life, will have their own play-styles, agendas, and personalities.
Personally, as a mostly-solo player, I prefer playing MMOs for these reasons:
Show me one single player game that has all this and I'd happily never play another MMO again. Oh wait, that's right, single-player games do not have these qualities. If I wanted to be forced into a group with others, I'd play a Multi-Player game. If I wanted to play a game by myself, I'd play a Single-Player game. What I enjoy is playing in a living world that gives me the choice to play how I wish and does not discriminate against how I wish to play at any given moment. This latter is what MMORPGs stand for and is why I prefer MMORPGs.
Another misconception is that most MMORPG players want to play in groups. This has been found to be the opposite and has even been flat out stated as such by WB, which you can hear in this video (linked to the begining of the conversation, listen to when he talks about learning from their mistakes on group content). So, those who prefer their MMORPGs to be group-focused are actually in the minority.
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Definition of a roleplaying game is this- A game in which players assume the roles of characters and act out fantastical adventures, the outcomes of which are partially determined by chance, as by the roll of dice.
Recently they seem to have changed to MMOSPG=Massively Multiplayer Online single player game
In my opininon its a shame that games are being developed for a solo centric crowd. The most fun i have ever had was with a group of folk adventuring through difficult content vs the easy solo gameplay seen in many of these games today.
Fact is, most people are going to want to powerlevel and min-max, not roleplay. Today's MMORPG standards have also evolved with respect to their outlooks on grouping with others, acceptable groups, and especially gameplay mechanics, such as PvP, and also endgame.
Before ANYONE starts spewing, "This is what they SHOULD be doing with the game," comments, I encourage you to realize that your opinion is a drop of water in very vast sea of players. And it's the largest bodies of water that ultimately get named. What the majority wants, in other words.
Not my words but expresses what I think very well.
Neverwinter Thieves Guild
So if I play more of a role play style, do I want to group with people only interested in the uber gear and want to run the same dungeon night after night for the special magic boots or whatever? Do I wait to find like minded people or play solo and maybe meet up with someone while playing. I like to just stop and look around sometimes, are other players going to sit and wait while I stop and smell the digital roses, so to speak. There was a graphics team that spent thousands of man hours creating a world for people to explore and many players breeze right by to kill whatever is next. I like the worlds of Oblivion, Skyrim, and GW2. The one difference in an MMO that I like is the randomness of people running around the world. As much as they try programming that in single player games, it is still a repetitive program.
So I will be happy with whatever single player content is available if I like the overall game play. If I chance to meet like minded individuals to group up with, I would not mind grouping on occasion. I just do not want to be forced to group because you have to, to accomplish something.
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."