test content
Logo
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
Please Dont
dridia
Banned Users Posts: 0 Arc User
Ive played alot of MMO's and heres a few game killers imo.
1. easy xp..make a hard xp curve so you dont out level your gear in an hour
2.Add rare mob Spawns with rare drops. no more of these tiered armors and weapons
all that does is make everyone a clone!
3.dont cater to the casual player, a person that plays more deserves more( if i go to work and stay 2 hours ,i dont get as much money as someone who works 8 hours)
Just a few thoughts i had , what do you all think?
1. easy xp..make a hard xp curve so you dont out level your gear in an hour
2.Add rare mob Spawns with rare drops. no more of these tiered armors and weapons
all that does is make everyone a clone!
3.dont cater to the casual player, a person that plays more deserves more( if i go to work and stay 2 hours ,i dont get as much money as someone who works 8 hours)
Just a few thoughts i had , what do you all think?
Post edited by dridia on
0
Comments
#1) For a game like NWO, I'd like to see people reaching max level in at least 6 months or more. Preferably alot more time.
#2) I want many uncommon/rare type mobs, but I agree about then NOT having special drops. That simply leads to farming. Make killing them the actual goal; track the kills, and offer titles to people...we love titles.
#3) I agree with your meaning; equal rewards for equal work, but people need to be able to actually feel a sense of accomplishment even if they only have a few hours to play. Casuals can spend money in the store for exp pots if they feel the need to "keep up" with friends, etc.
Personally I think we can all get along, we just need to stop worrying about what others players have, (Gear/Levels/Time to play), and focus on our selves. Hopefully NWO is less about rushing to the worst part of an MMO, (end game), and more about a series of memorable adventures with a bunch of memorable fellow players.
1. You do want tough xp path grant you. However one shouldn't over do it. =/
2. Yes! I like this idea!
3. And agreed. I really hope that this game does not add a zen store too it. It just doesn't need it.
The game is going to be free to play with no subscription from what we can tell so that means there will be a store.
Speaking as a casual player, well kind of casual player, I agree with all three points.
1. One of my disappointments with previous MMOs has been the focus on reaching max level as quickly as possible. Coming from a PnP background, the story and the group dynamics are what will make the game enjoyable over the long run.
2. The only qualifier with this is to guard against making certain quests that are the only ones that players can find a group for, if groups are required to complete the quests. This may mean rare drops are included in all group oriented quests or that the rare drops focus on characteristics that distinguish the item rather than make them incredibly powerful. Sorry developers, I know this makes item development more difficult and time consuming but the distinguishing characteristic could be fairly subtle adjustments to existing items.
3. I wholeheartedly agree with this, players who are more effective in game should receive greater benefits. And the amount of time spent playing is a key factor in effectiveness. But this should be taken care of with experience and the in game economy, if there is one.
#1) If people get max level in less than a month, then screw it. This is supposed to be like D&D, not WoW. The point of this game isn't to race to the finish, everyone get max level now! While people will do this, and by all means go ahead, we should not be making this the 1st priority. If it is the priority, then screw this game. I'd rather just go back to WoW and play a HAMSTER panda.
#2) I completely agree with this, I hated how everyone had "rare" mob gear. Annoying when everyone looks the freakin' same. Now titles, that's a good plan! And some mounts. Do you know how many hours I put into getting one mount? It took 2 hours a day for a month to get it, and I'd do it again.
#3) I agree that it should have an XP curve. Myself, if I have the time, I play like a man addicted to crack. Sadly, I can't usually. So I'd have to label myself casual. And as much as I hate the people with tons of time out-leveling me, I would find it more annoying if by spending a few hours in one day I could catch up to them. Are we children now, that we need to be patted on the head and told good job? I'm not playing this game if they've made it so easy you don't have to try to be rewarded. I'm freakin' 22, my generation helped CREATE this "no work, all reward" idea that everyone seems to jump on. Personally, it's moronic. Whoever came up with it is an idiot, and if Cryptic goes with it, they're idiots too.
All in all, Muzrub has it right. It's about enjoying the game. As I've said before, it's based off of D&D. While it's obviously not going to be the same, it's the same idea. How often do you try to get a level 20 wizard when playing D&D? If you answered always, go to h*&!.
1 - It is done so because people are eager and want to see what is next. So they don't want too much grind so that "what they see" keeps changing. Replay value should be increased by amount of content in game or classes and not by making grinding curve steeper.
2 - Having powerful items only if you group - is not something I can agree on. Though I myself like to group, but there are times when I solo. When I solo I want content to be more dangerous (as no one is there to revive me, it is dangerous even when scaled down) and rewarding. More risks, ore gains.
3 - "the amount of time spent playing is a key factor in effectiveness" I don't agree with this. Skill and 'modifying your character to meet your style' (which will eventually increase skill) should be the deciding factor. Having "amount of time spent" is a disastrous policy as it is not going to retain many current players, while discouraging new players by making "old" players stronger. This may also encourage elitism which will further hamper the MMO's growth among new players.
2.) I dont want to camp for days to try kill a rare mob that drops my BIS gear
3.) Why are you comparing a hobby of playing a game to a Job? I dont see why people think casual player is bad either HAMSTER they could be a better player then a hardcore player. Better system would be reward skills over grind.
And while I also like rare mobs, I also remember camping them in the early days of EQ. Hours spent killing the same three mobs over and over while waiting for that rare... If there was really a random way to have these mobs show up, I think they add a lot to a game. (I also actually like it when you have a random high level baddie that occasionally patrols a lower level zone. Dodging that mob adds an edge to what can be a boring grind.)
As for not catering to casual players, I think a game can serve the two audiences. I am not much into large raids, and because of that, I do not expect that type raid loot. If I can only log on for an hour or so, there should be things I can enjoy completing. And, when time allows, I should be able to engage in a more daunting task with a greater reward.
The reality is that companies can't afford to make both extremely well, the amount of time and content required is just too much. Smart companies make both experiences fun, but focus on one or the other.
I don't care how long it takes to get from 1 to 60 (or whatever the level cap is), but make it so that there is content to experience. Worrying about it having to take X number of months is a poor way to design a game. If those months are filled with nothing but killing rats then what does it matter how long I spend doing that?
Give me fun and heroic things to do (heroic is the name for the level 1 tier in 4e isn't it?) to do at level 1 and I don't care if I stay there for a year. But don't make an arbitrary grind for time sinks, heck this isn't a sub based game those kind of time sinks don't even make them money.
1- I want the game to be hard aswell but is also a dangerous path, i dont know if people wanna "waste" a lot of their time grinding anymore. If NWO will have ridiculous long story-arc than yes i want the the game to be hard to reach max level, otherwise i dont.
2-Rare mobs is an exelent idea, random spawn to avoid grind and like a week to spawn again, thats sounds good to me. And no i dont want clones everywhere like other static table item drop games.... *cought*WoW-cought*
3- Thats a complex discussion, i was once an hardcore player aswell and i trully understand what u mean, although i also now understand that casual players also "deserve" to see all the content and be able to get some good loot. Why not give solo dungeons uber loot like group dungeons ? Ofc the dificulty should be a lot harder coz they will probably be grind as hell but since neverwinter is an action-combat could also mean u will have to be a skilled player to finish them.
You've never played CO or STO, have you? You're pretty much asking them to make an MMO exactly the opposite of the only way they know how to. When STO launched, I had an Admiral in a week of casual play. The heavily instanced nature of their games mean that the only way you'll have rare gear is through the grinding of high-level content with the same gear, just like every MMO out there. Also, their games are INSANELY easy - sure, you can grind out some money, but within a month due to all of the grinding the games are designed around, the economy will be so out of whack that money won't matter anyway. They'll eventually add "new" currencies (if it doesn't launch with one) that can be bought with real money, and the only way to get the good gear is with this currency.
one thing tough, neverwinter is CLEARLY a casual arcad mmorpg that is supposed to be played on a quest-by-quest basis - something like, hey lets meet up and do this dungeon/quest etc...therefore i dont think the target audience for this game are the hard core players...
I feel multiple difficulty settings offering casual to challenging content would be the best way to make the most folks happy.
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | NEVERWINTER GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!
im not sure about that. even the larger portion of the hardcore gamers will push the easy button mode if they're offered it.
the more control you give players, the more ways they'll find to abuse it.
offer a quest thats challenging and a quest thats easy. let the players figure out which quest they want to run. adding easy buttons to what were supposed to be challenging quests isn't rewarding.
Not if the shinies scale according to difficulty setting.
F2P MMOs are about getting as many to play as possible. At the same time they are about replay value. Mmo audience, rpg, and pen & paper audiences have recognized patterns of difficulty, and they are vastly different. Naturally, in those three groups you have those who like all different types of challenges. With so many people coming from so many different walks of life and play levels, choices seem the only practical way to ensure more people click that Neverwinter icon each time.
This is a major topic for Neverwinter, and Cryptic needs to discus in more detail how THEY will gauge challenge in this game for us gamers.
Personally, the "easiness" of CO is a major turn off, and cheapens the entire game for me. There needs to be more challenge available for those who desire it...
Trying to balance the game for solo vs. party, and for those who want easy access to all quests vs. those who want much more challenging content will prove impossible without providing multiple ways to play.
The problem with Cryptic calling the blows and saying "this quest is easy" and "This quest is the ubernutz" is that once you beat it, there's no more challenge. Also a vast majority of casuals may never get to see a vast majority of the game. Ultimately, if there's too much easy or more hard content, that will define the game.
The easiest setting should have no valuable loot, and very little gold drop. Personally, I feel the game should lean towards group play, without making it a requirement. It should be played as a group no matter how small... and even tho it can be played alone or with two, should be rather difficulty to do so. But it should be doable. It should make people strive to want to get into the harder content. Make gamers strive for it.
Maybe the best reason to do this is it allows us to revisit out favorite quests as a slightly higher level toon, and still find challenge.. in addition to all the quests that are in level. More reason to play Cryptic content, more reason to play UGC, just more to do.
The game should scream D&D first, mmo second.
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | NEVERWINTER GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!
Logically, metrics on how people play the game in testing and when the game launches should tell Cryptic more about game play trends, but if STO and CO is any indication though the vast majority will solo or duo and will occasionally jump into group content via pugs, the challenge for Cryptic is to make traditional static group (played by guilds and regular group sessions) content interesting and rewarding enough to foster that style of game play while not alienating everyone else..... still, it's tough to do especially if one demographic is relatively small compared to the other.
(though I am a hardcore fan)
The demographic is simply different for Neverwinter, and it should be recognized by Cryptic. I'll bet you this game is adding 10-15 years easy on rolling averages compared with the superhero game and sto.
STO: Here's a post -" In march of 2012, I saw an estimate of ~4,600 playing on Steam, down from ~7k people during/shortly after the steam re-release. So lets say ~ 25 thousand people actually play STO in some capacity. Some people have estimated higher than 50, 80, 100 thousand though. Whats interesting is to see how many people from the steam list have stopped playing after they presumably got through all the content or just gave up playing."
Sounds like they should be finding new ways to market to those actually in their core demographic.
I hope as we get closer to launch, they do just this.
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | NEVERWINTER GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!
From my experience playing both of those games since beta there doesn't seem to be a lack of players and the cash shops seem to be hopping, if the situation is similar in Neverwinter the core demographic may end up taking a back seat, after all the core demographic is for the most part a very picky group.
Personally I think cryptic will market to a broader demographic, they do a lot I think to keep STO very Trek focused though some hard core Trekkies disagree with me, I think at the end of the day the situation will be similar for this game.
3) People playing more should get more, sure. However, exp/time should absolutely not be a 1:1 ratio. There still has to be a group of fast and highly rewarding activities that can be completed in about an hour/ an hour and a half, that contitute a major part of the experience available per day. That is to ensure that the so-called "casuals", while definitely behind the so-called "hardcore" in terms of progression, at least still have them somewhat in sight in terms of basic things, like experience and gold. Those "casuals" make up the major part of the population, so unless you want to play in an empty server and have the game shut down after a few months, you better not kick them away. Not to mention that you don't always have the time necessary to do all things you want each day, so you should always have that fast daily exp and gold source to keep you near where you want to be.
1. I don't want a character to max out within a month...but six months is waaaaay too long. We're playing D&D and you are EXPECTED to make another character. If you're not expecting to have multiple characters then you are sorely mistaken.
2. I love rare and random events/drops. I do have to agree any such events probably shouldn't be implemented or triggered in any way by grinding content though.
3. This is 100% dependent on your definition of casual. I don't consider a person who doesn't care to join 200 member guilds in order to do large raids or 100% of the time max group rush quests "hardcore."
If you don't put the time into the game you obviously shouldn't get freebies and bonus experience but neither should the game outright push players to make the game their lives in order to advance.
That is an opinion ;-)
No matter how casual or hardcore I am about a game I have very few games which I don't at least browse the game forums even if I don't post on them.
Furthermore there's varying styles of hard core and just because you play the game a lot doesn't win the "hardcore" title.
It could also be argued that the players who are on the forums tend to care more about the game than those who only play the game. I've been friends with many different players over the years and in my experience most people who didn't post or at least read the forums might have played a lot but truly didn't care about the game. If something happened that they didn't like they abandoned ship in a heartbeat.
I can't say I could classify those types of players as "hardcore" regardless of how much time they put into the game per day/week/month.
Yeah I agree with what you're saying but I don't think anyone wants to turn players away just because they don't group, after everything I have seen, read and heard about Neverwinter I just don't see this game being grouped focused, that doesn't mean that there won't be a lot for groups to do though, I just hope there is enough for each demographic to do without feeling left out.
I'm not even talking about groups. I'm talking about basic stuff like exp and gold. Because that's all you really need to progress. You don't need to bother with farming gear from dungeons, you can just buy that stuff if you have the money and the levels.
I'm also personally against the whole "choose your difficulty" thingie in dungeons. I just don't really like difficulty settings in RPGs because the difficulty levels always make enemies feel either artificially difficult or artificially easy. It's also a big immersion breaker to have to select difficulty when you enter a dungeon: "Hey, do you want to face the real Raven Queen, a Raven Queen that can be beatten by a couple warriors, a Raven Queen that you can beat alone, or a Raven Queen that can be beaten by a quadriplegic puppy on sleep pill medication?"...
Just have easy dungeons, normal dungeons and hard dungeons. If you feel something is too hard, level up a bit and come back. If you feel it's too easy, try going with fewer members, so that you get to keep more of the loot. It works in other games, why can't it work here?
This is what destroyed DDO for me - earlier raids like adq2, von6, abbot - take like max 20-25 mins to do with good team (some even 5-10 mins).
Then LOB came... not THAT long but longer than most. And now with new update... new raid is like 40+ mins for most of people.
I am bored sitting in the same instance so much time. And lets be honest - on max lvl raiding = almost everything.
I dont always have 1hour + for a game and now in ddo its like - if u have 25 lvl and only 30 mins - theres is no real sense of logging in and doing anything - only thing on pug in mostly new raid.... SOMETIMES abbot and lob if ure lucky :P
Second thing is new gear killed old raids for most of people - at least on Cannith.
So developers - if u put new gear in game in time... dont make it be superior and OP compared to old one. A little better, or with other bonuses - yes. But making old gear look like trash is not cool :P.
I agree with slow leveling. I dont want to be max lvl in a week or 2.
And I also prefer some random great stuff over mats crafting (in DDO I never do challenges.... its simpy boring).
Traps hm.... mini games sound fun but what other people in pty are supposed to do when rogue plays mini game? :P If theyre short why not.
But still - it SHOULD depend on roll. Not on mini game or player reflex.
Sounds like you truly wanted this game to be an rpg or coop. Nothing wrong with that, I loved almost all the official D&D RPGs. I agree Cryptic needs to draw in those who prefer soloable content as well. But, should they unbalance the game in order to accomplish this (making the game turn-key easy?) Heck no, they should have kept it a coop game if the goal was to provide mostly solo/duo play.
Hardcore vs casual. Solo vs party. Group play = turn gamers away. Your opinion of each of those terms/phrases are going to differ from other opinions, as are mine. Worse, there will be many that choose to do all three, solo, run with a friend or 2, or run full group.
That's why their needs to be multiple difficulty settings, and quests designed to challenge those at all levels and play abilities. The Foundry should be able to handle this.
This is not Superman versus the world. It's Dungeons & Dragons. And Cryptic needs to sell the game as such, and build value. WHY should someone play such a game? Here are the benefits. Then they can say they have games that cater to mostly solo/duo experiences (CO & STO) and to full group experiences (Neverwinter).
Nothing wrong with selling Neverwinter as a game that can be played with any number of players (up to five) - but they should highlight group features unique to Neverwinter that improves upon their efforts in CO and STO.
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | NEVERWINTER GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!
I like that too. I prefer letting the user decide, but I'd be ok with having Cryptic decide as long as there is enough good content at each level of difficulty. In the beginning this is going to be rough.... but I believe a longish beta might be of some use here...
PS: Heck you might even be able to do both, if you set a limit on how easy or difficult you can make a quest (say 5 level range for a loose example). This will allow those that enjoy someone's Foundry work a few extra levels where they can play that content, before leaving it. I totally agree with you that Raven Queen whose a level 5 monster should not be a challenge to Mr. Level 55 Paladin.
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | NEVERWINTER GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!
100% agree.
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | NEVERWINTER GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!
Well said. What kind of bragging rights do you have to beating the Raven Queen when anyone could beat her on a different difficulty? And which one is the "real" Raven Queen, the difficulty that the people who designed her wanted to play at? And balancing the loot that the Raven Queen drops across different difficulties is a nightmare.
In single player games and in MMOs - if it's too tough, go level up, get some new gear, and come back. Don't give easy buttons.