Official: Companion Balance Changes Feedback

xalkastiz · February 2023

Greetings, Heroes of Neverwinter!

The impact of companion DPS on balance has been a topic of interest for some time so I wanted to let you know about some upcoming balance changes to combat companions. We’ve made efforts to address underperforming and overperforming companions in the past, however we’ve only recently been able to take a more comprehensive approach. The overall goal is to bring the top tier performers more in line with one another and increase the effectiveness of underperformers and niche role companions. By standardizing the combat formulas used, we can ensure future companions and current companions both remain desirable and effective.

This change means that some top tier companions will experience a reduction in base damage. More specifically, several companions with AoE powers were using single target damage formulas, and a handful of single target companions were using formulas that did not scale well with player stats (Paranoid Delusion being the prime example). Our adjustments are intended to keep everything at the same relative desirability: if a companion was top tier DPS before, it will still be at the top - just not so far ahead of the pack as to invalidate the use of others.

To further clarify, we are not simply lowering damage across the board. Since much of the high-end content has already been balanced around the current companions, and the overall goal was to achieve a more balanced experience, we will also be boosting all companion damage by roughly 20%. This increase will be applied to everything using the new damage formulas, including those whose damage was initially reduced. NOTE: This change is not yet live on Preview.

I understand that changes to established content can feel frustrating, but I want to re-emphasize that our intent is not to rearrange companions’ current desirability, but to prevent the outliers from disrupting the overall balance of the game. Once you’ve had a chance to test the changes, we would greatly appreciate any feedback you might have on the updated experience. While we do not plan on reverting any companions back to their previous states, we will be paying close attention to feedback on their performance, which may prompt adjustments. We are particularly interested in how the pets compare relative to each other, so feedback such as, “My X used to deal 30% more damage than my Y, but now deals 5% less.” is especially useful to us.

For a broader overview of how we approach game balance, please check out the excellent Balance Changes: General Direction post.

weebz · February 2023

Look you guys need to get your stuff together. This MTOS HAMSTER has completely destroyed certain classes. Developing a Dungeon that less than 1% of the player base can complete all the while completely destroying entire classes that is the dumbest marketing ploy I have seen yet. You wonder why the game is dying? Stop listening to all the 1% elites and open you ears to the 99% of us that pays the bills. You may be smart with development but you guys are complete idiots when it comes to sales and marketing. You need to refocus on where your revenue is coming from if you want to have a job in 2023.

autumnwitch · February 2023

I just hope that people who paid for the premium companions in the packs/offers over the last few years still feel value for their money. One risk of making everything special is that nothing is special. Another thing of making things too homogenous is that it takes away the fun of being able to switch out companions for different situations and scenarios. Part of the engagement of the game (especially for us non elite 1%ers) is actually having fun with the game and not just chasing BiS all the time.

destrion · February 2023

Bringing all dps companions more in line with eachother sounds great but if you look at what is on preview now PD does even more dmg then it did before.
So that kind of achieved the opposite of what you are talking about

Are you at least thinking about rereleasing it in a lockbox so it's obtainable again for new players?

fritz · February 2023

> @xalkastiz#5524 said:
> Greetings, Heroes of Neverwinter!
>
NOTE: This change is not yet live on Preview.
>

Is the whole system not on PTS our just the damage increase for companions. Because the discrepancy between different types is still stark. Plus the damage of the mentioned Paranoid Delusion still differs significantly between classes. For some it's best in slot while completely worthless for others. This companion alone is a glaring balancing mess.

strathkin · February 2023

xalkastiz#5524 said:
Greetings, Heroes of Neverwinter!

The impact of companion DPS on balance has been a topic of interest for some time so I wanted to let you know about some upcoming balance changes to combat companions...

if a companion was top tier DPS before, it will still be at the top - just not so far ahead of the pack as to invalidate the use of others.

...and the overall goal was to achieve a more balanced experience, we will also be boosting all companion damage by roughly 20%. This increase will be applied to everything using the new damage formulas, including those whose damage was initially reduced. NOTE: This change is not yet live on Preview.

For a broader overview of how we approach game balance, please check out the excellent Balance Changes: General Direction post.

It's good to know this change isn't yet "LIVE" or at least "All" of the planned changes which may be more accurate? Guess we will have to wait and see, as many speculated that it had been on Preview, so the Market (Auction) on LIVE always adjusts a bit too early...

rngrob · February 2023

> @weebz#4878 said:
> Look you guys need to get your stuff together. This MTOS HAMSTER has completely destroyed certain classes. Developing a Dungeon that less than 1% of the player base can complete all the while completely destroying entire classes that is the dumbest marketing ploy I have seen yet. You wonder why the game is dying? Stop listening to all the 1% elites and open you ears to the 99% of us that pays the bills. You may be smart with development but you guys are complete idiots when it comes to sales and marketing. You need to refocus on where your revenue is coming from if you want to have a job in 2023.

Totally agree with you on this point. Hopefully the changes to companions ends the stupid metas that have become all to common since the launch of "Master" 1% content.

Unknown · February 2023

This content has been removed.

dracory1 · February 2023

Might be a far fetched idea but I'd like to see Companions of the Hall bonus expanded upon. Currently, there's no reason to run any other than Drizzt, Regis is used for absurd damage which is about to be nerfed... In terms of power I believe only tanks ever slot Bruenor or Regis, no one slots or uses Catti-Brie (but that's the issue of having Control Bonus which does not work as intended since forever).

The idea is to expand their power stacking to not just their active power but also summon power. For example, a Drizzt with Bruenor summoned would provide 4.5% bonus to damage instead of 3%
It does replace 5 out of 10 companions used in trials and 5 out of 5 in regular content but I feel like the change would be welcome even for dungeons. My idea for progression is:
1 - 3%
2 - 4.5%
3 - 6%
4 - 7.5%
5 - 10% (1% bonus for running all 5)
It should be enough to actually incentivize people to run those companions as they have such unique bonuses that no one uses.

aster · February 2023

Hello @xalkastiz#5524 and thank you for the thread!
Are you planning to change the augment companions as well?
In the current state, augment gives 30k rating stats to the owner, splitted into 3 main stats (or only one for Golden companions).

The problem with augments is that these RATING stats go over the cap 99% of the time, making companions useless in the mid and endgame.

I think it would be nice suggestion if augument could be reworked:: instead of giving rating stats it would be more interesting if they would give %stats, Maybe for balance not 30% of %stats but more or less 21% (7% each % stats). Or change Companion Enchantment to give %.
Thanks again!

mparcher · February 2023

Curious why companions are even being considered for changes when there are much bigger issues in the game that haven't been addressed. These proposed changes look as if they will have almost no effect on the outcome of dungeon runs which basically means they have no impact on the game. Probably should leave them alone and tackle bigger issues.

wazzer23 · February 2023

Zariel is one of the hardest companions to get a hold of one of the best looking and yet completely useless. Do you think you guys could make it decent? Any of your premium companions that are sold in the zen store or in packs etc should be at least outperforming the in game free and easy to get comps. So bring back xuna because right now it's ridiculous to expect people to pay to win an elite companion pack and for all the companions to be sub par. If you fix this and your sales go up I expect 10% commission 😆

arran · February 2023

xalkastiz#5524 said:

The overall goal is to bring the top tier performers more in line with one another and increase the effectiveness of underperformers and niche role companions. By standardizing the combat formulas used, we can ensure future companions and current companions both remain desirable and effective.

Balance Changes: General Direction post.

Yall post that at least once per year and it always comes down to nerfing whatever everyone uses and buffing the rarest companion you can find. Balance will not be achieved and we'll all use whatever aragon tells us to use.

nymeria · February 2023

I totally agree with weebz. While you talk about working on companions, there are dps that are end game, but still cannot keep up with the buff you put on certain dps classes. Elites will not even look at some classes for new content runs, even if they have the stats, bis weapons, bis companions, mounts, etc. Been playing this game for 7+ yrs, and it gets so frustrating that I can be end game, higher stats than some, have everything I am supposed to have, but still get told my dps is to low because some classes, like the wizard, get such a huge buff, that other classes can't keep up on the damage board. So to that wizard, your just not good enough to run with! Why don't you make ALL dps classes on an even playing field instead of tweaking companions, yet again?!? I don't need to be number 1 on the damage board, I play this game for fun, not to be the best over everyone else, but jeez, there are times when their is 100mil difference, no matter if you have perfect stats or not. Please cryptic, gearbox, arc, etc developers, can you help out some other dps classes?!? I run arbiter and even though the cleric was made to heal, you made a dps path, but make it so difficult to run anything worth running. It may get you through lower levels, but God forbid you want to run anything end game!

nymeria · February 2023

> @"rngrob#7231" said:
> > @"weebz#4878" said:
> > Look you guys need to get your stuff together. This MTOS HAMSTER has completely destroyed certain classes. Developing a Dungeon that less than 1% of the player base can complete all the while completely destroying entire classes that is the dumbest marketing ploy I have seen yet. You wonder why the game is dying? Stop listening to all the 1% elites and open you ears to the 99% of us that pays the bills. You may be smart with development but you guys are complete idiots when it comes to sales and marketing. You need to refocus on where your revenue is coming from if you want to have a job in 2023.
>
> Totally agree with you on this point. Hopefully the changes to companions ends the stupid metas that have become all to common since the launch of "Master" 1% content.

You are so very right! I wish they would fix this before tweaking companions, again.

Unknown · February 2023

This content has been removed.

strathkin · February 2023

aster#8001 said:
Hello @xalkastiz#5524 and thank you for the thread!
Are you planning to change the augment companions as well?
In the current state, augment gives 30k rating stats to the owner, splitted into 3 main stats (or only one for Golden companions).

The problem with augments is that these RATING stats go over the cap 99% of the time, making companions useless in the mid and endgame.

I think it would be nice suggestion if augument could be reworked:: instead of giving rating stats it would be more interesting if they would give %stats, Maybe for balance not 30% of %stats but more or less 21% (7% each % stats). Or change Companion Enchantment to give %.
Thanks again!

While I'm fine with how Augments are now, you have to choose the one that's right for you based on your 3 lowest stat's.

The one issue I see with your proposed solution, and this isn't a criticism either, so please don't take it as such; it's just feedback to re-think. As this would virtually make all Augments virtually the same, if I understood you correctly, except the Companion bonus. So while I like your idea to suggest a change, I'd instead suggest something to not upset others; so future Augments possibly offer a revision as it may give more Opportunities for Cryptic to consider--despite the # of people that liked your initial idea.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Augments: Consider Expanding (some) future ones perhaps into 4 stat's; doesn't apply to Golden, or existing ones!

Note: Most Golden companions all in on 1, isn't good for everyone; yet changing also be bad; as it penalize those who use effectively!
╘ In future maybe consider Golden perhaps with 2 stat's as well?

Most will want their 3 stat Augments (existing) companions to remain unchanged!

WIN-WIN ♫♪♫♪♪ ♫♪♫♪♪♪ ♪ ♫♪ ♪
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That might likely make a much easier sell, as that would give Cryptic Studios even far more Variation to expand by updating more variations of new Augments over time.

And wouldn't require changing any of the existing offerings, as that might upset a lot who like them as they are!

Why, because some depend upon the augment for exactly what they have, like the Cat, Butterfly for Tanks as an example, and there are countless others that might not be happy with this proposal. Most navigated just fine in the existing system of Augments, by changing their Mount Equip Power, or their Enchantments around, and then choosing the Augment for their 3 lowest stat's to boost their base value up to 50%.

It also gives them great opportunities to introduce new Companions with slightly different Companion Bonus!

Just something to think about, as I said not a criticism, just some constructive feedback.

vareena · February 2023

Fix your current issues first like floating players who can't do anything.

The orb in Ravenloft wiping players in trial stats too fast like it instant wipes you now no one gets a chance to face it before "BOOM" your dead.

Fix the weird double peen glitch with weapon Illusions on the umber hulk, serious the weapon Illusions show a weird double peen on your Umber hulk mount.

Also Fix your companions ai they literally all go stupid tard mode and not do anything alot. Might as well go without if the ai doesn't work correctly.

Also allow more Mote and glyph drops instead of having to buy them more.

Increase the amount of refining for Astral diamonds.

Penalize players for entering skirmishes, dungeons and trials harder for leaving them cause they didn't like the group or dungeon/Skermish/trial. I had so many players leaving like this it makes the game less fun.

Match making for previous thing needs a update like have a thing like WoW where you could choose a role and not get left with non healing healers who only heal themselves not the group or a tank who can't tank.

You guys would do so much better if you would listen to some players suggestions.

froger · February 2023

To everyone saying "fix other things first", it has been said countless times that different teams work on different things.

As for what I'd like to see with companions, my thoughts haven't changed much from https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter#/discussion/1255871/xuna-a-companion-worthy-of-being-by-my-side

If healer companion could provide reasonable healing, maybe they would be chosen. For example, I have an epic Lillend on my Barb and it's utterly useless at healing, this makes me not want to bother obtaining and leveling other healer type companions because I expect the same result. On some of my alts I have the Neverember Guard and it doesn't hold aggro to save it's life.

I want my companion to be useful. I want to be able to have a companion focused build to enhance my companion's role (heal, control, tank, dps). Yes, I miss my Xuna build on my Cleric healer, but know it isn't coming back. Man, was that hella fun.

I think it would be good to have companions that perform differently in different content, such as an increase in damage for a specific dungeon for a specific companion (ideally the one sold with the new content pack for the new content dungeon). This would be a nice bonus to go with the campaign currency bonus.

I like the idea of expanding on the champions of the hall companion bonus mentioned above.

What I don't want is all companions outputting similar DPS all the time.

Another thought is overload enchantments specifically for companions should be a thing again.

martax2008 · February 2023

Change the rule of the game during the match is unfair . We have a lot of companions that are no longer needed because "balancing" with no compensation. Now a new balancing incoming and i bet will be only new bis companion to buy/upgrade .

froger · February 2023

martax2008#4212 said:
Change the rule of the game during the match is unfair . We have a lot of companions that are no longer needed because "balancing" with no compensation. Now a new balancing incoming and i bet will be only new bis companion to buy/upgrade .

You should probably consider any money spent on this game to be temporary paid entertainment. What's gone is gone.
I adopted this thinking long ago. The reality is the game is everchanging.

plasticbat · February 2023

martax2008#4212 said:
Change the rule of the game during the match is unfair . We have a lot of companions that are no longer needed because "balancing" with no compensation. Now a new balancing incoming and i bet will be only new bis companion to buy/upgrade .

There is no rule. If there is a rule, it is a rule you established on your own.
Nothing is BiS forever. Whatever BiS stuff you have right now were the replacement of the last generation of BiS stuff which were the replacement of the BiS stuff before them. There have been Nth generations of BiS stuff.

quetzal437 · February 2023

Here's a thought. Give companions the same (I'll even settle for similar) A.I. as the enemies we face... since they are both server controlled after all. It is, and has been for at least the entire 6+ years I've played this game, absolutely infuriating to continue to adjust for combat advantage in solo play when my fully conscious but tactically, utterly stupid, companions deliberately and repeatedly maneuver to stand right next to me in combat when nearly the entire bestiary we face, including but by no means is limited to, mindless zombies, dimwit humanoids, uncontrolled undead, and even... frogs, are all smart enough to flank us in combat. Ask yourselves what sense this makes. I'll help - If I only had a brainless zombie as a companion I might get one tacticaly smart enough to not want to kill the companion myself. At least when the Chultan tiger went suicidal 8 times per dungeon run I had the satisfaction of watching the brainless thing off itself so I didn't have to. Relative power based on tier is a fantasy and has been the whole time. It's always going to be "do you have a chultan tiger? No? Too bad you can't play. Do you have a broom with 3 ring slots? No? Too bad you can't play. Do you have a bulette pup? No? Too bad you can't play. Do you have a Xuna? Abyssal chick? Cold Iron Warrior? Succubus? Regis? Pseudodragon? Not yet? Sorry, you don't have the next best in slot, you can't play. It's a broken record. And will be until you guys do what's been suggested.. Make them situational, or delete 75% of them and turn the rest ALL into augments and eliminate toxicity and solve an ongoing problem in one move. Otherwise we get unrealistic expectations based on tier quality (stands to reason a mythic comp obtained through purchase or gameplay would have a higher tier and thus more potential as a throwaway green of the same type.. Or ANY type, creating another problem, anything obtained at less than mythic = worthless). Case in point, The 'Legendary Elite Pack'.. Shameful. Makos one-shot a dracolich in the opening tutorial.. Celeste healed a mortally wounded Xuna with one spell, Xuna lawn mowered undead like a harvester and Knox... well, he was pretty good at looking out over a wall surveying the battlefield giving the impression of tactical superiority, Since then, Celeste can't apply a band aid properly, Xuna had a moment of realized potential, but after several videos touting her greatness, a subsequently a big zen market sale afterward so players could fast track getting her, got quietly adjusted to the point her blades can't cut a dry cobweb, Knox, well, he still looks out over a wall just as good as he did in the hook but still doesn't know which side of an enemy to stand on and would lose a fight with a dandelion. Even the mythic lich version of Makos that players were duped into buying can't kill a single redcap goblin by himself. Seems to me a rebalance is a good idea.. Otherwise it's still a fairly blatant case of false advertising.

punchingdragons · February 2023

Consoles need a similar system like PC, because we cannot even effectively measure companions properly. Currently it's all guess work, and it makes for a horrible experience to tune a character. Is this something you guys could consider putting into the development path?

bielius · February 2023

One point could be emphasize the 'connection' of a punch of companions with every different classes and roles... Some companions could be the best for Warlocks DPS, while another one's could be the best for a Rogues DPS, and different ones for ranged and close combat DPS, and of course special supporters for healers or tanks, with convenient roles. This way will balance the zillions of companions all trough the tabletop.

quetzal437 · February 2023

By the way, the augments in their current state stink too. I know, that's not helpful. Truly unproductive. But the same can be said of the work that's been done to fix often wipe-inducing tank scroll lock over the past 2+ years but that's not the point. Even if augment companions somehow, by incredible magic, raised the stats of our choosing, 1 of them, 3 of them, the lowest, the highest, even all of them to cap, our stats are still at 90% of value when 'max' is the term of use. "90% is max". Not 100%, 90%. That's the problem. Even if the wild idea that an augment could breach cap over 90% when summoned (not going to happen.. talk about a revenue killer) were to take shape it does not eliminate the impression I get that even with 90% in every stat, offensive, defensive and utility, our toon's max value is 90% in game, and by extension, my time's value is only worth 90% to the folks who provide the game we support. Every 1% less in any stat reduces this value. With this in mind, for any money or unit of time spent, you get a max of 90% value at best. What do you get for the missing 10%? Orange numbers telling you "don't do that". And to make things even more concrete, I get scaled in most of the content I enjoy spending time in.. As if screaming "hey player, play our game, build your toon to it's max, fall 10% short at best, then grab an augment companion that colors the stats you want orange, then we'll scale you down to the same potential you had two weeks into the game.. Unless you want to run the latest stuff, which you'll need to grab 90% of your 4 maxxed friends to help you"

wilbur626 · February 2023

Please add some kind of tag to identify a companions "role" (AoE or Single target damage dealer)

quetzal437 · February 2023

Another Idea? Offer a companion waiver. Something that allows the player the option to ditch the silly idea of bringing an extra cleric that can't heal, a fighter that can't hit... a housecat.. a baby chicken... into a dungeon chock full of Devils, Giants, Illithids, Demon Lords, Ancient Dragons, Liches, Vampires, Spider Queens and God knows what else to help them get through it In exchange for an extra encounter power (or allowing the existing ones to work properly) or reduced daily action point costs. Seriously, what lethal arsenal does a baby chicken bring to the party to help contend with a blessed tank buster giant drider under a demon goddess' personal favor? Or a 5 headed dragon goddess herself known as "The Great Catastrophe" Moral support? "Thank goodness you brought that marshmallow peep with us, Paladin, don't think we could've made it without it biting Tiamat in half with it's tiny beak and beating her 5 heads half senseless with it's tiny wings". Think about it. Less arguing, less balancing math, less graphic animation and tracking... less blue screens from future fixes. And a 3rd option.

havatem · February 2023

I feel the companions do indeed need a huge overhaul. Unfortunately though past changes have shown us all that more mistakes tend to be added than are fixed. Fix one break two others.

This is imo 2 issues firstly as stated before changing the old code for new is outwith most of the Devs currently skill set. They don't understand how the original line interfere with the new and vice versa. Secondly whomever proofs your algorithms, equations and maths is 90% of the time wrong. Luckily it has only been two huge mistakes in the last couple years. Unfortunately it's the cumulative small errors that are the big issues.

90% stats is thee biggest issue it's confusing to new players and baffling to mathematicians like myself.
You'll fix most of the formulas if you up said figure to 100%

Next your companion formula tries to give a striker companion 50% of a players stats (most basic term for application of comp dmg). This inherently changes pre stated formula. Now add in damage modifications and that formula is 4 rows back least of any priority.
Again this is fixed by creation of 100%
Give the player 100% stats and the companions 100% of their own stats. Then allow additional modification only activated on command lines (application of players powers artifacts etc)

Is this possible some will ask simple answer yes because you stop any fractals. Basically the system tries to correct itself by rounding up, or what we see powers miss fire etc. It's also much simpler to write easier to maintain and 100% accessable to add remove without any crossover's.
You operate a car at 90% you'll quickly break said car. ( Electrics burn out cables snap )

Please allow others to proof your formula and not on a test server with pen and paper like we were taught.
PS I volunteer for free no strings at all. the formula is useless I can't gain any advantage from it. You never know we both may learn something new.
Tbf if you can teach me anything new I'll pay you a coal mote.

strathkin · February 2023

froger#9967 said:
To everyone saying "fix other things first", it has been said countless times that different teams work on different things.

As for what I'd like to see with companions, my thoughts haven't changed much from https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter#/discussion/1255871/xuna-a-companion-worthy-of-being-by-my-side

If healer companion could provide reasonable healing, maybe they would be chosen. For example, I have an epic Lillend on my Barb and it's utterly useless at healing, this makes me not want to bother obtaining and leveling other healer type companions because I expect the same result. On some of my alts I have the Neverember Guard and it doesn't hold aggro to save it's life.

I agree with you, I don't think Augments have a problem either. I tried saying that in 'an indirect way' when I said you have to choose one with the 3 lowest stat's, and if you are using 2, or 3 focused enchantments, don't use an augment with that stat unless you still require it. Still I do think their is opportunity there, for Cryptic Studios to in future consider introducing new Augments with 4 stat's as that would still differentiate each from one another, while offering something 'slightly different' in future. This also would offer more choice not less, and wouldn't break those companions people have invested in & love.

Still getting back to your note, I hope that's what Cryptic is considering. I mean many Healer Companions back in the day use to be (somewhat) good at assisting a Healer out, still the primary role fell on the Healer. Yet now most Healer Companions don't, or won't make a noticeable difference:

One case & point is this guy:
https://neverwinter.fandom.com/wiki/Dedicated_Squire

Cleansing Touch
"The squire heals and cleanses all allies in melee range, removing any CC effects and healing up to 15% of targets health over 6 seconds." --melee range means having to be really close, within 5-8 ft to notice; & can no longer encourage companion's behavior.

I will stop there as an example, as I think your full message states it very clearly, still I remain hopeful the changes will make more companions desirable again... ...we'll just have to wait, once it's on Preview!

punchingdragons said:
Consoles need a similar system like PC, because we cannot even effectively measure companions properly. Currently it's all guess work, and it makes for a horrible experience to tune a character. Is this something you guys could consider putting into the development path?

It also would be wonderful if on Damage, Healing, Damage absorbed, etc... those various Rankings in Dungeons, Trials, Skirmishes; they then broke Player Character's, & to their right showed Companion contributions to the fight.

martax2008 · February 2023

plasticbat said:

martax2008#4212 said:
Change the rule of the game during the match is unfair . We have a lot of companions that are no longer needed because "balancing" with no compensation. Now a new balancing incoming and i bet will be only new bis companion to buy/upgrade .
There is no rule. If there is a rule, it is a rule you established on your own.
Nothing is BiS forever. Whatever BiS stuff you have right now were the replacement of the last generation of BiS stuff which were the replacement of the BiS stuff before them. There have been Nth generations of BiS stuff.

Who say companion/stuff should be Bis forever ? Simply add new that outperform instead of HAMSTER up the existing.
True there is no rule but someone here speaks about of quality of life in game and destroy companion/stuff is far to be funny for a player.

Official: Companion Balance Changes Feedback

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