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Preview Patch Notes: NW.123.20201218a.1

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  • rikitakirikitaki Member Posts: 774 Arc User

    I suspect, in the future, that they will uncap power and defense, or rework the system all over again. I'm only saying this because DPS is only about 50% away from being able to cap all offensive ratings. How long will that last?

    Forever. There is no way to get more than there already is. (except a major rework of potions or a major item bonus overhaul)
    Any stats come with IL, IL increases stat cap. You are moving nowhere. Quite the contrary, actually. The more IL you have, all the stats put into a specific aspect are watered down. At 50k IL it is not much difference between putting 500 points to power and defence - the change in your % stats would be exactly 1%... which is a bit too little as getting 500 specific stats is not exactly easy.

    If you ever reach full mount and full companion bolster, there is not much to improve. At least, there certainly is no reason to put too much of an effort to change a piece of gear for some other to gain a meagre 500IL increase, or to switch some stat to another. You would not notice the difference if the change means just 1% improvement.
  • tardbathtardbath Member Posts: 80 Arc User
    edited December 2020
    @wilbur626

    After your proposal i jumped back into preview, and i have to say. My tank finaly takes damage even in eCC. Those are good changes and it seems like, tanks will be needed after all and a healer ofc. Didn't test with dps, not enough time.

    Cheers
  • supmadbrosupmadbro Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    I'm fine with vorpal being crit chance, but should be increased a bit from 4%. Vorpal seems very weak considering with 90% crit sev 4% crit rate is probably about 3-3.5% dmg, bilethorn 60 magnitude hits (not including the 8% dmg on at-will, daily, encounter) does 5-11% depending on class. If vorpal was 8% crit rate it could be better than bilethorn on certain dps classes. Also enchants like dread/flaming/frost/plague fire provide similar dmg to vorpal but also provide a bonus to the whole team.
  • zimxero#8085 zimxero Member Posts: 876 Arc User
    edited December 2020
    I don't do PvP, but this stat system may have a big disparity between PvE and PvP. In PvE, all dps players are going to max their accuracy. If these builds are taken over to PvP... then deflection and deflect severity are useless there. To counter PvE style builds in PvP, defenders will max defense first, then crit avoid, then awareness, in that order. Crit avoid in PvP, kills opposing stats on a 2:1 ratio. The dps PvP builds will probably be Power, accuracy, CA, Defense, Crit avoid, and awareness.

    In short... deflect/severity & critical/severity will be avoided in PvP, because they cost 180% to make good, but only cost 90% to make completely worthless.

    Why are we limiting stat totals? Who cares if players go over 50% stat and 40% bonus? Why can't we just make it open ended?


    SUGGESTION: Raise the max to 100% in every category, and allow it to be from any combination (stats or bonus).
  • darthpotaterdarthpotater Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,128 Arc User
    edited December 2020

    Wow that vorpal change was.... unespected. Really. I cant think in how many vorpals are bound in the game since last exchange. Wow. Make it at least usefull. Even it lost his "thematical" theme. A vorpal weapon is a deadly one, well not anymore.

    Note that I dont use vorpal but I feel the pain of those who do.

    Enchants should open more builds, if you are going to change them, please come with something more creative. x% to a stat? meh. Ask us for ideas. I wont write here a wall of possible ideas if those will be ignored. You didnt even tell us that enchantments were going to be reworked.

    There were asks to make sure enchants were working on the percents and not the ratings. There were also asks to change Vorpal because people felt Crit Severity was easy to get and vorpal does not push crit severity over the cap.

    I have no issue swapping vorpal back to crit severity if people prefer it to stay there.
    First thank you for the replay, we aprecieate that you are even working in the weekend.

    Maybe you didnt understand my post, or maybe I can be more clear now: What I wanted to say is that If you are taking the precious time to work in the enchants, do it with balance and diversity in mind.

    I dont want critical severity back. Critical strike can be OK. But 4%? a companion gives 7,5% and we can have 5!.

    I wont count the bonus when using a daily. I will give you an example:
    - 4% increase in critical strike (other contributions)
    - When you make a critical hit, there is a X% chance that the enemy gets a Y magnitude damage (this could be more thematical with vorpal)

    but we can have other ideas, like when you make a critical hit, reduce the cooldowns of encounter powers in X sec (Y sec cooldown) or other ideas that can enable unique builds.

    Or When you make a critical hit, there is a 1% chance to give half the Action points, ask us for ideas if you are willing to change enchants, we can come with something interesting for each, and make all desirable (more or less).

    But this is not only about vorpal. Is also important that the other enchants changed are balanced, Now, only 1 or 2 are viable, and the same with armor enchantments.

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  • ron#1747 ron Member Posts: 115 Arc User
    > @arazith07 said:
    > There really weren't any arguments supported by facts against it. Just feeling and thoughts. Feedback was taken from those who suggested things with actual numbers and such. Tanks will still be required for endgame content, if you can prove that a dps can tank ToMM or Zariel with the changes on preview now, feel free to show it and continue doing so as damage gets adjusted.

    Of course that tanks are still going to be relevant in endgame content. It's just that they won't be relevant in the other 99% of the game's content
  • dracory1#6808 dracory1 Member Posts: 78 Arc User
    Alright, for the sake of loving god, this is a feedback that comes through after 3 different builds.

    Please, give us more sources of ratings. At 48k item level it was easy to cap everything on preview, I simply changed my runestones, companion equipment and enchantments plus some gear.

    Then, my item level was bumped up to 51k - it was barely manageable and critical severity was starting to limp behind.

    Now I am nearly at 53k - it is practically impossible to cap everything offensive. I need to use Goristro Horns for Critical Strike, Critical Severity before didn't even need a companion bonus, now I need at least one with 3.8% and using 2x companion equipment for critical severity. My defense was reduced to 45% from 50% overall.

    While people do get more damage from higher item level, the fact of not capping stats will cause a paradox where lower item level will give you more damage just because you'll be able to cap more stats at 50% from ratings.

    My suggestion?
    Collars should give 90% of their item level in ratings as everything else does. They currently at epic give 600 item level with 300 ratings and... 3% to stamina - useless, 3% to RAD gain - useless, 3% to movement speed - not a viable gain, 3% to either encounters or at-wills (who even uses daily collars?!) - slightly more useful but rings have the same effect and give 90% ratings. The only other useful collar is the critical severity one.

    At least from a DPS's point of view.

    And with more changes coming to preview... I am just getting afraid of what my character ratings will look like soon.
  • mzreaper#7914 mzreaper Member Posts: 12 Arc User
    please change vorpal bonus or give us an exchange. CA on daily use is a joke, as useless as it was at least severity was something, this new item you created and chose to call vorpal is worthless
  • vastano#2343 vastano Member Posts: 169 Arc User
    as i said to northside all these changes were supposed to give us players MORE build diversity
    from what i have seen so far the changes are acually pigeonholing everyone into only having 1 build that only bis will do anything else is just not going to survive in party
    and as for solo (which most of early content is) it will be unable to do
    great way to lose players who have already spent in some cases thousands of dollars
    let alone any new player who happens to find or want to try neverwinter gets destroyed by first mobs they meet try to work out why look at the stats ask a few people who tell them the complexity of building to survive and go look for a game easier to play
    i know for a fact if i had looked at the mess this is when i came here from ddo i would have run a mile
  • bandoswb#3578 bandoswb Member Posts: 20 Arc User
    The attempts being made here are commendable, in particular to make scaling better so earlier content is more challenging (tho rewards have to be commensurate) and to allow choice in builds. Two suggestions:

    First: Allow 90% deflect chance and severity - as two stats this will be hard to get, but would make lots of alternate builds viable.

    Second, the Vorpal change. The fact that the Vorpal was NOT a part of always up crit severity, and only worked on atwills, encounters and dailies AND went above the 90% cap to 110% was excellent. Pretty clear that CA and Accuracy are going to be the new meta without the Vorpal operating in this way as both contribute directly to damage for only raising one stat. If the Vorpal continues to operate by going above the cap, I bet that it will make a crit build more viable as well. Again, choice. Do I want to cap crit and crit severity with my Vorpal, or cap accuracy and CA with my bile (or whatever)?
  • vastano#2343 vastano Member Posts: 169 Arc User
    on a side note just went to preview and companion stats are messed up again
    basicly every comp gives pretty much same stat boost be it augment or fighter
  • rhicle#5482 rhicle Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    What about the Holy Vorpal you guys just sold people with zen ? Or what about whose Vorpals are bound including me and my couple of friends? If there are no exchange vendors for these, we can easily tell you guys are trolling us at this point.
  • masterogamasteroga Member Posts: 349 Arc User
    You dont even need to play with ANY of these redesigned weapon enchants to see they will all be inferior to Bilethorn on bosses and Lightning on trash mobs (for DPS). What a shocking surprise!

    The magnitudes you tried to increase are just too low, how would flaming ever outperform bilethorn? The % reduction to enemy stats or % increase to your own stats just feel too low....as you can only equip 1 weapon enchant and they are very expensive.

    Last but not least, you still have weapon enchants that don't do anything till after you cast a daily? Get that garbage out of here! Your data from last few mods should show terror and feytouch were virtually unused, correct?
  • dracory1#6808 dracory1 Member Posts: 78 Arc User
    edited December 2020
    Alright, so here is a quick comparison of Preview vs Live Weight of Virtue for DPS

    PREVIEW
    [12/21 0:49][Combat (Self)]Zariel deals 902976 (1978872) Radiant Damage to you with Weight of Virtue.

    LIVE
    [12/21 0:54] [Combat (Self)] Zariel deals 464629 (1278828) Radiant Damage to you with Weight of Virtue.

    No deflect. I have used Paladin Sigil - 15% DR, and Resiliency of the Depths - 5% DR.
    Additionally I have used up my stamina. Which meant that I had around 7% DR from Lionheart weapon set bonus.
    And I have also used Courage Breaker on the boss, -15% OD.

    My defense on live was capped.
    My defense on preview was at 73.5% (ITC bonus + 63.5% defense).

    The problem is - I have used up all my companion slots and capped defense just for that where it is not healthy for DPS.
    I am sorry but with 600k+ HP (637k on my rogue) and mind set of gaining some power since I did have 10 mythic companions, as well as 10 mythic mounts, I should achieve better results than on live server. This. Is. Much. Much. Worse. I mean it. Even with 1/5 of damage going next patch it will still be too high for DPS to survive with 50% defense - and if I use nothing for defense I have only ~44.5% due to my item level being 52k and heavily bringing my % down.

    Please, don't tell me that we should just use more debuffs as phase 5 includes 4 WoVs in a row. Even on live I can survive outside of protection bubbles with just 500k HP if I happen to stand too far away from healers and tanks, which means that boss is getting debuffed for me with just a griffon, wyvern knives and tiamat's orb for the most part.

    Edit:
    What I forgot to mention, though it is a minor part, is Barkshield procs, which are negligible due to being at 2 stacks in both cases.
  • zimxero#8085 zimxero Member Posts: 876 Arc User
    If each weapon & armor enchantment had a small special effect vs certain enemy types, then players might be tempted to collect and swap more of them. For instance....

    Flame Weapon Enchant: gives an extra 5% to fire damage and to burning
    Flame Shield: also gives 5% damage reduction to enemies that use fire

    Lightning Weapon Enchant: also gives an extra 5% damage to lightning skills
    Lightning Armor Enchant: also gives 5% damage reduction to enemies that use lightning

    Vorpal Weapon Enchant: also gives 5% extra damage to physical at-will powers.
    Prominence enchant: also gives 5% damage reduction from behemoths.

    Holy Avenger Enchant: also gives 5% extra damage versus undead
    Life Drinker Enchant: also gives 5% damage reduction from magic creatures.


    ... just examples of what i mean. i didn't balance it out or anything
  • admiralwarlord#3792 admiralwarlord Member Posts: 510 Arc User

    If each weapon & armor enchantment had a small special effect vs certain enemy types, then players might be tempted to collect and swap more of them. For instance....

    Flame Weapon Enchant: gives an extra 5% to fire damage and to burning
    Flame Shield: also gives 5% damage reduction to enemies that use fire

    Lightning Weapon Enchant: also gives an extra 5% damage to lightning skills
    Lightning Armor Enchant: also gives 5% damage reduction to enemies that use lightning

    Vorpal Weapon Enchant: also gives 5% extra damage to physical at-will powers.
    Prominence enchant: also gives 5% damage reduction from behemoths.

    Holy Avenger Enchant: also gives 5% extra damage versus undead
    Life Drinker Enchant: also gives 5% damage reduction from magic creatures.


    ... just examples of what i mean. i didn't balance it out or anything

    No, definitely not!
  • oldbaldyoneoldbaldyone Member Posts: 1,840 Arc User

    If each weapon & armor enchantment had a small special effect vs certain enemy types, then players might be tempted to collect and swap more of them. For instance....

    Flame Weapon Enchant: gives an extra 5% to fire damage and to burning
    Flame Shield: also gives 5% damage reduction to enemies that use fire

    Lightning Weapon Enchant: also gives an extra 5% damage to lightning skills
    Lightning Armor Enchant: also gives 5% damage reduction to enemies that use lightning

    Vorpal Weapon Enchant: also gives 5% extra damage to physical at-will powers.
    Prominence enchant: also gives 5% damage reduction from behemoths.

    Holy Avenger Enchant: also gives 5% extra damage versus undead
    Life Drinker Enchant: also gives 5% damage reduction from magic creatures.


    ... just examples of what i mean. i didn't balance it out or anything

    They are capable of coming up with time/resources sinks on their own, they don't need our help. We already have a pointless mount grind (which has very little effect on your toons power but a major effect on your IL and resources), are getting a pointless companion grind....all while a lot of people probably have yet to even see a collar drop and are rocking maybe a couple legendary insignias.
  • kanyoukanyou Member Posts: 1 New User
    Honestly as a relatively new player who has grinded hard and put money in the game to just start making the end game, I am completely depressed with the new changes. There is not a single thing that makes me think I will not have to completely redo my gear. All enchantments, companions, mounts, and more just to meet stats in the new system. I am sorry but starting from scratch is just too much. I do not have all the companions and mounts waiting in the wings like almost every tester I have watched. I truly don't mean to sound dramatic, but the history of massive changes over and over to your system does not motivate me to play and regear again knowing that odds are this system will change completely again in three mods or less. I really hope that the money that gets made from those that stay balances out the players that are going to stop playing. I have been patiently watching every streamer I can that conducts real number testing. I would really like to be show n one streamer just one single streamer that hasn't had to completely change all their gear.
  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 4,930 Arc User
    edited December 2020
    um, any chance of Shards of Bronzewood being added to the seal vendor? I checked the auction house last night and only 5 enchantments were for sale - at ridiculously high prices.

    Edit; or make it available from the Tarmalune Bar trader?
    Post edited by armadeonx on
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  • tgwolftgwolf Member Posts: 467 Arc User
    For the people all bent out of shape over the Vorpal, stop jumping to conclusions every time a change happens that you haven't thought through.

    The old version of the Vorpal was actually near useless in the new system; Crit. Severity is extremely easy to cap without trying, I had to remove my Vorpal before and I was still 9% over cap.

    While Crit. Strike is still as easy to stack as before, the extra 4% is very useful for DPS; freeing up some areas for other stats and still to a point useful for Healers, pretty much guaranteeing that you cap your Crit. chance for your heals.
  • supmadbrosupmadbro Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    tgwolf said:

    The old version of the Vorpal was actually near useless in the new system; Crit. Severity is extremely easy to cap without trying, I had to remove my Vorpal before and I was still 9% over cap.

    If you ever tested the old vorpal on preview you'd know that it went over the 90% crit sev cap because the vorpal crit severity was applied directly to encounters/dailys/at-wills and not in the character sheet. The current vorpal is just pure trash. Bilethorn out performs it significantly, even slow hitting classes like fighter and cleric will probably have bilethorn out perform vorp. the 4% needs to be upped to 8-10% for it to be usable for dps classes, even at 8-10% the fast hitting dps classes would still run bilethorn, which is what it should be like. Slow hitting classes use vorp, fast hitting ones bilethorn. Not everyone bilethorn.
  • eldredd#1450 eldredd Member Posts: 1 New User
    edited December 2020
    Crit rating or crit severity on vorpal is not a big deal imo both stats have equal value after changes and even if it's easier to cap severity now things may change in the future.
    Is the CA on daily use that's the problem, why change the way vorpal works. Vorpal is about crits, keep it only about crits.
    And because of the way crit rating/severity works is no way 4% to be equal to 4% def decrease etc of other enchants.
    Vorpal needs to be at least somewhere around 7-8% on crit rating or severity to be equal to the rest.

    PS
    Also please finally fix ray of frost to work with weapon enchants, it was 5% extra damage on at will before is 8% now and still no extra damage on ray of frost from vorpal or other etchants.
  • thefiresidecatthefiresidecat Member Posts: 4,486 Arc User
    edited December 2020
    armadeonx said:

    um, any chance of Shards of Bronzewood being added to the seal vendor? I checked the auction house last night and only 5 enchantments were for sale - at ridiculously high prices.

    Edit; or make it available from the Tarmalune Bar trader?

    FWIW, I'd bet a shiny plugged Nickle that within a month they redo the enchantment sale in zen market. 5 r15s for something like 3k or 4k zen and in the same vicinity for a weapon armor enchantment choice pack. with these changes, imo it's guaranteed they will do this one again. (it's happened a couple times in the last year) I wouldn't buy anything rn. sell yes buy no. there is a sale every year sometime between boxing day and new years. I kind of expect it then but it might be closer to when this drops. put all ad into the exchange now and hope you get your zen before sale.
  • thany#4351 thany Member Posts: 206 Arc User
    edited December 2020
    You should give up on all plans with new mod. Obviously this is a mess and you don't know what to do. This is a game. Game, which I play after work to have some fun and joy. Anyway, very soon we will "find out" again what is BiS. You just overcomplicate everything. Game shouldn't be a rocket science.
  • synyster3006synyster3006 Member Posts: 57 Arc User
    Are we sure that 8% damage bonus of Vorpal works? i run some tests in preview and when i tried to swap to another Weapon Ench (like Bilethorn, Plague Fire, ecc.) my hit damages were higher. Can someone also run some tests to confirm/negate what i saw?

    Thanks,
    Aster
  • khaozhunterkhaozhunter Member Posts: 63 Arc User
    > @synyster3006 said:
    > Are we sure that 8% damage bonus of Vorpal works? i run some tests in preview and when i tried to swap to another Weapon Ench (like Bilethorn, Plague Fire, ecc.) my hit damages were higher. Can someone also run some tests to confirm/negate what i saw?
    >
    > Thanks,
    > Aster

    If you read the patch notes on known issues says this: "Weapon Enchantments Damage bonuses incorrectly deal 1 or 0 damage.", then is a bug...
  • abwabwabaabwabwaba Member Posts: 85 Arc User
    Hi there!

    Not sure where to post, but I would really appreciate if someone could explain the following:

    Plague Fire now decreases your target’s Critical Avoidance by up to 1.5% per stack. Do enemies have critical avoidance at all?
    If no, then how will this work? Will it add up till or over the 90% crit chance cap? (I'm sure it doesnt/wont, but then what will happen? Nothing?)

    Sorry, english isnt my first language.
    Hide The Pain Harold!
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